Can France Resist the Woke invasion?

[Bloodporne]

In the case of a country like France, I just see it as a case of you reap what you sowed. Can't complain about your culture being compromised etc. when you're the one who invaded and subjugated others in the first place and now cry when you see too many of them come back on the, originally one-way, bridge you built. 

[Joe]

1 minute ago, Kal-El814 said:

 

It’s a shitty question.

I didn’t understand what the question had to do with the topic either, but I also didn’t like your response lol.

[SuperSpreader]

16 minutes ago, mclumber1 said:

 

Is there anything inherently wrong with insisting that immigrants assimilate to the prevailing culture of the country they moved to?  

 

I mean, why do they? How much do they?

 

Is the problem that they can't get ahead because they eat tacos and speak Spanish that therefore keep them from succeeding? or is the problem that certain Americans hate that they are eating tacos and speaking Spanish and succeeding. 

[Joe]

2 minutes ago, SuperSpreader said:

 

I mean, why do they? How much do they?

 

Is the problem that they can't get ahead because they eat tacos and speak Spanish that therefore keep them from succeeding? or is the problem that certain Americans hate that they are eating tacos and speaking Spanish and succeeding. 

I don’t think by assimilating he meant speaking Spanish and eating tacos. Lmao like what?

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

21 minutes ago, mclumber1 said:

 

Is there anything inherently wrong with insisting that immigrants assimilate to the prevailing culture of the country they moved to?  

 

The cultural assimilation that the French Republic "demands" is absolutely nothing like the cultural assimilation here in the US.

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

8 minutes ago, Bloodporne said:

In the case of a country like France, I just see it as a case of you reap what you sowed. Can't complain about your culture being compromised etc. when you're the one who invaded and subjugated others in the first place and now cry when you see too many of them come back on the, originally one-way, bridge you built. 

 

And let's not forget that the reason those immigrants from the former Francophone colonies are in France to begin with is to do the "dirty jobs" that "respectable" French people absolutely refuse to do.

[Bloodporne]

 

4 minutes ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

 

And let's not forget that the reason those immigrants from the former Francophone colonies are in France to begin with is to do the "dirty jobs" that "respectable" French people absolutely refuse to do.

Let's also not forget that on top of all that, France is extremely up its own ass. Everyone in Europe regards them as cultural snobs of the highest order for a reason. This is all an absurd mix. Whenever I see France cry about shit like this, I just roll my eyes a tad. 

[skillzdadirecta]

27 minutes ago, mclumber1 said:

 

Is there anything inherently wrong with insisting that immigrants assimilate to the prevailing culture of the country they moved to?  

No there isn't... the White South Africans managed to do it somehow.  Wait, what?

[skillzdadirecta]

France treats blacks, and by blacks I mean AMERICAN blacks, slightly better than the rest of the world. Africans, Muslims and Jews get the same treatment there they get everywhere else.

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

Just now, Bloodporne said:

And let's not forget a huge factor here which is that France are extremely up their own asses.

 

Let's also not forget that on top of all that, France is extremely up its own ass. Everyone in Europe regards them as cultural snobs of the highest order for a reason. This is all an absurd mix. Whenever I see France cry about shit like this, I just roll my eyes a tad. 

 

I know that Germany has its own racial issues in regard to the economic and social plight of its significant Turkish population, but at least they're not even remotely as arrogantly condescending as the French Republic and its hollow words of liberté, égalité, fraternité.

[Chris-]

American culture sucks so why would we want immigrants to assimilate to it? So more toddlers can have their brains blown out? Hard pass. 

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

Just now, skillzdadirecta said:

France treats blacks, and by blacks I mean AMERICAN blacks, slightly better than the rest of the world. Africans, Muslims and Jews get the same treatment their they get everywhere else.

 

I'm fairly convinced that the reason that African-Americans are treated marginally better in France is simply a case of one-upmanship with the United States.

[Kal-El814]

5 minutes ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

 

The cultural assimilation that the French Republic "demands" is absolutely nothing like the cultural assimilation here in the US.

 

This.

 

3 minutes ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

 

And let's not forget that the reason those immigrants from the former Francophone colonies are in France to begin with is to do the "dirty jobs" that "respectable" French people absolutely refuse to do.

 

And this.

 

Let’s also not forget that within the United States, cultural assimilation almost always means a regression to a white, Christian, English, speaking, cis, heterosexual mean. “If they want to come here so bad why aren’t they willing to compromise meaningful parts of their identity?” Come on now.

[Air_Delivery]

1 hour ago, AbsolutSurgen said:

My title follows the D1P tradition of putting in inflammatory, ridiculous titles on almost every thread in this sub-forum.

 

So that is a yes.

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

1 minute ago, Kal-El814 said:

Let’s also not forget that within the United States, cultural assimilation almost always means a regression to a white, Christian, English, speaking, cis, heterosexual mean. “If they want to come here so bad why aren’t they willing to compromise meaningful parts of their identity?” Come on now.

 

I'm going to push back on this a bit and suggest that American cultural assimilation is far more permissive of allowing those cultures to retain aspects of their identity than what is considered acceptable in the French Republic.  American cultural assimilation doesn't mean nearly the total abandonment of practically all aspects of their culture as is the case in France.

[mclumber1]

30 minutes ago, Kal-El814 said:

 

You’re not posting in an Iroquoian language, you tell me.

 

Which tribe has ownership of North America?  They fought bloody wars all the time - there wasn't some unified native culture over here.  

[b_m_b_m_b_m]

2 minutes ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

 

I'm going to push back on this a bit and suggest that American cultural assimilation is far more permissive of allowing those cultures to retain aspects of their identity than what is considered acceptable in the French Republic.  American cultural assimilation doesn't mean nearly the total abandonment of practically all aspects of their culture as is the case in France.

we only let people keep the bits that are christian-y enough and have good food and lots of booze.

[Bloodporne]

Just now, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

 

I know that Germany has its own racial issues in regard to the economic and social plight of its significant Turkish population, but at least they're not even remotely as arrogantly condescending as the French Republic and its hollow words of liberté, égalité, fraternité.

The difference is that while there are, and will always be, a segment of the population that are anti-immigrant anywhere, Germany knows it has zero room for cultural grandstanding or anything of the sort. Some other European countries have a similar attitude, or are strongly moving towards it at least in regards to its past, but not France. France has zero humility and seems to make zero effort to self-reflect on their antics based on my observation. I'm sure there are movements within the country like shown in this article but as an overall stance, it seems to be that. 

 

 

[Kal-El814]

1 minute ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

I'm going to push back on this a bit and suggest that American cultural assimilation is far more permissive of allowing those cultures to retain aspects of their identity than what is considered acceptable in the French Republic.  American cultural assimilation doesn't mean nearly the total abandonment of practically all aspects of their culture as is the case in France.

 

I’d agree with that perspective about French assimilation for sure, based on a lot of French colleagues I’ve had.

 

It is different in America, but I still maintain it’s a different side on the same die, and not something dramatically different. Most Asian people I know, or South American people with light skin I know get asked where they’re from twice if their first answer is somewhere in the US. A non trivial amount of Americans think Obama isn’t American. And so on and so forth.

 

But I know what you’re getting at and agree.

 

7 minutes ago, mclumber1 said:

Which tribe has ownership of North America?  They fought bloody wars all the time - there wasn't some unified native culture over here.  

 

I have no idea what bearing that has on anything. The fact that no one tribe owned America doesn’t somehow excuse colonization or genocide. Not that’s what you were doing, but whatever.

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

1 minute ago, Kal-El814 said:

I’d agree with that perspective about French assimilation for sure, based on a lot of French colleagues I’ve had.

 

It is different in America, but I still maintain it’s a different side on the same die, and not something dramatically different. Most Asian people I know, or South American people with light skin I know get asked where they’re from twice if their first answer is somewhere in the US. A non trivial amount of Americans think Obama isn’t American. And so on and so forth.

 

But I know what you’re getting at and agree.

 

I think the key difference between the "negative" aspects to cultural assimilation between the French Republic and the United States stems from where the "pressure" to do so originates.

 

In the French Republic, the pressure originates directly from the State itself while in the United States, the pressure is largely societally-driven.

[Kal-El814]

Just now, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

 

I think the key difference between the "negative" aspects to cultural assimilation between the French Republic and the United States stems from where the "pressure" to do so originates.

 

In the French Republic, the pressure originates directly from the State itself while in the United States, the pressure is largely societally-driven.

 

True.

[SuperSpreader]

55 minutes ago, Joe said:

I don’t think by assimilating he meant speaking Spanish and eating tacos. Lmao like what?

What assimilation then isn't happening. Did someone create a government of Arabian immigrants that defy American laws somewhere in Iowa?

[Joe]

8 minutes ago, SuperSpreader said:

What is assimilation then that isn't happening. Did someone create a government of Arabian immigrants that defy American laws somewhere in Iowa?

 

Many illegals in the US literally can’t speak a word of English and do not participate in American society in any meaningful way. That’s not ok in my opinion. But those types of people exist in far less numbers here than in Europe.

 

Also it should be pointed out that many don’t bother to learn the language and culture because they don’t feel they have a future here due to their immigration status. So I’m not really blaming the illegal.

[skillzdadirecta]

What does it mean to "participate in American society in a meaningful way" @Joe?

[SuperSpreader]

Just now, skillzdadirecta said:

What does it mean to "participate in American society in a meaningful way" @Joe?

 

He can always hire another one to clean the toilets. 

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

Another thing that absolutely gets my goat is that it's practically NEAR-IMPOSSIBLE for even legal immigrants to many European nations to become fully-fledged citizens of the countries in which they reside.  Hell, that even extends to subsequent generations of their families who seemingly exist in this netherworld of neither being a "citizen" nor a "visitor" for perpetuity.  

 

In such a condition -- largely imposed by the State itself -- how is any form of reasonable cultural/societal assimilation even remotely possible?

 

In summary: I don't give a rat's ass what any European has to say about the United States in regard to these type of issues.  Not in the very least.

[Joe]

2 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

What does it mean to "participate in American society in a meaningful way" @Joe?

Engaging with a non Spanish speaker would be nice!

[brucoe]

I've always found woke'ism as a right-leaning response to a bigot being told that his behavior isn't cool.

[Joe]

2 minutes ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

Another thing that absolutely gets my goat is that it's practically NEAR-IMPOSSIBLE for even legal immigrants to many European nations to become fully-fledged citizens of the countries in which they reside.  Hell, that even extends to subsequent generations of their families who seemingly exist in this netherworld of neither being a citizen nor a visitor for perpetuity.  

 

In such a condition -- largely imposed by the State itself -- how is any form of reasonable cultural/societal assimilation even remotely possible?

 

In summary: I don't give a rat's ass what any European has to say about the United States in regard to these type of issues.  Not in the very least.

This is what’s so underrated about the US. Even if their parents are societal pariahs in many ways, the children won’t be because they will have citizenship from the moment they are born and will learn English in school.

[Joe]

1 minute ago, brucoe said:

I've always found woke'ism as a right-leaning response to a bigot being told that his behavior isn't cool.

 

That’s not how the term started.

[brucoe]

1 minute ago, Joe said:

 

That’s not how the term started.

It's how it's used now.

[Joe]

Just now, brucoe said:

It's how it's used now.

By some, but I think most people in this thread understood what kind of definition of wokeism is being referred to here.

[AbsolutSurgen]

 

1 hour ago, Air_Delivery said:

So that is a yes.

I don't think the article is using it that way.  So, no.

[Guest]

I know what @Joeis talking about. My top guy in my remodeling business doesn’t speak hardly a word of English besides random construction related words. His is from El Salvador, but has three American children. They don’t do anything outside of the Spanish speaking community. Their kids don’t even play little league sports with the English speaking kids. 
 

But I get it, there is a ton of fear around being in the country illegally. I believe though that the real fix to the problem would be to make residency easier so you don’t feel like your always on the verge of being captured and deported.

[CayceG]

14 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

I know what @Joeis talking about. My top guy in my remodeling business doesn’t speak hardly a word of English besides random construction related words. His is from El Salvador, but has three American children. They don’t do anything outside of the Spanish speaking community. Their kids don’t even play little league sports with the English speaking kids. 
 

But I get it, there is a ton of fear around being in the country illegally. I believe though that the real fix to the problem would be to make residency easier so you don’t feel like your always on the verge of being captured and deported.

 

That guy pays sales tax and other service fees and literally remodels things as part of your business. 

 

How is that not an integral part of society? He doesn't need to go join the Rotary Club to be a part of society. 

Besides, like you said, do we (the majority white, English speaking portion of society) really make it worthwhile (to say nothing of welcoming) for people like him to integrate into the rest of culture?