Television WandaVision OT - For the Children!

[johnny]

is this taking place before or after the dr strange sequel?

[Remarkableriots]

31 minutes ago, Kal-El814 said:

 

I’d pay for a comedy montage of Cap derping through time and space returning the infinity stones. How’s he even getting them out of the briefcase? Just whaling on them with mjolnir so he doesn’t touch them and die? What’s his chat with Red Skull like? He’s cool with injecting Natalie Portman with red goo? Does Ant-Man potion shrink infinity stones?

Cap wouldn't die from touching them while he has Mjolnir which grants him the powers of Thor.

[Remarkableriots]

3 minutes ago, johnny said:

is this taking place before or after the dr strange sequel?

Before.

[Ghost_MH]

Spoiler

 

So, is this Quicksilver like a newly created human, some random nobody infused with his memories, or Quicksilver pulled out of an alternate dimension and now under Wanda's influence?

 

I very much enjoy where this is going. Between Quicksilver, Monica, and Darcy, I'm quite happy with the way this ties into the rest of the MCU.

 

 

[Mercury33]

Fuck them spoiler tags in this thread eh

[skillzdadirecta]

HOLY SHIT

[skillzdadirecta]

3 hours ago, johnny said:

is this taking place before or after the dr strange sequel?

Also before Spiderman's last movie and his next one.

[Spork3245]

1 hour ago, Ghost_MH said:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

So, is this Quicksilver like a newly created human, some random nobody infused with his memories, or Quicksilver pulled out of an alternate dimension and now under Wanda's influence?

 

I very much enjoy where this is going. Between Quicksilver, Monica, and Darcy, I'm quite happy with the way this ties into the rest of the MCU.

 

 

Spoiler

I have no idea, but that was Evan Peters who played Quicksilver, Wanda’s brother, in the X-Men movies  

 

[Ghost_MH]

16 minutes ago, Spork3245 said:

  Hide contents

I have no idea, but that was Evan Peters who played Quicksilver, Wanda’s brother, in the X-Men movies  

 

Spoiler

Well yes, but I'm curious to know if they'll explain where he came from. I guess the possibilities are...

 

Random dude just had his memories wiped and turned into Pietro, and they happened to use Evan Peters.

 

Wanda conjured up an entirely new human from nothing and turned him into Pietro, and they happened to use Evan Peters.

 

This is the same Quicksilver from Fox and he was yanked from that dimension into the MCU.

 

The first option would be terribly boring. The other two would be far more interesting. The second as well since there's still the question of who the fuck are these kids.

 

[Spork3245]

I’m about 99% sure that

Spoiler

Wanda is being manipulated. She was starting to tell Vision that she had no idea how this actually started, then whoever is manipulating (still thinking Mephesto) threw a fake Quicksilver into the mix.

 

[skillzdadirecta]

17 minutes ago, Spork3245 said:

I’m about 99% sure that

  Hide contents

Wanda is being manipulated. She was starting to tell Vision that she had no idea how this actually started, then whoever is manipulating (still thinking Mephesto) threw a fake Quicksilver into the mix.

 

Pretty sure that 

Spoiler

Agnes the neighbor is the one pulling the strings behind the scenes. Whether or not she's Mephisto is in question.

 

[Reputator]

6 hours ago, Kal-El814 said:

 

I’d pay for a comedy montage of Cap derping through time and space returning the infinity stones. How’s he even getting them out of the briefcase? Just whaling on them with mjolnir so he doesn’t touch them and die? What’s his chat with Red Skull like? He’s cool with injecting Natalie Portman with red goo? Does Ant-Man potion shrink infinity stones?

 

There is literally a handful (ha) of stones that Capt would either have a really awkward time returning, or would've been downright impossible.

[Gavin King]

So X-Men are coming, right!?

[Reputator]

2 hours ago, skillzdadirecta said:

Pretty sure that 

  Reveal hidden contents

Agnes the neighbor is the one pulling the strings behind the scenes. Whether or not she's Mephisto is in question.

 

 

I actually had a really similar thought to that but her fear seems genuinely when potentially doing something that might upset Wanda.

 

Also fuck spoiler tags here guys. These OTs are always spoilery.

 

That said, when discussing this with a co-worker, it seems like the time fuckery is probably what lead to the dimensions becoming unstable and intertwining. Tony Stark even says that when you mess with time, it tends to mess back. It's that or the creation of Westview itself is an unstable entity and is causing rifts to appear.

 

But quite honestly, I think it's clear Wanda is NOT in total control as Rambeau (and some others) seem to think. The kids are real, as like Vision she can't control their minds. The scope of the manipulation of minds and objects is, as Darcy and Jimmy mention, far beyond what we've seen from Wanda before. On top of that, she isn't aware of everything that happens. I don't think she pulled Rambeau in, as she didn't seem to even know she was an outsider until she let the 'Ultron' bit slip. She wasn't aware of the first drone or the 'bee keeper' until they were in front her.

 

She stole Vision's body so she definitely plays a role here, but I think she merely acts as the "director" while someone even more powerful acts as the "producer". She has taken ownership of the world but it's not all her own.

[skillzdadirecta]

The time travel fuckery definitely has caused this... The Xmen already had their cinematic universe rewritten because of time travel shenanigans. Deadpool as well.... combine those with what happened in Infinity War and End game with the blips and time travel and you could easily say that the realities "merged". This could be the first step in setting that up. 

And reharding Agnes, she doesn't seem to be in any kind of distress when she breaks character like the other folks we've seen so far.

[Jason]

12 hours ago, Kal-El814 said:

 

I like the X-Men plenty, I just think the MCU is just fine without them. In general I think a comics universe works better when there aren’t a handful of people walking around who could plug into Cerebro and shut down 99% of problems by literally thinking about it kinda hard, but... that toothpaste has been out of the tube for a while and it’s not like Doctor Strange couldn’t do the same, I suppose.

 

Somewhat tangentially to that, i wonder how the MCU would handle Magneto. They’ve been generally unwilling to let super powerful baddies off the hook at the end of a movie. The X-Men letting Magneto live / Chuck’s enduring friendship with him is one of the more confusing things about Marvel comics, to me.

 

EDIT - also, Deadpool potentially being the foot in the door for mutants to get into the MCU is just... eh. Again, I really enjoy Deadpool but 3 movies of Van Wilder’s Merc With a Mouth is an awful lot of that character and too much Ryan Reynolds.

 

The obvious problem is that they're basically stuck with Ryan Reynold's Deadpool because of what a hit Deadpool was. Which is because when his Deadpool movie came out the Fox X-Men franchise was stagnant. The Fox X-Men movies weren't bad but it was stuck in that late 90s/early 00s idea of what constituted a good comic book super hero movie (BEAM BATTLES!), and Reynolds obviously got the material a lot better than the other Fox X-Men people did.

 

9 hours ago, Kal-El814 said:

 

I suppose in a post blip world... they’ve always just been there? Kinda weird for them to now show up at the fight in Endgame if that’s the case, but... there’s only so much time and energy to care about these things.

 

With the post-blip stuff in Endgame everyone came back with their memories of pre-blip life. And Dr. Strange and crew were the ones who got everyone to the final battle so it makes sense that they'd only transport in the people they already knew about.

[Jason]

3 hours ago, Ghost_MH said:

  Hide contents

Well yes, but I'm curious to know if they'll explain where he came from. I guess the possibilities are...

 

Random dude just had his memories wiped and turned into Pietro, and they happened to use Evan Peters.

 

Wanda conjured up an entirely new human from nothing and turned him into Pietro, and they happened to use Evan Peters.

 

This is the same Quicksilver from Fox and he was yanked from that dimension into the MCU.

 

The first option would be terribly boring. The other two would be far more interesting. The second as well since there's still the question of who the fuck are these kids.

 

Spoiler

Peters = Pietro

 

 

[Reputator]

41 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

And reharding Agnes, she doesn't seem to be in any kind of distress when she breaks character like the other folks we've seen so far.

 

What about when Vision's neighbor almost let loose "because we're all..."?

[silentbob]

Holy fuck this is a great series. Being high watching it just added to the great tension they are building here. I had questions and now I HAVE QUESTIONS!? I agree she is not in complete control and you saw that from the opening with the kids. Why can’t I control you, and then trying it on Vision again, and no other kids really making her question things too. That is why the person really in control (Herb?) needed a “quick”silver interruption to them thinking any deeper. He also seem to bring Wanda back into the tv reality of her control. It better be either a Full House or Secret World of Alex Mack like paradox (and kudos on the new tv themes/openings every week)  Where she could turn herself into quicksilver for a fast escape

[Spork3245]

8 hours ago, skillzdadirecta said:

Pretty sure that 

  Reveal hidden contents

Agnes the neighbor is the one pulling the strings behind the scenes. Whether or not she's Mephisto is in question.

 

 

Spoiler

She’s almost def Agatha Harkness. Her unseen husband, Ralph, who she keeps mentioning, is probably Mephisto - lots of little clues, like during the power outage her commenting that “Ralph looks better in the dark anyway”, or her bunny being named “‘Ol Scratchers” or whatever (Old Scratch is another name for the devil). Also, when SWORD was matching IDs to everyone, Agatha was the only one with no ID attached to their picture besides Wanda & Vision. I think Wanda “made a deal with the devil” here.

Could def be mistaken, though!  

 

[skillzdadirecta]

25 minutes ago, Spork3245 said:

 

  Hide contents

She’s almost def Agatha Harkness. Her unseen husband, Ralph, who she keeps mentioning, is probably Mephisto - lots of little clues, like during the power outage her commenting that “Ralph looks better in the dark anyway”, or her bunny being named “‘Ol Scratchers” or whatever (Old Scratch is another name for the devil). Also, when SWORD was matching IDs to everyone, Agatha was the only one with no ID attached to their picture besides Wanda & Vision. I think Wanda “made a deal with the devil” here.

Could def be mistaken, though!  

 

Spoiler

Damn you you beat me to it... I'm marathoning the episodes now and came to the conclusion that Agnes is probably Agatha Harkness as well. She made another devil reference in the first episode, something about "the devil being in the details" and in the second episode she said that "all of this is for the children". Wanda's kids are obviously the true targets. Someone is using Wanda's powers and grief to mainpulate her in to creating those kids who probably have direct connections to the same power that powered the Infinity Stones. Another thing that was mentioned is that there is a lot of Big Bang energy in the area and the stones were created at the time of big bang. Wanda, like Captain Marvel is powered by infinity energy... no telling HOW powerful she really is.

 

[Spork3245]

2 hours ago, skillzdadirecta said:

  Reveal hidden contents

Damn you you beat me to it... I'm marathoning the episodes now and came to the conclusion that Agnes is probably Agatha Harkness as well. She made another devil reference in the first episode, something about "the devil being in the details" and in the second episode she said that "all of this is for the children". Wanda's kids are obviously the true targets. Someone is using Wanda's powers and grief to mainpulate her in to creating those kids who probably have direct connections to the same power that powered the Infinity Stones. Another thing that was mentioned is that there is a lot of Big Bang energy in the area and the stones were created at the time of big bang. Wanda, like Captain Marvel is powered by infinity energy... no telling HOW powerful she really is.

 

Spoiler

I think this could end with the creation of WAND and Rambeau gaining powers from being “touched” by Wanda’s powers, becoming Photon. Maybe. MAYBE.

 

[Mercury33]

10 hours ago, Jason said:

 

The obvious problem is that they're basically stuck with Ryan Reynold's Deadpool because of what a hit Deadpool was. Which is because when his Deadpool movie came out the Fox X-Men franchise was stagnant. The Fox X-Men movies weren't bad but it was stuck in that late 90s/early 00s idea of what constituted a good comic book super hero movie (BEAM BATTLES!), and Reynolds obviously got the material a lot better than the other Fox X-Men people did.

 

 

With the post-blip stuff in Endgame everyone came back with their memories of pre-blip life. And Dr. Strange and crew were the ones who got everyone to the final battle so it makes sense that they'd only transport in the people they already knew about.

Why would anyone want to recast Deadpool? Ryan Reynolds is literally the perfect casting for him. That would be like being excited that for a new Wolverine or hoping they recast Iron Man after the first movie. 

[Kal-El814]

10 hours ago, Jason said:

With the post-blip stuff in Endgame everyone came back with their memories of pre-blip life. And Dr. Strange and crew were the ones who got everyone to the final battle so it makes sense that they'd only transport in the people they already knew about.

 

True, I’d just meant that if the world was at risk for being destroyed, seems unlikely that Chuck or Emma or everyone would miss that and sit it out. I mean if Mantis can TKO Thanos surely Chuck should be able to.

[SuperSpreader]

1 hour ago, Kal-El814 said:

 

True, I’d just meant that if the world was at risk for being destroyed, seems unlikely that Chuck or Emma or everyone would miss that and sit it out. I mean if Mantis can TKO Thanos surely Chuck should be able to.

Retcon Chuck fucked with Thanos to let Tony get the gauntlet

[AbsolutSurgen]

Finally, a really good episode.  I thought the writing for Vision's growing epiphany was really well done.  Ditto for how Wanda handled/reacted to all of the influences.

Spoiler

Loved how they showed Agnes asking if she should redo the scene, with Wanda looking on somewhat helplessly to demonstrate how she is losing (or never really had) control over the narrative.

 

[johnny]

 

[cusideabelincoln]

14 hours ago, Reputator said:

 

I actually had a really similar thought to that but her fear seems genuinely when potentially doing something that might upset Wanda.

 

Also fuck spoiler tags here guys. These OTs are always spoilery.

 

That said, when discussing this with a co-worker, it seems like the time fuckery is probably what lead to the dimensions becoming unstable and intertwining. Tony Stark even says that when you mess with time, it tends to mess back. It's that or the creation of Westview itself is an unstable entity and is causing rifts to appear.

 

But quite honestly, I think it's clear Wanda is NOT in total control as Rambeau (and some others) seem to think. The kids are real, as like Vision she can't control their minds. The scope of the manipulation of minds and objects is, as Darcy and Jimmy mention, far beyond what we've seen from Wanda before. On top of that, she isn't aware of everything that happens. I don't think she pulled Rambeau in, as she didn't seem to even know she was an outsider until she let the 'Ultron' bit slip. She wasn't aware of the first drone or the 'bee keeper' until they were in front her.

 

She stole Vision's body so she definitely plays a role here, but I think she merely acts as the "director" while someone even more powerful acts as the "producer". She has taken ownership of the world but it's not all her own.

 

Seem like all of the weirdness is possible because of what The Ancient One told Hulk in Endgame.  In the present, after Cap returns the stones to their original time, the Infinity stones have been destroyed, so they are not able to control the flow of time, allowing "forces of darkness" to enter into that reality stream.

 

Dr. Strange is now going to have to deal with the aftermath of this, and surely the end of WandaVision is now going to directly tie in.

[Guest]

That was enjoyable and I laughed obnoxiously loud at the reveal at the end 😂

[skillzdadirecta]

14 hours ago, Spork3245 said:

  Reveal hidden contents

I think this could end with the creation of WAND and Rambeau gaining powers from being “touched” by Wanda’s powers, becoming Photon. Maybe. MAYBE.

 

Spoiler

I had to look up WAND because I had never heard of it before. Marvel's magic defense department that I knew of was A.R.M.O.R.

Alternate Reality Monitoring and Operational Response Agency...

MARVEL.FANDOM.COM

---

1 History 1.1 Marvel Zombies 1.2 Operation: Midnight Sons 1.3 Lyra the Savage She-Hulk 1.4 Other Zombie Dimenisons 1.5 Nazi Zombies 2 Paraphernalia 3 See Also 4 Links and References 4.1 Footnotes Like S.H.I.E.L.D. was established for global security and S.W.O.R.D. for extraterrestrial security, A.R.M.O.R. was established as a force of extra-dimensional security to guard against contamination and conflict from other alternate...

 

 

One of these will probably end up being formed by the end of the series.

[Guest]

Hat tip to all you comic book fans for explaining all the stuff I wouldn't have the first idea about with these movies and shows. Nice to get the important bits of lore that the movies and shows can't really delve into.

[Spork3245]

8 hours ago, skillzdadirecta said:

  Hide contents

I had to look up WAND because I had never heard of it before. Marvel's magic defense department that I knew of was A.R.M.O.R.

Alternate Reality Monitoring and Operational Response Agency...

MARVEL.FANDOM.COM

---

1 History 1.1 Marvel Zombies 1.2 Operation: Midnight Sons 1.3 Lyra the Savage She-Hulk 1.4 Other Zombie Dimenisons 1.5 Nazi Zombies 2 Paraphernalia 3 See Also 4 Links and References 4.1 Footnotes Like...

 

 

One of these will probably end up being formed by the end of the series.

Honestly...

Spoiler

I probably meant ARMOR but I couldn’t remember their name and googling eventually brought me to WAND  

 

[Kamusha]

Honestly I enjoyed the first three episodes the most. It’s still one of the weirder things Marvel has put out but it was significantly more interesting before they showed their cards.

[skillzdadirecta]

19 hours ago, johnny said:

 

I can totally see "Baby Vision" being this years Baby Yoda at Christmas 

[Kal-El814]

So the perimeter sirens were going off again before Quicksilver showed up, which suggests that Quicksilver just ran in, as opposed to Wanda “making” him. That tracks with her talking to her kids about how you shouldn’t magic people back from the dead and seeming pretty genuinely surprised that Quicksilver was there.

 

So... how do we think he got there? There seems to be something else going on beyond just what Wanda is doing herself, and the other characters talking about how Wanda never displayed power on this level seems to track with that.