Television The Mandalorian OT - This is the Way

[CitizenVectron]

45 minutes ago, ort said:

But that's what doesn't make sense. If it's able to see who you are and compare it to a database, surely a person not in the empire would not be in the system, and it would not recognize him as a person able to access it, but also, who gives a shit. Yes, that is the correct answer.

 

It's one of those things that yes, they could add 60 more seconds of exposition and explain it, but why bother... this is a face scanner, it scans your face and sets up a dramatic moment, fill in your own blanks and just sit back and enjoy it.

 

Just like they could show a scene where he's flying around the planet for 6 hours looking for the right place, but why even show that? Or have Ashoka give him directions, but again, why bother?

 

Like I said, the quality of the rest makes up for moments like this. You can pick anything apart if you really want. There are very few films that stand up to real scrutiny.

 

Boba Fett is Jango Fett and is the same as every Clone Trooper. It makes sense they wouldn't allow Clone Troopers since some of them went haywire...and they've moved on to non-clones.

[Mercury33]

Wow...just wow

[Greatoneshere]

Whether Boba Fett is recognized as one of the most famous bounty hunters in the galaxy or because he looks just like the clone troopers from 25 years back doesn't matter - either way, it arouses suspicion, whether good or bad, and the whole point of the operation is meant to be covert and discreet. An old clone trooper walking around an essentially secret Empire mining facility when all the clone troopers were long ago disbanded (and most are dead due to battle or their advanced clone aging) would be super weird for the Empire to see, so best not to risk it.

 

Either and/or both reasons work for why Boba wouldn't want to be the one to go in. Hell, even Mayfeld wanted to call the whole operation off when he realized his old superior officer was there and might recognize him. An old clone trooper is a much bigger risk than even that.

 

I think people tend to forget that Star Wars Rebels starts by taking place 5 years before A New Hope (with each season spanning one year), while The Mandalorian starts by taking place five years after Return of the Jedi, making The Mandalorian take place 13 years after Rebels (or 9 years by the end of Rebels since each season on that show spans a year, ignoring Rebels' epilogue). 

 

Point being, there are ex-clone troopers in Rebels and it's pretty implied most clone troopers are already long gone - so by Mandalorian's time, it'd be even stranger to have a clone trooper waltz around an Empire facility.

[tbca]

Reading through these last few pages and it makes wonder if people even enjoy watching the things they devote hours to watching 

[LazyPiranha]

5 hours ago, CayceG said:

 

 

Since when has ANY Star Wars property involved showing us the character arriving at a planet anywhere except exactly where they need to be for the purposes of the story?

 

Additionally, I think you're focusing on the fact that a baby was put in handcuffs and arriving at "Why are there baby handcuffs" rather than remembering that the galaxy is full of creatures of all shapes and sizes AND the Empire was a fascist nightmare, and maybe THAT explains why there are Grogu-sized cuffs. 

 

 

 

So I'll tell you what Mandalorian means to me. 

 

This latest episode really kinda brings a message and a deeper meaning and a really good character arc together in a way that resonates with me. 

Mando is the member of essentially a religious cult. When we first see him, he's just a cool bounty hunter. Then we are shown that he has this code that involves strict religious practices. The practices and beliefs are established through the first season while a bond is forming between Grogu and Mando. He has this duty to Grogu because Mando's creed says so. External characters exemplify this as well, providing a mirror for Mando's creed and showing him (and us) what it means to follow it. 

 

Now in the 2nd season, there's an exploration of Mando's beliefs. We're shown other Mandalorians outside his sect, and see their practices which clash with his. Outsiders (Mayfeld) point out apparent contradictions (or things that could be explained away by a zealot as, actually they aren't contradictory). And we see Mando do something to break a part of his creed in support another part of it. 

 

This echoes my spiritual journey. I was raised and grew up a conservative evangelical Christian. We had practices and beliefs that were different from other Christian groups. As I grew up and got out in the world I was exposed to people of other expressions of Christianity and others that weren't believers at all. The same differences in practice and questioning/criticism from outsiders that we watched in this season of The Mandalorian are things I experienced in the past. I have been in situations where my a religious practice was challenged to support another part of my religious creed. The questions that are there in the episodes are ones I have felt. What's more important? The little list of things you do and don't do to define you as a member of this religion? Or the ultimate goal that religion espouses? Or is something external to the religion's teaching more important than any of the former?

 

 

To say that the show is cotton candy might work for you. But to others it has a deep and abiding meaning and I sincerely appreciate that it's being explored. 

Something can be threadbare fluff and still be meaningful to people.  My point is not that the show does wrong but it’s themes, mood, or broad strokes as it generally does a pretty good job with all of that.  What I’m saying is that the logical plot that puts our heroes in place is largely nonsense and the show aims to deliver memorable moments by not giving a single shit about how the pawns got into place.  Mando having to remove his helmet and dealing with that conflict can land emotionally, but it doesn’t change the fact that the terminal is an obvious and stupid Mcguffin.  Sure you can torture a justification, but the entire thing is a clear and lazy plot device.  The face thing doesn’t even cover the fact that our Boston townie somehow just happens to have a magical empire USB stick that instantly finds the ship in question as if it’s just labeled Gideon.ship in the directory or something.  
 

I like the show, it’s a lot of fun, and largely the emotional beats land just find.  It’s also a profoundly dumb show.  Both can be true.

[ort]

1 hour ago, tbca said:

Reading through these last few pages and it makes wonder if people even enjoy watching the things they devote hours to watching 

 

I mean, I'm pretty sure we all laid out very clearly that none of us actually really care about this, and that we all understand this is ridiculous and pointless...

[skillzdadirecta]

1 hour ago, tbca said:

Reading through these last few pages and it makes wonder if people even enjoy watching the things they devote hours to watching 

Spoiler alert: They don't.

[Spawn_of_Apathy]

3 hours ago, TwinIon said:

Maybe I'm getting my timelines messed up, but why wouldn't Fett be the ideal candidate to access a terminal? Are there no longer any clones among the troopers? They once made up 100% of the fighting force, and we've seen clones working at every level of the army, so surely it wouldn't have been unusual for a clone to access a terminal. I didn't think we were so far removed that they'd all be gone by now. Did I miss the point at which the empire got rid of all the clone troopers?

 

Regardless, I generally agree that Star Wars is at it's best when it's gesturing to bigger things and wider worlds as opposed to investigating the minutia or the mechanics of something.

clones were kind of weeded out of the Empire’s fighting force well before even A New Hope. Heck even by Rebels. There were a number of reasons for getting rid of them. The Clones were expensive. All Clones that took part in Order 66 were never the same. The chip inhibited too much of their personality. They became more droid like and lost some of their effectiveness. Sidious wanted “true believers” as opposed to being programmed too. This was never showed on screen. Though in Rebels it was mentioned how the Clones were decommissioned. It was talked about more in comics and books. 
 

Even had they kept them around in service, without producing more Clones by the time of the Mandalorian any remaining clones would like they were in their 70s due to advance aging. Boba does look as old because he’s an unaltered clone and grew up naturally. 
 

While the average storm trooper may not recognize the face of a clone, it is possible an officer might. If whatever genetic scanner they were taking about at one point didn’t also detect him. 

[CayceG]

1 hour ago, LazyPiranha said:

Something can be threadbare fluff and still be meaningful to people.  My point is not that the show does wrong but it’s themes, mood, or broad strokes as it generally does a pretty good job with all of that.  What I’m saying is that the logical plot that puts our heroes in place is largely nonsense and the show aims to deliver memorable moments by not giving a single shit about how the pawns got into place.  Mando having to remove his helmet and dealing with that conflict can land emotionally, but it doesn’t change the fact that the terminal is an obvious and stupid Mcguffin.  Sure you can torture a justification, but the entire thing is a clear and lazy plot device.  The face thing doesn’t even cover the fact that our Boston townie somehow just happens to have a magical empire USB stick that instantly finds the ship in question as if it’s just labeled Gideon.ship in the directory or something.  
 

I like the show, it’s a lot of fun, and largely the emotional beats land just find.  It’s also a profoundly dumb show.  Both can be true.

 

Yeah, I'll buy that. But I think if it's in service of the story, it's pretty acceptable. But I can see how it's a nitpick. 

[TwinIon]

It seems I had made an incorrect assumption about the state clones in the Imperial army. I thought the mechanics of the terminal were a bit odd,, and for reasons I explained I wasn't sure why Fett wasn't an ideal candidate, but neither affected my enjoyment of the episode. 

 

Mandalorian is really great at capturing the fun part of Star Wars. It doesn't need to get into why Beskar can stop a saber or why it seems everyone forgot about the Jedi in less than a generation. It's a show that can make just the barest case for why Mando and friends need to go on these adventures, and that's good enough for me to enjoy it.

 

My biggest issue with the show is that we only get 8 episodes per season.

 

[legend]

I'd like to participate in the meaningless discussion about the face scanner. My best explanation for this silly plot mechanic is that it's not for security, it's for logs, so that they can go back and see who was accessing the data at the time if they need to. In this case, that would actually turn out valuable, because now they actually have information about what Mando looks like.

[CayceG]

1 minute ago, legend said:

I'd like to participate in the meaningless discussion about the face scanner. My best explanation for this silly plot mechanic is that it's not for security, it's for logs, so that they can go back and see who was accessing the data at the time if they need to. In this case, that would actually turn out valuable, because now they actually have information about what Mando looks like.

 

This is a great reason that sets up a potential plot beat for the future. 

[Joe]

Based legend. Hope Favreau is reading this.

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

On 12/5/2020 at 12:06 PM, Chris- said:

Also, another example of the show leaning on the films and cleaning them up: the way they handled any questions about how Jango/Boba fit the new cannon surrounding Mandalorian culture was so deftly done (I bet Pablo Hidalgo is a big reason why).

 

Pablo once answered a question I asked him on Twitter!

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

[Greatoneshere]

To be fair, it wasn't just the face, he had to have the access key to, and also be at a terminal in an Imperial base.

[Reputator]

Weren't the characters literally discussing the problem of having their faces get scanned because the Empire was checking if they were showing up on New Republic datalogs? The explanation is built into the episode.

[skillzdadirecta]

[CayceG]

26 minutes ago, Reputator said:

Weren't the characters literally discussing the problem of having their faces get scanned because the Empire was checking if they were showing up on New Republic datalogs? The explanation is built into the episode.

 

ISB databases, but yes. 

[GeneticBlueprint]

On 12/14/2020 at 10:45 AM, skillzdadirecta said:

Here's a simple explanation for the facial recognition thing that seems to have a bunch of folks hung up. It either A. is to prevent droids from accessing material or B. Because its the Empire, only HUMANS can access material and not aliens because the EMpire is somewhat racist as well as fascist. Take your pick... whichever one fits your head canon and enjoy the show.

 

Next thing you know we're gonna need a WHOLE MOVIE to explain why the Empire's scanners require facial recognition from pretty much ANY human face 

 

I just took it as a security precaution. Who accessed this info and when? Timestamp picture.

[AbsolutSurgen]

It was a plot device to get Din to take off his helmet, to demonstrate his commitment to saving Grogu. 

[skillzdadirecta]

1 hour ago, AbsolutSurgen said:

It was a plot device to get Din to take off his helmet, to demonstrate his commitment to saving Grogu. 

This too.

[Spork3245]

I heard that the computer had to scan his face because it was using old tech that Mark Zuckerberg sold the Empire. Could just be a rumor, but now it seems as though that ICE has Mando’s photo on record, soooooo...

[LazyPiranha]

You can torture a justification for literally anything.  Boba Fett could have shown up as a completely stacked 22 year old blond woman and I could argue that the digestive juices of the sarlacc have incredible anti-aging properties but are also loaded with midiestrogen, the force version of lady hormones.  It explains things, but it's still fucking stupid.  Sure, you can accept that the empire has somehow created to single most lax IT security policy of all time because apparently it has.  It's still a glaring plot device lazily designed to do one thing and one thing only.  The face thing is just the cherry on top of the nonsense Sunday.  Apparently any random scrub can just use the terminal, no login necessary, and pinpoint the exact location of every single ship in the secret fleet.  You think something like that would be obscenely valuable to the new republic and might at the very least have a password.

 

Look, the entire show is run off of spaghetti logic and not thinking about anything.  Remember how the whole crux of the last season was that people could just hunt down Grogu and Mando as long as they had a space beeper?  Did that thing run out of batteries or something?  Why isn't Mando just pulling that thing out and following the little red blink?  The fact that the framework of the show is popsicle sticks, bubblegum, and prayer doesn't make it less fun, but let's not go around putting more work into the logic of the show than the writers themselves.

 

 

[Mercury33]

Needed that USB stick thing to access the info. So he did need a “password” or “key”. Ya know, like when in the movies they had stolen old access codes to be allowed to land places. 

[CayceG]

The cylinder is actually an Imperial officer's code cylinder. It's another specialized access key, essentially. That was explored a bit in Rebels, so this isn't untrod ground for Filoni. 

[SimpleG]

[Luke is stranded out in a harsh snowstorm.]
Obi-Wan Kenobi: [voice comes out of nowhere] Luke. Luke!
Luke Skywalker: [weakly] Ben?
Obi-Wan Kenobi: [spirit appears in front of Luke] You will go to the Dagobah system.
Luke Skywalker: [delirious] Dagobah system?
Obi-Wan Kenobi: There you will learn from Yoda, the Jedi Master who instructed me.

Luke Skywalker: But how will I find him?

Obi-Wan Kenobi: /Shrug

Luke Skywalker: No Address or coordinates?

Obi-Wan Kenobi: Shakes Head

Luke Skywalker: FFS you know the Dagobah system has like 5 or 6 planets in it right

Obi-Wan Kenobi : Whistles

Luke Skywalker: A picture right, surely you have a picture of him? For god sakes you know long it will take to find him?

Obi-Wan Kenobi: [ Fades away]Later Bitces!

 

 

 

Luke spends the rest of the trilogy stopping at Star Wars version of truck stops asking lot lizards if they a know a "yoda" and how much an old fashioned will run him.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[CitizenVectron]

 

[skillzdadirecta]

This is literally "how fast Ravens fly" all over again.

[cusideabelincoln]

2 hours ago, CitizenVectron said:

 

 

Wowzers, Filoni can hit those high notes!

[AbsolutSurgen]

I am enjoying watching the Mandalorian.

 

My take on how the first two seasons are written.

They have a general concept of where they want to happen in the season finale.

They have a bunch of "set-pieces"/concepts/action scenes that they think would make cool episodes.

They try and think up ideas of how to string together the cool ideas. 

They pepper in ideas that foreshadow what is going to happen. Din playing catch with Grogu and taking off his helmet are, IMHO are a blatant foreshadowing for some difficult decision that Din will make in the season finale.

 

 

IMHO, following the formula of this show is really hard to write for.  Trying to come up with 3-4 things to string together in a movie is not hard -- doing it 15+ times is pretty difficult, as you quickly run out of good ideas.  In the grand scheme of things, having Din and Grogu go from planet to planet EVERY FUCKING episode is pretty stupid -- no one would actually do this kind of journey in RL.  And the way they get their information on the next step in their journey often feels contrived.  But given the structure of the show, IMHO, the writing is actually not that bad.  As a viewer, you either decide to buy into this formula, and suspend your disbelief, or you don't, and you miss out on what makes this show entertaining -- the mostly "fun" vignettes for what they are.

 

And really -- has the "writing" and character motivations in Star Wars EVER been good?

 

For the record -- some of the other things in Star Wars that I have suspended my disbelief on:  The Force, noise in space, FTL travel, gravity on space ships, light sabres, blasters, all computer displays being stuck in the 70s, ships in space flying like they are in an atmosphere, every living creature being comfortable with the same atmosphere composition, pressure and gravity.  Having nonsensical computer security is easy by comparison.

[legend]

On 12/16/2020 at 10:26 AM, LazyPiranha said:

The fact that the framework of the show is popsicle sticks, bubblegum, and prayer doesn't make it less fun, but let's not go around putting more work into the logic of the show than the writers themselves.

 

I'm going to need you to return your geek membership card.

[LazyPiranha]

52 minutes ago, legend said:

 

I'm going to need you to return your geek membership card.

Jokes on you, I never had one.

[Kal-El814]

[CayceG]

Boba Fett died today  

 

 

Jeremy Bulloch, Original Boba Fett Actor in ‘Star Wars’ Films, Dies at 75

VARIETY.COM

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Jeremy Bulloch, the British actor who starred as bounty hunter Boba Fett in the original “Star Wars” trilogy, died in London. He was 75.