skillzdadirecta Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 9 minutes ago, TwinIon said: My takeaway from the debate reactions I've seen is that where people wanted to find reasons to dislike Hilary, people are looking for reasons to like Biden. The debate was terrible all around, but Biden didn't exactly put on a masterclass performance. He seemed unsure, missed easy talking points, largely disowned much of his own party, and simply looked his age. However, he wasn't openly courting white supremacists, questioning the legitimacy of the election process, or making calls to interfere in that election. He wasn't acting like a child, lying with complete abandon, or otherwise acting Trumpian, so he was the easy and obvious choice between the two. Still, I feel like I'm seeing a whole lot more forgiveness of Biden's follies than we saw with Hilary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaysWho? Posted September 30, 2020 Author Share Posted September 30, 2020 Also, I know there are few people who can debate like Obama, and I know McCain is a whole different debate opponent, but considering McCain's disdain for Obama at the time and the attacks he threw at him, Biden should probably call Obama for pointers on how to brush everything off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skillzdadirecta Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 You guys are putting WAAAY too much thought into this sham of an exercise... definitely more thought than Trump is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaysWho? Posted September 30, 2020 Author Share Posted September 30, 2020 3 minutes ago, Jason said: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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TwinIon Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 18 minutes ago, SaysWho? said: I thought the "You left me with 128 judges positions to fill" was an easy one to rebut, but at the same time, maybe Senate inside stuff doesn't really do as well as my political ass thinks. I threw my hands up at that one, it really seemed like a softball. I suppose it's not Trump's own direct fault, but still would have been an easy point to refute. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ort Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 29 minutes ago, TwinIon said: My takeaway from the debate reactions I've seen is that where people wanted to find reasons to dislike Hilary, people are looking for reasons to like Biden. The debate was terrible all around, but Biden didn't exactly put on a masterclass performance. He seemed unsure, missed easy talking points, largely disowned much of his own party, and simply looked his age. However, he wasn't openly courting white supremacists, questioning the legitimacy of the election process, or making calls to interfere in that election. He wasn't acting like a child, lying with complete abandon, or otherwise acting Trumpian, so he was the easy and obvious choice between the two. Still, I feel like I'm seeing a whole lot more forgiveness of Biden's follies than we saw with Hilary. It was just painful to sit through. I would grade the debate performances like this... Joe Biden: D Donald Trump: F------ I understand that the people behind the curtain who are running the Democratic Party all decided that Biden best ticked off the most boxes they needed to win this thing... but man... he is so freaking old and really does have trouble getting things out. Trump is 100 times more incoherent, true, but is this really where we are? 330 million Americans and this is the best we can do? They should have the next debate take place in a Denny's and just let it be an hour and a half of them arguing about cholesterol pills and Moons over My Hammys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 1 minute ago, ort said: They should have the next debate take place in a Denny's 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 37 minutes ago, TwinIon said: My takeaway from the debate reactions I've seen is that where people wanted to find reasons to dislike Hilary, people are looking for reasons to like Biden. The debate was terrible all around, but Biden didn't exactly put on a masterclass performance. He seemed unsure, missed easy talking points, largely disowned much of his own party, and simply looked his age. However, he wasn't openly courting white supremacists, questioning the legitimacy of the election process, or making calls to interfere in that election. He wasn't acting like a child, lying with complete abandon, or otherwise acting Trumpian, so he was the easy and obvious choice between the two. Still, I feel like I'm seeing a whole lot more forgiveness of Biden's follies than we saw with Hilary. One thing that was SUPER obvious that Trump was trying to do was to box in Biden where either he "supports the radical left" or "he just lost the radical left!" I didn't perceive it as he disowned lefists at all. He just successfully finessed himself as being to the left of Trump, but not radically so. That to me was a major bright spot of his performance, actually. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 @TwinIon The Trump team came into this debate with the clear intention of goading Biden into supporting leftist ideals, so that they could then attack him for it. They failed, and now they're pissed and want to create a rift between Biden and leftists instead. Very transparent, but I'm still impressed that the Biden team saw right through it. AOC was prepared for this as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 1 minute ago, Jason said: Oh come the fuck on, didn't he say their literal slogan? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaysWho? Posted September 30, 2020 Author Share Posted September 30, 2020 42 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said: You guys are putting WAAAY too much thought into this sham of an exercise... definitely more thought than Trump is. I think donald really thinks he nailed his performance. I'm probably overthinking some things. Ex: Biden could barely get in a word edgewise with the court packing question but I don't think many people thought that as much as appreciating "will you shut up, man?" I really think that spoke to a lot of people, as obvious as it may sound, and it didn't matter much that he didn't get through his whole answer. I'm hoping the "silent" people (not caught by the polls) are the ones who heard that and thought it was overdue for someone to say it. One of my friends who's black didn't say much in 2016 and doesn't like Biden, but he made it a point to say something like, "Biden was combative sometimes, and Trump didn't condemn white supremacy. These transgressions are not equal to each other at all." My brother didn't vote the past two elections and is voting for Biden despite thinking he's going to win big. And my gf is in law enforcement but can't take four more years of this shit (and she has to deal with white supremacists all the time in her position). None are dyed in the wool Democrats but it's gotten to such an extreme point that they don't even feel safe under Trump. This is anecdotal so it's not a prediction. She tells me all the time she thinks most people think like this, and I'm always like, "It's not that I think you're illogical. I just REALLY hope you're right." So I continue to hope that these kinds of people I know are part of many. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost_MH Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 12 minutes ago, Joe said: One thing that was SUPER obvious that Trump was trying to do was to box in Biden where either he "supports the radical left" or "he just lost the radical left!" I didn't perceive it as he disowned lefists at all. He just successfully finessed himself as being to the left of Trump, but not radically so. That to me was a major bright spot of his performance, actually. Yeah, it was pathetically obvious Trump was trying to debate positions Biden didn't own. Trump's lies are usually pretty transparent, but they're awful hard to ignore when he's trying to contradict the words coming straight from Biden's mouth. I'm sure his supporters will figure out some way to argue Trump won those exchanges and nothing will change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 4 minutes ago, Joe said: Oh come the fuck on, didn't he say their literal slogan? What's the slogan? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 3 minutes ago, Jason said: What's the slogan? My bad, apparently the Proud Boys are using "Standby and Standown!" as a slogan post-hoc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anathema- Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 1 hour ago, TwinIon said: My takeaway from the debate reactions I've seen is that where people wanted to find reasons to dislike Hilary, people are looking for reasons to like Biden. The debate was terrible all around, but Biden didn't exactly put on a masterclass performance. He seemed unsure, missed easy talking points, largely disowned much of his own party, and simply looked his age. However, he wasn't openly courting white supremacists, questioning the legitimacy of the election process, or making calls to interfere in that election. He wasn't acting like a child, lying with complete abandon, or otherwise acting Trumpian, so he was the easy and obvious choice between the two. Still, I feel like I'm seeing a whole lot more forgiveness of Biden's follies than we saw with Hilary. Especially because Clinton floored trump three times in a row and never got credit for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaysWho? Posted September 30, 2020 Author Share Posted September 30, 2020 Gonna post this here and the full presidential thread. Like after the convention, Biden's favorability went up. What we can't know yet is if it's a stable change that remains this way weeks after. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimpleG Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 24 minutes ago, Jason said: I laugh every time time I see this pic , Trump trying to use his “Scanner” power to blow up Hill dogs head on stage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaysWho? Posted September 30, 2020 Author Share Posted September 30, 2020 After the debate, CNN did a fact check. The fact checker said, "The two sides were not equal. Nearly every line we fact checked from Trump was a lie." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaysWho? Posted September 30, 2020 Author Share Posted September 30, 2020 17 hours ago, Massdriver said: I do agree that Biden didn’t do terrible. He did ok. Tons of missed opportunities and it seems like he didn’t prep properly for Trump, but he did well enough to maintain his lead. edit: I think I’m just harsher on him for missed opportunities. I think he did relatively bad given the chances he had to hit Trump. Trump controlled the debate and he definitely went all in on rallying his base. Finally reading some of the posts here made during the debate. So I think Biden did fine as we're seeing from polling, and at the same time, I'm sure he could do a lot better in how he responds to Trump anyway (asking him to name a Dem governor I think would have been good). I think some of us, as skillz was saying, can overthink this. It actually reminds me of 2008 on the CEB. McCain was going all-out on Obama in the last debate, and at one point when Obama was asked if Palin was qualified, he said he thinks that's up to the American people to figure out. And some here were screaming, "NO, GO AFTER HER! THERE'S SO MUCH MATERIAL!" and then before the post-debate polls, the declaration that McCain won handily. Obama was shown to have ran away with the win. My best guess is that people really don't care about that stuff that much and knee-jerk hate interruptions, so Trump can ask "tough" questions to Biden, but an average person could think, "Just let the guy finish, geez." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 2 hours ago, Jason said: 'Shapiro the Capo" has a certain ring to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaladinSolo Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 1 hour ago, SaysWho? said: After the debate, CNN did a fact check. The fact checker said, "The two sides were not equal. Nearly every line we fact checked from Trump was a lie." Dale is the only fact checker that's worth anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CastlevaniaNut18 Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 one of my best friends from high school who I have on FB, but haven't actually spoken to in years said this: "I felt President Trump was prepared and Biden wasn't. He was lost the whole night. I think he went in cocky and it backfired." These people live in an alternate reality. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TyphoidHater Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 1 hour ago, CastlevaniaNut18 said: one of my best friends from high school who I haven't on FB, but haven't actually spoken to in years said this: "I felt President Trump was prepared and Biden wasn't. He was lost the whole night. I think he went in cocky and it backfired." These people live in an alternate reality. To them, trump totally condemned the proud boys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted September 30, 2020 Share Posted September 30, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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