Sony PlayStation 5 OT - Play Has No Limits, update: financial report indicates no major first-party/exclusive PS5 releases prior to end of March 2025, PS5 in "latter half" of console cycle

[crispy4000]

3 minutes ago, legend said:

 

Wouldn't change my decision. I'm extremely happy that MS is putting such an effort into making all their games available on PC going forward, but for me that just means I have no reason to get an Xbox. Whereas PS5 will have exclusives I cannot play on PC.*

Until they’re ported.

[legend]

2 minutes ago, crispy4000 said:

Until they’re ported.

 

Are you holding out on GoW, Spiderman, HZD, TLoU2, Uncharted, etc. on some hope they'll eventually someday find their way to PC?

[Spork3245]

[crispy4000]

1 hour ago, legend said:

 

Are you holding out on GoW, Spiderman, HZD, TLoU2, Uncharted, etc. on some hope they'll eventually someday find their way to PC?

https://store.steampowered.com/app/1151640/Horizon_Zero_Dawn_Complete_Edition/

 

I didn’t hold out.  Well, technically I waited a few years into the generation to buy a Sony console.  But I also didn’t know Sony would be going this direction.  

 

I get the feeling we’ll be seeing PC ports of PS5 ‘exclusives’ once the SSD situation on computers catches up.

 

We’ll see more PS4 ports in the meanwhile.  Like the above.

 

I still might get a PS5 at some point, maybe a mid-cycle box.  It depends on how cheap 1st party games are there relative to PC.

[nublood]

I just spent $1100 for a gaming PC and I feel that’s pretty inexpensive. But anything over $600 for a console and I’d feel ripped off.
 

$699?? Get real. 

[JPDunks4]

1 hour ago, legend said:

 

Are you holding out on GoW, Spiderman, HZD, TLoU2, Uncharted, etc. on some hope they'll eventually someday find their way to PC?

HZD and Bloodborne are coming so far. 

 

Well at least according to pretty good sources for Bloodborne.  The report was Bloodborne Remaster coming to PS5 that can play 60fps, and also releasing on PC.

 

I think it's fair to say Sony will be porting over all their exclusives to PC over time.  Def not going Microsofts route of Day and Date, but it wouldn't shock me if they try to launch on PC a few years after.  There's a reason they rebranded their studios to Playstation Studios or whatever its called now.

[Xbob42]

22 minutes ago, nublood said:

I just spent $1100 for a gaming PC and I feel that’s pretty inexpensive. But anything over $600 for a console and I’d feel ripped off.
 

$699?? Get real. 

Well yeah, $1100 for a PC, while not cheap, is not terribly pricey "for a PC." But you also don't need to buy multiple different brands of PCs for exclusive games. Not yet anyway. Your PC is also capable of doing things besides just being a game box. Most people, or at least adults into gaming, seem to buy multiple consoles, so when I think of it like that, even an extra hundred bucks can start to add up if you're the multi-console type, especially if you factor in early adopter issues and mid-gen refresh possibilities. PC's got the ever-expanding upgrade cycle as well of course, although it has slowed down tremendously since the early 2000s.

 

I think $400 really is a tremendous sweet spot for a high-end console. The power for performance is typically extremely good, and without mid-gen refreshes, it's a good 7-10 year investment most of the time. Although if you compare PCs or console to $1k+ phones that release annually and have a monthly fee just to be functional just about everything seems super affordable!

24 minutes ago, JPDunks4 said:

HZD and Bloodborne are coming so far. 

 

Well at least according to pretty good sources for Bloodborne.  The report was Bloodborne Remaster coming to PS5 that can play 60fps, and also releasing on PC.

 

I think it's fair to say Sony will be porting over all their exclusives to PC over time.  Def not going Microsofts route of Day and Date, but it wouldn't shock me if they try to launch on PC a few years after.  There's a reason they rebranded their studios to Playstation Studios or whatever its called now.

I'm not yet nearly confident enough to assume all exclusives will come over, but I imagine if the PC versions of their games do exceptionally well then that likelihood skyrockets, obviously. I had not considered that angle of rebranded studios, so that actually gets me a little curious about their long-term intents. I definitely don't expect day-and-date at any point since the timed exclusivity would get them both double dippers and keep their console relevant.

[Keyser_Soze]

2 hours ago, legend said:

 

Are you holding out on HZD, on some hope they'll eventually someday find their way to PC?

 

 

(Hey it's too late but nobody tell him)

[SaysWho?]

12 hours ago, Xbob42 said:

Yeah but Sony's so much smaller than Microsoft. I always find it a little weird that they don't try to compete at a higher level while leveraging their tremendous wealth. Guess they gotta keep their losses in check and obviously you're not gonna find many companies wanting to throw away tons of money just to beat down the competition, but they always seem to just compete at the same level or lower, like the fucking Zune.

 

I think you hit the nail on the head. I don't feel like a ton of big companies really kill the competition? I mean, WWE did. Fucking A....

[crispy4000]

1 hour ago, Xbob42 said:

Well yeah, $1100 for a PC, while not cheap, is not terribly pricey "for a PC." But you also don't need to buy multiple different brands of PCs for exclusive games. Not yet anyway. Your PC is also capable of doing things besides just being a game box. Most people, or at least adults into gaming, seem to buy multiple consoles, so when I think of it like that, even an extra hundred bucks can start to add up if you're the multi-console type, especially if you factor in early adopter issues and mid-gen refresh possibilities. PC's got the ever-expanding upgrade cycle as well of course, although it has slowed down tremendously since the early 2000s.

 

You don't even need to spend $800+ for a PC unless you want it to blow consoles out of the water.  Regardless, the best time to build new isn't now.  It'll be 2 or so years into the next gen.
 

Also, the way I see it, $100 spent on PC games goes much further than consoles.  So many competing storefronts means better deals and bundles generally.  Occasionally console game deals can be cheaper, including the used market, but it's the exception not the norm.

 

Epic's free giveaways alone would be worth the price of a monthly subscription.  Then if you've got Amazon Prime, there's the dozen or so games Twitch gives out a month.  You can earn wallet credit on Steam pretty easily (I make a $50 a year).  You get so much added value just for being on PC.  No online fees either!

[Duderino]

16 hours ago, Xbob42 said:

The only thing that felt "next-gen" like this in the PS5 presentation for me was the Ratchet and Clank transitions, which were a lot of fun, even if the multi-second buffers between dimensions were a far cry from "zero load times," it was still dramatically faster than anything we've seen lately.

In terms of how gaming could evolve in the upcoming generation, this stands out as a notable "next-gen" leap.  It very clearly illustrates how the PS5 can lead to new experiences not possible on the PS4/XBO.

 

Raytracing has the potential to do the same, but currently we are lacking a killer demonstration of how it can lead to new gaming possibilities in the XSX/PS5 era.  Minecraft's path tracing looks great, but I don't think it is the game to really sell that.

 

Hoping that the Xbox July event games will tackle this by showing us some crazy new utilities of the tech that apply to game design.

[crispy4000]

1 hour ago, Duderino said:

In terms of how gaming could evolve in the upcoming generation, this stands out as a notable "next-gen" leap.  It very clearly illustrates how the PS5 can lead to new experiences not possible on the PS4/XBO.

 

Raytracing has the potential to do the same, but currently we are lacking a killer demonstration of how it can lead to new gaming possibilities in the XSX/PS5 era.  Minecraft's path tracing looks great, but I don't think it is the game to really sell that.

 

Hoping that the Xbox July event games will tackle this by showing us some crazy new utilities of the tech that apply to game design.

 

With raytracing?  There’s as much of a possibility of that as the 3DS has with 3D.  It’s hard to build new gameplay experiences around new rendering techniques.

 

Best I can think of is some maze of mirrors type of thing.

[crispy4000]

11 minutes ago, legend said:

 

Funny timing  So in this case, your hope got you one from the list I made. Yay? 

 

If Sony does start making an effort to have all their exclusives come to PC to the same degree MS is, then it will indeed be the same situation and PC gamers won't have much reason for owning PS5 either. But we're still not there yet.

We’ve known for a while.  Honestly, I never hoped for it before it was announced.  Several more games are heavily rumored to make the transition as well.  Dreams, Bloodborne, etc.

 

I don’t think Sony is headed down Microsoft’s path either.  But timed exclusivity is still much different than real exclusivity.  Horizon coming to PC strongly signals that could be the future. 

[legend]

1 minute ago, crispy4000 said:

We’ve known for a while.  Several more games are heavily rumored to make the transition as well.  Dreams, Bloodborne, etc.

 

I don’t think Sony is headed down Microsoft’s path either.  But timed exclusivity is much different than real exclusivity.  Horizon coming to PC strongly signals that could be the future. 

 

I wouldn't bank on seeing it for all of them. But if that that does appear to change by the time you'd be considering getting a PS5 anyway, then by all means hold out. I would too, although I suspect I'll be getting a PS5 sooner than I'd expect to see a large scale shift in this policy, if it ever happens, anyway.

[crispy4000]

8 minutes ago, legend said:

 

I wouldn't bank on seeing it for all of them. But if that that does appear to change by the time you'd be considering getting a PS5 anyway, then by all means hold out. I would too, although I suspect I'll be getting a PS5 sooner than I'd expect to see a large scale shift in this policy, if it ever happens, anyway.

It’s completely uncharted territory.  Sony’s showing a willingness to port.  We don’t know when or how many, just that they’re willing to with one of their biggest properties.  And will likely do others.

 

What I will say is that I’d rather own Sony’s games on PC in the long term.  And that by nature, I’m a patient gamer.  But we’ll have to see how it shakes out.  I wouldn’t be jumping into the PS5 straight away anyways.  All the games will be full price. 

[legend]

1 minute ago, crispy4000 said:

It’s completely uncharted territory.  Sony’s showing a willingness to port.  We don’t know when or how many, just that they’re willing to with one of their biggest properties.  And will likely do others.

 

What I will say is that I’d rather own Sony’s games on PC in the long term.  And that by nature, I’m a patient gamer.  Though we’ll have to see how it shakes out.  I wouldn’t be jumping into the PS5 straight away anyways.  All the games will be full price. 

 

Well, by all means, if you want to wait and hope, go for it

[crispy4000]

5 minutes ago, legend said:

 

Well, by all means, if you want to wait and hope, go for it

Also... I want to know where these consoles come up short.  And what we’ll be pining for in a revision.  As much of that is on AMD as the platform holders.

 

I want a competitive answer to DLSS.

[Greatoneshere]

12 minutes ago, crispy4000 said:

It’s completely uncharted territory.  Sony’s showing a willingness to port.  We don’t know when or how many, just that they’re willing to with one of their biggest properties.  And will likely do others.

 

What I will say is that I’d rather own Sony’s games on PC in the long term.  And that by nature, I’m a patient gamer.  But we’ll have to see how it shakes out.  I wouldn’t be jumping into the PS5 straight away anyways.  All the games will be full price. 

 

I'm in the same boat. I'm day one for PS5 if Sony's games stay exclusive, but if they port them over eventually, well, there's dozens of other games I want to play so I am more than happy to wait. I think Sony should port because they are leaving money on the table, but I won't need a PS5 if they do. 

[legend]

18 minutes ago, crispy4000 said:

Also... I want to know where these consoles come up short.  And what we’ll be pining for in a revision.  As much of that is on AMD as the platform holders.

 

I want a competitive answer to DLSS.

 

Yeah I would love for AMD to start competing more in the GPU market. 

[crispy4000]

1 hour ago, legend said:

 

Yeah I would love for AMD to start competing more in the GPU market. 

It just means the GPU side of things could be a lot more cost/value effective on PC than previous console generations (which is awesome).  On consoles, devs have largely stopped trying to get fancy with upscaling lately.  It’s not a given at all.  Whereas DLSS 2.0 seems like it’ll be the probable future on PC.

 

On the flip side, I expect consoles to have an edge with SSDs for a while.

[chakoo]

3 hours ago, crispy4000 said:

 

With raytracing?  There’s as much of a possibility of that as the 3DS has with 3D.  It’s hard to build new gameplay experiences around new rendering techniques.

 

Best I can think of is some maze of mirrors type of thing.

Yup. Raytracing is a fundamental shift in graphics pipelines that will take a few years to really bear fruit. Much like G-Buffers led to deferred rendering which lead to PBR. Quake RTX and Mindcraft RTX give us a nice hint of what you can do when you build your pipeline around it (vs just sprinkling it on like other games are) but it will be a while before it is fully exploited in ways that lead to people coming up with new game ideas that take advantage of it. 

[AbsolutSurgen]

3 hours ago, crispy4000 said:

Also... I want to know where these consoles come up short.  And what we’ll be pining for in a revision.  As much of that is on AMD as the platform holders.

 

I want a competitive answer to DLSS.

DLSS uses the tensor cores, AFAIK AMD doers not have something similar on the PS5 chips.

(NVidia is devoting ~50% of an RTX chip to RT/Tensor cores -- AMD can't just "do" what RTX chips are doing for free.)

[crispy4000]

2 minutes ago, AbsolutSurgen said:

DLSS uses the tensor cores, AFAIK AMD doers not have something similar on the PS5 chips.

(NVidia is devoting ~50% of an RTX chip to RT/Tensor cores -- AMD can't just "do" what RTX chips are doing for free.)

Well, yes.  I was meaning some kind of software solution that devs could employ universally.  Checkerboarding 2.0 if you will.  Just something that iterates on what we saw this gen that gives their cards more of a fighting chance and the consoles a boost.

[crispy4000]

 

[Keyser_Soze]

6 hours ago, crispy4000 said:

It’s completely uncharted territory.  Sony’s showing a willingness to port.

 

[Jason]

On 6/11/2020 at 5:55 PM, ManUtdRedDevils said:

 

I was thinking Frieza but this works too. 

[Xbob42]

10 hours ago, crispy4000 said:

On the flip side, I expect consoles to have an edge with SSDs for a while.

Well, if by "consoles" you mean just PS5, then sure. Would've been far more immediately impactful if both consoles used this architecture because as it stands the chances of it being utilized outside of first party (and the very rare true exclusive third party) PS5 games is virtually nil.

[crispy4000]

4 hours ago, Xbob42 said:

Well, if by "consoles" you mean just PS5, then sure. Would've been far more immediately impactful if both consoles used this architecture because as it stands the chances of it being utilized outside of first party (and the very rare true exclusive third party) PS5 games is virtually nil.

I wouldn’t be surprised if Series X had some slight edge over PC with their SSD at launch due to the optimizations they’re also making.  Reducing bottlenecks is what the consoles do well, and that appears to be much more important than raw numbers with these drives.  Watch the LinusTechTips apology video.
 

As for PS5 exclusives being the only ones to take true advantage, I would have agreed with you before we saw what UE5 was doing.  Now it depends on how scalable their tech is, how widely adopted their pipeline is, etc.

[Xbob42]

1 minute ago, crispy4000 said:

As for PS5 exclusives being the only ones to take true advantage, I would have agreed with you before we saw what UE5 was doing.  Now it depends on how scalable their tech is, how widely adopted their pipeline is, etc.

I think for any impact you'd expect from gameplay to matter, it wouldn't be a multiplatform game, otherwise it's just for convenience and speed rather than fun stuff.

[crispy4000]

19 minutes ago, Xbob42 said:

I think for any impact you'd expect from gameplay to matter, it wouldn't be a multiplatform game, otherwise it's just for convenience and speed rather than fun stuff.

If you narrow it just to gameplay defining features, then sure.  Something like Ratchet may not be able to be ported for quite a while.

 

But that’s just a slice of the larger picture.  Epic made a pretty strong case for SSD optimizations going hand in hand with visual fidelity in the future.

 

And when PC SSD’s eventually do catch up, it’s going to be absolutely nuts.  UE5 nannite + DLSS 2.0 +  new RTX Line ..... it could feel like a next gen leap within a console generation.

[Xbob42]

I can't wait! Been a while since we had so much new tech to look forward to, both in the console and PC space!

[Mr.Vic20]

I personally think that the PC architecture issue will likely be addressed right around the same time UE5 engine games are actually a thing and not just hype demos. According to Tim Sweeney UE5 won't even be fully available to developers until the end of 2021. So at best there might be a handful of games using it by Summer 2022. That's a long time in PC terms to make some changes both at the OS/API levels and hardware. 

[Remarkableriots]

https://www.cnet.com/news/sonys-ps5-design-is-bold-daring-and-future-facing-playstation-ceo-says/?ftag=CAD-03-10aaj8

Quote

"We wanted to do something that was bold and daring almost," said Sony's PlayStation CEO Jim Ryan in an interview with CNET following the company's reveal Thursday. "We wanted something forward facing and future facing, something for the 2020s."

[skillzdadirecta]

On 6/12/2020 at 8:38 PM, Chairslinger said:

 

People keep bitching about this, but the number of copies it sells on next gen systems alone will still probably be more than 99.9% of games can ever hope to sell(10-30 million?).

 

 

And it will be the 4th time I will have bought it myself so I'm part of the problem 

 

 

[SaysWho?]

 

These fuckers make me wish I was clever like them.