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Movies Scorsese on Marvel movies: "That's not cinema" "Theme park ride" EDIT: Coppola says Marvel movies "despicable" "same movie over and over again"

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https://variety.com/2019/film/news/samuel-l-jackson-martin-scorseses-marvel-1203360546/

 

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“I don’t see them. I tried, you know? But that’s not cinema,” Scorsese said. “Honestly, the closest I can think of them, as well made as they are, with actors doing the best they can under the circumstances, is theme parks. It isn’t the cinema of human beings trying to convey emotional, psychological experiences to another human being.”

 

Response from some associated with Marvel:

 

Samuel L. Jackson: “I mean that’s like saying Bugs Bunny ain’t funny. Films are films. Everybody doesn’t like his stuff either,” Jackson told Variety‘s Angelique Jackson at the grand opening of Tyler Perry’s new studio in Atlanta, Ga. “Everybody’s got an opinion, so I mean it’s okay. Ain’t going to stop nobody from making movies.”

 

 

From the co-director of Into The Spiderverse:

 

 

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Maybe he hasn't seen the newer ones. But if he only saw the original Thor or Captain America he was right to criticize. :p

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14 minutes ago, Keyser_Soze said:

Maybe he hasn't seen the newer ones. But if he only saw the original Thor or Captain America he was right to criticize. :p

 

Okay, sorry for swarming your notifications with Michael Cohen's face :p, but yeah, early Marvel wasn't that great. If he watched the first two Iron Man movies and Incredible Hulk, then yeah.

 

But shit, even I was a critic then and really dig it now. Wouldn't say I'm a huge MCU fan who anxiously awaits every film, and I miss a decent amount of them, but what they've done has really impressed me now.

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Friend of mine summed this up perfectly this weekend "These older guys are resentful that they are no longer relevant and pissed that it's getting harder to get financing for their films." Marty is entitled to his opinion and I love his films... but he doesn't help his case when he denigrates the work of other film makers, many who grew up loving his work. 

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Old man criticizes things he hasn't experienced. Whatever.

 

Whether it's Scorsese on Marvel films or Ebert on games or anyone else on some art that they have some personal aversion to, even if they're a genius, it's hard to take them seriously. Especially when that thing is seen as a threat to what they love. It's got to be frustrating to be a living legend and struggle so hard to find the money to make your next film, while comic book and Marvel movies in particular consume the box office. 

 

Now, I'd totally listen to a commentary track of Scorsese tearing apart any given Marvel film, even one that I love. I'll listen to and take to heart any criticism he makes of something he's watched. His movies might not make money anymore, but the man still knows cinema as well as anyone. 

 

On that topic, Scorsese had a great conversation recently with Tarantino and they talk a bit about how Scorsese's view of "Hollywood" cinema was impacted by the films he was exposed to when he was young. Well worth a read. The DGA also has a podcast where directors interview other directors about their movies, and it can be pretty great at times.

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He was more than likely asked his damn opinion and responded honestly, and quite respectfully and diplomatically even by praising the actors and craft, as a 76 year old legend of film making. What was he supposed to do, lie and say they're fucking awesome when he clearly doesn't get the appeal? I don't even agree with him but it's Martin Scorsese. Disrespecting and mocking him is laughable considering his legacy and contributions to cinema. It doesn't mean one can't disagree with his opinion but acting like he's just some washed-up, stupid old man because he doesn't like these flicks is absurd to me. 

 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, SaysWho? said:

 

Okay, sorry for swarming your notifications with Michael Cohen's face :p, but yeah, early Marvel wasn't that great. If he watched the first two Iron Man movies and Incredible Hulk, then yeah.

 

 

But IM 1 and Hulk are the best phase one movies.

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56 minutes ago, RedSoxFan9 said:

He's right

 

Exactly.

 

In some ways he's very on point. Doesn't mean I agree with him, but MCU films are barely films to me - definitely entertaining, etc. same as theme park rides, and given it's Disney, the analogy is even more apt.

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There was a time when Marty and the young guys of HIS generation were unfairly critiqued by the generation before them as well... nice to see that he's keeping the tradition alive.  And I'd argue with anyone that what The Russos and Josh Brolin were able to do with Thanos, an entirely mo-capped character that has as much as an arc and psychological depth as any other character in movies is quintessentially cinematic but that's just me... I'm very familiar with this line of thinking having gone to film school in New York. Film snobbery and elitism is annoying as fuck... and I consider MYSELF a film snob :p

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Scorsese is incredible, of course, but pontificating about whether something “is cinema” is the same kind of smooth brain thinking people engage in when trying to explain why rap isn’t TECHNICALLY music because reasons. He’s earned his opinion and the right to share it, but it’s a stupid take. 

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4 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

I wonder if this is why he dropped out of The Joker... wasn't he involved at one point?

He was involved. He directed The King of Comedy. 

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Just now, Kal-El814 said:

He was involved. He directed The King of Comedy. 

Lol I know but he was directly involved with Joker at one point... I think executive producing or something.

 

Well he was rumored to be at one point.

 

https://deadline.com/2017/08/the-joker-origin-movie-todd-phillips-martin-scorsese-scott-silver-batman-dc-universe-1202154053/

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Can't say I necessarily disagree with him though I wish he'd grown out of his seeming obsession with gangsters by now.

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1 hour ago, SFLUFAN said:

Can't say I necessarily disagree with him though I wish he'd grown out of his seeming obsession with gangsters by now.

 

I would love to see more films like "Silence" from him. That's easily top 10 from the 2010's for me.

 

And yeah, I don't really disagree with his assessment. There are like three emotionally impactful scenes that I can remember over however many movies they've made. But most of them were at least fun during some parts. So yeah. An amusement park is an apt analogy of those for me.

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This is the same BS that complained about Comic Books being a form of Art and literature. 

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3 hours ago, Keyser_Soze said:

 

 

But IM 1 and Hulk are the best phase one movies.

 

The bar was low.

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In every medium there are deep thought provoking experiences and there are easy fun experiences.  In every medium there are really good and worthwhile examples of both.  Hating on either style is kind of pointless.

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1 minute ago, number305 said:

In every medium there are deep thought provoking experiences and there are easy fun experiences.  In every medium there are really good and worthwhile examples of both.  Hating on either style is kind of pointless.

Uh NO, my confirmation bias penis doesn’t turn into a diamond cutter for just no reason. Important film man said something I sometimes say and respect WILL be paid. Now let’s all watch the Infernal Affairs remake starring Marky Mark because that’s real cinema.

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3 minutes ago, Kal-El814 said:

Uh NO, my confirmation bias penis doesn’t turn into a diamond cutter for just no reason. Important film man said something I sometimes say and respect WILL be paid. Now let’s all watch the Infernal Affairs remake starring Marky Mark because that’s real cinema.

I do have to say that Infernal affairs and the funky bunch is a great movie.

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18 minutes ago, Kal-El814 said:

Uh NO, my confirmation bias penis doesn’t turn into a diamond cutter for just no reason. Important film man said something I sometimes say and respect WILL be paid. Now let’s all watch the Infernal Affairs remake starring Marky Mark because that’s real cinema.

 

:lol::cheers:

 

What do Jazz, Blues, Rock and Roll, Country Music, Hip Hop, Techno, Metal, Punk and House all have in common? They were each dismissed as not being legitimate forms of music by the older generation that preceded them for various reasons based on generational differences, cultural, class. The fact that people are STILL falling for this straw man is hilarious to me. Art is in the eye of the beholder and anyone who dismisses one form of art over another due to personal taste is full of shit as far as I'm concerned... I don't give a fuck who they are to be honest. I HATE modern hip hop music with the passion of a billion suns... but I'm self aware enough to realize that it's more about ME and not about the music. The music has evolved passed me into something I can barely recognize/relate to. That doesn't mean it's invalid. It means I'm getting old.

 

I would definitely agree that The Marvel Movies and most Big Hollywood Blockbusters are rollercoaster rides, yes. But making a successful, entertaining and engaging experience like that is an art form in itself. There's a difference between the Marvel Films and Bay's transformer movies or even what DC attempted and failed to do. 

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9 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

I would definitely agree that The Marvel Movies and most Big Hollywood Blockbusters are rollercoaster rides, yes. But making a successful, entertaining and engaging experience like that is an art form in itself. 

 

100% agree with this. I mean you can't go on something like the Pirates of the Caribbean ride at Disneyland or a monstrous wooden roller coaster and not appreciate the vision and creativity that went into it.

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2 hours ago, GeneticBlueprint said:

I would love to see more films like "Silence" from him. That's easily top 10 from the 2010's for me.

I finally got around to seeing that a few weeks ago, and goddamn. It's a hell of a thing. Glad I watched it. It will stick with me for a very long time. I'll probably never watch it again. 

 

Guardians of the Galaxy, though? I'll ride that roller coaster again any day. 

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What he said was only an insult if you don't like theme park rides. I do, so . . . I think he's simply making a distinction of intent between the kinds of films he likes, makes, and enjoys personally and the aim of MCU movies.

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2 hours ago, Greatoneshere said:

What he said was only an insult if you don't like theme park rides. I do, so . . . I think he's simply making a distinction of intent between the kinds of films he likes, makes, and enjoys personally and the aim of MCU movies.

 

Maybe he specifically meant the teacup ride!

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Tony Stark Weighs In...

 

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In the ongoing saga of celebrities reacting to Martin Scorsese’s comment that Marvel movies are “not cinema,” actor Robert Downey Jr. has thrown his hat into the ring with his own response, according to Deadline. In an interview on Howard Stern’s satellite radio show, Downey took a measured amount of umbrage with Scorsese’s comment. “According to Scorsese, it’s not cinema. I gotta take a look at that,” Downey said. Stern quickly followed up on the issue, asking if Downey thought the Iron Man and broader Marvel movies qualified as cinema.“I mean, it plays in theaters,” he responded. “I appreciate his opinion. I think it’s like anything where we need all of the different perspectives so we can come to center and move on.”

 

“It’d be like saying Howard Stern isn’t radio,” he said. “It makes no sense to say it." Despite all that, Downey doesn’t think Scorsese’s comments come from a place of envy over the box office or cultural success of the Marvel Cinematic Universe. “Of course he’s not jealous of the success,” Downey said. “He’s Martin Scorsese.” Downey added that there’s something to be said for how genre movies like the Marvel films “denigrated” the artform of cinema, but said that he was “happy to be part of the problem, if there is one.”

 

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20 hours ago, skillzdadirecta said:

I HATE modern hip hop music with the passion of a billion suns... but I'm self aware enough to realize that it's more about ME and not about the music.

It's just shit, rest assured. I support you in this secret seething hatred of yours that I know is just waiting to explode somewhere, sometime...I'll be there handing you the bat.

 

And every time a new "Core" genre is formed in sorta-Metal, a part of me just fucking dies and sheds a tear for Tony Iommi. 

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Francis Ford Coppola defends Martin Scorsese's critique of Marvel movies, calls them 'despicable'

 

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“When Martin Scorsese says that the Marvel pictures are not cinema, he’s right because we expect to learn something from cinema, we expect to gain something, some enlightenment, some knowledge, some inspiration,” he said, according to AFP.

 

“I don’t know that anyone gets anything out of seeing the same movie over and over again. Martin was kind when he said it’s not cinema. He didn’t say it’s despicable, which I just say it is.”

 

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