CitizenVectron Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 Good thread on why the vaccines are likely to work: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris- Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 52 minutes ago, sblfilms said: So show me the expected adoption based on a federal mask mandate and the net effects of it. That is how you get to the point of figuring out if the policy does have a meaningful impact. So far you've provided nothing to indicate a federal mask mandate would do anything, and apparently the Biden administration at this point agrees that it wouldn't based on their policy proposals. Or I guess they are fine with people needlessly dying when the issuance of the mandate isn't a particularly difficult bit of policy work. 44 minutes ago, Joe said: This is not what is happening. They are planning to push mask mandates, just at the state and local level. They don't want it to be federal. First off I never advocated for a federal mask mandate, I just said any impact of a toothless mandate is worthwhile; those aren't necessarily inclusive positions. Second, what Joe said. Though for the sake of the exercise, let's flip the question around: show me the cost (real or figurative) of a federal mask mandate. I am confident even a nominal amount of saved lives makes it a worthwhile exercise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris- Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 52 minutes ago, sblfilms said: So show me the expected adoption based on a federal mask mandate and the net effects of it. That is how you get to the point of figuring out if the policy does have a meaningful impact. So far you've provided nothing to indicate a federal mask mandate would do anything, and apparently the Biden administration at this point agrees that it wouldn't based on their policy proposals. Or I guess they are fine with people needlessly dying when the issuance of the mandate isn't a particularly difficult bit of policy work. 44 minutes ago, Joe said: This is not what is happening. They are planning to push mask mandates, just at the state and local level. They don't want it to be federal. First off I never advocated for a federal mask mandate, I just said any impact of a toothless mandate is worthwhile; those aren't necessarily inclusive positions. Second, what Joe said. Though for the sake of the exercise, let's flip the question around: show me the cost (real or figurative) of a federal mask mandate. I am confident even a nominal amount of saved lives makes it a worthwhile exercise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost_MH Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 23 minutes ago, Chris- said: First off I never advocated for a federal mask mandate, I just said any impact of a toothless mandate is worthwhile; those aren't necessarily inclusive positions. Second, what Joe said. Though for the sake of the exercise, let's flip the question around: show me the cost (real or figurative) of a federal mask mandate. I am confident even a nominal amount of saved lives makes it a worthwhile exercise. To add to this, most people don't really pay attention to the news. If everyone in the country cm got a few masks in the mail with a letter asking them to use it and stay safe, I would imagine that would change the minds of a not insignificant number of people. Even then, if it's only 1000, then that lives saved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewhyteboar Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-08-17/what-works-to-persuade-people-to-wear-masks A way to get people to wear masks is to compare them to helmets or seatbelts: "A recent survey of more than than 2,000 state residents offered respondents five different messages and gauged whether they made people more or less likely to wear a mask in public, as compared to a control group that saw no message. Comparing masks to helmets and seatbelts was the only message that had a positive impact on people’s decisions." So a Biden administration could send masks to every household in America with literature explaining how a mask is just like a seatbelt or helmet. It won't get everyone on board, but the more people wearing masks the better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marioandsonic Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 6 minutes ago, thewhyteboar said: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-08-17/what-works-to-persuade-people-to-wear-masks A way to get people to wear masks is to compare them to helmets or seatbelts: "A recent survey of more than than 2,000 state residents offered respondents five different messages and gauged whether they made people more or less likely to wear a mask in public, as compared to a control group that saw no message. Comparing masks to helmets and seatbelts was the only message that had a positive impact on people’s decisions." So a Biden administration could send masks to every household in America with literature explaining how a mask is just like a seatbelt or helmet. It won't get everyone on board, but the more people wearing masks the better. I'm pretty sure that a Venn diagram of those who don't wear helmets, seat belts, or masks would nearly overlap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fizzzzle Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 I'm starting to focus more on the Senate races in georgia. I've noticed, outside of lindsey graham, republicans in the Senate are divided in how they're treating Trump. Some, like Romney, seem like they're leaving him behind. Mcconnell seems like he's playing both sides. They basically have to decide whether they think georgia flipped blue because A) there are actually more democrats that voted, or B) are there a bunch of Republicans who just voted blue (or libertarian) because they don't like Trump. They have to pick one of those lanes. It's like they either have to double down on the Donald or distance themselves from him. I'm really interested to see the rhetoric we see over the next couple months. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spork3245 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 I just really want to say how fucking stupid the new “restrictions” in NJ are. Indoor dining has to end by 10pm and can’t reopen until 5am... just... jfc: how fucking many people were eating out between 10:01pm-4:59am? How is this actually going to affect the soaring infection rates in NJ in any meaningful way? What the actual fuck. It’d be one thing if that was on top of other restrictions to help slow the infections down, but it’s not - this is literally the only thing put into place and it’s just really REALLY dumb. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyser_Soze Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 8 hours ago, thewhyteboar said: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-08-17/what-works-to-persuade-people-to-wear-masks A way to get people to wear masks is to compare them to helmets or seatbelts: "A recent survey of more than than 2,000 state residents offered respondents five different messages and gauged whether they made people more or less likely to wear a mask in public, as compared to a control group that saw no message. Comparing masks to helmets and seatbelts was the only message that had a positive impact on people’s decisions." So a Biden administration could send masks to every household in America with literature explaining how a mask is just like a seatbelt or helmet. It won't get everyone on board, but the more people wearing masks the better. At the grocery story every so often over the PA they remind everyone to wear a mask or face covering. I think if you use the term face covering people might be more likely to wear one just because mask has a kind of a negative connotation to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 2) The study, published in The Lancet Psychiatry journal, analysed electronic health records of 69 million people in US, with 62,000 cases of #COVID19. In the three months following testing positive, 1 in 5 survivors had first time diagnosis of anxiety, depression or insomnia. — Eric Feigl-Ding (@DrEricDing) November 10, 2020 14) BOTTOMLINE: Folks—gonna level with you—I would not want this for myself or anyone I know. Death is not the only bad outcome of #COVID19—even if we survive, there are huge chronic consequences. For those still advocating herd to “infect everyone” w/out vaccine—you’re insane.— Eric Feigl-Ding (@DrEricDing) November 10, 2020 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comet Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 12 minutes ago, ManUtdRedDevils said: Do we have any examples of a similar virus or bacteria that has such a myriad of downstream effects?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyser_Soze Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 33 minutes ago, ManUtdRedDevils said: Well Trump already had this before Covid so he wasn't affected. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chakoo Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 2 hours ago, Spork3245 said: I just really want to say how fucking stupid the new “restrictions” in NJ are. Indoor dining has to end by 10pm and can’t reopen until 5am... just... jfc: how fucking many people were eating out between 10:01pm-4:59am? How is this actually going to affect the soaring infection rates in NJ in any meaningful way? What the actual fuck. It’d be one thing if that was on top of other restrictions to help slow the infections down, but it’s not - this is literally the only thing put into place and it’s just really REALLY dumb. Does it include bars? If so they’re going after the younger crowd and bar hoppers. We’ve had a few cases in Canada where a sick person went bar hopping and got a lot of people sick in one night. Early closing of bars and restaurants are one of the targets for that reason up here, they were responsible for 43% of the spread at one point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 2 hours ago, Spork3245 said: I just really want to say how fucking stupid the new “restrictions” in NJ are. Indoor dining has to end by 10pm and can’t reopen until 5am... just... jfc: how fucking many people were eating out between 10:01pm-4:59am? How is this actually going to affect the soaring infection rates in NJ in any meaningful way? What the actual fuck. It’d be one thing if that was on top of other restrictions to help slow the infections down, but it’s not - this is literally the only thing put into place and it’s just really REALLY dumb. He also shut down bar side seating, which is the bigger deal. He kinda snuck it in there too in the press conference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skillzdadirecta Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 13 minutes ago, chakoo said: Does it include bars? If so they’re going after the younger crowd and bar hoppers. We’ve had a few cases in Canada where a sick person went bar hopping and got a lot of people sick in one night. Early closing of bars and restaurants are one of the targets for that reason up here, they were responsible for 43% of the spread at one point. That's EXACTLY what they're going for. I heard a local radio show this morning talking about how lit the bars and clubs have been in Jersey and I guarantee that's where most of the spread is occuring. My brother has been hanging out in these street pretty much like the pandemic is non-existent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spork3245 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 30 minutes ago, chakoo said: Does it include bars? If so they’re going after the younger crowd and bar hoppers. We’ve had a few cases in Canada where a sick person went bar hopping and got a lot of people sick in one night. Early closing of bars and restaurants are one of the targets for that reason up here, they were responsible for 43% of the spread at one point. 18 minutes ago, Joe said: He also shut down bar side seating, which is the bigger deal. He kinda snuck it in there too in the press conference. 15 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said: That's EXACTLY what they're going for. I heard a local radio show this morning talking about how lit the bars and clubs have been in Jersey and I guarantee that's where most of the spread is occuring. My brother has been hanging out in these street pretty much like the pandemic is non-existent. They’re still allowed to be outside in those tent-things. Bar seating was six-feet apart anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skillzdadirecta Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 Just now, Spork3245 said: They’re still allowed to be outside in those tent-things. Bar seating was six-feet apart anyway. Nobody is abiding by that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spork3245 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 9 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said: Nobody is abiding by that. “Nobody” is extremely hyperbolic. It depends on the business. The few times I’ve been in places since indoor dining was reopened (to pickup takeout) the bar stools were all 6+ feet apart and even had Xs made from tape on the floor. It’s obviously anecdotal for both of us, but I’m not seeing this restriction affecting much in its current form given that these people who are breaking rules inside will continue to break them in these heated tents outside. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chakoo Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 8 minutes ago, Spork3245 said: They’re still allowed to be outside in those tent-things. Bar seating was six-feet apart anyway. Bar seating six-feet apart doesn't do anything either. We had that and even limited the number of people per a table and people kept ignoring it or hopping from groups of tables. There is tons of examples/proof of this in canada. Again even with tight restrictions this accounted for 43% of the spread before we went back into another lockdown. Even if it's just a few people sick this stuff causes a cascading effect because those sick people then started hanging out with families at thanksgiving and halloween and now we're up to over 1,300 cases from what started out at 200-300. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skillzdadirecta Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 4 minutes ago, Spork3245 said: “Nobody” is extremely hyperbolic. It depends on the business. The few times I’ve been in places since indoor dining was reopened (to pickup takeout) the bar stools were all 6+ feet apart and even had Xs made from tape on the floor. It’s obviously anecdotal for both of us, but I’m not seeing this restriction affecting much in its current form given that these people who are breaking rules inside will continue to break them in these heated tents outside. Ok its hyberbolic... which is why they're taking the step of basically targeting and shutting down nightlife in Jersey. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spork3245 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 Just now, chakoo said: Bar seating six-feet apart doesn't do anything either. We had that and even limited the number of people per a table and people kept ignoring it or hopping from groups of tables. There is tons of examples/proof of this in canada. Again even with tight restrictions this accounted for 43% of the spread before we went back into another lockdown. Even if it's just a few people sick this stuff causes a cascading effect because those sick people then started hanging out with families at thanksgiving and halloween and now we're up to over 1,300 cases from what started out at 200-300. I guess my argument is that it should be eliminated completely and not from 10:01-4:59 as it’s not going to affect much, especially considering the enclosed + heated tents. I also thought that the rule in NJ was that you couldn’t just order drinks anyway and had to get food as well - or is that just NY? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spork3245 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 2 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said: Ok its hyberbolic... which is why they're taking the step of basically targeting and shutting down nightlife in Jersey. Yes, saying “nobody” which infers absolute 100% is hyperbolic, completely. And they aren’t shutting down nightlife considering outside after 10pm is still fine, even in enclosed tents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chakoo Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 1 minute ago, Spork3245 said: I guess my argument is that it should be eliminated completely and not from 10:01-4:59 as it’s not going to affect much, especially considering the enclosed + heated tents. I also thought that the rule in NJ was that you couldn’t just order drinks anyway and had to get food as well - or is that just NY? Now going farther I can totally agree with you on. I think NA is due for a good lockdown soon with the rates our numbers are going. People's selfishness is leading to this being far worse than it had to be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spork3245 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 Just now, chakoo said: Now going farther I can totally agree with you on. I think NA is due for a good lockdown soon with the rates our numbers are going. People's selfishness is leading to this being far worse than it had to be. Yea, that’s completely my argument: this isn’t going far enough in its current form. 100% shutdown from 10:01-4:59 would be the better thing to do is what I’m saying. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_m_b_m_b_m Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 1 minute ago, b_m_b_m_b_m said: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSpreader Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 The justices are trying to help the GOP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_m_b_m_b_m Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 1 minute ago, Jason said: This being the covid thread, we just had a wee little discussion yesterday on the efficacy of unenforceable/unpunished mask mandates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 With North Dakota hospitals at 100% capacity, Burgum announces COVID-positive nurses can stay at work | INFORUM WWW.INFORUM.COM In an attempt to alleviate some of the staffing concerns, Burgum announced that the state health officer has amended an order that will allow health care workers with asymptomatic cases of COVID-19 to continue working in hospitals' COVID-19 units. The Republican governor said hospital administrators asked the state to take the extraordinary step. Jesus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyser_Soze Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 Nurse, if you can breathe and stand, just keep working please. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 14 minutes ago, CitizenVectron said: With North Dakota hospitals at 100% capacity, Burgum announces COVID-positive nurses can stay at work | INFORUM WWW.INFORUM.COM In an attempt to alleviate some of the staffing concerns, Burgum announced that the state health officer has amended an order that will allow health care workers with... Jesus. Now the real question is, will they be responsible enough to at least keep those nurses in the COVID ward? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyser_Soze Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chairslinger Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 With no stimulus coming and cases spiking it's nice to know people will be told to stay in their houses which they will promptly be evicted from. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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