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The Snyder Cut is real...and it's SPECTACULAR!


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Had to skip to the end here. Trying to avoid spoilers because I still haven't seen this movie, so, is this director's cut worth watching for 4 hours over the theatrical release? Are the action sequences overall fun at all? It's what I liked the most from BvS, which I found pretty meh otherwise.

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32 minutes ago, Joestradamus said:

Had to skip to the end here. Trying to avoid spoilers because I still haven't seen this movie, so, is this director's cut worth watching for 4 hours over the theatrical release? Are the action sequences overall fun at all? It's what I liked the most from BvS, which I found pretty meh otherwise.


The action scenes are generally pretty good. If you like Snyder action in general you’ll probably like what you get here. 

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54 minutes ago, Brick said:

People (idiots) complain about POC taking the role of a white comic book character, but if anyone deserves to have their race changed it's Aquaman being played by a Pacific Islander! 

Of all the superheroes put into the movies so far, the only ones that are defined by their race are Black Panther and maybe Captain America (at least his MCU iteration).

 

We see there are black Amazons. Superman is literally an alien. Bruce Wayne and Tony Stark are just rich. Race isn't an important part of their characters.

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8 minutes ago, Fizzzzle said:

Of all the superheroes put into the movies so far, the only ones that are defined by their race are Black Panther and maybe Captain America (at least his MCU iteration).

 

We see there are black Amazons. Superman is literally an alien. Bruce Wayne and Tony Stark are just rich. Race isn't an important part of their characters.

 

Pretty much. Unless their race is part of the actual characterization in some way, there's no reason swapping their race from a White person to a POC should be an issue.

 

I would say maybe Batman makes sense to have as White though because the Wayne family is generations of wealth, and you just don't have that yet in America. In 200 years if the character is still around, sure you could have an American family that are a minority race, and Bruce is coming from generational wealth. Even then though there's no reason you couldn't have his father, and the Wayne side of the family White, but his mother is a Chinese woman from a wealthy business family, in fact I think there's a comic run now about the Batman characters in high school, and that's exactly what they did, so Bruce is half Asian. 

 

Then again we're talking about a man who dresses up as a bat and fights crime with high tech gadgets, so what does it really matter to be realistic about wealthy POC families in America? :p

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Finished the movie.

 

Good things: The characters actually all have stuff to do in this version, so that's cool.

 

Bad things: Definitely not worth watching for 4 hours. During some of fight scenes around the middle of the movie I just started browsing reddit.

 

Honestly though, it does make me want to see more. I like Ben Affleck as Batman. I like Gal Gadot as Wonder Woman, even if WW 1984 was kind of blegh.

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1 hour ago, Brick said:

 

Pretty much. Unless their race is part of the actual characterization in some way, there's no reason swapping their race from a White person to a POC should be an issue.

 

I would say maybe Batman makes sense to have as White though because the Wayne family is generations of wealth, and you just don't have that yet in America. In 200 years if the character is still around, sure you could have an American family that are a minority race, and Bruce is coming from generational wealth. Even then though there's no reason you couldn't have his father, and the Wayne side of the family White, but his mother is a Chinese woman from a wealthy business family, in fact I think there's a comic run now about the Batman characters in high school, and that's exactly what they did, so Bruce is half Asian. 

 

Then again we're talking about a man who dresses up as a bat and fights crime with high tech gadgets, so what does it really matter to be realistic about wealthy POC families in America? :p

There’s old Black money in America... just not as old as white money. There are prominent black families whose forbears were freed slaves who started businesses and passed the wealth down generationally. There’s a book I read years ago called “Our Kind of People” that talks about this little known segment of black society.

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3 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

There’s old Black money in America... just not as old as white money. There are prominent black families whose forbears were freed slaves who started businesses and passed the wealth down generationally. There’s a book I read years ago called “Our Kind of People” that talks about this little known segment of black society.

 

Sure, but not as much, or as far back as old White money in America, which is what I'm getting at. Some of the comics that have gone into the history of the Wayne family tell about how the Wayne family dynasty goes back centuries, and centuries, hence why they're multi billionaires. 

 

Again though in a couple more generations I don't see why they couldn't make a Black Bruce Wayne without anyone batting an eye (pun intended). 

 

This reminds me of someone that was discussing Michael Clarke Duncan as The Kingpin in Daredevil, and they weren't really for it not because of racist views, but because Wilson Fisk is supposed to operate in secret; a normal businessman to the everyday public, but a criminal mastermind unbeknownst to them all. A Black business tycoon (at least in 2003) would raise a few eyebrows (which also reminds me of the movie American Gangster, which I thought was a great movie, and there's a line in it where Russell Crowe's character tells the other law enforcement men how the leader of this gang is Black, and they don't believe him). That's not too bad of a reasoning, but then again MCD was a beast, and killed it in that otherwise forgetful movie, so who really cares? Plus how many actors are that size? 

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5 minutes ago, Brick said:

 

Sure, but not as much, or as far back as old White money in America, which is what I'm getting at. 

28 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

There’s old Black money in America... just not as old as white money.

 

 

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i don’t think you even need bruce wayne to come from generational wealth. i know some of you are dedicated to what makes these characters who they are but you can just make his family billionaires going back as far as you want. great grandparent or just his father. who cares batman is batman. 

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I find the first 2.5 parts of the movie to be a slog. Some good scenes in there, but overall very slow with a lot of unfinished CGI and as someone mentioned earlier, some bad music choices. But then I started enjoying the fuck out of the entire movie, especially from Stryker-island onward. Even the score got drastically better, and for once the WW music riff when she faces off with Steppenwolf doesn't feel out of place like it did in her stand-alone movies and BvS.

 

I rewatched the Whedon version not too long ago, so it's fairly fresh in my memory.  The Snyder Cut is visually superior in every way.  I seriously cannot understand Whedon leading off his version with the absolutely terrible CGI on Cavill's face.  What a way to bias the viewers' perception from the get-go.  But even discounting that decision, every comparable shot in the Synder Cut is better than Whedon's.

 

I love all of the extended cuts for the fight scenes.

 

The visual effects (energy beams, lightning) look much better than Whedon's cut.

 

The Batman shots look like a comic page brought to life.

 

Steppenwolf isn't a complete goofball.  Seems to be a Whedon trait to make villains hokey.  Loki in the Avengers is unironically goofier than he is in any other MCU movie.

 

And the ending is so much fun for DC nerds.

 

 

On 3/18/2021 at 5:26 PM, Kal-El814 said:

This fight scene is still cool. I miss Batman mentoring Flash a little though, I liked that part of the original cut.

 

In the Whedon Cut, Flash really needed that motivation to "save just one person".  But in the Snyder Cut, Flash had already saved that one wiener.  #alreadyahero

 

On 3/19/2021 at 12:30 AM, skillzdadirecta said:

Zeus along with Artemis and Ares... I want to see THAT movie. The movie about the first Apocalyptian invasion. I was having a conversation with @Mercury33offline and as much as I liked that sequence, i think having Darkseid get his ass kicked was a mistake. It diminshes his menace and threat. He should have been saved for the end and shouldn;t have been at the head of that invasion.

 

That would have definitely made more sense, given that Superman had only been Earth's protector for only... a decade?  The narrative would have been more consistent if only Steppenwolf had been on Earth, found the Anti-Life Equation, got his ass kicked and then immediately banished taking the secret with him.  The way we have it now we have to assume Darkseid got his ass kicked and then just forgot where Earth was, lol.

 

 

 

On 3/19/2021 at 12:16 PM, Kal-El814 said:

The hot dog is the funniest thing Snyder has ever shot, there’s no denying that.

 

On 3/19/2021 at 1:53 PM, skillzdadirecta said:

It was incredibly creepy... I thought so as well. The Hot dog was just the phallic, subliminal icing on the cake. I was half expecting him to start gently rubbing the hot dog across her lips before he actually saved her :lol:

 

When subtext is so obvious it becomes text.  I laughed so hard at the first sight of the hot dogs, their phallic-ness and the way Barry was looking at Iris was creepy and hysterically out of place.  I had no idea what he was going to do with one when he grabbed it.  Despite the entire scene being in slow motion, when he did that my perception slowed down even more, lol.

 

 

 

20 hours ago, Joestradamus said:

Had to skip to the end here. Trying to avoid spoilers because I still haven't seen this movie, so, is this director's cut worth watching for 4 hours over the theatrical release? Are the action sequences overall fun at all? It's what I liked the most from BvS, which I found pretty meh otherwise.

 

Yes, the action is great and an improvement over the original release.

 

16 hours ago, johnny said:

i don’t think you even need bruce wayne to come from generational wealth. i know some of you are dedicated to what makes these characters who they are but you can just make his family billionaires going back as far as you want. great grandparent or just his father. who cares batman is batman. 

 

Set Batman in the present day as Middle-Eastern.  His family's wealth comes from Big Oil.

 

Set Batman in the near future.  His family wealth comes from a cryptomining Asian gamer.  His mom or dad was a good guy who donated millions to unsuspecting Twitch streamers.  He's also the only person Superman fears, because aside from Batman he is also known as the Crypto-Knight!

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Well i liked that quite a bit more than the other version, really wasn't expecting it to be so much different, especially the cyborg and Steppinwolf scenes, wasn't perfect but significantly better IMO.

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I liked it.  Shrug.  There's a couple of scenes I wouldn't have minded cutting out and saving 5 minutes, but it blows my mind there's a version of the movie with barely any of the Joe Morton character and less Cyborg.  I'm not totally crazy with the character design, but if he didn't have a full arc, what's the use of bringing him in?

 

Anyway, it's better than CATS.

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10 minutes ago, Bitgod said:

I liked it.  Shrug.  There's a couple of scenes I wouldn't have minded cutting out and saving 5 minutes, but it blows my mind there's a version of the movie with barely any of the Joe Morton character and less Cyborg.  I'm not totally crazy with the character design, but if he didn't have a full arc, what's the use of bringing him in?

 

Anyway, it's better than CATS.

 

I hope there's a buttholes cut if justice League coming out next. 

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5 hours ago, johnny said:

i don’t think you even need bruce wayne to come from generational wealth. i know some of you are dedicated to what makes these characters who they are but you can just make his family billionaires going back as far as you want. great grandparent or just his father. who cares batman is batman. 

Bruce Wayne isn’t even a billionaire in the comics anymore :lol: He lost his fortune when the Joker took over the Wayne Foundation during Joker War. They got the money back but now the fortune is controlled by Lucas Fox and his family... who are black :shh:

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16 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

They got the money back but now the fortune is controlled by Lucas Fox and his family... who are black :shh:

 

Any relation to Rick Fox?

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1 hour ago, skillzdadirecta said:

Bruce Wayne isn’t even a billionaire in the comics anymore :lol: He lost his fortune when the Joker took over the Wayne Foundation during Joker War. They got the money back but now the fortune is controlled by Lucas Fox and his family... who are black :shh:

 

OK now you're acting as if I said there aren't any wealthy Black families in America, which is not at all what I said. 

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24 minutes ago, Brick said:

 

OK now you're acting as if I said there aren't any wealthy Black families in America, which is not at all what I said. 

Project much? I didn't say anything of the kind and wasn't even referring to you anymore... I was just pointing out that Batman ISN'T a billionaire anymore and being rich whether its generational wealth or not isn't essential to his character. Stop being so sensitive. A Black Batman makes a hell of a lot more sense to me than a Black Superman :shrug:

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I watched the first 30 minutes this morning with an open mind and it’s certainly well shot. I can see why people are preferring it over the theatrical. It does feel like one’s individual vision rather than the Frankenstein of a movie we got in theaters. There is certainly good stuff here, even if some of it falls apart if I think too much. Some of it is unintentionally funny because it’s Zach going full Snyder, but at least I’m entertained watching it during those parts.

 

But this absolutely has no rhythm. It’s a collection of scenes, and those individual scenes themselves go on too long. There is no sense of propulsion, scenes don’t build upon each. I’ll try to watch more over the next few days because apparently it picks up in the second half, but i absolutely cannot imagine watching this is one setting. This is something that only can work as a home viewing experience IMO.

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That whole alternate timeline sequence was weird to say the least. Especially because it seems clear that flash is the only one that understands the alternate timeline thing, as he's essentially the one who creates them as far as I remember.

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3 hours ago, skillzdadirecta said:
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WWW.FORBES.COM

Snyder seems to have a hit with both fans and critics with his cut of Justice League on HBO Max.

For what this is worth lol!

Its fallen half a point since this was written, but overall yeah, its better than the rest of DCs offerings.

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I went in with very low expectations and was pleasantly surprised. I hated batman vs superman and found the Whedon JL to be completely forgettable nothing.

 

Pros

It is 4 hours long and honestly doesn't drag at all, this is the biggest accomplishment of this movie.

 

Cyborg, goes from barely being in the Whedon cut to becoming a fully introduced, developed and realized character.

 

Steppenwolf gets a bit more character than the original version, still very thin but something is better than nothing.

 

Superspeed and how it depicted, even WW's "mild" superspeed looked impressive and Flash's feats especially at the end are some of the high points of the movie.

 

How to balance Superman with other characters that should be vastly weaker than him, you don't. So its always funny to figure out how they are going to balance a character that can push planets out of their orbit with a rich guy that works out a lot. I love that they just let Superman be an unstoppable god monster that absolutely wrecks the main badguy that everyone else couldn't handle even when they teamed up.

 

 

Cons

So much unnecessary slowmo, I know it ZS but do we really need a slowmo shot of Aquaman drinking whiskey.

 

Speaking of Aquaman he didn't talk to a single fish in all 4 hours.

 

ZS's weird obsession with hymnal music, I don't think it fit a single scene it was used in.

 

Darkseid's introduction, so this is supposed to be the megabad galactic level end boss of the DCU but they introduce him by having almost get killed by Ares who was killed by WW who is not even the strongest member of the JL.

 

Martian Manhunter, bizarre way to bring in the character. Just "hi I'm here"

 

Epilogue, up until the epilogue I was thinking "wow I would actually like to see a ZS directed sequel to this movie". After the epilogue which feels like it was parts of 3 sequential sequels I am not so sure.

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I did it. I re-watched BvS.  It's still not good.  The best thing about it is at least Justice League does better with the crap it was handed.  I need to re-watch MoS again, but it really does feel like all three of those movies are one big continuous story.

 

Sadly, the one aspect that ruins the entire movie is Lex Luthor.  If he is reworked, maybe even removed, there's probably a decent film in there.  But, and I know this is going to sound ironic in today's world, I absolutely hate how Jesse "Zuckerberg" Luthor's evil plan is to manipulate the heroes not using social media, but regular media - the news and snail-mail letters.  The World's Greatest Detective and an investigative journalist are duped by a troll account.  It's so frustrating that perhaps the irony and social commentary there was intentional, but I can't buy that because the movie never goes out of its way to point it while it loves to preach to us about God's responsibility.

 

Luthor's attempted mass social manipulation also impacts the other important problem I have:  Nothing feels earned.  The pinnacle of this being Superman's death.  It's hard for me to believe this movie has showed us that Luthor did successfully frame Superman's public popularity, and then that same population gives a crap about him being dead instead of "blaming him for bringing Doomsday (Zod) to this world in the first place".

 

3 hours ago, elbobo said:

Darkseid's introduction, so this is supposed to be the megabad galactic level end boss of the DCU but they introduce him by having almost get killed by Ares who was killed by WW who is not even the strongest member of the JL.

 

And oddly it seems like he re-used the shot of Darkseid slamming the ground to reveal the Anti-Life Equation with Steppenwolf, only mirrored and removed some CGI characters.  I'd bet it was not supposed to be Darkseid laying siege, but they wanted more screen time so they shoe-horned him in.

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After watching this, I'm surprised at the number of people that think this is a good movie. This is not the complete train wreck the theatrical release is, but as far as I'm concerned it's still a remarkably bad movie. Sure, Cyborg is a character as opposed to not being one, but the rest of the League is free from any development. Sure, the villian has a motivation, but he's also reduced to being a glorified henchman, while Darksied does all of nothing other than appear in a LOTR style flashback. The mcguffins are better explained in this, but they're still stupid and they added a whole new mcguffin that isn't explained at all. Some of the action is slightly better, but that was far from the biggest sin of the original.

 

As far as I'm concerned, this is a film that is still fighting in the dumpster to be king of the trash pile. I haven't re-watched BvS or the theatrical release, but it's clearly still in a league with those films rather than contending to be an actually decent film like Wonder Woman or most of the MCU.

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2 hours ago, TwinIon said:

After watching this, I'm surprised at the number of people that think this is a good movie. This is not the complete train wreck the theatrical release is, but as far as I'm concerned it's still a remarkably bad movie. Sure, Cyborg is a character as opposed to not being one, but the rest of the League is free from any development. Sure, the villian has a motivation, but he's also reduced to being a glorified henchman, while Darksied does all of nothing other than appear in a LOTR style flashback. The mcguffins are better explained in this, but they're still stupid and they added a whole new mcguffin that isn't explained at all. Some of the action is slightly better, but that was far from the biggest sin of the original.

 

As far as I'm concerned, this is a film that is still fighting in the dumpster to be king of the trash pile. I haven't re-watched BvS or the theatrical release, but it's clearly still in a league with those films rather than contending to be an actually decent film like Wonder Woman or most of the MCU.


Nope

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8 hours ago, cusideabelincoln said:

I did it. I re-watched BvS.  It's still not good.  The best thing about it is at least Justice League does better with the crap it was handed.  I need to re-watch MoS again, but it really does feel like all three of those movies are one big continuous story.

 

Sadly, the one aspect that ruins the entire movie is Lex Luthor.  If he is reworked, maybe even removed, there's probably a decent film in there.  But, and I know this is going to sound ironic in today's world, I absolutely hate how Jesse "Zuckerberg" Luthor's evil plan is to manipulate the heroes not using social media, but regular media - the news and snail-mail letters.  The World's Greatest Detective and an investigative journalist are duped by a troll account.  It's so frustrating that perhaps the irony and social commentary there was intentional, but I can't buy that because the movie never goes out of its way to point it while it loves to preach to us about God's responsibility.

 

Luthor's attempted mass social manipulation also impacts the other important problem I have:  Nothing feels earned.  The pinnacle of this being Superman's death.  It's hard for me to believe this movie has showed us that Luthor did successfully frame Superman's public popularity, and then that same population gives a crap about him being dead instead of "blaming him for bringing Doomsday (Zod) to this world in the first place".

A lot of this stems from Snyder’s complete lack of interest in developing the human side of characters like Superman. Clark has to work at the Daily Planet because he does in the comics, but he has no real reason to. He has no education in the field and in BvS they establish that Metropolis and Gotham are sister cities... and Clark doesn’t know who Bruce Wayne is. But if Clark and Lois work for The Daily Planet then of course that’s what Luthor is going to attack even if it makes no sense. 
 

8 hours ago, cusideabelincoln said:

And oddly it seems like he re-used the shot of Darkseid slamming the ground to reveal the Anti-Life Equation with Steppenwolf, only mirrored and removed some CGI characters.  I'd bet it was not supposed to be Darkseid laying siege, but they wanted more screen time so they shoe-horned him in.


I agree with this. It makes no sense to have Darkseid reveal the anti-life then be surprised when Steppenwolf finds it, then not immediately boom tube to earth to get it. 
 

3 hours ago, TwinIon said:

After watching this, I'm surprised at the number of people that think this is a good movie. This is not the complete train wreck the theatrical release is, but as far as I'm concerned it's still a remarkably bad movie. Sure, Cyborg is a character as opposed to not being one, but the rest of the League is free from any development. Sure, the villian has a motivation, but he's also reduced to being a glorified henchman, while Darksied does all of nothing other than appear in a LOTR style flashback. The mcguffins are better explained in this, but they're still stupid and they added a whole new mcguffin that isn't explained at all. Some of the action is slightly better, but that was far from the biggest sin of the original.

 

As far as I'm concerned, this is a film that is still fighting in the dumpster to be king of the trash pile. I haven't re-watched BvS or the theatrical release, but it's clearly still in a league with those films rather than contending to be an actually decent film like Wonder Woman or most of the MCU.


Yeah agreed. I’m surprised to find that I think there’s a good 2+ hour movie in the Snyder Cut, but as it is it’s not good. There are some really good moments and scenes but the cut as is remains a mess. 

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