Television Ricky Gervais' new Netflix special is filled with rabid transphobia, surprising no one

[skillzdadirecta]

Just now, stepee said:

 

You may be right, it is case by case and with comedians that makes sense to me logically. I do feel concern about trans people feeling alone if these things happen, and they will still be noticed of course, and nobody said anything. But maybe for the overall good as far as a tactic of removing these people from the limelight for the future and reducing overall damage they could cause if amplified it is indeed the right call in this case.

Showing support for the Trans community might be the ONLY reason that makes sense but it's still giving these guys exactly what they want. Gervais and Chappelle are reactionary comics. They WANT a reaction from folks, good or bad. I remember going to a comedy show in NYC and watching Paul Mooney live. The shit this guy said about white people made ME cringe and a couple of people got up and left but a lot of the mostly white crowd stayed. I never understood why anyone would sit there and be insulted and think that's a good time. The "jokes" weren't even funny... just mean.

[stepee]

1 minute ago, skillzdadirecta said:

Showing support for the Trans community might be the ONLY reason that makes sense but it's still giving these guys exactly what they want. Gervais and Chappelle are reactionary comics. They WANT a reaction from folks, good or bad. I remember going to a comedy show in NYC and watching Paul Mooney live. The shit this guy said about white people made ME cringe and a couple of people got up and left but a lot of the mostly white crowd stayed. I never understood why anyone would sit there and be insulted and think that's a good time. The "jokes" weren't even funny... just mean.

 

I mean I get all that, I obviously know what they are doing “shock comic” isn’t a new way of making money, but yeah it’s just the balance of support vs boosting.

[Guest]

I certainly could be wrong, but I think you would better achieve your goal of support by spending your efforts in direct support of the communities you say you care about. Spend your money with those who are affected. I get it, it is far easier for us to sit and complain about the things we don't like than to do something positive in support of what we do. But nothing good comes without some sacrifice.

[SaysWho?]

8 minutes ago, stepee said:

 

The board just doesn’t have enough people to boost anything is what I meant. 

 

[stepee]

4 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

I certainly could be wrong, but I think you would better achieve your goal of support by spending your efforts in direct support of the communities you say you care about. Spend your money with those who are affected. I get it, it is far easier for us to sit and complain about the things we don't like than to do something positive in support of what we do. But nothing good comes without some sacrifice.

 

You can literally do both!

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, stepee said:

 

You can literally do both!

 

But one doesn't help, it just makes you feel better  

[Keyser_Soze]

20 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

Same here. His special wasn't even on my radar until this thread 

 

I saw this thread, then Netflix sent an email like the usually do "We added something you might like" - So people may tune in to see "the fuss" and others won't even know there is a fuss.

[Bloodporne]

8 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

Showing support for the Trans community might be the ONLY reason that makes sense but it's still giving these guys exactly what they want. Gervais and Chappelle are reactionary comics. They WANT a reaction from folks, good or bad. I remember going to a comedy show in NYC and watching Paul Mooney live. The shit this guy said about white people made ME cringe and a couple of people got up and left but a lot of the mostly white crowd stayed. I never understood why anyone would sit there and be insulted and think that's a good time. The "jokes" weren't even funny... just mean.

Funny you mention that because I once paid to see Mooney live in the later 2000s I think? I did not feel good about my purchase.

 

[skillzdadirecta]

1 minute ago, Bloodporne said:

24 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

 

Funny you mention that because I once paid to see Mooney live in the later 2000s I think? I did not feel good about my purchase.

That was around when I saw him. I was there with friends who were guests of his so we didn't pay anything and I got to meet him afterwards. Nice guy, but I didn't find him funny at all.

[stepee]

11 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

 

But one doesn't help, it just makes you feel better  

 

So you are saying you can both help AND feel better? Nice!

[stepee]

And to be fair, it should be noted that complaining about people talking about the thing is still talking about the thing and amplifying it just the same. But again, this isn’t twitter, it’s different talking about things things amongst friends; which I guess includes you assholes!

[Bloodporne]

2 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

That was around when I saw him. I was there with friends who were guests of his so we didn't pay anything and I got to meet him afterwards. Nice guy, but I didn't find him funny at all.

The set I saw was terrible dude lol. He spent a good portion triggered by a black & white couple near the front, ranting about that, then told some political jokes that sucked and then complained about not being more well known because of white people. Hilarious set...

 

 

[skillzdadirecta]

3 minutes ago, Bloodporne said:

The set I saw was terrible dude lol. He spent a good portion triggered by a black & white couple near the front, ranting about that, then told some political jokes that sucked and then complained about not being more well known because of white people. Hilarious set...

 

 

Yeah that sounds about right. Pretty sure that was par for the course with him at the time. Honestly he came across as mentally unstable to me and not funnyor insightful.

[Kamusha]

If criticizing this special can only help its popularity then why did Netflix delay releasing it for months?

 

Just because vitriolic rhetoric doesn't affect you personally doesn't mean it will go away if you simply ignore it. You have to address it head on, and work on educating the community around you so that this rhetoric won't have an affect. Unfortunately here in Florida and other conservative states it's illegal to teach children that transphobia is wrong, so I have to get a bit more... creative in how I chose to educate my community. But ignoring issues and not bringing awareness/education to them is only gonna make things worse.

[Bloodporne]

3 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

Yeah that sounds about right. Pretty sure that was par for the course with him at the time. Honestly he came across as mentally unstable to me and not funnyor insightful.

It was the standup equivalent of listening to one of those Penn Station street preachers who look like they wear old area rugs

[AbsolutSurgen]

1 hour ago, sblfilms said:

 

The board that is constantly hate posting tweets from bad people 100% is signal boosting them   I'm not that interested in this Gervais special, but literally the only reason I would watch it at this point is because of this very thread as I try to see things myself before commenting on them. This is exactly what Gervais wants! It is even baked into the structure of the show by being at the top. He hopes people tune in to see what the fuss is about and then stick around for the rest since it is already on.

The only reason I watched the Chapelle special was because of the controversy around it

1 hour ago, stepee said:

 

I mainly made my remark because AS always seems to point his ire, at the very least, at the least problematic part of any issue, but I never see it pointed at the actual issue. IE: Maybe if you are going to post to condemn people for being upset at this bigot, -at least condemn him as well. And we certainly do not boost anyone on this board.

 

I usually agree with you on most items and I don’t need to die on this hill or anything, and certainly don’t have the energy for it today, but I’m not sure if just being silent is the thing?

 

I suppose it’s case by case, I guess for this I would want to defer to the trans community how they would like it handled and would respect it if that is indeed what they want. It’s just I would instinctively feel like if we just let people go out and bash trans people to an audience of millions and didn’t say anything, that could make someone feel very alone.

 I didn't realize that I expressed ire. 

FWIW, I generally don't offer an opinion on content I haven't consumed.  Since I probably won't ever watch this special, I also probably won't ever comment on how transphobic it is or isn't.

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

Judging by this thread, my ability to never want to engage with something that's been severely criticized for espousing rhetoric that I abhor must be some kind of bloody superpower.

[stepee]

1 minute ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

Judging by this thread, my ability to never want to engage with something that's been severely criticized for espousing rhetoric that I abhor must be some kind of bloody superpower.

 

Somehow engaging with the content directly doesn’t “boost” them. Science.

[Moa]

2 minutes ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

Judging by this thread, my ability to never want to engage with something that's been severely criticized for espousing rhetoric that I abhor must be some kind of bloody superpower.

 

Before you call Hitler a Nazi you need to listen to his speeches in the original German.

[CastlevaniaNut18]

2 hours ago, Kamusha said:

 

Okay. Just letting you know I have pride in what I do similarly in how I'm sure you have pride in what you do. But please don't group my art form in with a transphobe. I tried to even it out by sharing a set from a trans comic but you didn't seem interested.

I didn’t do that, but okay. I’m sorry I’m not that interested in something you do and love. 

[Kamusha]

 

5 minutes ago, CastlevaniaNut18 said:

I didn’t do that, but okay. I’m sorry I’m not that interested in something you do and love. 

 

20 hours ago, CastlevaniaNut18 said:

I really don't watch much standup comedy. Maybe this is why?

 

[Guest]

34 minutes ago, Kamusha said:

If criticizing this special can only help its popularity then why did Netflix delay releasing it for months?

I can only assume they were worried about the negative press cycle and the managerial headache that they were in for, like with the Chappelle special. There are often non-economic costs to business decisions that cause delayed action. Hard to say with nothing more than some alleged insider information about a delay and backlash concern. It should also be noted that Gervais and Netflix don’t have wholly aligned goals here, and the cost/benefit analysis is as such not identical.

 

Gervais could want all the controversy while Netflix doesn’t want it because of those non-economic costs.

 

39 minutes ago, Kamusha said:

But ignoring issues and not bringing awareness/education to them is only gonna make things worse.

I would posit that this is a false dichotomy. Not driving engagement with people you believe are bad actors on <insert issue> doesn’t mean you are ignoring the issue. We each have a finite amount of time and resources, and using those to express outrage online about comedians saying objectionable things accomplishes a lot less than providing material support to the targets of the comedian.

 

I think we are more likely to see Gervais cancelled into 4 more Netflix specials too despite the e-ink spilled over this special. That at least appears to be the more common outcome of these campaigns.

[Guest]

25 minutes ago, Moa said:

 

Before you call Hitler a Nazi you need to listen to his speeches in the original German.

This is such a hilariously terrible analogy I can only assume you typed it with a large grin on your face  

[CastlevaniaNut18]

6 minutes ago, Kamusha said:

 

 

 

I was definitely being a little facetious. 
 

But no, I just don’t care for the genre as a whole most of the time. It’s not about you. 

[Brick]

While we're on the subject of transphobic comics (Jesus does this topic need it's own thread? Ugh), fuck Bill Maher. Again. 

 

 

[stepee]

22 minutes ago, Brick said:

While we're on the subject of transphobic comics (Jesus does this topic need it's own thread? Ugh), fuck Bill Maher. Again. 

 

 

 

wow that is amazingly dumb holy fuck

[Kal-El814]

Why aren't more trans kids coming out in states actively passing laws that make it more difficult to exist HURRRRRR HRURRRERRRRRRRE HURRRRRERERRRRR

[Moa]

2 hours ago, Brick said:

While we're on the subject of transphobic comics (Jesus does this topic need it's own thread? Ugh), fuck Bill Maher. Again. 

 

 

[Brick]

3 hours ago, Kal-El814 said:

Why aren't more trans kids coming out in states actively passing laws that make it more difficult to exist HURRRRRR HRURRRERRRRRRRE HURRRRRERERRRRR

 

While I would never appear on his show to begin with, I would love to be at that table when he's spouting off some dumb take and call him out on his bullshit. 

[DPCyric]

Well I was considering canceling my Netflix subscription this seals the deal.

[Fizzzzle]

On 5/25/2022 at 8:14 PM, Kal-El814 said:

Why aren't more trans kids coming out in states actively passing laws that make it more difficult to exist HURRRRRR HRURRRERRRRRRRE HURRRRRERERRRRR

I've always wondered "why are there more trans women than trans men?" Last I checked, trans women outnumber trans men by about 3:1. Unless there's some biological factor we don't know about yet, it would have to be something cultural. 

 

My theory has been that we, as a society, are generally pretty accepting of "girls who act like boys." In other words, girls who want to play football and wear men's clothing are treated like... normal. Boys who want to play with dolls and wear dresses have to bottle everything up. Girls are given more latitude to just be who they are, so they're more comfortable in their own skin, even if they're not "normal."

 

Gender dysmorphia shouldn't be more common in men than in women, yet it is. I don't think it's because men are more likely to experience it, rather that women are more likely to have adjusted to their own identity by the time they're an adult, because they haven't felt "wrong" for being themselves.

 

That was a long way of saying that if these people are so afraid of gays and trannies, they should probably just let their kids be whoever they want to be. They're helping create the problem they're afraid of.

 

(Not that being trans should ever be considered a "problem," I'm just making a point)

 

Also I recognize that take could come off as dismissive towards trans people. I don't mean it that way. Everyone's experience is unique. Sexuality/gender isn't something that lends itself to broad strokes

[Kamusha]

On 5/25/2022 at 3:26 PM, CastlevaniaNut18 said:

I was definitely being a little facetious. 
 

But no, I just don’t care for the genre as a whole most of the time. It’s not about you. 

 

I don't really care about your indifference to comedy. I just don't find transphobia to be something worth being flippant about.

[Kamusha]

On 5/25/2022 at 3:20 PM, sblfilms said:

I can only assume they were worried about the negative press cycle and the managerial headache that they were in for, like with the Chappelle special. There are often non-economic costs to business decisions that cause delayed action. Hard to say with nothing more than some alleged insider information about a delay and backlash concern. It should also be noted that Gervais and Netflix don’t have wholly aligned goals here, and the cost/benefit analysis is as such not identical.

 

Gervais could want all the controversy while Netflix doesn’t want it because of those non-economic costs.

 

I would posit that this is a false dichotomy. Not driving engagement with people you believe are bad actors on <insert issue> doesn’t mean you are ignoring the issue. We each have a finite amount of time and resources, and using those to express outrage online about comedians saying objectionable things accomplishes a lot less than providing material support to the targets of the comedian.

 

I think we are more likely to see Gervais cancelled into 4 more Netflix specials too despite the e-ink spilled over this special. That at least appears to be the more common outcome of these campaigns.

 

But Netflix's stock took a hit during the Chapelle controversy. This is documented. And their subscriptions are down for the first time ever. I'm not saying this is the sole reason, but Netflix's brand has certainly taken a hit. And I think it's a good thing for these issues to have a light shown on them because don't consumers deserve to know if their subscription dollars are being spent to platform hateful rhetoric?

 

And sometimes doing the right things means you aren't always successful. Unfortunately most people don't have the most education or evolved views on trans people. But education takes time and it takes patience. But just because it might not be successful doesn't mean you shouldn't speak out. The allegations against Louis CK didn't stop him from winning a Grammy, but does that mean we shouldn't be discussing his harassment of women? Hell, the discussion on him winning the Grammy probably generated a lot of listeners to the album. But I didn't see you arguing that it shouldn't be discussed.

 

And to respond to something you said earlier, its disingenuous for you to pretend that Chapelle signed a new special BECAUSE of the controversy. He is one of the biggest comedians today, and his specials were doing gangbusters for Netflix even before he went too hard on the trans stuff. No, he got a new deal in spite of everything. But stuff like this, to borrow a phrase from you, has non-economic costs for Chapelle. His brand has taken a hit. His name has more negative connotations in comedic circles than it did a decade ago. It will likely tarnish his legacy if he's choosing this to be his late-career stance. It won't age well at all.

[Kamusha]

And one last thing @sblfilms, and this is important and I say it with all due respect, but maybe you're not in the position to be suggesting what trans people should or shouldn't be doing when it comes to combating hateful rhetoric. It's not your fight, and your lack of personal experience comes through clearly. I would never tell a person of color what the best strategy for calling out racism would be. In those situations I understand I lack the personal experience so I try to sit back and listen rather than lecture. You certainly don't have any issue with calling out a white user if you think they are wrong or ignorant on issues related to race, and I'm not afraid to tell you that you're straight up wrong when it comes to trans issues. You have a lot of learning to do. I hope you're willing to do the necessary self-reflection and learn how to be a better alley for a community that is under a lot of underserved attacks right now.

[johnny]

good to know. i’ll be ignoring this special so netflix doesn’t get my view. i still mooch off of somebody else’s account or else i probably wouldn’t even have netflix