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Update: Mueller to testify before House Judiciary and Intelligence Committees on July 24

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chakoo

chakoo

Posted
Posted
5 hours ago, RedSoxFan9 said:

 

maybe Democrats will reconsider now

I'm getting very tired of this hot take. Mueller passed everything along for congress to continue. It is part of their ***k job.

 

It also ignores that him, his party and his base isn't going to pull more fuckery up to, during and past the election to keep him from getting kicked out. I'd rather them be tied up defending themselves in congress then spending it on the campaign trail pulling more fuckery.

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osxmatt

osxmatt

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Republicans have zero credibility when they say the Mueller investigation was retribution for losing the 2016 election. Now let's say Democrats decide not to open impeachment proceedings, fearing it will be too politically controversial. And Trump wins in 2020. Then what?

 

At that point Democrats (should they keep the House) cannot start impeachment proceedings, because there will absolutely be weight to the idea it's retribution for losing the 2020 election. And honestly this report transcends politics and party. I've read the entire report now. People talk about how Trump's daily tweets are damaging institutions, and I believe that is true.

 

But if Democrats decide not to open an impeachment inquiry based on what this report entails, I think that damages Congress more than anything Trump has said or done.

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Anathema-

Anathema-

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1 hour ago, Greatoneshere said:

Democrats ain't gonna do shit except stamp their feet and whine. I wish they had a real backbone. Maybe we'll see the semblance of one at some point.

 

I'm not sure about that, considering how many inquiries have launched. Those hearings would have to exonerate trump in order to not make it any worse and so all dems would be doing is making their own supposed "do nothing" stance even more untenable.

 

Remember that Congress opened inquiries into Watergate like, a year before impeachment was filed.

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Spawn_of_Apathy

Spawn_of_Apathy

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3 hours ago, Greatoneshere said:

Democrats ain't gonna do shit except stamp their feet and whine. I wish they had a real backbone. Maybe we'll see the semblance of one at some point.

If the Dems had AOC as speaker and Warren as minority leader we’d see the Democrats with more teeth actually willing to bite into things. 

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PaladinSolo

PaladinSolo

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2 hours ago, SaysWho? said:

Trump received no bump after Barr's "summary."

 

His poll numbers have decreased since the redacted report. I could potentially see a drip-drip-drip from this with hearing from people such as McGahn and Mueller.

His approval didn't fall much is at 39%, but man his disapproval skyrocketed to 57, fence sitters appear to have not liked what they've read/heard.  Dems seem eager to keep him on the ballot for 2020 as impeachment support dropped though.

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SaysWho?

SaysWho?

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13 minutes ago, PaladinSolo said:

His approval didn't fall much is at 39%, but man his disapproval skyrocketed to 57, fence sitters appear to have not liked what they've read/heard.  Dems seem eager to keep him on the ballot for 2020 as impeachment support dropped though.

 

This reply, tho.

 

 

I forget who it was in 2016 -- I think @SilentWorld or @legend maybe? -- but the same point was made: who's flip-flopping between candidates so much? How does approval change that much when so much is baked in? 

 

I've thought for a while that some people simply change their opinions based on events that others won't change their opinion on, which is probably part of it, and also that approval/disapproval doesn't necessarily mean your vote is what it is. He's taking a hit now, as he should, and maybe some of those people will be permanent. But it may be a thing where, "Okay, I disapprove of what he's doing on the government shutdown but I still like him overall, especially compared to the Democrats," so when the shutdown's over, they approve of him overall because he's "hurting the people he should be hurting."

 

Which would explain why there's a baseline of around 41% for so long and it always reverts to that since around January of 2018.

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Jason

Jason

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Mueller report: Russia hacked state databases and voting machine companies

 

Remember all the anecdotal reports of people being certain they were registered to vote, but then being told they weren't on the voter rolls when they showed up? Keeping people from voting is effectively equivalent to changing votes.

 

Also,

 

Quote

Last year, then Sen. Bill Nelson, D-Fla., and Marco Rubio, R-Fla., both warned Florida election systems were susceptible to Russian cyberattacks. Nelson, who lost the election to Florida Gov. Rick Scott, said Russians had gained access to Florida voter data but didn’t offer any details.

 

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legend

legend

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28 minutes ago, SaysWho? said:

 

This reply, tho.

 

 

I forget who it was in 2016 -- I think @SilentWorld or @legend maybe? -- but the same point was made: who's flip-flopping between candidates so much? How does approval change that much when so much is baked in? 

 

I've thought for a while that some people simply change their opinions based on events that others won't change their opinion on, which is probably part of it, and also that approval/disapproval doesn't necessarily mean your vote is what it is. He's taking a hit now, as he should, and maybe some of those people will be permanent. But it may be a thing where, "Okay, I disapprove of what he's doing on the government shutdown but I still like him overall, especially compared to the Democrats," so when the shutdown's over, they approve of him overall because he's "hurting the people he should be hurting."

 

Which would explain why there's a baseline of around 41% for so long and it always reverts to that since around January of 2018.

 

Not sure if it was me, but it is a really weird phenomenon all the same. Your hypothesis seems as good as any I can think of.

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Jason

Jason

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@SaysWho? @legend most people don't pay attention to the news anywhere near as much as we do. People not caring until it's something that directly affects them is probably part of it, but I'd bet a big factor is also simply a matter of what people are even aware of. I mean hell, you've got some places randomizing the ballot order because of people literally just voting for whomever happens to be on the top of the ballot—those kind of absurdly low-information voters are presumably a big driver of this oscillation. 

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Greatoneshere

Greatoneshere

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17 hours ago, Anathema- said:

I'm not sure about that, considering how many inquiries have launched. Those hearings would have to exonerate trump in order to not make it any worse and so all dems would be doing is making their own supposed "do nothing" stance even more untenable.

 

Remember that Congress opened inquiries into Watergate like, a year before impeachment was filed.

 

I mean, I hope you are right, but Democrats are good at disappointing you. :p 

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b_m_b_m_b_m

b_m_b_m_b_m

Posted
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1 hour ago, PaladinSolo said:

His approval didn't fall much is at 39%, but man his disapproval skyrocketed to 57, fence sitters appear to have not liked what they've read/heard.  Dems seem eager to keep him on the ballot for 2020 as impeachment support dropped though.

A lot of People wrongly think impeachment means he will be removed from office. Hell yeah keep him on the ballot, but also do the impeachment thing.

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Reputator

Reputator

Posted
Posted
10 hours ago, Jason said:

Mueller report: Russia hacked state databases and voting machine companies

 

Remember all the anecdotal reports of people being certain they were registered to vote, but then being told they weren't on the voter rolls when they showed up? Keeping people from voting is effectively equivalent to changing votes.

 

Also,

 

 

 

I'm sure they're only testing the waters at this point. Blatant vote changing, if it hasn't occurred already, will be happening probably within the next couple election cycles. The Russians can elect whoever they want, and our systems are too outdated to do anything about it.

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Jason

Jason

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5 minutes ago, Reputator said:

I'm sure they're only testing the waters at this point. Blatant vote changing, if it hasn't occurred already, will be happening probably within the next couple election cycles. The Russians can elect whoever they want, and our systems are too outdated to do anything about it.

 

Pulling people off the voter rolls would probably be less obvious than outright flipping votes, but like I said, it amounts to the same thing.

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