Zaku3 Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 57 minutes ago, Xbob42 said: Ubisoft having to specifically design several settings lower than PC's lowest is... a little worrying. On the other hand, Legion runs like shit no matter your machine. You can only get it running "acceptably," even with RT off completely. It's not a good gauge of anything. How does it run on the 3080? I want to give Watch Dogs 2 a go since I will have a new GPU this week. I have Control, Flight Sim, and am hoping for WD2 as a test for the new rig. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crispy4000 Posted November 14, 2020 Author Share Posted November 14, 2020 44 minutes ago, TomCat said: just finished watching this and he says what ive been saying Did the same. He speaks about the SDK being less ready on Microsoft’s side. But nothing as to RT in specific. And certainly no claims that WD:L is being significantly hamstrung by it. We’ll see RT optimizations and improvements throughout the gen. It can only get better down the road. But I don’t think we’ll be seeing 2080 performance out of these consoles with RT. It’s not being realistic. We’re far from it now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomCat Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 9 minutes ago, crispy4000 said: Did the same. He speaks about the SDK being less ready on Microsoft’s side. But nothing as to RT in specific. And certainly no claims that WD:L is being significantly hamstrung by it. We’ll see RT optimizations and improvements throughout the gen. It can only get better down the road. But I don’t think we’ll be seeing 2080 performance out of these consoles with RT. It’s not being realistic. We’re far from it now. I dont understand why you using CROSS GEN games as a Barometer for Raytracing performance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbsolutSurgen Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 3 minutes ago, TomCat said: I dont understand why you using CROSS GEN games as a Barometer for Raytracing performance What game do you want him to use? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomCat Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 1 minute ago, AbsolutSurgen said: What game do you want him to use? Not these lauch games that are still designed to work on last gen machines. Look the main performance hit for RT is Frame Rate. What does Velocity arch. and all the RDNA features do like VRR, Mesh Shaders, they will increase Frame rates or you can use those saved frame rates to implement Stronger Raytracing. And one MS adds their DLSS solution with ML you will be blown away Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crispy4000 Posted November 14, 2020 Author Share Posted November 14, 2020 3 minutes ago, TomCat said: I dont understand why you using CROSS GEN games as a Barometer for Raytracing performance What other barometer do we have? A cross gen game should be able to push RT plenty. It’s adding to what’s already optimized to run on weaker hardware. Even Control could be described as such. Was it not a fair barometer for RTX cards? ...Of course it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomCat Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 1 minute ago, crispy4000 said: What other barometer do we have? A cross gen game should be able to push RT plenty. It’s adding to what’s already optimized to run on weaker hardware. Even Control could be described as such. Was it not a fair barometer for RTX cards? ...Of course it is. control will be a good example because they are actually patching the game so they should actually leverage the hardware and they DEV. is technically sound Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbsolutSurgen Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 5 minutes ago, TomCat said: Not these lauch games that are still designed to work on last gen machines. Look the main performance hit for RT is Frame Rate. What does Velocity arch. and all the RDNA features do like VRR, Mesh Shaders, they will increase Frame rates or you can use those saved frame rates to implement Stronger Raytracing. And one MS adds their DLSS solution with ML you will be blown away [Sung to the tune of Tomorrow from the Annie musical/movie] The benchmarks will get better Tomorrow Bet your bottom dollar that tomorrow There'll be better! Just thinking about Ray Tracing Clears away my doubts, And the sorrow 'Til there's none! When I'm stuck in a day With low framerate, And resolution, I just stick out my chin, And Grin, And Say, Oh New games will come out Tomorrow So ya gotta hang on 'Til tomorrow Those new games Tomorrow! Tomorrow! I love ya Tomorrow! You're always a day away When I'm stuck in a day With low framerate, And resolution, I just stick out my chin And Grin, And Say, Oh Tomorrow! Tomorrow! I love ya Tomorrow! You're always A day A way! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duderino Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 Well one thing is getting clearer. Differences between the consoles (specs/api/architecture) are not always producing a predictable and decisive leader. Both are very competitive at this moment in time. The good news is both XSX and PS5 look like they'll be supplying decent enough Raytracing for the price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crispy4000 Posted November 14, 2020 Author Share Posted November 14, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spork3245 Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 Stop guys, my penis can only get so erect Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duderino Posted November 15, 2020 Share Posted November 15, 2020 Another game where in very specific circumstances one console can outperform the other, but neither are producing a bad experience, especially in gameplay. Will wait for DF to get the full picture (and Raytracing details in quality mode) but based on this I don’t think you can go wrong with either console for COD: Part of me does hope this keeps up. While performance is important, a better multiplat experience is not something that typically temps me to buy a second box or one console over another. Even going back with the OG Xbox, it was Ninja Gaiden and Panzer Dragoon Orta that reeled me in. It’s still too early to say, but I really hope the differentiators between consoles this gen have less to do with resolutions and performance graphs on cross platform games. I’d much rather see exclusives really demonstrate the strengths of each platform. Hopefully in the comming years we'll see more of that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duderino Posted November 17, 2020 Share Posted November 17, 2020 Now this doesn't add up: Observer: System Redux is Simply Better on PS5 Than Xbox Series X WWW.GAMESPEW.COM Thanks to a ray tracing toggle and more, the PS5 version of Observer: System Redux is notably better than its Xbox Series X counterpart. I'd guess the PS5 was their main console SKU. Perhaps with Raytracing in particular this will matter more this gen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stepee Posted November 17, 2020 Share Posted November 17, 2020 30 minutes ago, Duderino said: Now this doesn't add up: Observer: System Redux is Simply Better on PS5 Than Xbox Series X WWW.GAMESPEW.COM Thanks to a ray tracing toggle and more, the PS5 version of Observer: System Redux is notably better than its Xbox Series X counterpart. I'd guess the PS5 was their main console SKU. Perhapse with Raytracing in particular this will matter more this gen. Spoke with Tomcat about this earlier he and let me know that it’s because of a bug in the xbox devkit that renders each k as it’s own set of 4k so instead of 4k it’s rendering 4x4k which is causing its performance to appear to be worse. MS is working on a script to convert the code to read the correct number of k’s and once that’s in this should run at 4k/120 with rt ON. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ominous Posted November 17, 2020 Share Posted November 17, 2020 TLDR: PC gaming FTW3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xbob42 Posted November 17, 2020 Share Posted November 17, 2020 Just now, Ominous said: TLDR: PC gaming FTW3 Pretty much. I wonder if these weird minor wins for the PS5 will keep up, though. It strikes me as incredibly bizarre that there'd be much of a difference at all since they're essentially the same exact system but with the Series X being more powerful and the PS5 having a faster SSD, which with these games really shouldn't matter much since they're cross-gen and not designed from the ground up for them. Seems like either people are developing primarily for PS5 first (which, again, wouldn't make much sense... damn near same hardware) or MS has got something funky going on with their firmware or drivers or something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crispy4000 Posted November 17, 2020 Author Share Posted November 17, 2020 9 hours ago, stepee said: Spoke with Tomcat about this earlier he and let me know that it’s because of a bug in the xbox devkit that renders each k as it’s own set of 4k so instead of 4k it’s rendering 4x4k which is causing its performance to appear to be worse. MS is working on a script to convert the code to read the correct number of k’s and once that’s in this should run at 4k/120 with rt ON. We already know their APIs are good now! Because of logic: On 10/30/2020 at 5:57 PM, TomCat said: We know that MS is the software company and that Sony cant keep up when it comes to designing Api's because Sony is a Hardware company. Just gotta wait for a good developer to properly use them! ... In all seriousness, I expect it'll get patched soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crispy4000 Posted November 17, 2020 Author Share Posted November 17, 2020 1 hour ago, Xbob42 said: Pretty much. I wonder if these weird minor wins for the PS5 will keep up, though. It strikes me as incredibly bizarre that there'd be much of a difference at all since they're essentially the same exact system but with the Series X being more powerful and the PS5 having a faster SSD, which with these games really shouldn't matter much since they're cross-gen and not designed from the ground up for them. Seems like either people are developing primarily for PS5 first (which, again, wouldn't make much sense... damn near same hardware) or MS has got something funky going on with their firmware or drivers or something. Lots of could-be's at the moment. It's impossible to say for sure what the bottlenecks are on either system yet. But for now, it's still uncanny how close they are performance-wise in general with cross-gen stuff. DMC5 could be a sign that Series X will have an RT advantage in the future, though I don't think it would pull away hard and fast in that until an upscaling solution materializes. (that's better suited for Series X, presumably) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyser_Soze Posted November 17, 2020 Share Posted November 17, 2020 Not sure how true this is about DMC5 but it sounds like not everyone had a 4K monitor or monitors that ran at 120htz on the development team so it could explain why it doesn't run so great Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPDunks4 Posted November 17, 2020 Share Posted November 17, 2020 Dirt 5 dev said the same. There simply aren't many 4k120fps HDR TVs out there, and the team definitely didn't have one at each person's home for testing. He said there wasn't an easy way to test due to Covid, where as they'd typically have something at the studio for them to test on. He also said they simply have to learn the RDNA2 features as there hadn't been an RDNA2 GPU out yet. Said the 120fps mode used only 5ms of 8ms on the Xbox, so plenty of overhead left on the CPU. Now they just need to learn the new GPU features to get more out of the games visually. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomCat Posted November 23, 2020 Share Posted November 23, 2020 On 11/17/2020 at 5:42 AM, JPDunks4 said: Dirt 5 dev said the same. There simply aren't many 4k120fps HDR TVs out there, and the team definitely didn't have one at each person's home for testing. He said there wasn't an easy way to test due to Covid, where as they'd typically have something at the studio for them to test on. He also said they simply have to learn the RDNA2 features as there hadn't been an RDNA2 GPU out yet. Said the 120fps mode used only 5ms of 8ms on the Xbox, so plenty of overhead left on the CPU. Now they just need to learn the new GPU features to get more out of the games visually. damn that sure sounds alot like what someone I know been saying. He also said they didnt have the SDk's for the series X they had to develop the game on an Xbox 1 GDK. Something else ole TomCat said Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crispy4000 Posted November 23, 2020 Author Share Posted November 23, 2020 1 hour ago, TomCat said: damn that sure sounds alot like what someone I know been saying. He also said they didnt have the SDk's for the series X they had to develop the game on an Xbox 1 GDK. Something else ole TomCat said ole TomCat also said the APIs would be ahead and that Series X raytracing would beat a 2080 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crispy4000 Posted November 23, 2020 Author Share Posted November 23, 2020 Interesting results here. Series X comes on top with RT in holding frame rate during setpiece moments and cutscenes, but under PS5 with the 120fps mode. Series S lacks RT entirely. Either way, seeing RT on these consoles targeting 60fps above 1080p is a triumph. Even when it's just shadows. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crispy4000 Posted December 9, 2020 Author Share Posted December 9, 2020 Spiderman MM adds 60fps RT mode. Resolution takes a cut, and so do shadows in reflections. But it's a welcome surprise! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodyHell Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 17 minutes ago, crispy4000 said: Spiderman MM adds 60fps RT mode. Resolution takes a cut, and so do shadows in reflections. But it's a welcome surprise! Damn, I gotta check that out. I deleted it last night, and cyberpunk today, ill get to it over xmas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xbob42 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 Oh yeah, getting closer and closer to just giving us the settings to tweak ourselves! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyser_Soze Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 Just now, Xbob42 said: Oh yeah, getting closer and closer to just giving us the settings to tweak ourselves! If you play Bright Memory on Xbox Sex it is exactly that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stepee Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 The new mode seems like the way to go, especially if you had trouble deciding before. Yeah, it’s not as sharp as either other mode but Insomniacs taa seems to be putting in the work and it still looks sharp enough. Always awesome to see devs get clever with the optimization like this! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stepee Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 PLEASE put this mode in Rachet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crispy4000 Posted December 18, 2020 Author Share Posted December 18, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spawn_of_Apathy Posted December 18, 2020 Share Posted December 18, 2020 So what does Miles Morales sacrifice for 60fps+RT? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyser_Soze Posted December 18, 2020 Share Posted December 18, 2020 41 minutes ago, Spawn_of_Apathy said: So what does Miles Morales sacrifice for 60fps+RT? Resolution, reflection quality and pedestrian density Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spawn_of_Apathy Posted December 18, 2020 Share Posted December 18, 2020 28 minutes ago, Keyser_Soze said: Resolution, reflection quality and pedestrian density I thought more realistic reflections were a major reason to have Ray tracing? that seems like giving you a high FPS but reducing overall movement speed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stepee Posted December 18, 2020 Share Posted December 18, 2020 37 minutes ago, Spawn_of_Apathy said: I thought more realistic reflections were a major reason to have Ray tracing? that seems like giving you a high FPS but reducing overall movement speed. Im not sure what the second sentence means exactly, but it certainly does not have that effect. Whats great is they didn’t reduce the amount of reflective surfaces, it’s just the actual quality of the reflections which you don’t notice so much moving. It’s really a great set of compromises and the definitive way to play it unless you have an 80” screen or something where the native 4k matters more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crispy4000 Posted December 18, 2020 Author Share Posted December 18, 2020 DF also posted this recently for the first game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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