Jason Posted November 12, 2018 Share Posted November 12, 2018 1 minute ago, CitizenVectron said: I'd like to actually say that the entire culture of Americans rejecting "losers" in politics is a bad one. In almost all other western democracies a party will run a leader two or even three times before choosing another. I guess it's because in other democracies it's typically a battle of ideas when choosing your local rep (who then determines the leader) whereas the vote for President in the US is almost entirely based on a cult of personality and the idea that each one will be a saviour. Hillary's already failed twice at becoming president. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted November 12, 2018 Share Posted November 12, 2018 1 minute ago, Jason said: Hillary's already failed twice at becoming president. I would only count it as one failed attempt. I am not saying that she in particular should run again, but the US is really stupid in how it dumps its leaders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chairslinger Posted November 12, 2018 Share Posted November 12, 2018 19 minutes ago, PaladinSolo said: Yes because the party has soured on her big time. The GOP was pretty damn sour on Trump, too. As the primary nears, imagine the Dems start to panic about a crowded field with low name recognition. But more importantly, imagine they start telling themselves the narrative, "Why take our chances with a wild card when Hillary won the popular vote and a fluke cost her in the Electoral College? Now Trump is less popular because he has a record that he didn't have in '16, that'll definitely net us whatever razor thin margin we needed in WI, PA, and MI." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaladinSolo Posted November 12, 2018 Share Posted November 12, 2018 8 minutes ago, Chairslinger said: The GOP was pretty damn sour on Trump, too. As the primary nears, imagine the Dems start to panic about a crowded field with low name recognition. But more importantly, imagine they start telling themselves the narrative, "Why take out chances with a wild card when Hillary won the popular vote and a fluke cost her in the Electoral College? Now Trump is less popular because he has a record that he didn't have in '16, that'll definitely net us whatever razor thin margin we needed in WI, PA, and MI." Not really the same thing, Trump had his 30% of votes throughout the first half of the primaries, and won states because the other 14 idiots split the votes. Clinton does not have a dedicated 30% of the party behind her, and he approval ratings have actually gotten worse since the election. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted November 12, 2018 Share Posted November 12, 2018 20 minutes ago, CitizenVectron said: I would only count it as one failed attempt. I am not saying that she in particular should run again, but the US is really stupid in how it dumps its leaders. I don't see why failing to make it out of the primaries shouldn't count as a failed attempt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spawn_of_Apathy Posted November 12, 2018 Share Posted November 12, 2018 Hillary is not a candidate to energize people to the polls to vote against Trump. There are still non-Trump supports that are not convinced Hillary would be any better. Not the same kind of terrible just a different flavors of terrible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted November 12, 2018 Share Posted November 12, 2018 @CitizenVectron I'd also point out that people are hot on Beto's future even though he just lost, for example. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedSoxFan9 Posted November 12, 2018 Share Posted November 12, 2018 29 minutes ago, CitizenVectron said: I'd like to actually say that the entire culture of Americans rejecting "losers" in politics is a bad one. In almost all other western democracies a party will run a leader two or even three times before choosing another. I guess it's because in other democracies it's typically a battle of ideas when choosing your local rep (who then determines the leader) whereas the vote for President in the US is almost entirely based on a cult of personality and the idea that each one will be a saviour. I think we would see more losing candidates run again if they were younger when they lost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spawn_of_Apathy Posted November 12, 2018 Share Posted November 12, 2018 21 minutes ago, Jason said: @CitizenVectron I'd also point out that people are hot on Beto's future even though he just lost, for example. Man, had he won though... He may not have been ready for a 2020 POTUS run, but maybe a 2024 or 2028 run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewhyteboar Posted November 12, 2018 Share Posted November 12, 2018 3 hours ago, Anathema- said: lol mark penn Yup. Mark Penn hasn't worked for her in 10 years or so. Why does anyone care what he thinks about anything? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedSoxFan9 Posted November 12, 2018 Share Posted November 12, 2018 4 hours ago, Anathema- said: lol mark penn I wonder if he has figured out how primaries work Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarSolo Posted November 12, 2018 Share Posted November 12, 2018 This is a nope from me. Look, I don't doubt Hillary would be a better President than Trump, I also don't doubt there'd be people who died under Trump's administration that would be alive today if Hillary were President. But there are people out there (Democrat, Republican, independent) who see her as pure evil no matter what. And to watch the two of them debate again? Dear fucking God, kill me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finaljedi Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 7 minutes ago, MarSolo said: This is a nope from me. Look, I don't doubt Hillary would be a better President than Trump, I also don't doubt there'd be people who died under Trump's administration that would be alive today if Hillary were President. But there are people out there (Democrat, Republican, independent) who see her as pure evil no matter what. And to watch the two of them debate again? Dear fucking God, kill me. Every debate with Trump is going to be a shitshow, he can't talk policy without getting the wording from Fox and Friends Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massdriver Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 Now we just need Senator Elect ( is that proper?) Mitt Romney to run again and we are all set for some nostalgia! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jwheel86 Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 The simple test is can the candidate kick Trump's ass in a debate, not out smart him, but make Trump look small. If they can find someone who can do that and come off as an authentic human, they'll win by chipping at the Trump cult and motivating the base to come out. Beto never hit Cruz directly in the debates despite multiple opportunities, he's authentic but I don't see him as being able to make Trump bleed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 4 minutes ago, Jwheel86 said: The simple test is can the candidate kick Trump's ass in a debate, not out smart him, but make Trump look small. If they can find someone who can do that and come off as an authentic human, they'll win by chipping at the Trump cult and motivating the base to come out. Beto never hit Cruz directly in the debates despite multiple opportunities, he's authentic but I don't see him as being able to make Trump bleed. Gillum is amazing at this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_m_b_m_b_m Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 1 hour ago, Jose said: Gillum is amazing at this. And also, it's hard to believe I'm saying this in the US, but being black would help him. When it comes to turnout for the general election that is Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaysWho? Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 Hillary Launches Campaign To Raise $100 Million Or Else She’ll Run For President Quote CHAPPAQUA, NY—In a press conference announcing her plans for the 2020 election, Hillary Clinton told reporters she is launching a campaign Tuesday that will raise $100 million by the end of the year or else she will run for president. “I’m very excited to roll out my initiative to secure this full amount within seven weeks, and if it is not successful—let me be very clear on this—I will once more fill out the paperwork to run for president and submit it to the Federal Election Commission,” said Clinton, who stressed that she was “absolutely serious” about her new A Hundred Million Or Me campaign, describing the town halls and candidate meet-and-greets she would soon begin holding in Iowa and New Hampshire if donors came up even a penny short. “What I’m asking you to do is picture—and picture very vividly—the following things: Lawns plastered with ‘I’m With Her In 2020’ signs, continuous television ads showcasing my strenuous attempts to appear enthusiastic, entire news cycles once more given over to my use of a private email server as secretary of state. That’s one possibility. The other is you give me $100 million. Up to you.” At press time, sources confirmed Clinton had raised $17.6 billion in the first 45 seconds of the campaign. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithan Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 On 11/12/2018 at 11:30 AM, RedSoxFan9 said: it would be kind of funny if she lost to trump again im sure they would blame russia again, not the fact everybody hates her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 15 minutes ago, Mithan said: im sure they would blame russia again, not the fact everybody hates her. She received more votes than Trump did, and received the second-highest vote total of all time in any election. Want to rephrase that? Literally no one but Obama has ever received more votes than her. If you think that everyone hated her, then that is only revealing your own projections. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 19 minutes ago, Mithan said: im sure they would blame russia again, not the fact everybody hates her. I really don't get what's so difficult for so many people to get their heads around with respect to it being perfectly possible for it to BOTH be true that she was a shitty candidate and that the Russians interfered to give Trump an extra push. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_m_b_m_b_m Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 57 minutes ago, CitizenVectron said: She received more votes than Trump did, and received the second-highest vote total of all time in any election. Want to rephrase that? Literally no one but Obama has ever received more votes than her. If you think that everyone hated her, then that is only revealing your own projections. Opinion polls had her as the most dislikable pol outside of trump. She is extremely disliked and has been for some time. How much of that is her and how much is part of a decades long right wing hit job is debatable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 Just now, b_m_b_m_b_m said: Opinion polls had her as the most dislikable pol outside of trump. She is extremely disliked and has been for some time. How much of that is her and how much is part of a decades long right wing hit job is debatable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithan Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 On 11/13/2018 at 3:46 PM, CitizenVectron said: She received more votes than Trump did, and received the second-highest vote total of all time in any election. Want to rephrase that? Literally no one but Obama has ever received more votes than her. If you think that everyone hated her, then that is only revealing your own projections. Yes? And is that what I was commenting on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithan Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 On 11/13/2018 at 3:51 PM, Jason said: I really don't get what's so difficult for so many people to get their heads around with respect to it being perfectly possible for it to BOTH be true that she was a shitty candidate and that the Russians interfered to give Trump an extra push. Seems to me like you are reaching. Her comments calling 50% of American's deplorables, having high negatives, people wanting to make a "fuck you" vote to show how pissed they are at business as usual, and the FBI announcing they were re-investigating her then not and the electoral college had a much higher effect than 3 or 4 votes swayed by the Russians on Facebook. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 On 11/13/2018 at 9:15 AM, Jose said: Gillum is amazing at this. Trump getting embarrassed by a black man again would be oh so sweet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilentWorld Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 4 hours ago, Mithan said: Seems to me like you are reaching. Her comments calling 50% of American's deplorables, having high negatives, people wanting to make a "fuck you" vote to show how pissed they are at business as usual, and the FBI announcing they were re-investigating her then not and the electoral college had a much higher effect than 3 or 4 votes swayed by the Russians on Facebook. this is an even stupider take than when you said a few years ago that there was surely a coming housing collapse in Canada Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaysWho? Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 14 hours ago, Mithan said: Her comments calling 50% of American's deplorables 50% of Trump supporters =/= 50% of Americans unless the entire country supports Trump. And judging by the past 2 years, please tell me the errors there. Trump just called Democrats mobs, which is an actual third of America, and it gets cheered by every crowd with whom he speaks. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithan Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 11 hours ago, SilentWorld said: this is an even stupider take than when you said a few years ago that there was surely a coming housing collapse in Canada If you bought a house in most areas in Canada in the last 5 years, you probably lost money. Wait and see for Toronto and Vancouver. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithan Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 2 hours ago, SaysWho? said: 50% of Trump supporters =/= 50% of Americans unless the entire country supports Trump. And judging by the past 2 years, please tell me the errors there. Trump just called Democrats mobs, which is an actual third of America, and it gets cheered by every crowd with whom he speaks. So calling 50% of American's "deplorables" is correct? And no, I don't agree with Trump calling Democrats "mobs", but then again, I don't have a partisan view point like you do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaysWho? Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 11 minutes ago, Mithan said: So calling 50% of American's "deplorables" is correct? I've seen people not read an entire post, but to not read the first two sentences of the post you're quoting? Pretty impressive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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