General Entertainment Update: Netflix begins "right-sizing" its workforce (i.e., layoffs)

[DarkStar189]

2 hours ago, ManUtdRedDevils said:

The Rise of Netflix Competitors Has Pushed Consumers Back Toward Piracy

WWW.VICE.COM

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BitTorrent usage has bounced back because there's too many streaming services, and too much exclusive content.

As we all knew was bound to happen once a million competitors joined. I look forward to the consolidation that will happen. 

Will it eventually turn into cable all over again? We'll have like 2 services that have bought everything up or merged together. And for $40/50/60 a month you get all these shows in one package?  Shit.... I realized I'm probably paying close to that now for all the services I have. If I didn't have kids I'd cut all but one or two. 

[TwinIon]

14 hours ago, BloodyHell said:

Yeah, its definitely an adjustment from just a few years ago when they were the only game in town. People were always going to pick and choose, and sub for a month here and there to some, and always for others. The infinite growth of being the only player can't last forever.

 

But also, Netflix has pissed people off. Every show gets canceled before it's natural end. I think Last Kigdom is one of the few that got one. 

If a show underperformed, fucking write better, and direct better, Don't just bail after 8 episodes on everything that isn't immediately loved. That has certainly been a reason im subbed to them for fewer months every year, while I generally have hbo, and now Disney year round. Prime Video is just in my Amazon Prime sub, and honestly, I watch it more than Netflix too. Re-watching BSG now. 

 

I feel like I've seen a lot of talk about shows getting canned by Netflix, but are they really any worse than anyone else? When I look through the list of canceled Netflix shows, most of the shows I actually watched and liked got more than one season, and they're the kind of shows that wouldn't have existed pre-Netflix. Shows like Sense8, Lady Dynamite, and American Vandal.

 

I'll concede that of the 71 shows listed at that link, 43 of them only got one season, but of those the only two I watched were Tuca & Bertie and Cowboy Bebop, and only the former deserved more (which it ended up getting from Cartoon Network).

 

Maybe it's just because of the shows that I actually watch on Netflix, but my overall impression is that they generally give shows more time than I'd have expected.

[Guest]

34 minutes ago, TwinIon said:

I feel like I've seen a lot of talk about shows getting canned by Netflix, but are they really any worse than anyone else?

I’ve wondered the same, like maybe this is just a truism (“Netflix cancels lots of shows after 1 season”) that also happens to

be the norm for the industry?

 

There are tons of major network shows that get punted into mid season replacement roles, or totally dumped into the summer wasteland, and never get second seasons and this has always been the case. Not sure how the streamers compare on the hit/miss factor.

[Fizzzzle]

I suppose with Netflix, it's more binary. Like with traditional network shows, they'll try it in prime time first, then move it to a different slot, etc before fully pulling the plug.

 

Netflix cancelled Cowboy Bebop like, what, a week after they released it? The algorithm was just immediately like "nope," and the show was killed

[BloodyHell]

1 hour ago, Fizzzzle said:

I suppose with Netflix, it's more binary. Like with traditional network shows, they'll try it in prime time first, then move it to a different slot, etc before fully pulling the plug.

 

Netflix cancelled Cowboy Bebop like, what, a week after they released it? The algorithm was just immediately like "nope," and the show was killed

I dunno, its definitely anecdotal, but to me Netflix feels worse. It's gotten to the point where im basically not watching new Netflix shows until they finish, because I have no interest in investing my time in a show that will probably be canceled.

[Massdriver]

On 4/22/2022 at 4:57 PM, CastlevaniaNut18 said:

I've discovered I like Nordic Noir and Netflix is a good place for that content. I still have so much in  that genre alone to watch.

This seems like something I might like. My dad watches a lot of international programming on Netflix and insists it's great. Dark is one of the few international shows I watched. There's a lot of value on Netflix that I haven't even begun to tap.

 

 

2 hours ago, TwinIon said:

 

I feel like I've seen a lot of talk about shows getting canned by Netflix, but are they really any worse than anyone else? When I look through the list of canceled Netflix shows, most of the shows I actually watched and liked got more than one season, and they're the kind of shows that wouldn't have existed pre-Netflix. Shows like Sense8, Lady Dynamite, and American Vandal.

 

I'll concede that of the 71 shows listed at that link, 43 of them only got one season, but of those the only two I watched were Tuca & Bertie and Cowboy Bebop, and only the former deserved more (which it ended up getting from Cartoon Network).

 

Maybe it's just because of the shows that I actually watch on Netflix, but my overall impression is that they generally give shows more time than I'd have expected.

 

 

https://www.ft.com/content/c7d9da39-c626-425f-976f-712e5543c289

Quote

Netflix does drop more shows than other studios. It cancelled 11 per cent of its US television series last year, while Disney and WarnerMedia dropped 9 per cent, NBCUniversal 8 per cent and ViacomCBS only 4 per cent, according to Ampere. Perhaps the best insight into Netflix’s strategy was in a letter to a UK House of Lords committee. The company said it focused on “completers” — people who watch all of a show in the first 28 days after it is released — which would probably put quieter, slow-burning shows at a disadvantage. Or put simply: Netflix rewards bingeing. While Hulu and HBO Max have been releasing episodes staggered over time, Netflix has stuck to its all at once, binge-drop strategy. Most Netflix shows end after two or three seasons, and the company’s priority is adding and retaining subscribers — not selling advertising. A new show is probably a better way to find new subscribers than one that has already been around. All this breeds an ephemeral nature to the platform. A Netflix show can be popular for a few days or a week, and then is quickly supplanted by the next release. These details might seem trivial on an individual level, but with hundreds of shows a year, Netflix has become the largest commissioner of television in the world. It is the Godzilla of the business it once disrupted. This is why people like Shukert — and Hollywood at large — agonise over figuring out what Netflix wants. There has been a long-simmering frustration that Netflix is an opaque conveyor belt of content. I am told that a few more painful cancellations are coming soon. Did not enough people binge them?

 

Overall I'm still a fan of Netflix, but they do cancel too many shows. Along those lines, this Financial Times article seems to back up some of the intuitions here.

 

[TheLeon]

Yes, they cancel a lot of shows, but they also gave us 6 seasons of Bojack Horseman, which goes a long way in my book. 

[Guest]

I mean, 11 percent isn’t a high number and kinda goes against the idea people are espousing that Netflix is just cancelling everything. It may simply be that Netflix cancels a relatively high percentage of the shows or genres people here seem to gravitate toward.

[TwinIon]

1 hour ago, Massdriver said:

https://www.ft.com/content/c7d9da39-c626-425f-976f-712e5543c289

 

Overall I'm still a fan of Netflix, but they do cancel too many shows. Along those lines, this Financial Times article seems to back up some of the intuitions here.

Thanks for finding that. I couldn't quickly figure out how many shows we're talking about here, but the number is probably less than 100 if we're only talking US TV. So the difference between Netflix and Disney / Warner is only maybe two shows. This shows that cancellation rates for new shows is lower than it used to be, but still only about half of new network TV shows get a second season. It also shows how much that number changes from year to year, and I'd guess it varies a lot between producers as well.

 

 

While I remain dubious as to the proposition that Netflix is much worse at canceling promising shows than anyone else, what I feel very confident they're worse at is advertising their content. Netflix seems to expect the recommendation algorithm to surface new things, and if a show doesn't take off, there's not much to be done. How much of network TV commercial time is advertising other shows on their network? It's probably a reasonable amount, and Netflix just doesn't have that. It's been discussed earlier in the thread, but their unwillingness to release things weekly also changes how people talk about shows and how long they live in the zeitgeist. Even Apple more aggressively advertises their other shows when you want to watch something. There are other factors as well, but it boils down to shows not getting the same exposure on Netflix that they may have had elsewhere, and that has probably killed a number of shows early.

 

I think the other thing that's changed a lot over time is that the existence of such strong competition has meant that Netflix doesn't have nearly the monopoly on weird TV they used to. Early on I'd look at shows that took huge risks like Lady Dynamite or Master of None or Sense8 and think that these are shows that wouldn't make it on TV normally, but they exist because Netflix was willing to take risks and needed content. Now the streaming wars have heated up so much that every viable show can find a home somewhere, but Netflix is also increasingly risk adverse.

[CastlevaniaNut18]

2 hours ago, Massdriver said:

This seems like something I might like. My dad watches a lot of international programming on Netflix and insists it's great. Dark is one of the few international shows I watched. There's a lot of value on Netflix that I haven't even begun to tap.

 

 

Yeah, so far I've watched The Valhalla Murders(Iceland) and The Chestnut Man(Denmark). I enjoyed them both. the latter was adapted from a book I'd read and enjoyed. I've added a ton of other stuff to my watch list, but because I don't watch TV as much, it's taking me a while to get to them. But it's definitely a genre I've discovered I like. I watch it in the original languages with subtitles.

[Massdriver]

5 hours ago, sblfilms said:

I mean, 11 percent isn’t a high number and kinda goes against the idea people are espousing that Netflix is just cancelling everything. It may simply be that Netflix cancels a relatively high percentage of the shows or genres people here seem to gravitate toward.

That’s plausible that they cancel more from genres we like and may be supported by the rest of the article. Netflix shows generally last 2-3 seasons according the article. I’m not sure what the case is for other streamers, but that seems short.  The full FT article ties that into their binge strategy which fits in with what some others have been feeling here. 
 

 

[skillzdadirecta]

5 hours ago, sblfilms said:

I mean, 11 percent isn’t a high number and kinda goes against the idea people are espousing that Netflix is just cancelling everything. It may simply be that Netflix cancels a relatively high percentage of the shows or genres people here seem to gravitate toward.

Bingo. When they canceled Cowboy Beebop and Jupiter's Legacy after promoting those shows heavily, fanboy/genre sites took notice. This fed the perception that Netflix cancels too many shows but the reality is, they make shows no one else would make and rescue shows that other networks gave up on.

[Keyser_Soze]

As someone who mostly watches Korean shows on Netflix I don't really get burned by cancellations because most of those shows are one season and done anyway. The idea is so good and the conclusion is so satisfying you don't need any more. Normal US shows could definitely benefit from this (looking at you Prison Break)

[skillzdadirecta]

8 minutes ago, Keyser_Soze said:

Normal US shows could definitely benefit from this (looking at you Prison Break)

Prison Break definitely went on far longer than it should have. 

[Keyser_Soze]

1 minute ago, skillzdadirecta said:

Prison Break definitely went on far longer than it should have. 

 

Yeah. Basically anything past the first season.

[skillzdadirecta]

Just now, Keyser_Soze said:

 

Yeah. Basically anything past the first season.

I mean once the broke out of Prison... the title makes no sense 

[GeneticBlueprint]

The last season was one of the worst seasons of any tv show I've ever seen.

[Keyser_Soze]

34 minutes ago, GeneticBlueprint said:

The last season was one of the worst seasons of any tv show I've ever seen.

 

Jodi Lynn O'Keefe  doe

[Zaku3]

I've enjoyed their international programming. I would cancel it if it wasn't that my ex mother-in-law (unfortunately my ex-wife) use my account.

 

I think I'm just more into youtube, podcast, and audiobooks then I am tv shows and movies. While star wars has taken massive damage from how bad the sequel trilogy was, I can't even watch MCU shows. I have seen Falcon and the Winter Soldier a few of the what if episodes but would need to force myself to watch the others. Even watching We Own This City until it hooked me in I had to force myself to not just turn off the tv and watch youtube vids.

[BloodyHell]

6 hours ago, Zaku3 said:

I've enjoyed their international programming. I would cancel it if it wasn't that my ex mother-in-law (unfortunately my ex-wife) use my account.

 

I think I'm just more into youtube, podcast, and audiobooks then I am tv shows and movies. While star wars has taken massive damage from how bad the sequel trilogy was, I can't even watch MCU shows. I have seen Falcon and the Winter Soldier a few of the what if episodes but would need to force myself to watch the others. Even watching We Own This City until it hooked me in I had to force myself to not just turn off the tv and watch youtube vids.

Oh, I definitely agree with you about Marvel and Star Wars. And even Star Trek. Im really hoping Strange New Worlds is better. 

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

Layoffs Begin at Netflix

GIZMODO.COM

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It’s a sign of continuing struggles for the streaming giant after it announced significant viewer loss earlier this month.

 

Quote

 

Netflix’s blog Tudum, an onomatopoeia meant to resemble the sound made when the app starts, is now sounding more like ta-“doom” after the streaming giant suddenly laid off its blog staff Thursday afternoon.

 

The blog had hired industry writers, some of whom had come from sites like G/O’s own A.V. Club and Jezebel, to write about Netflix programming, including interviews with showmakers and other rundowns of the latest content coming to the platform.

 

According to multiple tweets, the layoffs came in late afternoon on Thursday, and many were reportedly blindsided by the news. Now-former writers took to Twitter after the layoffs to announce they were open for work. Several expressed feelings of having the rug pulled out from under them.

 

 

[stepee]

tbf nobody even knew that blog existed

[Jason]

1 hour ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

Layoffs Begin at Netflix

GIZMODO.COM

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It’s a sign of continuing struggles for the streaming giant after it announced significant viewer loss earlier this month.

 

I saw one of the writers they brought in tweeting she'd been fired after two weeks or a couple of months or something stupid like that, right after leaving a union job to boot. 

[Reputator]

Netflix shareholders sue over subscription slump disclosures

WWW.REUTERS.COM

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Netflix Inc has been hit with a shareholder lawsuit in a U.S. court in California accusing the streaming entertainment company of misleading the market about its ability to keep adding subscribers in recent months.

 

[Kal-El814]

I feel like I'm missing something here. Netflix bills every month, right? It seems like they should be in a position to be less surprised by this than they seem to be.

[Bloodporne]

I think I've exclusively watched Seinfeld on Netflix for like two months now if I boot it up at all. 

[DPCyric]

On 4/26/2022 at 4:48 PM, sblfilms said:

I mean, 11 percent isn’t a high number and kinda goes against the idea people are espousing that Netflix is just cancelling everything. It may simply be that Netflix cancels a relatively high percentage of the shows or genres people here seem to gravitate toward.

 

Here is the thing it cancels the shows that the people who actually subscribe for their content are there for. Stuff like The Dark Crystal and Cowboy Bebop aren't attracting the masses but the people who will actually cancel their membership if they aren't getting exclusive content they want. Most people are just going to leave their subscription on and binge whatever but much like Microsoft used to on Xbox they are not catering to their hardcore consumer.

[Derek]

I may have said it already, in this thread, but once I finish Ozarks, I'll be ready to ditch Netflix. 

 

If I didn't have kids, I would've binged the entire thing right away, but Ruth says 'fuck' about 5 times more than their mom, so my Ozark time is very limited.

 

Would've finished it on Sunday, but watched Batman instead. 

[skillzdadirecta]

On 5/7/2022 at 8:16 AM, DPCyric said:

 

Here is the thing it cancels the shows that the people who actually subscribe for their content are there for. Stuff like The Dark Crystal and Cowboy Bebop aren't attracting the masses but the people who will actually cancel their membership if they aren't getting exclusive content they want. Most people are just going to leave their subscription on and binge whatever but much like Microsoft used to on Xbox they are not catering to their hardcore consumer.

Hard disagree there as they greenlight shows most other networks wouldn't even touch and there's plenty of content for "hardcore" consumers. What other Network would have even MADE Cowboy beebop or Dark Crystal? And wasn't it the "Hardcore Consumer" that shat all over Cowboy beebop before it even came out effectively killing it before it even had a chance? 

[Mercury33]

14 hours ago, skillzdadirecta said:

Hard disagree there as they greenlight shows most other networks wouldn't even touch and there's plenty of content for "hardcore" consumers. What other Network would have even MADE Cowboy beebop or Dark Crystal? And wasn't it the "Hardcore Consumer" that shat all over Cowboy beebop before it even came out effectively killing it before it even had a chance? 

Let alone that Anime division all of which are VERY hardcore and adult. That’s an area only Prime has touched and they’re just barely getting into it. 
 

You can’t complain about Cowboy Bebop if you’re also getting multiple seasons of Castlvania and He Man lol