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Update: Tim Epic says that games featuring NFTs won't be banned on EGS because freedom

Commissar SFLUFAN

By Commissar SFLUFAN
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legend

legend

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On 2/7/2022 at 10:18 AM, DPCyric said:

 

For gaming Diablo 2 could have used NFT's for loot so there couldn't be dupes and you could verify your transactions (would have fixed the issue with Diablo 3), I've seen a purse company that are doing qwerty codes they are registering on the block chain to stop counterfeits, concert tickets with a smart contract that have a tax if you sell them to thwart scalpers, albums that every sell has a tax that goes back to the artists. There is an NFT bubble that is going to pop most of it was money laundering and it is good there are laws now stopping that (same was done with art before laws was put in place) however there are still many interesting use cases for them. Also proof of stake blockchains like Algorand that are carbon neutral are becoming hot places to mint NFT's. I know several people in third world countries using play to earn games to put food on the table including several who lost their jobs to the coronavirus pandemic I hate all this disinformation when I see plenty of good things coming out of this. The market will change dump shit like minting NFT's on Etherium will go away (in fact they have partnered with Cardano so you can mint NFT's on their platform and migrate them to reduce processing power ahead of ETH 2.0) and over inflated priced stuff will die.

 

Or these applications could just cryptographcially sign their data without a blockchain. The only argument I can see for the blockchain is "yeah but I don't want to host anything myself for my products. I'd rather make it everyone else's problem in perpetuity and at far less efficiency."

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BloodyHell

BloodyHell

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On 2/7/2022 at 11:18 AM, DPCyric said:

 

For gaming Diablo 2 could have used NFT's for loot so there couldn't be dupes and you could verify your transactions (would have fixed the issue with Diablo 3), I've seen a purse company that are doing qwerty codes they are registering on the block chain to stop counterfeits, concert tickets with a smart contract that have a tax if you sell them to thwart scalpers, albums that every sell has a tax that goes back to the artists. There is an NFT bubble that is going to pop most of it was money laundering and it is good there are laws now stopping that (same was done with art before laws was put in place) however there are still many interesting use cases for them. Also proof of stake blockchains like Algorand that are carbon neutral are becoming hot places to mint NFT's. I know several people in third world countries using play to earn games to put food on the table including several who lost their jobs to the coronavirus pandemic I hate all this disinformation when I see plenty of good things coming out of this. The market will change dump shit like minting NFT's on Etherium will go away (in fact they have partnered with Cardano so you can mint NFT's on their platform and migrate them to reduce processing power ahead of ETH 2.0) and over inflated priced stuff will die.

They are worthless nonsense that will further exploit gamers, and you should stop shilling for them. 

Itch.io's statement is the most honest one so far.

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Commissar SFLUFAN

Commissar SFLUFAN

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image0.jpeg

The Biggest NFT Video Game's Economy Is Collapsing Because NFT Games Don't Work

REASON.COM
Some NFT assets held their value during January's crypto crash, but not the video game monsters in Axie Infinity.

 

Quote

 

The biggest NFT game currently in the marketplace is Axie Infinity, a game—similar to Pokémon—in which players collect and battle monsters which resemble axolotl salamanders.

 

The business model for Axie Infinity and nearly all other nonfungible token (NFT) games is called "play to earn." In these games, all players must start by purchasing NFT characters on a marketplace. In-game assets and currencies are traded on crypto exchanges, so everything in the game is worth money. The often-high upfront cost of buying into the game is theoretically justified by the opportunity to earn money by playing.

 

Web3 investors are really excited about the prospects of games like this. Reddit co-founder Alexis Ohanian, who is an investor in Axie Infinity, believes play-to-earn games will be 90 percent of the gaming market in five years. And Sky Mavis, the developer that makes Axie Infinity, had the good fortune to be years ahead of the competition. Their NFT game launched in 2018, and they were live and operational when NFTs exploded in popularity and investors decided to bet that the blockchain was the future of gaming. 

 

As a result of being first movers in the space, this once-tiny independent studio was able to raise $150 million in financing in October 2021 at a valuation of $3 billion. Around the same time, Sky Mavis trumpeted its game's tremendous subscriber growth, which exploded in the third quarter of 2021 to over two million daily active users. In December, Axie Infinity Shards (ASX), the game's governance token, had a market capitalization larger than that of the French games publisher Ubisoft, which makes the Assassin's Creed, Far Cry, and Watch Dogs games. In July, a single rare Axie monster sold for 369 ether, worth over $800,000 at time of sale. A rare plot of land in the game sold for 550 ether ($2.5 million) despite the fact that the gameplay features using in-game land are not yet available.

 

 

Man, if the libertarian apologists at Reason don't think this is a good idea...

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  • Commissar SFLUFAN changed the title to Update: "The Biggest NFT Video Game's Economy Is Collapsing Because NFT Games Don't Work" (Reason)
HardAct

HardAct

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   Can someone explain to me how this is any different that the SoJ {Son of Jordon ring} in Diablo 2 back in the day? Other than the items being "Yours" and being able to bring it into another game which is laughable unless it's a game from the same Developer maybe. But Diablo had a Virtual secondary market place where item were traded back and froth using mostly the RoJ as currency. You could buy SoJ from people and they would drop the rings in game after you picked them up and they were gone. I'm a bit confused as to the difference other than these items maybe being one of a kind but sharing you "Hard earned item in other games, or all games it just Ludacris..! RIGHT?"

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TwinIon

TwinIon

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1 hour ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:
image0.jpeg

The Biggest NFT Video Game's Economy Is Collapsing Because NFT Games Don't Work

REASON.COM
Some NFT assets held their value during January's crypto crash, but not the video game monsters in Axie Infinity.

 

 

Man, if the libertarian apologists at Reason don't think this is a good idea...

Yeah, I was surprised to see that come out of Reason, but I think the argument they present is a good one.

 

I've mostly often thought about gaming NFTs being a bad idea because the in-game economy is always going to be subject to the devs. So while your creature in Axie Infinity might be worth a lot because it has some desirable trait, what happens if the devs decide to nerf it because that trait is too powerful? Or they just introduce a new trait that is much better and the value of yours drops.

 

What this most recent episode shows is actually the opposite problem, where factors outside of the game demolish the value that you "earned" in game, which is something I hadn't thought about as much, but is very much a real problem.

 

In WoW and EVE I know you can earn in game currency and use it to pay for your subscription. This is the equivalent of the stock market going down so now your 1M WoW gold that was worth 5 months subscription is now worth 1/8th of a subscription, but nothing in game changed the rate at which you can earn.

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Ghost_MH

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1 hour ago, HardAct said:

   Can someone explain to me how this is any different that the SoJ {Son of Jordon ring} in Diablo 2 back in the day? Other than the items being "Yours" and being able to bring it into another game which is laughable unless it's a game from the same Developer maybe. But Diablo had a Virtual secondary market place where item were traded back and froth using mostly the RoJ as currency. You could buy SoJ from people and they would drop the rings in game after you picked them up and they were gone. I'm a bit confused as to the difference other than these items maybe being one of a kind but sharing you "Hard earned item in other games, or all games it just Ludacris..! RIGHT?"

 

You're not missing anything. I've said it before and I'll say it again. Storing things on the blockchain like this only makes sense if you want zero infrastructure. However, you'd need a sizable player base to make an actual thriving market. One you're at the size where a thriving market can exist, you're already large enough that it would be stupid not to store everything within your own private database, allowing you to control and maintain balance of the entire market.

 

Like it would make sense for Pokemon, but Pokemon is already big enough that it would be stupid for the Pokemon Company to just not maintain control of their data through their own, internal, databases.

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BloodyHell

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6 hours ago, HardAct said:

   Can someone explain to me how this is any different that the SoJ {Son of Jordon ring} in Diablo 2 back in the day? Other than the items being "Yours" and being able to bring it into another game which is laughable unless it's a game from the same Developer maybe. But Diablo had a Virtual secondary market place where item were traded back and froth using mostly the RoJ as currency. You could buy SoJ from people and they would drop the rings in game after you picked them up and they were gone. I'm a bit confused as to the difference other than these items maybe being one of a kind but sharing you "Hard earned item in other games, or all games it just Ludacris..! RIGHT?"

Stone of Jordan, btw 😜 

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legend

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Yeah I have fond memories of the crazy emergent economy of Diablo 2 (mainly the in-game economy, not the fact that people paid actual money for the stuff :p ). Considering how bad their network code actually was (in their defense, it was an earlier time!), it's amazing how much it evolved.

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HardAct

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23 hours ago, legend said:

Yeah I have fond memories of the crazy emergent economy of Diablo 2 (mainly the in-game economy, not the fact that people paid actual money for the stuff :p ). Considering how bad their network code actually was (in their defense, it was an earlier time!), it's amazing how much it evolved.

DAMN it!!

   This topic has really peaked my interest it picking up Diablo 2 Resurrected and joining the grind.....lol

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legend

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39 minutes ago, HardAct said:

DAMN it!!

   This topic has really peaked my interest it picking up Diablo 2 Resurrected and joining the grind.....lol

 

Fair warning, I kind of dropped off of D2R because they didn't update the netcode at all, and what worked well for the smaller population of gamers back in the day, does not work well today. There were all kinds of major latency issues, queues to get online, and a host of other problems. It's possible they worked on it and improved it more -- they certainly were making some improvements when I dropped off -- but the fact that they were using ancient netcode did not inspire confidence in me :p 

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Ghost_MH

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On 2/16/2022 at 11:15 AM, legend said:

Yeah I have fond memories of the crazy emergent economy of Diablo 2 (mainly the in-game economy, not the fact that people paid actual money for the stuff :p ). Considering how bad their network code actually was (in their defense, it was an earlier time!), it's amazing how much it evolved.

 

And they had to hire an actual economist like all these other games with huge economies where things are valued in real world currency. They need someone have on staff to make sure things don't collapse and leave gamers feeling like all the money they've invested is now worthless. It's weird. Like, countries also employ economists for the same reason. It's like actually managing economies has real value.

 

Trying to forgoe some sort of market manipulation and assuming it'll just work because magic is like the 23rd craziest thing about games trying to build economies around NFTs.

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HardAct

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On 2/17/2022 at 8:09 AM, legend said:

 

Fair warning, I kind of dropped off of D2R because they didn't update the netcode at all, and what worked well for the smaller population of gamers back in the day, does not work well today. There were all kinds of major latency issues, queues to get online, and a host of other problems. It's possible they worked on it and improved it more -- they certainly were making some improvements when I dropped off -- but the fact that they were using ancient netcode did not inspire confidence in me :p 

THANKS!,

   I have little time for a game as short as D2R {as I remember it} to just do the same thing over and over again to maybe find something cool. I eat/dreamed/slept D2 back in the day but I just would be a very casual player, only single player too. 

 

   Fun fact, I was surfing D2R shit and ran across Grim Dawn and thought, I always wanted to try that game! Went to steam to maybe buy it, and Holy Shit I own it already with 6 hours played...lol, that and Path of Exile. I do love hack n slash games I can not lie but I think i'm gonna just jump into GD and see what that's about! I will buy D2R down the road but I'm gonna hold off!

 

   I do want it on the Steam deck but it's not on Steam Dang....

 

 

I ALSO PRE-Ordered Elden Ring for the Series X to play on the 83" C1 using the some of the over 400 dollars worth of Best Buy certificates I have from the Tv and Xbox and 1Tb external HD I bought. Some expire in may so better get on that ball! 

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heydude93

heydude93

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The ONLY appealing stuff about anything NFT-related I know of is it's a good way to pay bills right now for struggling artists, the quality of some of the art (Beeple's a real one) and those animated gifs you can display in a digital picture frame or something. If unique art was being sold in that form It'd kinda make sense, but It's a calculus equation to me how any of this had to be entrenched in crypto, blockchain, etc lmao. It's like the beanie babies craze but somehow dumber and amplified by 1000. 

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Keyser_Soze

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23 minutes ago, heydude93 said:

The ONLY appealing stuff about anything NFT-related I know of is it's a good way to pay bills right now for struggling artists, the quality of some of the art (Beeple's a real one) and those animated gifs you can display in a digital picture frame or something. If unique art was being sold in that form It'd kinda make sense, but It's a calculus equation to me how any of this had to be entrenched in crypto, blockchain, etc lmao. It's like the beanie babies craze but somehow dumber and amplified by 1000. 

 

I know some artists who went down that hole of trying to get into the NFT game. But I warned them that it's not the quality of the work that is "appealing" to the NFT people so to put effort into making something unique is a waste of effort. So they are selling work around $300 with some outliers (not bad of course) but nothing compared to the millions of dollars the ugly apes and other things are going for.

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legend

legend

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If I were an artist I would have such mixed feelings about NFTs. On the one hand, if you can sucker some of these people out of some money while this lasts, it can't hurt to have more cash. On the other hand, the whole notion of NFTs is so antithetical to the point of art it would be infuriating. Not that the art world hasn't had a history of the economics being at odds with it goals, but NFTs elevate that scumminess to such an incredible level. It quadruples down on the worst aspects of the community.

 

 

(This is not to say that all economics is incompatible with the goals of art, only the degradation into its value being purely about speculation rather than subjective value)

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heydude93

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Tbf some amazing artists become multi millionaires w/ NFTs so sometimes buyers do recognize quality. Like most everything, the NFT scene isn't absolutely good or bad, though techdork cringe art does seem be highly profitable as well and more influential. As far as I know, at least. Over time, like having expertise in lore of some popular entertainment that many have a passionate savant-like knowledge of, I'm starting to realize/accept there's probably gonna be some prominent subcultures in the art lexicon I simply wont have the energy or interest to feel like keeping up with 

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legend

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6 hours ago, heydude93 said:

Tbf some amazing artists become multi millionaires w/ NFTs so sometimes buyers do recognize quality.

 

That fact, regardless of how true, seems much more suggestive of shenanigans of speculation, rather than art appreciation, because you don't need to spend millions on a publicly available digital piece of art.

 

6 hours ago, heydude93 said:

Like most everything, the NFT scene isn't absolutely good or bad, though techdork cringe art does seem be highly profitable as well and more influential. As far as I know, at least. Over time, like having expertise in lore of some popular entertainment that many have a passionate savant-like knowledge of, I'm starting to realize/accept there's probably gonna be some prominent subcultures in the art lexicon I simply wont have the energy or interest to feel like keeping up with 

 

No, the NFT scene is just plain bad :p The technology is a solution looking for a problem that carries a ton of baggage. I have yet to think of a problem where a blockchain is actually an appropriate solution.

 

By all means, lets use more cryptographic technologies, but lets burn the blockchain to the ground. The worst future is tech bros continue to push it into everything and everything gets less efficient and brittle. That goes for proof of work and the other "efficient" consensus methods of these permissionless time-stamping systems.

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Commissar SFLUFAN

Commissar SFLUFAN

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Tim Epic says that games featuring NFTs won't be banned on EGS because freedom:

 

EJndnKBLEpr5LBcTfbgp4F-1200-80.jpg

Epic boss says NFT games won't be banned on the Epic Games Store | PC Gamer

WWW.PCGAMER.COM
Following Mojang's announcement against the technology, Tim Sweeney says it's not Epic's place to ban them.

 

Tim Epic decided to open his big mouth in response to Mojang saying that NFTs will not be supported or allowed in Minecraft, the biggest game on the planet:

 

obYXd6XP8jjw8XYhTANDHd-1200-80.jpg

No NFTs in Minecraft, Mojang says | PC Gamer

WWW.PCGAMER.COM
The official guidelines are being updated to address the matter in detail, but the short version is, "No."

 

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Moa

Moa

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NFTs suck balls. 
 

However, I do think they will probably end up having a place in gaming as a method of doing cosmetics. The problem with NFTs is people using them as a scam or thinking they can make a shitty game around them, but the actual technology seems well-suited for TF2 hats. Maybe I’m just ignorant but I predict I’m like 5 years NFTs will be normalized in gaming and it won’t be a big deal. 

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