Sony Insomniac just had a massive leak with upcoming titles and practically everything else

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

Wolverine gameplay mechanics:

 

 

 

[Remarkableriots]

I would bet it had some connections with the movie deals where they continue to work together. Where Marvel can continue to use Spider-Man and cross-promotion with other Marvel characters.

[Dodger]

I just want to know how all the other Sony stuff got in there. Seems like there is a lot of stuff Insomniac should not have, unless this hack goes way beyond that.

[Dodger]

There's also a slide where it suggests Sony will be releasing it's games Day and Date on PC in the next few years. I probably just need to bite the bullet and get a beefy gaming PC. I probably would have done it already if I could just play everything on Steam, or if PC Games Pass worked with Steam. Having GP through 2026 is nice. Maybe for next gen instead of buying the next box I just get a PC and be done with it. PC/Switch 2 is probably the way to go going forward. 

[Brian]

47 minutes ago, Dodger said:

There's also a slide where it suggests Sony will be releasing it's games Day and Date on PC in the next few years. I probably just need to bite the bullet and get a beefy gaming PC. I probably would have done it already if I could just play everything on Steam, or if PC Games Pass worked with Steam. Having GP through 2026 is nice. Maybe for next gen instead of buying the next box I just get a PC and be done with it. PC/Switch 2 is probably the way to go going forward. 

If this is true, I’ll probably ditch both consoles and go full PC (desktop and handheld) and have a Switch 2. 

[best3444]

I guess I'm a PC/Switch 2 user next gen myself. 

[Dodger]

Also if this is the case and Sony eventually starts releasing day and date on PC, and these slides already mention PC versions of all the Marvel games, MS ends up being right in putting all their games on PC day and date. 

[TwinIon]

1 hour ago, Dodger said:

There's also a slide where it suggests Sony will be releasing it's games Day and Date on PC in the next few years. I probably just need to bite the bullet and get a beefy gaming PC. I probably would have done it already if I could just play everything on Steam, or if PC Games Pass worked with Steam. Having GP through 2026 is nice. Maybe for next gen instead of buying the next box I just get a PC and be done with it. PC/Switch 2 is probably the way to go going forward. 

I’d be really shocked if they go forward with that. MS has a unique incentive structure that allows them to devalue their own consoles. For Sony I just don’t see the benefit. Maybe their experiments with PC releases have started to show that PC sales don’t really eat too much into their console sales. Maybe they can project that they lose 500k PlayStation units, but can gain an extra 1M PC sales by releasing day and date it’s worth it, but that still seems unlikely to me. The extra PC sales would have to overcome the Steam tax plus whatever value you can assign to turning a single game sale into a potential PlayStation customer.

 

That said, I’d love to see that be the case. It would probably save me from buying a PS5 Pro and give me the ability to play these games on my Steam Deck.

[crispy4000]

1 hour ago, Dodger said:

Also if this is the case and Sony eventually starts releasing day and date on PC, and these slides already mention PC versions of all the Marvel games, MS ends up being right in putting all their games on PC day and date. 

 

Right about what exactly?  Individual games make more money when they’re on more platforms.  But they’re trading off those gains with lost royalty and subscription revenues when more people chose Valve.  They’re further cannibalizing their console AAA game sales with the loss leader subscriptions they’re popularizing.

 

Microsoft is probably better positioned than Sony to work out this strategy regardless, because I think it’ll take more screens than just TVs or monitors, and they’re better positioned to make a play there.
 

The real winner in all this would be Nintendo IMO.  They’ll go from an appropriate time to exit the console market (Wii U), to always having a given place in it.  Because they’re the only ones offering games you’d need their platform for.  One could say they’ve already ‘won’ by selling their games at a premium for longer / for always.  They’re the only one of the big 3 managing not to devalue their products in the name of competition.  (as much as that sucks for us)

 

Hell, they’re charging more and selling more.  

[stepee]

honestly I just took a massive leak myself 

[AbsolutSurgen]

56 minutes ago, crispy4000 said:

 

Right about what exactly?  Individual games make more money when they’re on more platforms.  But they’re trading off those gains with lost royalty and subscription revenues when more people chose Valve.  They’re further cannibalizing their console AAA game sales with the loss leader subscriptions they’re popularizing.

 

Microsoft is probably better positioned than Sony to work out this strategy regardless, because I think it’ll take more screens than just TVs or monitors, and they’re better positioned to make a play there.
 

The real winner in all this would be Nintendo IMO.  They’ll go from an appropriate time to exit the console market (Wii U), to always having a given place in it.  Because they’re the only ones offering games you’d need their platform for.  One could say they’ve already ‘won’ by selling their games at a premium for longer / for always.  They’re the only one of the big 3 managing not to devalue their products in the name of competition.  (as much as that sucks for us)

 

Hell, they’re charging more and selling more.  

Sony putting games on PC literally has no impact on Nintendo whatsoever. 

[crispy4000]

1 hour ago, AbsolutSurgen said:

Sony putting games on PC literally has no impact on Nintendo whatsoever. 

You’re correct.  What day and date does ensure is that I’d never buy a Sony console again.  As it did Microsoft.  I’d likely be exclusively a Nintendo gamer on console, because they sell exclusives worth buying their hardware in specific for.

 

Which again, begs the question if Microsoft and Sony are actually “right” to devalue the appeal of their consoles that much.

 

It’s the kind of the thing that would have me rooting for Valve to enter the console market proper, after being emboldened with the Deck.

[Kal-El814]

4 hours ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

Wolverine gameplay mechanics:

 

 

 

 

So it's Assassin's Creed.

 

Kidding aside, it's funny to see every feature from every 3rd person action game with a stealth system from the last 10 yeats just listed out in this context.

[Dodger]

I haven’t seen the slide but I have seen a lot of references to Sony wanting to raise prices on games to $80-100 as well. I don’t know if PC games would still be $60 in that case but it’s starting to become a clear case of I just need a gaming PC. Sony will clearly keep putting games on PC, maybe not day and date but they will come.

[Remarkableriots]

If I had four grand to spend on building a PC, I would. Until that happens, I'll stick to getting the new PS systems.

[Brick]

24 minutes ago, Remarkableriots said:

I had four grand to spend on building a PC, I would. Until that happens, I'll stick to getting the new PS systems.

 

lol you do not need to spend four fucking grand to build a PC

[Spawn_of_Apathy]

6 hours ago, Dodger said:

There's also a slide where it suggests Sony will be releasing its games Day and Date on PC in the next few years. I probably just need to bite the bullet and get a beefy gaming PC. I probably would have done it already if I could just play everything on Steam, or if PC Games Pass worked with Steam. Having GP through 2026 is nice. Maybe for next gen instead of buying the next box I just get a PC and be done with it. PC/Switch 2 is probably the way to go going forward. 

If day and date are a few years out you have some time. Doesn’t seem like a rush now. Then you can get a 5090 Ti to play all Sony games day 1. 

[Remarkableriots]

32 minutes ago, Brick said:

 

lol you do not need to spend four fucking grand to build a PC

How much would you recommend spending on a 5090 build when that comes out?

[Brick]

Just now, Remarkableriots said:

How much would you recommend spending on a 5090 build when that comes out?

 

Ask @stepee or @Mr.Vic20 as they are much better at builds than I (they helped me when I upgraded 5 years ago).

[Keyser_Soze]

32 minutes ago, Brick said:

 

Ask @stepee or @Mr.Vic20 as they are much better at builds than I (they helped me when I upgraded 5 years ago).

 

Ask them and they'll tell you 6 grand!

[stepee]

Well I’d imagine the price of the 5090 would dictate the build mostly. We will see if the price remains 1600 or if they do something dumb like $2000 for it. The rest of the build like another 1.5k to not bottleneck it.

[Dodger]

Anyone want to let me hold about 3 grand then. The only thing stopping me at this point is the upfront entry cost. That and I’ll blow all this money just to go play the Disgaea games or something on it.

[crispy4000]

10 hours ago, Remarkableriots said:

If I had four grand to spend on building a PC, I would. Until that happens, I'll stick to getting the new PS systems.

 

The best argument for a console today is that an equivalent PC costs more in relativity than prior gens at this point.  But it'd be odd to think PC can't ever get to previous levels of affordability again.  The barometer may have already shifted in a different way, with reconstruction solutions on PC being superior and more tweakable.

 

If Sony and Microsoft both dropped all first party games day and date on PC, paying a bit more for an equivalent build would be quite easy to justify.  You'd save that just on online fees over the life of a console.  You could still subscribe to Games Pass, for cheaper.  Sony's games could drop price (like rocks) at the same pace as their console versions.  Win / Win / Win

 

If the console manufactures don't see the danger in that for their console business, its their loss.  Sony's only got their foot halfway in the door, which is probably wise.  But if they go all in, they'll never be able to take it back.

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

This is a really good article that analyzes the information that was illegally procured and provides insight into the significant challenges involved in operating a studio in this day and age.  I highly encourage you to read it!

 

What Hacked Files Tell Us About The Studio Behind Spider-Man 2

KOTAKU.COM

---

Internal documents show how a big PlayStation studio plans its future

 

Quote

 

Insomniac Games quickly established itself as one of the most prolific studios within PlayStation after Sony acquired it for what seems like a bargain at $229 million four years ago. 2020's Spider-Man: Miles Morales, 2021's Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart, and this year’s Spider-Man 2 showed that the studio could keep putting out technically impressive blockbusters without sacrificing quality.

 

Now, various internal documents released online as part of a malicious ransomware hack suggest just how hard this has been to pull off, with studio leaders juggling teams, timelines, and budgets like Tetris blocks in order to ship games that aren’t just excellent but also profitable. They also hint that possible cutbacks within Sony Worldwide Studios may only be adding to the challenge.

 

 

Quote

 

Spider-Man 2 was a big milestone for Insomniac Games. In addition to garnering rave reviews and a Game of the Year nomination at this year’s Game Awards, Sony also called it the fastest-selling PlayStation game ever, despite being a PS5 exclusive. But the web-slinging blockbuster, which featured dazzling action set pieces and tons of carefully crafted story beats, was seemingly also the studio’s most expensive game ever. One internal presentation pegged the final cost at around $300 million, almost three times the cost of 2018’s Spider-Man for the PS4.

 

While the internal presentations, emails, and meeting notes released as part of the hack are a narrow and incomplete picture of the studio, they nevertheless offer a small glimpse of the types of problems Insomniac Games is thinking through at the moment, and its hopes for the future. A finance post-mortem on Spider-Man 2 delivered in November broke down the costs of the project in detail.

 

 

Quote

Pre-production began in 2018, and at peak earlier this year there were 264 developers working directly on the project, with an additional 116 contributing in the form of managers, IT staff, and other support roles. 314 minutes of cinematics alone cost over $40 million. The final cost was roughly $30 million over the original $270 million budget, according to the presentation, requiring the game to sell 7.2 million copies at full price to break even. The game had sold 6.1 million copies as of November 12.

 

Quote

These and other presentations provide a clear sense that Insomniac, despite its successes and the seeming resources of its parent company, is grappling with how to reverse the trend of ballooning blockbuster development costs. “We have to make future AAA franchise games for $350 million or less,” reads one slide from a “sustainable budgets” presentation earlier this year. “In today’s dollars, that’s like making [Spider-Man 2] for $215 million. That’s $65 million less than our [Spider-Man 2] budget.” Another slide puts the problem more starkly: “...is 3x the investment in [Spider-Man 2] evident to anyone who plays the game?”

 

Quote

 

Whatever final decisions Insomniac decided to make about its upcoming projects, some internal documents suggest budget cuts demanded by Sony have complicated matters. Presentations earlier in the year point to a rough projected headcount of 500 moving forward. But a September email from Sony specified a full-time employee max headcount of 470, down from its current estimated 485 employees. PowerPoint slides from a September presentation reference “6 potential areas to reduce headcount,” including a few layoffs, not backfilling certain positions, and placing up to five employees on performance improvement plans which might eventually end in them getting fired.

 

A more recent presentation in November points to potentially more drastic cuts. “Slimming down Ratchet and cutting new IP will not account for the reductions Sony is looking for,” reads a PowerPoint note attributed to Insomniac head Ted Price. “To remove 50-75 people strategically, our best option is to cut deeply into Wolverine and Spider-Man 3, replacing lower performers with team members from Ratchet and new IP.”

 

 

Quote

Business plans change, and Sony would not confirm if the discussed cuts are still on the table or already completed. But a notes file referencing a November 9 PlayStation off-site meeting reiterates the 50-75 number of cuts. The notes suggest the cuts are being asked of other PlayStation studios as well, including the line “there will be one studio closure.” Sony did not respond when asked to clarify.

 

[Xbob42]

Where the fuck are people getting 3 or 4 grand for a new PC from?!

 

Yeah maybe if you're going for the world's most expensive GPU, CPU and are factoring an ultra high-end OLED into the cost (do people factor TVs into console purchases? I almost never watch TV, so I'd definitely factor it in) at which point your "entry point" was actually "put me on a fucking throne."

Even with inflation, unrelated GPU inflated prices and the like, you can still build an extremely fast and capable PC for far less than that.

[AbsolutSurgen]

1 hour ago, Xbob42 said:

Where the fuck are people getting 3 or 4 grand for a new PC from?!

 

Yeah maybe if you're going for the world's most expensive GPU, CPU and are factoring an ultra high-end OLED into the cost (do people factor TVs into console purchases? I almost never watch TV, so I'd definitely factor it in) at which point your "entry point" was actually "put me on a fucking throne."

Even with inflation, unrelated GPU inflated prices and the like, you can still build an extremely fast and capable PC for far less than that.

I don't think this is the thread you meant to post in.

[Xbob42]

41 minutes ago, AbsolutSurgen said:

I don't think this is the thread you meant to post in.

Looks like the right thread to me!

[crispy4000]

For the record I agree with you Xbob.  You still don’t need to spend a fortune.  But there’s no denying that the crypto boom put pricing out of whack.  This gen it feels much more expensive to build something pretty good that lasts.  Even if it’s always somewhat cheap to get your foot in the door.

[AbsolutSurgen]

Just a moment...

PCPARTPICKER.COM

Not hard to spend a lot on a PC. 

[CastlevaniaNut18]

1 hour ago, AbsolutSurgen said:

Just a moment...

PCPARTPICKER.COM

Not hard to spend a lot on a PC. 

You picked like the most expensive of everything. The point is, you don’t have to spend that much on a capable PC. 

[legend]

I think for many people the main value proposition of a gaming PC is much better graphics than console. But to get those much better graphics, you do have to pay for upper tier. 4k is a bit much, but 3k isn't crazy if you're buying everything from scratch. Consoles don't have to work as hard because developers can optimize for that fixed hardware so you need a fair amount of muscle to make a very big difference on PC. And if you're merely going to match, you might as well get a console. Even both is probably still cheaper.

 

There are other value propositions for PC of course, like being able to run your ancient games without purchasing a remake or hoping for BC, better mod support, etc. But I think the main one of interest to people who otherwise typically game on consoles is much better graphics and that does require substantial buy in.

[Dodger]

4 hours ago, Xbob42 said:

Where the fuck are people getting 3 or 4 grand for a new PC from?!

 

Yeah maybe if you're going for the world's most expensive GPU, CPU and are factoring an ultra high-end OLED into the cost (do people factor TVs into console purchases? I almost never watch TV, so I'd definitely factor it in) at which point your "entry point" was actually "put me on a fucking throne."

Even with inflation, unrelated GPU inflated prices and the like, you can still build an extremely fast and capable PC for far less than that.

 

Assuming you plug it into a tv you already have how much is a PC that will run games 4k60 fps  with ray tracing and all that jazz for say the next 3 years assuming you’re starting from scratch for everything but the tv?

[Xbob42]

 

2 hours ago, crispy4000 said:

For the record I agree with you Xbob.  You still don’t need to spend a fortune.  But there’s no denying that the crypto boom put pricing out of whack.  This gen it feels much more expensive to build something pretty good that lasts.  Even if it’s always somewhat cheap to get your foot in the door.

Oh, absolutely. It's distinctly more expensive than before. It's already expensive enough that there's no need to exaggerate prices; they already sound exaggerated!

1 hour ago, Dodger said:

 

Assuming you plug it into a tv you already have how much is a PC that will run games 4k60 fps  with ray tracing and all that jazz for say the next 3 years assuming you’re starting from scratch for everything but the tv?

Well, that depends. What do you mean by 4k60? I feel like we're kind of inching our way out of the era of native resolutions. If you're doing 4k60 with raytracing, you're either using DLSS or you're running a 4090. I highly recommend the DLSS route, it's cheaper and gives a massive performance boost, allowing you to crank up more settings than just raw resolution.

 

So this all comes down to how much stuff you need, and of course, as you've already mentioned, your performance targets. Do you literally have no PC parts around? You need a mouse, keyboard, case, SSDs, the whole shebang? Well, that'll obviously cost more. If you've already got some of that stuff, you can save by not trying to upgrade every single element of your existing PC all at once.

 

Unfortunately, as it stands now, your PC gaming budget is basically like 50% based on the cost of the GPU alone.

 

That said, I'm a fan of paying for high performance even if it's more expensive. Sadly with DLSS, raytracing and stuff on top of inflated prices, the only card I'd recommend for someone who wants to take advantage of ray tracing while having a very high res and good performance would be the very expensive RTX 4080.

 

HOWEVER, I hear the 4070 Ti (Ti! Not just 4070!) is pretty damn good and is several hundred dollars cheaper. Still expensive, but much less so. And if you're aiming for 60 FPS instead of higher? The 4070 Ti should thrash whatever you throw at it.

 

AMD seems like a no-brainer for CPUs at the moment... Lemme see if I can put together a list. Don't expect the old days of a super fast PC for $800. Not until prices normalize again, if they ever do. But still, I think I can keep it far under $3-4k.

 

 

There's a very high end PC with all components (guess I didn't include headphones or speakers, I assume most people have those) that will easily demolish games for years to come. I'm betting much longer than 3 years, since games are based on console specs.

 

If you're willing to drop down a tier/generation of GPU or CPU, you can save a few hundred more bucks.

 

Then there's deal hunting. I just chucked this shit into the cart on Amazon, but of course things go on sale all the time depending on the storefront. I rarely buy my entire PC from a single source because typically a few components will be on a deep discount. There's communities (forums, discords, etc) that will help pick parts much better than I ever could and get the best deal while doing it.

 

And again, this is for a very high end PC, buying everything from scratch. You could cut this down by several hundred dollars by aiming for 1440p or being willing to turn down some settings. Or going for a vastly cheaper AMD GPU.

 

All that considered, you could easily get these costs down to about $1000-1200. But I'd rather spend a few hundred more and be set for longer and not have performance be an issue for an extra year or two.

 

Of course, price can go up as well if you need to factor in a monitor, want a very high end mouse and keyboard, pick up a pricey AIO, you can totally spend $5k+ on a PC, let alone $3-4k, but you'd be kind of a fool for doing so.

 

I recommend starting out with a much more modest build and seeing if you even like gaming on your PC before trying to kit yourself out in the craziest shit. That gives you time to adjust to ecosystems, how you handle tweaking performance if you're not used to it, what you do and don't like about components and brands, etc, before diving in to something that may not be for you and blowing a ton of cash.

 

My personal hope is GPU prices become reasonable again. That $800 for that 4070 Ti used to be the cost of the absolute highest end card, while this is lower than the 4090 and 4080, which are comically expensive. And unfortunately nvidia jacked up the prices of the mid-tier stuff (which is where the best deals are) while also making them weaker relative to previous generations using the same naming schemes. It's very frustrating.

 

P.S. Lots of people upgrading their PCs are willing to sell their perfectly good used parts at absolutely staggering discounts. You can cut a PC's price in half if you're able to find major parts used and it's not Mining Season.

[Spork3245]

A PC Build of Wolverine allegedly leaked.

Breaking the rule because I have no idea where else to get the video:

 

 

[Keyser_Soze]

So PC version will come out in 2028!