Television Marvel's "What If...?" First episode came out today

[Fizzzzle]

Gotta say.... eh.

 

I do like the premise. I felt like it got a little to "wink wink," which I fear will be a common theme throughout the series. The animation was also a bit all over the place. In the action scenes it's generally really good, but then in some dialogue scenes it looks like a Telltales game

 

Side note: a nitpick I have is during the episode (no spoilers), when they're discussing what Hydra is doing in Norway, the fucking COMMANDER of whatever the unit Peggy was a part of says "the Nazis were in Norway!?" as if they hadn't invaded Norway 3 years before the show takes place.

 

Something that confused me:

Spoiler

Did I miss something? How did Red Skull get the tessaract? Was it powering Steve's suit or something? Did they ever explain that? Howard Stark had the tessaract, then the next time we see it, Red Skull has it.

 

 

Anyway, episode 1 wasn't bad, but I hope it gets better. Given the format, it's impossible not to compare it to The Animatrix, which is probably a little unfair, but the plot of the vignettes in The Animatrix never felt derivative of The Matrix itself. They told their own stories.

[Greatoneshere]

I'll definitely be watching, and apparently the "what if?" series is canon due to the multiverse. 

[Fizzzzle]

15 minutes ago, Greatoneshere said:

I'll definitely be watching, and apparently the "what if?" series is canon due to the multiverse. 

I guess it just further opens the multiverse, so they could theoretically pull basically any character back and use "multiverse" as the excuse. Like they could theoretically pull Captain Carter into the mainline movies, even though that would be weird since they'd have to almost entirely replace Hayley atwell with a CG version of herself.

 

I'm legitimately worried about the multiverse stuff becoming too fucky. Like they're already teetering on the edge of "who cares because nothing matters," now they're legitimately saying nothing matters. If they can manage it as well as they did with Loki, then cool, but we'll see what happens with Dr. Strange.

 

Then again, the comics have reached that point multiple times, so... Whatever.

[EternallDarkness]

3 hours ago, Fizzzzle said:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Did I miss something? How did Red Skull get the tessaract? Was it powering Steve's suit or something? Did they ever explain that? Howard Stark had the tessaract, then the next time we see it, Red Skull has it.

 

 

 

Spoiler

It was indeed powering Steve's suit, but then he got buried and captured and Skull retrieved it to use to open the portal 

 

[Greatoneshere]

1 hour ago, Fizzzzle said:

I guess it just further opens the multiverse, so they could theoretically pull basically any character back and use "multiverse" as the excuse. Like they could theoretically pull Captain Carter into the mainline movies, even though that would be weird since they'd have to almost entirely replace Hayley atwell with a CG version of herself.

 

I'm legitimately worried about the multiverse stuff becoming too fucky. Like they're already teetering on the edge of "who cares because nothing matters," now they're legitimately saying nothing matters. If they can manage it as well as they did with Loki, then cool, but we'll see what happens with Dr. Strange.

 

Then again, the comics have reached that point multiple times, so... Whatever.

 

I've had this worry the moment Marvel started discussing time travel and multiverses and when DC started discussing Flash's Flashpoint storyline to do the same in Flash's upcoming movie. It's very hard to make you care about things when there are variants of everybody to keep bringing back the same character, even with a different (or not) personality. It's going to become too fucky I think.

[Reputator]

4 hours ago, Fizzzzle said:

Gotta say.... eh.

 

I do like the premise. I felt like it got a little to "wink wink," which I fear will be a common theme throughout the series. The animation was also a bit all over the place. In the action scenes it's generally really good, but then in some dialogue scenes it looks like a Telltales game

 

Side note: a nitpick I have is during the episode (no spoilers), when they're discussing what Hydra is doing in Norway, the fucking COMMANDER of whatever the unit Peggy was a part of says "the Nazis were in Norway!?" as if they hadn't invaded Norway 3 years before the show takes place.

 

Something that confused me:

  Reveal hidden contents

Did I miss something? How did Red Skull get the tessaract? Was it powering Steve's suit or something? Did they ever explain that? Howard Stark had the tessaract, then the next time we see it, Red Skull has it.

 

 

Anyway, episode 1 wasn't bad, but I hope it gets better. Given the format, it's impossible not to compare it to The Animatrix, which is probably a little unfair, but the plot of the vignettes in The Animatrix never felt derivative of The Matrix itself. They told their own stories.

 

I missed that Norway exchange somehow, but yeah I agree with everything you said.

 

It was fun, but a little on the verge of being too campy at times.

[silentbob]

I dug the episode, and liked that they made Peggy the powerful Captain we got in Winter Soldier over First Avenger. Liked the nods to the original story while showing the slightest diverge in ones reaction. Also, did anyone like the complete Wonder Woman ripoff deflecting the rocket/grenade in the middle of the battlefield. 

[johnny]

are the episodes independent from one another or is it gonna have an overarching storyline? 

[Fizzzzle]

2 hours ago, johnny said:

are the episodes independent from one another or is it gonna have an overarching storyline? 

They are all short stories, as far as anyone knows.

[PaladinSolo]

I don't think I'll be watching these I really don't care that they swapped out characters for different roles. 

[Kamusha]

I like Marvel enough that I didn’t mind having to watch 3 or so movies a year to keep up. But I’m not sure if I like them enough to also watch every episode of every show in addition to the movies. Keeping up with Marvel is turning into a full time job.

[number305]

1 hour ago, Komusha said:

I like Marvel enough that I didn’t mind having to watch 3 or so movies a year to keep up. But I’m not sure if I like them enough to also watch every episode of every show in addition to the movies. Keeping up with Marvel is turning into a full time job.

I agree with this, but I have young twin boys that are super excited for everything marvel - so we watch it all together.  Most of them are decent - But I did sleep through a few of the winter soldier shows.

[Kal-El814]

14 hours ago, Fizzzzle said:

I guess it just further opens the multiverse, so they could theoretically pull basically any character back and use "multiverse" as the excuse. Like they could theoretically pull Captain Carter into the mainline movies, even though that would be weird since they'd have to almost entirely replace Hayley atwell with a CG version of herself.

 

I'm legitimately worried about the multiverse stuff becoming too fucky. Like they're already teetering on the edge of "who cares because nothing matters," now they're legitimately saying nothing matters. If they can manage it as well as they did with Loki, then cool, but we'll see what happens with Dr. Strange.

 

Then again, the comics have reached that point multiple times, so... Whatever.

 

As soon as you adopt the “nothing matters” approach to comics and superhero movies, you’ll be much better off. Let individual movies, issues, books, etc., be their own thing, acknowledge that canon is nothing more than the weakest connective tissue, and it’s all a better way to enjoy the whole thing.

[XxEvil AshxX]

3 hours ago, PaladinSolo said:

I don't think I'll be watching these I really don't care that they swapped out characters for different roles. 

 

Marvel What If's used to be cool... they were usually twists on big events, toying around with ideas on what would it have been like if this happened instead of that.

 

I don't trust today's Disney/Marvel to do them justice. I can't see this being anything other than an opportunity to do race/gender swaps and then say "but it's just a what if" when someone criticizes it. I just don't think the creativity is there. Hopefully they prove me wrong.

 

I'd like to see something like, "What If Wolverine would've discovered the alien symbiote during the Secret Wars?" or something like that.

[Reputator]

59 minutes ago, XxEvil AshxX said:

 

Marvel What If's used to be cool... they were usually twists on big events, toying around with ideas on what would it have been like if this happened instead of that.

 

I don't trust today's Disney/Marvel to do them justice. I can't see this being anything other than an opportunity to do race/gender swaps and then say "but it's just a what if" when someone criticizes it. I just don't think the creativity is there. Hopefully they prove me wrong.

 

I'd like to see something like, "What If Wolverine would've discovered the alien symbiote during the Secret Wars?" or something like that.

 

I was looking through a list on Wikipedia of the What If issues and a LOT of them are "what if so-and-so had gotten these powers instead?" So I don't think this first episode is inconsistent with the series.

[XxEvil AshxX]

10 minutes ago, Reputator said:

 

I was looking through a list on Wikipedia of the What If issues and a LOT of them are "what if so-and-so had gotten these powers instead?" So I don't think this first episode is inconsistent with the series.

 

No, I know. There are a lot that were like that. What I'm saying is that they weren't all like that. And a lot of those were in the context of circumstancial events, like, "what if the radioactive spider would've bit MJ instead?" Like, a butterfly effect. One tiny little detail changes the entire course of the marvel universe. Stuff like that.

 

I'm just saying I hope they put more thought into it than just being a swap for the sake of a swap. Like, "what if Iron man was black? Because reasons!"

[Reputator]

1 minute ago, XxEvil AshxX said:

 

No, I know. There are a lot that were like that. What I'm saying is that they weren't all like that. And a lot of those were in the context of circumstancial events, like, "what if the radioactive spider would've bit MJ instead?"

 

I'm just saying I hope they put more thought into it than just being a swap for the sake of a swap. Like, "what if Iron man was black? Because reasons!"

 

Well, in this case it was circumstantial. The title of the episode could have just as easily been "What if Agent Carter stayed in the room when Steve Rogers underwent Project Rebirth?" But that's a bit too long and not as catchy.

 

But none of the other episodes coming up are random gender or ethnic swaps either. They're all swaps with different characters that we know, who may or may not have different physical characteristics. And according to a review I read, the third episode deals with an assassin hunting the Avengers before they have a chance to come together (or something like that).

[silentbob]

I wonder if that will be the Killmonger episode where he saved Tony from the attack of the first movie. No attack, no ironman, no avengers initiative to be involved with and could see them as a threat. Tons of cool shit they could do and we do have a Zombies episode to look forward too. 

[Fizzzzle]

27 minutes ago, silentbob said:

I wonder if that will be the Killmonger episode where he saved Tony from the attack of the first movie. No attack, no ironman, no avengers initiative to be involved with and could see them as a threat. Tons of cool shit they could do and we do have a Zombies episode to look forward too. 

That's what I'm hoping for. Go deep down the rabbit hole.

[TwinIon]

I enjoyed the episode well enough, but for the most part it was telling such a similar story to what we've already seen, it felt almost like a re-casting than anything else. Pretty much all the major beats were repeats.

 

Spoiler

I actually got pretty excited when they retrieved the tesseract and then built the smasher (or whatever the suit was called). It felt like they were really going to divert from First Avenger. Those two changes actually felt like bigger "what ifs" than swapping Carter and Rogers. The whole war effort could have gone differently, the Tesseract could have huge ramifications, and having a Mark I Iron Man suit 60 years early sure seems impactful. Instead they found ways to revert quickly back to familiar situations with some names being swapped. They still had to go save Bucky, the train still resulted in losing a best friend, the Carter/Rogers relationship had the same moments, they still had to to go the Castle, and Cap still had to sacrifice themselves at the end only to appear in time for the Avengers initiative. I feel like there was so much room to tell a story slightly less familiar, and I hope the show does that in future episodes.

 

I was also mixed on the animation. I think most of the action works well, and they did plenty of it. I still don't like how they render faces. It's difficult to articulate other than it just feeling "off" in some way.

 

[Kamusha]

4 hours ago, number305 said:

I agree with this, but I have young twin boys that are super excited for everything marvel - so we watch it all together.  Most of them are decent - But I did sleep through a few of the winter soldier shows.

I totally feel that. Kids love the MCU and it’s fun to see it through their eyes. And just to be clear, I quite enjoyed bout WandaVision and Loki, so I will still keep up with some of the shows. But it’s also clear there are areas of the MCU that just don’t interest me the same. I also couldn’t finish Falcon and the Winter Soldier. The more Marvel embraces weird stuff like the multiverse and cosmic shit the more it makes the super spy stuff seem boring in comparison. I’ll probably skip Hawkeye too for that reason. I used to be a completionist with the MCU but I just can’t anymore.

[johnny]

i thought it was pretty boring. dunno why they picked this as the first episode. there has to be more interesting what if scenarios. 

 

dunno about the animation. don’t really care for it. don’t think it looks particularly good. 

[Fizzzzle]

44 minutes ago, johnny said:

i thought it was pretty boring. dunno why they picked this as the first episode. there has to be more interesting what if scenarios. 

 

dunno about the animation. don’t really care for it. don’t think it looks particularly good. 

Yeah. I think there are moments where it looks good, then other moments where I think I'm in a telltale game. It is wildly inconsistent.

[Kal-El814]

10 hours ago, johnny said:

i thought it was pretty boring. dunno why they picked this as the first episode. there has to be more interesting what if scenarios. 

 

dunno about the animation. don’t really care for it. don’t think it looks particularly good. 

 

I assumed they were starting in chronological order, but I guess we’ll see.

[Zaku3]

Ok i want a Captain Peggy movie. 

[silentbob]

4 hours ago, Zaku3 said:

Ok i want a Captain Peggy movie. 

Well it was pretty much Wonder Woman and used her walk into battlefield badass style too. I will admit she did kick ass

 

 

i liked tonight’s episode and had the Gunn banter done pretty well. Huge cast too for this episode and wonder if they will follow through with the ending

[Kal-El814]

I haven’t read anything about What If, so I was not expecting Chadwick Boseman’s voice going into this episode. Man.

[silentbob]

2 hours ago, Kal-El814 said:

I haven’t read anything about What If, so I was not expecting Chadwick Boseman’s voice going into this episode. Man.

he apparently will be in a couple more episodes this year according to the boss KF himself

[Fizzzzle]

Got hit in the feels a bit with Chadwick's voice, but.... eh. So far, I think the series kind of sucks. Still got 8 more episodes to go, so we'll see.

[Reputator]

This last episode was really cheesy. This show seems more kid-oriented than I thought. I don't think I'll bother keeping up with it. It's not really for me.

[Kal-El814]

2 hours ago, Reputator said:

This last episode was really cheesy. This show seems more kid-oriented than I thought. I don't think I'll bother keeping up with it. It's not really for me.

 

I dunno, confirmation that Peter Quill not being one of the Guardians is the best thing that could happen to the Galaxy is pretty great

[skillzdadirecta]

I thought the episode was fun in a light hearted way  I do wonder if they are going to go down some of the darker paths some of these What If stories can take though. Some of the best What If's got REALLY dark. DC recently did something similar with their Dark Knights multiverse storylines and those were Dark as HELL.

[johnny]

i liked the episode with t’challa 

[EternallDarkness]

While it was good to hear Boseman again and there were a number of laughs in the episode, Starlord's over the top good at any and everything was honestly annoying 

[brucoe]

There are two reasons I don't care about this series:

 

1. "What If" makes it appear that the episodes of are no importance whatsoever. I prefer Marvel for its continuity and how it builds its universe. Having a show that's dedicated to stuff that doesn't happen seems a waste of time to me.

 

2. I hate cartoon content. I know a lot of people don't, but it's the reason I ignore tons of content that comes out from Star Wars. It's mostly for children and written that way which turns me off completely. It's why I have such a hard time taking cartoon content seriously. I think the only real cartoon content I've seen that engaged me was the old movie Wizards, and that's mainly because it took itself seriously.

 

Again, I know a lot of people feel otherwise, and I'm fine with that. That just means such content is for you. Not for me.