Being a non-parent near a three year old…

[Chris-]

2 hours ago, Brian said:

Lolololol. That’s some goofy ass shit you think bud.

 

They are breweries - they are, first and foremost, drinking establishments. Maybe some like the one you go to intentionally cater to families (as is their right), but the ones that do not are obviously not designed with children in mind - they are spaces for adults. If you want to eat or drink with a family or mix of adults and children, there are ample places that cater to that and comparatively fewer spots that are adult only, so I see absolutely no reason why its unreasonable to expect spaces that are designed for adults remain only for adults.

[Biggie]

Only reason to have kids is to have someone to mow your yard, wash your car, and do other household chores. 

[TUFKAK]

18 minutes ago, Biggie said:

Only reason to have kids is to have someone to mow your yard, wash your car, and do other household chores. 

I’ll just hire someone for that 

[Biggie]

1 minute ago, TUFKAK said:

I’ll just hire someone for that 

Goddamn genius lol 

[TUFKAK]

6 minutes ago, Biggie said:

Goddamn genius lol 

More cost effective and a much better ROI.

[Keyser_Soze]

1 hour ago, TUFKAK said:

I’ll just hire someone for that 

 

Why not hire some kids?

[TUFKAK]

12 minutes ago, Keyser_Soze said:

 

Why not hire some kids?

Cause I want the job done right.

[johnny]

kids are fine. some are dipshits but most of them are fine. maybe a little odd. it’s obviously annoying when a kid is having a meltdown in the same place is you but it happens. parents likely feel worse about it than you do. 

[Karld316]

10 hours ago, stepee said:

Thank you all for your participation in my thread. I appreciate all of your thoughtful responses so far. Thank you and please don’t forget to rate the topic 5 stars!

I rated it -5 stars.

 

You're welcome

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

Some of the "hot takes" in this thread are so very edgy, weird, and creepy that I'm outright embarrassed by them.  And I'm really not that fond of children to begin with.

 

When @Bacon is the voice of reason, maybe some self-introspection is in order.

[Chris-]

30 minutes ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

Some of the "hot takes" in this thread are so very edgy, weird, and creepy that I'm outright embarrassed by them.  And I'm really not that fond of children to begin with.

 

When @Bacon is the voice of reason, maybe some self-introspection is in order.

 

Don't diminish our little hentai goblin like that! 

[stepee]

The thread definitely got weirder than I anticipated 

[Bacon]

56 minutes ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

When @Bacon is the voice of reason, maybe some self-introspection is in order.

I'm just tired of kids being shit on for not behaving like adults. It's actually pretty weird to call kids "sex trophies." That sounds extra weird out of context but still off-putting in context.  Like, it's not fair of me to make assumptions on how anyone actually treats random children IRL, but I remember being a kid, and adults are often cruel for what feels like no reason at all.

 

And I'm not here saying people are wrong for being annoyed. Kids can be annoying. I see how people are blaming the parent instead of the kid. Kids probably don't want to be on airplanes or most breweries either. But like, idk, man. I'm not trying to change any opinions, I just think some of these takes are, uh, not great and mean. And I'm not too interested in how parents and kids are not great and mean to you or whatever.

 

25 minutes ago, Chris- said:

 

Don't diminish our little hentai goblin like that! 

No. I think it's pretty weird that I'm the one with these takes. It reminds me a lot of how I view other atheists and how they can treat a lack of faith as a pseudo-religion. Sorry if that doesn't make sense, but I feel like some might know what I mean. 

 

[stepee]

Just now, Bacon said:

I'm just tired of kids being shit on for not behaving like adults. It's actually pretty weird to call kids "sex trophies." That sounds extra weird out of context but still off-putting in context.  Like, it's not fair of me to make assumptions on how anyone actually treats random children IRL, but I remember being a kid, and adults are often cruel for what feels like no reason at all.

 

And I'm not here saying people are wrong for being annoyed. Kids can be annoying. I see how people are blaming the parent instead of the kid. Kids probably don't want to be on airplanes or most breweries either. But like, idk, man. I'm not trying to change any opinions, I just think some of these takes are, uh, not great .

 

No. I think it's pretty weird that I'm the one with these takes. It reminds me a lot of how I view other atheists and how they can treat a lack of faith as a pseudo-religion. Sorry if that doesn't make sense, but I feel like some might know what I mean. 

 

 

I know EXACTLY what you mean with atheists  

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

9 minutes ago, Bacon said:

No. I think it's pretty weird that I'm the one with these takes. It reminds me a lot of how I view other atheists and how they can treat a lack of faith as a pseudo-religion. Sorry if that doesn't make sense, but I feel like some might know what I mean. 

 

Like @stepee, I know exactly the type of "internet atheist" that you're referring to.

[Joe]

Some of these posts what the fuck lol.

 

Thanks to @b_m_b_m_b_mand @Baconfor being the voices of reason.

[Keyser_Soze]

Bacon is all grown up now and making sense. 🥲

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

This shithole country already does practically the bare minimum -- if even that -- to ensure a decent quality of life for the vast majority of its children and their care providers (parents/grandparents/teachers/social workers, etc.) so I'm not going to make any apologies for being nauseated by some of these "opinions".

[Keyser_Soze]

Also, just because you're at an adult's only place doesn't mean you're not surrounded by babies. Adults can be so immature they are as an annoying as an unruly kid. Heck, some of them ITT. I'd gladly take a well behaved kid over an adult baby.

[GeneticBlueprint]

5 minutes ago, Keyser_Soze said:

Also, just because you're at an adult's only place doesn't mean you're not surrounded by babies. Adults can be so immature they are as an annoying as an unruly kid. Heck, some of them ITT. I'd gladly take a well behaved kid over an adult baby.

I have this conversation with my wife frequently. “It’s tough being at home with the kids all day.”  Yeah I know. I work in an office. 

[TUFKAK]

Here’s another edgy hot take 

 

I’d rather have full blown aids with a viral load greater than 10k and a non existent cd4 count than a child

 

sorry not sorry 

[Joe]

4 minutes ago, TUFKAK said:

Here’s another edgy hot take 

 

I’d rather have full blown aids with a viral load greater than 10k and a non existent cd4 count than a child

 

sorry not sorry 

Good for you man. No one here is criticizing your choice to not have kids. I’m sorry that you have people in your life that do criticize that choice.

[gamer.tv]

1 hour ago, stepee said:

The thread definitely got weirder than I anticipated 

[stepee]

Yeah I was just making a parody thread like haha cuz it’s annoying some of y’all take it too far lol

 

The one thing I will say is that due to the points @b_m_b_m_b_m brings up I do try to make my annoyance not visible as I understsnd how stressful it must be for the parents just trying to do their thing. 

 

BUT that high pitched shriek thing that comes out of them, and I try I really do, but parents just need to bare with me a second when that happens because my response of kind of shuddering when that happens is not voluntary, it’s just literally painful to me and that’s how my body reacts. So parents need to not be upset at me for being a little shaken when that siren comes on. 

 

Existing in society is about just trying to be understanding of everyone and doing your best to not make other people uncomfortable while doing your thing, and there’s levels to everything and it’s all situational, but I’d say that while some parents probably do deserve to be publicly scorned, probably not the vast majority of them.

[TUFKAK]

8 minutes ago, Joe said:

Good for you man. No one here is criticizing your choice to not have kids. I’m sorry that you have people in your life that do criticize that choice.

If you review the posts, only one person was being personally attacked, I don’t care ftr, but is child free people are often and routinely personally attacked for our choices whereas those with kids take those not liking kids or minimizing contact with them as an attack on them personally. Wanna hazard a guess how often I’m ridiculed or questioned about my vasectomy while being child free? 
 

That’s a distinction that has relevance and yeah, deliberately over the top but I matched energies.

 

in public my only response will be, turning to my partner and saying “gods im glad I’m sterile” when a kid is being annoying and move on with my day. Because as I said early, they’re kids they’re gonna be kids and I’m not faulting them, it’s almost like I had to take courses on this or something.

[TheLeon]

People never ask me why I don’t want kids. If they talk to me for more than 2 minutes, they’ll think “yeah this dude is a mess. He shouldn’t have kids”

[TUFKAK]

26 minutes ago, TheLeon said:

People never ask me why I don’t want kids. If they talk to me for more than 2 minutes, they’ll think “yeah this dude is a mess. He shouldn’t have kids”

I routinely get “you’d be such a great dad” “ your kids would be gorgeous” and now “but you make so much money they’d have a great life.” Etc

 

Why is this acceptable when I made my choices in regards to my reproductive health clear. 

 

I long ago stopped being impacted by these comments but it shows that our choices are not culturally respected whereas I’m expected to arrest my behavior for their comfort. I’m not making comments that are the child-free equivalent to them, but if I’m visually annoyed by annoying behavior I’m “a child.”

 

edit: I just remembered a recent interaction. Getting my Zoloft rx filled, the pharmacy tech commented on my appearance, basically asking if I’m going to dress up as wolverine for Halloween, then she asked if I have kids, told her no, she asked any plans to have them, said no and I’ve had a vasectomy so will never have any. She visually recoiled and had a gasp. But tell me more why I have to change my behavior to not make parents feel bad.

[Brian]

1 hour ago, Bacon said:

Kids probably don't want to be on airplanes or most breweries either. 

 

I will only address this point since I did engage though I wish I didn’t. Young kids, like my daughter who is 4, want to go with you when you go out. Whether that is shopping, doing yard work, going to a brewery, taking out the garbage or even going to work. You make a decision whether it is appropriate and you lay ground rules that if violated means you go home.  
 

At the brewery, she draws, watches the phone, pet doggies, dances to the music, and steal sips of beer.  She doesn’t disturb anyone. Most people engage her. She has a lot fun. 
 

You guys act like kids are mutants that are constantly screaming. She has been on plane for 8 hours multiple times flying to Europe in economy and business class with no issues. As long as we keep her fed and rested, she is a happy go lucky kid. 

[Joe]

29 minutes ago, TUFKAK said:

If you review the posts, only one person was being personally attacked, I don’t care ftr, but is child free people are often and routinely personally attacked for our choices whereas those with kids take those not liking kids or minimizing contact with them as an attack on them personally. Wanna hazard a guess how often I’m ridiculed or questioned about my vasectomy while being child free? 
 

That’s a distinction that has relevance and yeah, deliberately over the top but I matched energies.

 

in public my only response will be, turning to my partner and saying “gods im glad I’m sterile” when a kid is being annoying and move on with my day. Because as I said early, they’re kids they’re gonna be kids and I’m not faulting them, it’s almost like I had to take courses on this or something.

I get it. Your posts come off as someone that is very hurt. I’m just saying you don’t have to refer to children as mistakes and parents as breeders. Many parents, including myself and others here, are respectful of your choice to not have kids. The respect should be reciprocal I think?

[Bacon]

8 minutes ago, Brian said:

I will only address this point since I did engage though I wish I didn’t. Young kids, like my daughter who is 4, want to go with you when you go out. Whether that is shopping, doing yard work, going to a brewery, taking out the garbage or even going to work. You make a decision whether it is appropriate and you lay ground rules that if violated means you go home.  
 

At the brewery, she draws, watches the phone, pet doggies, dances to the music, and steal sips of beer.  She doesn’t disturb anyone. Most people engage her. She has a lot fun. 
 

You guys act like kids are mutants that are constantly screaming. She has been on plane for 8 hours multiple times flying to Europe in economy and business class with no issues. As long as we keep her fed and rested, she is a happy go lucky kid. 

Ah, well, I was mostly thinking back to my own childhood and my aunt's youngest. While I can remember exactly how I felt at 4, I was a bit more reclusive and would have rather gone to my grandma's house it if was an option. My aunt's youngest also doesn't like to go out much. Or well, didn't. I'm not sure now. At restaurants, I was giga shy and wanted to hide from the waiters. That was just when I was really young tho.

 

And, just in case, I didn't mean to imply "kids are mutants that are constantly screaming." My aunt's oldest was super chill. Aunt's youngest, not so much. I just wanted to acknowledge they can be annoying, not that they always or even mostly are.

[TUFKAK]

1 minute ago, Joe said:

I get it. Your posts come off as someone that is very hurt. I’m just saying you don’t have to refer to children as mistakes and parents as breeders. Many parents, including myself and others here, are respectful of your choice to not have kids. The respect should be reciprocal I think?

I’d not say hurt, I get why it comes across as such, but I more just put out the energy to parents they routinely give to me. I’m open and unapologetic about my child-free life as it helps to normalize it. My fiancé gets way more hate for her child free life than me Ftr for the simple reason that a woman who doesn’t want kids is still seen as damaged by a wide swath of the community.

 

I do respect those who have kids, I just won’t apologize or alter my behavior for being annoyed by annoying behavior and it’s not my responsibility to make parents not feel bad in public, especially when I don’t get that same courtesy.

 

As I said, I adore my niece and am spending so much time at their house now as a result. I’d still not expect others to accommodate me when I fail at soothing her.

[TUFKAK]

@Joe

 

i think a better example of my point is to shift to our desire to end heteronormativity. Little things like vocabulary assist in that, hence why I mostly refer to my fiancé as my partner in social settings/emails etc, being open and unapologetic about relationships that aren’t the culturally “normal” cis gendered heterosexual monogamous coupling and putting it out there for everyone to see. Exposure breeds acceptance, hence why Pride exists but also why those of us who aren’t in those relationship dynamics display what and who we are, other people’s comfort be damned. Wanna annoy a chud, call your female fiancé your partner for example. The fact me and my best friend; a gay woman, are routinely mistaken for a pair-bond when we go out; even in the bay, shows there’s a lot of work to be done still.
 

breeding is still seen as the default setting and those of us who exist outside of that are routinely seen as abnormal/damaged etc and the fact people still expect specific accommodations for their choices, as seen in this thread, furthers that too. I’d never tell a parent they’ll change their minds about breeding, wonder why I don’t get that. Hell, I’ve been told multiple times I’ll reverse my vasectomy. 

 

What you get from me is my advocacy for programs and policies opposed to my financial best interests but which benefit parents over me. My property taxes are over 1%, I’ll never personally benefit from the majority of the taxes I pay there but still ok paying them to drive society forward.

[Brian]

21 minutes ago, Bacon said:

Ah, well, I was mostly thinking back to my own childhood and my aunt's youngest. While I can remember exactly how I felt at 4, I was a bit more reclusive and would have rather gone to my grandma's house it if was an option. My aunt's youngest also doesn't like to go out much. Or well, didn't. I'm not sure now. At restaurants, I was giga shy and wanted to hide from the waiters. That was just when I was really young tho.

 

And, just in case, I didn't mean to imply "kids are mutants that are constantly screaming." My aunt's oldest was super chill. Aunt's youngest, not so much. I just wanted to acknowledge they can be annoying, not that they always or even mostly are.

She dictates what she wants to do or not do. We never drag her anywhere she doesn’t want to go unless it’s like the doctors because then you will get bad behavior. 
 

I wasn’t implying that you are saying kids are mutants. The general tone in the thread has been hostile towards kids.
 

I whole heartedly agree that kids can be annoying especially when you get 3+ kids together.  If you don’t want to engage with kids that’s fine. We have friends that don’t so we get a babysitter when we go out with them.   

[Biggie]

This debacle of a thread is all @stepee fault. lol. Good job bro. 

[TUFKAK]

2 minutes ago, Biggie said:

This debacle of a thread is all @stepee fault. lol. Good job bro. 

This is a great thread lol