McConnell may have just had a stroke in the middle of talking to the press.

[MarSolo]

The ultimate irony?

 

This guy is older than all of them:

[Guest]

6 hours ago, BloodyHell said:

So what does an age minimum achieve? Why can an 85 year old be president, but not a 25 year old? A cap makes far more sense than a minimum.

I don’t think the current minimums are sensible. You could certainly make the argument that the brain development of all children still being deeply in process makes them unsuitable as a class, but the opposite is not true for the elderly. The particular areas of brain development that continue into the late teen and mid 20s are directly connected to decision making.

 

It is notable that in this thread filled with people who are certainly above the average intelligence of an American have yet to describe how the existence of decreasing mental acuity in and of itself hampers the ability of elderly legislators to do their job. Relative drops are of no consequence. The question is whether or not the actual decline in mental fitness is large enough to cross a threshold where an entire class of citizens shoulder be rendered unfit.

 

Even the person this thread is about has thus far not shown a decrease in ability to serve the interests of his constituents!

 

At least in the Feinstein case you can point to examples where she was supposed to be casting a vote in committee and instead starts reading a speech. But we shouldn’t make anti-democratic policy over one awful situation.

 

 

[Air_Delivery]

4 hours ago, MarSolo said:

The ultimate irony?

 

This guy is older than all of them:

Keeping your weight down and exercising is important for all age groups but it is absolutely essential when you are older.

[5timechamp]

29 minutes ago, Air_Delivery said:

Keeping your weight down and exercising is important for all age groups but it is absolutely essential when you are older.

 

Then why hasnt Trump dropped dead yet!!!

What dark magic is keeping him alive, are bone spurs and being an insufferable jerk the key to longevity? 

[Air_Delivery]

14 minutes ago, 5timechamp said:

 

Then why hasnt Trump dropped dead yet!!!

What dark magic is keeping him alive, are bone spurs and being an insufferable jerk the key to longevity? 

I would bet you money he has health problems not to mention declining mental faculties.

Cardio is by far the most important thing you can do to keep your marbles. 

[unogueen]

I honestly hate watching bags of bones work and grind well past body comfort, whether necessity or avarice. It's bad, and indicative of social faults, whether at the bottom or the top. Period. Labour should have a hard set figure where the means of production no longer falls under certain cohorts, like most people would like to keep children away from deep fryers. The criterias can be argued, but only under the most advantageous conditions should there be exemptions (skipping grades upward or something). Meat and bone is all we have and it is very susceptible to life conditioning.

[MarSolo]

3 hours ago, Air_Delivery said:

Keeping your weight down and exercising is important for all age groups but it is absolutely essential when you are older.

Or you smoke the good shit like Harrison Ford does. A story popped up recently that he and Paul McCartney smoked together and Paul had to practically be carried out of the restaurant.

[Air_Delivery]

18 minutes ago, MarSolo said:

Or you smoke the good shit like Harrison Ford does. A story popped up recently that he and Paul McCartney smoked together and Paul had to practically be carried out of the restaurant.

Reminds me of that Louis CK bit where he didn't realize they have been working on weed like its the cure for cancer

[Keyser_Soze]

7 hours ago, Air_Delivery said:

I would bet you money he has health problems not to mention declining mental faculties.

Cardio is by far the most important thing you can do to keep your marbles. 

 

He plays golf so he gets plenty of exercise!

[Fizzzzle]

23 hours ago, Air_Delivery said:

I would bet you money he has health problems not to mention declining mental faculties.

Cardio is by far the most important thing you can do to keep your marbles. 

You can improve health so much by simply walking places. Especially for older people. That's why it sucks when elderly folks can no longer drive if they live in a place where they're stranded without a car.

[legend]

On 9/2/2023 at 1:37 PM, sblfilms said:

I don’t think the current minimums are sensible. You could certainly make the argument that the brain development of all children still being deeply in process makes them unsuitable as a class, but the opposite is not true for the elderly. The particular areas of brain development that continue into the late teen and mid 20s are directly connected to decision making.

 

It is notable that in this thread filled with people who are certainly above the average intelligence of an American have yet to describe how the existence of decreasing mental acuity in and of itself hampers the ability of elderly legislators to do their job. Relative drops are of no consequence. The question is whether or not the actual decline in mental fitness is large enough to cross a threshold where an entire class of citizens shoulder be rendered unfit.

 

Even the person this thread is about has thus far not shown a decrease in ability to serve the interests of his constituents!

 

At least in the Feinstein case you can point to examples where she was supposed to be casting a vote in committee and instead starts reading a speech. But we shouldn’t make anti-democratic policy over one awful situation.

 

 

 

If you think McConnell being unable to answer questions does not represent an inability to serve adequately then, no, we're never going to find common ground on this one!  

[Guest]

27 minutes ago, legend said:

 

If you think McConnell being unable to answer questions does not represent an inability to serve adequately then, no, we're never going to find common ground on this one!  

What part of serving as a senator is impacted by these two episodes? Please be specific.

 

But if you don’t want to bother explaining that point, I’ll gladly concede McConnell as an example of a person unable to perform their duties due to complications of aging (though it seems more likely it is due to the concussion he sustained, but that is speculation on my part!), because that raises our total examples to…2.

 

Is your position then that we should make anti-democratic policy for an entire class of people because of 2 examples of older public servants who lost it at the end of their political careers?

[TUFKAK]

Yes

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, TUFKAK said:

Yes

I appreciate the honesty as opposed to those who dance around it. Also those who will admit the primary driver here is to get younger and more progressive people in positions of power, because that is the undercurrent of the whole thing. The anti-Boomer/Gen X sentiment has grown more and more fierce amongst the 40 and unders.

[TUFKAK]

8 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

I appreciate the honesty as opposed to those who dance around it. Also those who will admit the primary driver here is to get younger and more progressive people in positions of power, because that is the undercurrent of the whole thing. The anti-Boomer/Gen X sentiment has grown more and more fierce amongst the 40 and unders.

A have no issues making anti democratic policies for anti democratic people.

 

Politics is local but it’s way more national.

 

And fuck the boomers, they were handed everything from the greatest generation then spent decades destroying it, I’m tired of their policies and viewpoints controlling our national discourse and direction.

 

these fuckers were born on third base but pretended they hit a triple, I know as an Astros fan you may not be familiar with a triple 😂

[LazyPiranha]

I don’t think there’s a genuine or easy solution to the problem. I don’t think there should be a hard age cutoff, a significant portion of our country is elderly and we shouldn’t cut them off at the knees politically even if the boomers are particularly problematic.  Them dragging us down isn’t fixed by a younger generation completely forsaking them, it just changes the unfairness.  

[TUFKAK]

Just now, LazyPiranha said:

I don’t think there’s a genuine or easy solution to the problem. I don’t think there should be a hard age cutoff, a significant portion of our country is elderly and we shouldn’t cut them off at the knees politically even if the boomers are particularly problematic.  Them dragging us down isn’t fixed by a younger generation completely forsaking them, it just changes the unfairness.  

After 40 years they can fucking bill me.

[legend]

3 hours ago, sblfilms said:

What part of serving as a senator is impacted by these two episodes? Please be specific.

 

But if you don’t want to bother explaining that point, I’ll gladly concede McConnell as an example of a person unable to perform their duties due to complications of aging (though it seems more likely it is due to the concussion he sustained, but that is speculation on my part!), because that raises our total examples to…2.

 

Is your position then that we should make anti-democratic policy for an entire class of people because of 2 examples of older public servants who lost it at the end of their political careers?

 

 

Answering questions for the public is very much part of being a senator. "Sorry the senator can't take any questions right now because they're having a brain failure" is uh, not good  

 

But even that aside, these are simply the most publicly visible and indisputable examples of how aging is impacting some of these people. Great lengths are taken to cover up problems. We've heard the whispers about Feinstein being problematic for years, but only now is it so extreme that you just can't hide it at all anymore. So, no, I don't think it's reasonable to conclude that these are the only two age-related problems. I've also had concerns about the aging government long before McConnel was shutting down in font of the public.

 

Sadly, aging sucks big time and has many residual effects well beyond these very visible examples. There are also health risks that come with aging beyond mental degradation too. The chance for serious health problems goes way up. It's one of the reasons why I very much didn't want Bernie to run for president -- it's a big gamble when the next major health issue comes and I don't want to roll that dice with a president or any serious position (I'm not happy about Biden's age either even though he seems to be in decent shape). We can add RBG to the list of the how horrible the outcome was for her sticking in there all the way to the end too if you want another very visible example though.

 

You can label a maximum age as "anti-democratic" and while under some definitions that could be technically correct, I think it fails to represent the proposal of a maximum age restriction faithfully. We usually don't label any policy with any restriction as anti-democratic. I would have never used the term "anti-democratic" to describe the various minimum age requirements even though I think some of them maybe should be lowered and are too high. By calling it that, it feels like you're trying to get an emotional reaction from the associations rather than assess the situation at hand. Though I don't think you're doing that deliberately and manipulatively, it's an easy thing to fall into doing without that explicit intent.

 

Words and terms are vague, often by design, but you can't let that vagueness be a substitute for argument. I'm happy to hear an argument about why adding a maximum age restriction might be bad. I'm not convinced it's the right thing to do even though I do absolutely believe some of these people in government should have left, because every additional rule makes the analysis of how that rule can be gamed more complex to analyze. Maybe a maximum age restriction would open the door for abuse of some kind that I'm missing. Seems like not given it applies to everyone and every person would have a very long opportunity to serve, but I'd love to have that conversation! But saying "no because by some definition it's anti-democratic" just shuts down conversation, closing the door to finding better ways to govern.

 

And maybe we're closer to agreement than it seems. If your position is "maybe it's fine, but I'm hesitant to add more rules because I'm unsure of the consequences" then I can understand that more. But it seems like you're coming out very hard against the idea, rather than just being unsure.

[CastlevaniaNut18]

He's gone for good @legend

[legend]

1 minute ago, CastlevaniaNut18 said:

He's gone for good @legend

 

Oh shit. Wtf just happened?

[CastlevaniaNut18]

1 minute ago, legend said:

 

Oh shit. Wtf just happened?

Check the Nazi  thread.

[legend]

4 minutes ago, CastlevaniaNut18 said:

Check the Nazi  thread.

 

 

Well that sucks. I'm taking the time to argue with sblfilms more substantively because I like him

[SuperSpreader]

3 hours ago, Guest said:

I appreciate the honesty as opposed to those who dance around it. Also those who will admit the primary driver here is to get younger and more progressive people in positions of power, because that is the undercurrent of the whole thing. The anti-Boomer/Gen X sentiment has grown more and more fierce amongst the 40 and unders.

 

I'm 41, count me in on the anti Boomer/Gen X crowd please. 

[marioandsonic]

35 minutes ago, SuperSpreader said:

 

I'm 41, count me in on the anti Boomer/Gen X crowd please. 

Same, 34 here

[chakoo]

It’s kind of irksome to act like there is only two instances of this happening from our representatives. I’m sure if we took the time to look through past events we’ll find more. Like hell I’d consider pelosi’s hello moment one.

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

Just now, marioandsonic said:

Same, 34 here

 

You're exactly the crowd he was referencing

 

It's people like me (turning 49 in January) that are the exceptions!

[Jason]

16 minutes ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

You're exactly the crowd he was referencing

 

It's people like me (turning 49 in January) that are the exceptions!

 

ok boomer

 

Spoiler

Spoiler

Spoiler

 

 

 

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

6 minutes ago, Jason said:

ok boomer

 

  Reveal hidden contents

  Hide contents

  Hide contents

 

 

 

 

I'm solidly part of Generation X, thank you very much!

[legend]

1 hour ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

 

I'm solidly part of Generation X, thank you very much!

 

You have my condolences  

[Jason]

1 hour ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

I'm solidly part of Generation X, thank you very much!

 

Well at least you're not Gen Z I guess, little gif-hating shits.

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

In regard to the topic, I'm in agreement with @legend's contention that our system already implements a fair number of inherently "anti-democratic" measures (and probably, not nearly enough!) that have become the generally-accepted, relatively non-contentious means of conducting political business, so I'm not exactly sure why this one would be so very beyond the pale.

 

The strongest argument that I comes to my mind in comparing these "anti-democratic" measures to those for the minimum age requirements for holding political office is that those particular "anti-democratic" measures can be overcome through the natural process of getting older thereby negating their "anti-democratic" nature.  This is simply not the case for the "anti-democratic" nature of age ceilings as it's simply impossible to "age younger".

[TUFKAK]

15 minutes ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

In regard to the topic, I'm in agreement with @legend's contention that our system already implements a fair number of inherently "anti-democratic" measures (and probably, not nearly enough!) that have become the generally-accepted, relatively non-contentious means of conducting political business, so I'm not exactly sure why this one would be so very beyond the pale.

 

The strongest argument that I comes to my mind in comparing these "anti-democratic" measures to those for the minimum age requirements for holding political office is that those particular "anti-democratic" measures can be overcome through the natural process of getting older thereby negating their "anti-democratic" nature.  This is simply not the case for the "anti-democratic" nature of age ceilings as it's simply impossible to "age younger".

Counter point 

 

hgh 

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

Just now, TUFKAK said:

Counter point 

 

hgh 

 

Your literal chronological age doesn't reverse.  You will still be 75 years old even with the physiological conditioning of a 45 year old.

[TUFKAK]

Just now, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

 

Your literal chronological age doesn't reverse.  You will still be 75 years old even with the physiological conditioning of a 45 year old.

To be fair I think the hang ups are primarily on mental faculties and hgh has been noted, in a few studies and I grant both the Methodology and I was problematic, to have a positive impact on that.

[legend]

15 minutes ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

In regard to the topic, I'm in agreement with @legend's contention that our system already implements a fair number of inherently "anti-democratic" measures (and probably, not nearly enough!) that have become the generally-accepted, relatively non-contentious means of conducting political business, so I'm not exactly sure why this one would be so very beyond the pale.

 

The strongest argument that I comes to my mind in comparing these "anti-democratic" measures to those for the minimum age requirements for holding political office is that those particular "anti-democratic" measures can be overcome through the natural process of getting older thereby negating their "anti-democratic" nature.  This is simply not the case for the "anti-democratic" nature of age ceilings as it's simply impossible to "age younger".

 

That's true, you can't go backwards. Though the inability to run for office after an age would probably be the least "unfair" outcome of aging  Sadly aging just sucks and we have to accept that reality until my AIs solve it.* That or just think of time as happing all at once from a different perspective in which case it doesn't really matter.

 

 

^{* Do my AIs still have trouble walking straight and being confused by a bit of noise in the image? Yes, but I'm sure they'll crack the aging problem for us any moment now...}