Movies Update: New Mexico issues "maximum" fine to Rust production company after report finds "serious and willful" safety violations

[Emblazon]

Alec Baldwin Fired Prop Gun That Killed Cinematographer Halyna Hutchins, Injured Director

TRIB.AL

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Alec Baldwin fired a prop gun on a set in New Mexico, accidentally killing cinematographer Halyna Hutchins and wounding director Joel Souza.

 

[Emblazon]

You’d think that after Brandon Lee, there’d  be better safeguards in place. How does something like this even happen? And just fucking horrible. 

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

Jesus Christ

[GeneticBlueprint]

That is horrifying for literally everybody on the set.

[Derek]

Jesus. I don't even know what to say. That's terrible.

[skillzdadirecta]

This is a horrible horrible accident. A lot of people will feel awful about this... especially the propmasters who were supposed to be in charge of those weapons.

[Keyser_Soze]

Not sure how you could continue making the movie with this weighing on your mind the whole time.

[skillzdadirecta]

17 minutes ago, Emblazon said:

You’d think that after Brandon Lee, there’d  be better safeguards in place. How does something like this even happen? And just fucking horrible. 

Given how long it's been since Brandon Lee and how infrequently this happens considering how many films are shot, this is defintiely an outlier.

[Emblazon]

1 minute ago, Keyser_Soze said:

Not sure how you could continue making the movie with this weighing on your mind the whole time.

I was thinking that as well. It’s not something you can just get back to work on in a few weeks. That horror, I’m sure, lasts a lifetime. 
 

How long were they on hiatus with The Crow?

[skillzdadirecta]

11 minutes ago, Emblazon said:

I was thinking that as well. It’s not something you can just get back to work on in a few weeks. That horror, I’m sure, lasts a lifetime. 
 

How long were they on hiatus with The Crow?

A couple of years I think.

[Kal-El814]

I hope Baldwin is getting counseling and I feel terrible for the families of the victims and people responsible for the props. 

[skillzdadirecta]

Yeah I can't imagine the guilt these guys must be feeling. Fact remains that somebody fucked up badly unfortunately. This shit should NOT happen on a professional fim set.

[Jason]

 

[Fizzzzle]

1 hour ago, Jason said:

 

I said this in the other thread, but like... I don't know. This story got headlines because it involved a big name actor and a gun. Crewmembers and (especially) stuntmen die or get permanently injured on movie sets fairly often. Like multiple times a year. You're dealing with live wires, guns (even blanks are dangerous), moving vehicles, rigging, fire, controlled falls, gas, stunts... shit's dangerous.

 

Clearly some type of safety protocol was not followed in this case, and a tragic accident occurred. And I think that, in general, stuntment especially need to get paid more (as well as the crew in general, but for reasons that don't simply include danger). I just also think people are already rallying around this case as some kind of landmark event because it was a story that was easy to headline. No one cared about the crewmember who got crushed to death making Resident Evil: The Final Chapter, or the stuntwoman who got killed in a motorcycle crash filming Deadpool 2, or the stuntman who died from a fall while filming The Walking Dead, or the two pilots who died making American Made, or any number of other accidents that happen all the time.

 

On some level, it is simply a dangerous job. Obviously, all precautions should always be taken, and every time an accident happens, a full investigation should be launched into who, how, and why it happened. And any time someone is on set with moving vehicles, live guns, fire, etc, they should be compensated for hazard pay. But to use this as an example of some gross neglicence of hollywood in general is more than a bit disingenuous. It's just an easy viral headline.

[skillzdadirecta]

@Fizzzzle where are you getting that people routinely get hurt making movies? I saw the incidents you posted in the other thread and even those are a SMALL fraction of incidents when you take into account how many movies and TV shows are in production at any given moment. People do get hurt doing stunts and its a dangerous occupation, but its no where near as normal as you seem to think it is. I subscribe to several industry publications and know quite a few stunt people and these incidents are notable BECAUSE they are so rare and when they happen it's ususally because of some kind if safety protocol not being followed. Accidents like this are pretty rare on big budget sets with A list talent. Also this wasn't a stunt person that got hurt. This was the director and the D.P. Something went horribly wrong on this set for this to happen the way it did.

 

The fact that these incidents are so rare is why this so shocking, especially after all of the precautions that went into place after Brandon Lee's accident what, 30 years ago or so?

[Fizzzzle]

9 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

@Fizzzzle where are you getting that people routinely get hurt making movies? I saw the incidents you posted in the other thread and even those are a SMALL fraction of incidents when you take into account how many movies and TV shows are in production at any given moment. People do get hurt doing stunts and its a dangerous occupation, but its no where near as normal as you seem to think it is. I subscribe to several industry publications and know quite a few stunt people. Accidents like this are pretty rare on big budget sets with A list talent. Also this wasn't a stunt person that got hurt. This was the director and the D.P. Something went horribly wrong on this set for this to happen the way it did.

 

The fact that these incidents are so rare is why this so shocking, especially after all of the precautions that went into place after Brandon Lee's accident what, 30 years ago or so?

My point is why is this a big story compared to all the other people that get hurt/killed? In fact, guns with blanks seem to be one of the least likely ways to get hurt on set because people DO take it very seriously.

 

I'm probably more reacting to stuff I've seen on twitter rather than on here, but people seem to be like "WHY WERE WE EVER USING BLANKS, THIS IS UNACCEPTABLE" when I'm like... dude, multiple people die every year making movies. Of course it's a small fraction of movies in general, but an even smaller fraction of that small fraction happens from the use of blanks. Especially because of the Brandon Lee accident.

 

Basically the fact that it's shocking isn't what bothers me, it's the reaction to the shock. It was a horrible accident, not some watershed moment.

[skillzdadirecta]

1 minute ago, Fizzzzle said:

My point is why is this a big story compared to all the other people that get hurt/killed? In fact, guns with blanks seem to be one of the least likely ways to get hurt on set because people DO take it very seriously.

 

I'm probably more reacting to stuff I've seen on twitter rather than on here, but people seem to be like "WHY WERE WE EVER USING BLANKS, THIS IS UNACCEPTABLE" when I'm like... dude, multiple people die every year making movies. Of course it's a small fraction of movies in general, but an even smaller fraction of that small fraction happens from the use of blanks. Especially because of the Brandon Lee accident.

 

Basically the fact that it's shocking isn't what bothers me, it's the reaction to the shock. It was a horrible accident, not some watershed moment.

It's a horrible moment that SHOULD NOT HAVE HAPPENED. Especially with a big star like Baldwin pulling the trigger. He's a producer on this film so ultimately he himself may bear some responsibility, there is no reason that something like this should have happened in 2021. People blaming blanks are missing the point. Somebody dropped the ball BIG TIME and that's what that Tweet about IATSE was talking about. Gonna be interesting to see what the investigation turns up but I suspect there was some pressure from some one pretty high up the chain of command to cut some corners which led to this happening. That's usually what happens in these types of accidents on sets. So fucked up.

 

And Stunt men STILL don't have an oscar category... something they've been pushing for for a minute.

[Moa]

At the risk of pearl clutching, this thread title is in poor taste.

[Fizzzzle]

1 hour ago, skillzdadirecta said:

It's a horrible moment that SHOULD NOT HAVE HAPPENED. Especially with a big star like Baldwin pulling the trigger. He's a producer on this film so ultimately he himself may bear some responsibility, there is no reason that something like this should have happened in 2021. People blaming blanks are missing the point. Somebody dropped the ball BIG TIME and that's what that Tweet about IATSE was talking about. Gonna be interesting to see what the investigation turns up but I suspect there was some pressure from some one pretty high up the chain of command to cut some corners which led to this happening. That's usually what happens in these types of accidents on sets. So fucked up.

 

And Stunt men STILL don't have an oscar category... something they've been pushing for for a minute.

So we agree on basically everything, like I agree that a serious safety oversight must have happened in this case, and it should be investigated, so it should not have happened and hopefully won't happen again. So if it was a safety oversight from a rush of preparation to get the shot, which would definitely be something the IATSE would want to prosecute, then good, the rush to get a shot shouldn't override the safety of the crew. But if it was a simple mistake of like someone loading the gun and not telling anyone, or someone loading the gun and failing to tell Alec Baldwin that the gun was loaded, or Alec Baldwin not checking to see if the gun was loaded before firing, etc. Those are all things that need to be handled better. I'm never going to say that they don't need to do better. But, on a movie set, you are dealing with dangerous things. Accidents will happen.

 

And obviously I realize that dying from a gunshot should not be something that you have to think about while filming a movie.

[Brick]

Murder is too harsh to lay on Baldwin as this sounds like a freak accident, and not something he did intentionally. 

 

This is why you never point a gun, real or fake, at anyone. I vaguely remember during an episode of the second season of Project Greenlight the DOP for that Shia LaBeuf movie they were shooting yelling at some background actor for pointing his rifle at the camera. Also a recent video of Will Smith slapping a prop gun away out of some dude's hand because he was picking it up, and it was pointing at Smith 

[Mercury33]

5 hours ago, Moa said:

At the risk of pearl clutching, this thread title is in poor taste.

Agreed

[elbobo]

I'm curious to know the exact mechanics of what happened here especially with multiple people shot and it was a western film so my guess is a live shotgun round got loaded somehow or a round was fired from a handgun or rifle and went through the first person to hit the second. 

[Fizzzzle]

1 minute ago, elbobo said:

I'm curious to know the exact mechanics of what happened here especially with multiple people shot and it was a western film so my guess is a live shotgun round got loaded somehow or a round was fired from a handgun or rifle and went through the first person to hit the second. 

We don't know how it happened yet. Whether it was a situation of an accidental firing of a blank with people standing close by and Baldwin didn't know it was loaded, or if it was a situation where somehow live rounds got loaded into the gun, or whatever.

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

I changed the thread title.

[Emblazon]

Actually, it might not be far off. Not for Baldwin, but for someone—Apparently it was just released that the gun in question contained a single, live round. 
 

And I had wanted to incorporate “Rust” in the thread title, but was drawing blanks in the spur of the moment. 

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

3 minutes ago, Emblazon said:

Actually, it might not be far off. Not for Baldwin, but for someone—Apparently it was just released that the gun in question contained a single, live round. 
 

And I had wanted to incorporate “Rust” in the thread title, but was drawing blanks in the spur of the moment. 

 

Prop Gun Fired by Alec Baldwin Contained Live Bullet, Says IATSE Local 44 — UPDATE

WWW.YAHOO.COM

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The incident took place October 21 at the Bonanza Creek Ranch in Santa Fe County. It is under investigation.

 

[Ghost_MH]

9 minutes ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

 

Prop Gun Fired by Alec Baldwin Contained Live Bullet, Says IATSE Local 44 — UPDATE

WWW.YAHOO.COM

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The incident took place October 21 at the Bonanza Creek Ranch in Santa Fe County. It is under investigation.

 

 

An actual live round and not a Brandon Lee jammed bullet being fired by a blank round? If so, what and how? Was whoever it was making the blanks just miss a bullet and throw it in with the others and nobody loading the weapons notice? That still doesn't explain why Alec was pointing the gun at actual people.

[Bloodporne]

15 minutes ago, Ghost_MH said:

 

An actual live round and not a Brandon Lee jammed bullet being fired by a blank round? If so, what and how? Was whoever it was making the blanks just miss a bullet and throw it in with the others and nobody loading the weapons notice? That still doesn't explain why Alec was pointing the gun at actual people.

I mean I have no idea but weirder shit has happened...maybe it was a ricochet situation of sorts? The fact it actually killed one person and seems to have substantially injured another makes me wonder if it was something else than a straight point & shoot at the cinematographer. 

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

23 minutes ago, Ghost_MH said:

 

An actual live round and not a Brandon Lee jammed bullet being fired by a blank round? If so, what and how? Was whoever it was making the blanks just miss a bullet and throw it in with the others and nobody loading the weapons notice? That still doesn't explain why Alec was pointing the gun at actual people.

 

At this point, it's best to wait for the coroner's report as this has now gone into "What The Hell?" territory. 

[Ghost_MH]

Just now, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

At this point, it's best to wait for the coroner's report as this has now gone into "What The Hell?" territory. 

 

Yeah, there are so many things that had to have gone wrong for two people to wind up getting shot by a veteran actor/producer. It's baffling.

[Reputator]

48 minutes ago, Ghost_MH said:

 

An actual live round and not a Brandon Lee jammed bullet being fired by a blank round? If so, what and how? Was whoever it was making the blanks just miss a bullet and throw it in with the others and nobody loading the weapons notice? That still doesn't explain why Alec was pointing the gun at actual people.

 

There's definitely a LOT of questions that need answering here. I'm wondering the same things myself.

[CitizenVectron]

31 minutes ago, Bloodporne said:

I mean I have no idea but weirder shit has happened...maybe it was a ricochet situation of sorts? The fact it actually killed one person and seems to have substantially injured another makes me wonder if it was something else than a straight point & shoot at the cinematographer. 

 

My initial guess would be that it wasn't a single bullet, but some kind of shrapnel that shot out (from something in the barrel that shouldn't have been there).

[SaysWho?]

1 hour ago, Emblazon said:

Actually, it might not be far off. Not for Baldwin, but for someone—Apparently it was just released that the gun in question contained a single, live round. 
 

And I had wanted to incorporate “Rust” in the thread title, but was drawing blanks in the spur of the moment. 

 

1 hour ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

 

Prop Gun Fired by Alec Baldwin Contained Live Bullet, Says IATSE Local 44 — UPDATE

WWW.YAHOO.COM

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The incident took place October 21 at the Bonanza Creek Ranch in Santa Fe County. It is under investigation.

 

 

omg

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

IATSE Says Alec Baldwin ‘Rust’ Prop Gun Had Live Round; Cops Say “Hasn’t Been Determined”

DEADLINE.COM

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The prop gun that killed one Rust crew member & injured the director has become the focus of debate

 

Quote

 

Law enforcement do not know right now if the prop gun that Alec Baldwin fatally fired on a New Mexico film set yesterday contained a “live single round,” despite claims from an L.A. IATSE Local.

 

“We haven’t even begun the forensics on that issue,” Sante Fe County Sheriff’s Office spokesman Juan Rios told Deadline this morning. “That hasn’t been determined by us as of yet,” Officer Rios added. “We expect to have more information next week as our investigation continues.”

 

 

In regard to the union situation:

 

Quote

While there were no Local 44 members employed on the set of Rust, it is still to be determined if members of New Mexico Local 480, which covers “experienced film workers in 99 crafts within 20 departments,” according to their website, were working on the low budget Western.

 

Local 44 is based in L.A. and they're the ones claiming that it was a live round and that the propmaster was non-union, not Local 480 (the New Mexico branch).

[Keyser_Soze]

11 minutes ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

Local 44 is based in L.A. and they're the ones claiming that it was a live round and that the propmaster was non-union, not Local 480 (the New Mexico branch).

 

Was this the propmaster?

 

Spoiler