~*Official Thread of America's Return to Thoughts & Prayers Normalcy*~

[BloodyHell]

2 minutes ago, Fizzzzle said:

I mean... With any magazine-loaded gun, you can always just make a bigger magazine. A magazine is just a bullet holder with a spring at the bottom.

Again, many have built in magazines. Both rifles and shotguns. They aren’t so easily replaced or extended. 
 

the AR platform is the problem, for a lot of reasons, but the biggest is it’s cheap, modifiable, and abundant.

[CastlevaniaNut18]

1 minute ago, Fizzzzle said:

I mean... With any magazine-loaded gun, you can always just make a bigger magazine. A magazine is just a bullet holder with a spring at the bottom.

That requires more work and knowledge, along with significantly more expensive ammo. Which is why mass shooters go buy the cheaper and easier to use AR.

[Fizzzzle]

1 minute ago, BloodyHell said:

No, they won’t. America is not Australia. There will be no widespread selling of rifles to the government, period. People won’t do it, no matter what scenario you try to “force”.

That's so defeatist. I'm one of the biggest lib cuck doom posters on this forum, but I get sick of the "it wouldn't work in America" excuse. Maybe it wouldn't, but I'm not going to say every effort is doomed to the point that we shouldn't even try.

[Fizzzzle]

Just now, CastlevaniaNut18 said:

That requires more work and knowledge, along with significantly more expensive ammo. Which is why mass shooters go buy the cheaper and easier to use AR.

Making the gun is the hard part. Making a magazine is easy, relatively speaking.

 

Not to say that I don't think we should do it, I just question the end result.

 

I am very wary of half-measures that lead most liberals to say "GG, job done" but don't do anything at best or actually make things worse at worst.

[BloodyHell]

9 minutes ago, Fizzzzle said:

That's so defeatist. I'm one of the biggest lib cuck doom posters on this forum, but I get sick of the "it wouldn't work in America" excuse. Maybe it wouldn't, but I'm not going to say every effort is doomed to the point that we shouldn't even try.

It’s reality.

 

I’m for a buyback of them, but I doubt I’d hand them in unless I was somehow forced

5 minutes ago, Fizzzzle said:

Making the gun is the hard part. Making a magazine is easy, relatively speaking.

 

Not to say that I don't think we should do it, I just question the end result.

 

I am very wary of half-measures that lead most liberals to say "GG, job done" but don't do anything at best or actually make things worse at worst.

Again, not all magazines are a removable cartridge, and Unless you’re an actual gunsmith with a full shop and a metal press, you aren’t making proprietary 30 round magazines for multiple thousand dollar hunting rifles that cost 7-15$ every time you pull the trigger. Cost is the AR’s draw. There are far better combat weapons available than an AR, but they aren’t affordable.
 

 

[Jason]

guys why do you think you're getting a serious conversation out of apoc

[CayceG]

37 minutes ago, Fizzzzle said:

That's so defeatist. I'm one of the biggest lib cuck doom posters on this forum, but I get sick of the "it wouldn't work in America" excuse. Maybe it wouldn't, but I'm not going to say every effort is doomed to the point that we shouldn't even try.

 

Practicality of a gun reduction policy aside, you also have to convince leftists and minority groups that have armed up in defense of their own communities to hand their guns in to a government that routinely makes policy to diminish their political power and at times erase them from existence. 

 

 

[skillzdadirecta]

1 hour ago, Fizzzzle said:

Actually a .22 shot to the head is much more likely to kill you than a .45. mainly because it doesn't have enough velocity to exit out the other side, it just fragments in your brain. A .45 will likely leave a clean exit wound, which increases your survival rate dramatically. And by dramatically I mean you're still probably going to die, but you have better odds relatively speaking.

So you're talking about headshots between two different handgun caliber's right? I'm talking about wounds from handguns vs assault rifles particularly AR-15's which have become the gun of choice for mass shooters in this country. I'm no gun expert by any means but I have worked on several stories recently discussing the subject and why AR's are so deadly. Articles like this one

 

A surgeon explains why AR-15-style rifles are so deadly | Salon.com

WWW.SALON.COM

---

“It's not uncommon to see bones that are disintegrated,” one doctor said of injuries sustained from these kinds of rifles

 

Quote

As AR-15s are repeatedly used in mass shootings across the country, doctors have spoken up on what treating patients with injuries sustained by these weapons are like— and how these wounds are more severe and disconcerting than, say, from a knife or handgun.

"In a typical handgun injury, which I diagnose almost daily, a bullet leaves a laceration through an organ such as the liver," Heather Sher, a radiologist who treated victims of the Parkland shooting in 2018, wrote in The Atlantic. "To a radiologist, it appears as a linear, thin, gray bullet track through the organ. There may be bleeding and some bullet fragments."

But when she looked at a CT scan from one of the Parkland victims, who was shot by an AR-15-style rifle, "the organ looked like an overripe melon smashed by a sledgehammer, and was bleeding extensively." She was amazed at how a gunshot wound could cause so much damage.

 

Quote

 

Survival could depend on if a main vessel is hit or not. Still, Sakran said when treating patients who have been shot with these kinds of guns, the "destruction is much greater" than that caused by a handgun. Sakran said body tissue can be so "destroyed and pulverized" that it is hard to treat.

"It's not uncommon to see bones that are disintegrated," Sakran said. "You can have tissue that looks incredibly jagged and just even has become necrotic in how it looks and how it feels because, again, that energy and that blast effect has really impacted and caused this kind of cavitation that occurs."

Sakran said this kind of sustained injury can be especially life-threatening in children.

 

"In children, you can imagine that their vital organs are much more narrowly condensed, right?" Sakran said. "It's not a surprise how devastating these injuries are for children." Though the protocol is the same for gunshot victims regardless of the specific weapon, Sakran said that when he's treating a victim of an AR-15-style rifle, in the back of his mind he knows the injuries are more likely to be life-threatening.

 

"I know that I'm probably about to face really significant intra abdominal injuries or this is going to require some extensive operative intervention to save this person," Sakran said. "It is just very clear to me that the amount of death and destruction that one can cause with an assault-style rifle cannot be compared to someone [hurt] with a knife or even a handgun."

 

All guns are deadly but THESE guns are causing wounds in civilians and children that haven't been seen outside of wars and the battlefield. THIS is why folks are focusing more on AR's than Handguns even though handguns account for far more deaths than ARs. There's just no reason these weapons should be in the hands of civilians. Especially untrained civilians who haven't been vetted in anyway. 

 

[Fizzzzle]

1 minute ago, skillzdadirecta said:

So you're talking about headshots between two different handgun caliber's right? I'm talking about wounds from handguns vs assault rifles particularly AR-15's which have become the gun of choice for mass shooters in this country. I'm no gun expert by any means but I have worked on several stories recently discussing the subject and why AR's are so deadly. Articles like this one

 

A surgeon explains why AR-15-style rifles are so deadly | Salon.com

WWW.SALON.COM

---

“It's not uncommon to see bones that are disintegrated,” one doctor said of injuries sustained from these kinds of rifles

 

 

 

All guns are deadly but THESE guns are causing wounds in civilians and children that haven't been seen outside of wars and the battlefield. THIS is why folks are focusing more on AR's than Handguns even though handguns account for far more deaths than ARs. There's just no reason these weapons should be in the hands of civilians. Especially untrained civilians who haven't been vetted in anyway. 

 

I kind of feel like getting into a debate about this is kind of losing the plot...

[skillzdadirecta]

Just now, Fizzzzle said:

I kind of feel like getting into a debate about this is kind of losing the plot...

I didn't realize it was a debate. 

[Kamusha]

Yeah as a queer leftist in the south I have no faith in the government to protect me at this point. I’m not even a gun person, they make me uncomfortable, but circumstances have forced me to accept them as a necessary evil.

[Fizzzzle]

Just now, skillzdadirecta said:

I didn't realize it was a debate. 

You're right, I just didn't want it to become one.

 

In my opinion, ALL semi-auto guns should be banned, regardless of the caliber of the bullet.  My point was that focusing on the caliber of the bullet kind of makes you lose the point.

[SimpleG]

6 minutes ago, Jason said:

guys why do you think you're getting a serious conversation out of apoc

Serious or not, hes correct.

 

8 minutes ago, CayceG said:

 

Practicality of a gun reduction policy aside, you also have to convince leftists and minority groups that have armed up in defense of their own communities to hand their guns in to a government that routinely makes policy to diminish their political power and at times erase them from existence. 

 

 

One of my biggest pet peeves of this board is the " herr durr anyone who owns a gun is a tiny dicked pussy". There are a metric ton of minority gun owners whos only protection is a gun. Cops arent in any rush to help some Korean grocery store owner who has been robbed half a dozen times. 2 very close family members are part of a Drag troop that do not do shows unless they have protection or they conceal carry. On several occasions I have been asked to show up,hang out and escort them from the club to the parking lot while carrying. Police sure as fuck arent gonna do shit for them.

[skillzdadirecta]

2 minutes ago, Kamusha said:

Yeah as a queer leftist in the south I have no faith in the government to protect me at this point. I’m not even a gun person, they make me uncomfortable, but circumstances have forced me to accept them as a necessary evil.

I feel the same way. Staying with my parents and the first night I was here, my father showed me where he keeps his gun.

[skillzdadirecta]

Shit and @Kamusha is in Jacksonville Florida... EVERYBODY down there is packing heat and you can get into a shootout just for looking at someone wrong. It makes sense for her to want to protect herself by carrying... everyone else it. It's unfortunately become a necessary evil like she said.

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

As I've said before, "substantive" gun control is a dead and buried issue.  It's not worth spending an iota of political or economic capital on, at least for a couple more generations.

 

The "left" would be better served by directing its energies towards ensuring that marginalized/threatened social groups are guaranteed in their rights to arm the hell up for their self-defense against the white ethnosupremacist/Christian nationalist forces that seek to eliminate their very existence.

 

This definitely isn't the world we want, but we always get the world we deserve.

[Kamusha]

1 hour ago, skillzdadirecta said:

Shit and @Kamusha is in Jacksonville Florida... EVERYBODY down there is packing heat and you can get into a shootout just for looking at someone wrong. It makes sense for her to want to protect herself by carrying... everyone else it. It's unfortunately become a necessary evil like she said.

Not to mention I work at a low income school on what is know as the most dangerous road in Jacksonville. I can’t even get pizza delivered for my students yet I commute there every damn day.

[Fizzzzle]

1 hour ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

As I've said before, "substantive" gun control is a dead and buried issue.  It's not worth spending an iota of political or economic capital on, at least for a couple more generations.

 

The "left" would be better served by directing its energies towards ensuring that marginalized/threatened social groups are guaranteed in their rights to arm the hell up for their self-defense against the white ethnosupremacist/Christian nationalist forces that seek to eliminate their very existence.

 

This definitely isn't the world we want, but we always get the world we deserve.

I know I've mentioned it on here before, but I think there's a window to attack the 2A on exactly what it means by "arms." Can you go to your local walmart and by nitroclycerin? No, you can't, because that would be stupid and dangerous. At some point, we decided that high-explosives don't count as "arms," even though it's completely subjective. The Second Amendment was written before the existence of high-explosives, once high-explosives were invented, pretty much everyone was like "yeah maybe average people shouldn't have those."

 

Imagine if TNT wasn't invented until now, you'd have people screaming "BUT MAH RITES" until the Supreme Court protected it.

 

But you're right, it's a dead and buried issue.

[marioandsonic]

I still remember when I was a seasonal employee at a nearby Cabela's a decade ago, during when the Sandy Hook shooting happened.  I don't have exact numbers, as it was during the Christmas season, but I'm pretty sure we reached record sales during that time.

 

Gun control debate in this country is fucking dead.  The gun nuts won.  Just accept it.  I doubt there will ever be any legislative change that will affect anything.

[Fizzzzle]

11 minutes ago, marioandsonic said:

I still remember when I was a seasonal employee at a nearby Cabela's a decade ago, during when the Sandy Hook shooting happened.  I don't have exact numbers, as it was during the Christmas season, but I'm pretty sure we reached record sales during that time.

 

Gun control debate in this country is fucking dead.  The gun nuts won.  Just accept it.  I doubt there will ever be any legislative change that will affect anything.

So then the only option is the nuclear one like the Black Panthers did in the 60's. Just have a bunch of burly black dudes start open-carrying everywhere to make a point. Only I fucking hate that solution.

[Kal-El814]

2 hours ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

As I've said before, "substantive" gun control is a dead and buried issue.  It's not worth spending an iota of political or economic capital on, at least for a couple more generations.

 

The "left" would be better served by directing its energies towards ensuring that marginalized/threatened social groups are guaranteed in their rights to arm the hell up for their self-defense against the white ethnosupremacist/Christian nationalist forces that seek to eliminate their very existence.

 

This definitely isn't the world we want, but we always get the world we deserve.

 

I genuinely don't think this is true, and I think I'm pretty defeatist about this topic. The main thing preventing a decent amount of stuff like red flag laws, better background checks, banning assault style weapons, etc., is lobbying. Those measures are very popular across the political spectrum, gun lobbyists ensure that it doesn't seem that way if you consume any mass media at all.

 

I'm not kidding myself to think that snapping all of what I listed into existence would make a meaningful dent overnight (again, handguns cause more deaths than assault weapons, as is often brought up in these threads) but I do think there's something to be said for groundswell building towards more meaningful legislation. 

[BloodyHell]

14 hours ago, skillzdadirecta said:

So you're talking about headshots between two different handgun caliber's right? I'm talking about wounds from handguns vs assault rifles particularly AR-15's which have become the gun of choice for mass shooters in this country. I'm no gun expert by any means but I have worked on several stories recently discussing the subject and why AR's are so deadly. Articles like this one

 

A surgeon explains why AR-15-style rifles are so deadly | Salon.com

WWW.SALON.COM

---

“It's not uncommon to see bones that are disintegrated,” one doctor said of injuries sustained from these kinds of rifles

 

 

 

All guns are deadly but THESE guns are causing wounds in civilians and children that haven't been seen outside of wars and the battlefield. THIS is why folks are focusing more on AR's than Handguns even though handguns account for far more deaths than ARs. There's just no reason these weapons should be in the hands of civilians. Especially untrained civilians who haven't been vetted in anyway. 

 

But that just isn't accurate. You can get hollow points or lead tipped bullets in any caliber. The thing is, people are rarely shot with high caliber weapons. I've seen the difference in damage between a .300wsm hollow point and a 5.56(.223)in flesh, it's not even close. 

It all depends on the type of bullet and the firearm it's shot from. A full metal jacket makes small holes. A hollow point, slug or ballistic silver tip destroys. The thing about handguns is they don't have anywhere near the velocity of rifle. Smaller cartridges, less gunpowder, and short barrels make for a massive reduction in impact force, with much shorter range. Barrel length and powder charge is what makes rifles so deadly. Theres little chance i'm even hitting a target at a hundred yards with a pistol due to lack of stabilization from a longer barrel, and less force behind it. With a rifle of almost any caliber above .22, you could kill stuff at 100-200 yards all day, The higher the caliber in general, the more force and damage its going to create, and the longer the barrel (to a point), the longer it's deadly range and accuracy. 

 

[MarSolo]

I don’t want to be defeatist about it anymore.

 

I have twin nephews now, and they’re probably the closest I’ll ever have to having children of my own. I love those little peanuts. The idea of these two going to school terrifies the shit out of me now knowing the reality of school shootings being as American as apple pie.

[skillzdadirecta]

3 hours ago, BloodyHell said:

But that just isn't accurate. You can get hollow points or lead tipped bullets in any caliber. The thing is, people are rarely shot with high caliber weapons. I've seen the difference in damage between a .300wsm hollow point and a 5.56(.223)in flesh, it's not even close. 

It all depends on the type of bullet and the firearm it's shot from. A full metal jacket makes small holes. A hollow point, slug or ballistic silver tip destroys. The thing about handguns is they don't have anywhere near the velocity of rifle. Smaller cartridges, less gunpowder, and short barrels make for a massive reduction in impact force, with much shorter range. Barrel length and powder charge is what makes rifles so deadly. Theres little chance i'm even hitting a target at a hundred yards with a pistol due to lack of stabilization from a longer barrel, and less force behind it. With a rifle of almost any caliber above .22, you could kill stuff at 100-200 yards all day, The higher the caliber in general, the more force and damage its going to create, and the longer the barrel (to a point), the longer it's deadly range and accuracy. 

 

I don't even know what you're arguing against here. 

 

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, MarSolo said:

I don’t want to be defeatist about it anymore.

 

I have twin nephews now, and they’re probably the closest I’ll ever have to having children of my own. I love those little peanuts. The idea of these two going to school terrifies the shit out of me now knowing the reality of school shootings being as American as apple pie.

The kids are way more likely to be in a deadly car crash as American children than to experience gun violence at school, and it isn’t even close. Don’t let the ghoulish media obsession with school shootings scare you into thinking that schools are particularly dangerous places.

[Ghost_MH]

8 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

The kids are way more likely to be in a deadly car crash as American children than to experience gun violence at school, and it isn’t even close. Don’t let the ghoulish media obsession with school shootings scare you into thinking that schools are particularly dangerous places.

 

School shootings, yes, but guns in general, no. Guns are the leading cause of death for kids in this country, just ahead of car accidents. Cars are getting safer while more dangerous guns are being fed into the country, so it was inevitable that guns would catch up.

 

I'm just happy to be in Massachusetts where the gun death rates are the lowest in the country. We're somewhat comparable to like France.

[skillzdadirecta]

1 minute ago, Ghost_MH said:

 

School shootings, yes, but guns in general, no. Guns are the leading cause of death for kids in this country, just ahead of car accidents. Cars are getting safer while more dangerous guns are being fed into the country, so it was inevitable that guns would catch up.

 

I'm just happy to be in Massachusetts where the gun death rates are the lowest in the country. We're somewhat comparable to like France.

I know more people who have died from guns than from car accidents so... yeah.

[BloodyHell]

2 hours ago, skillzdadirecta said:

I don't even know what you're arguing against here. 

 

Oh, im not arguing against anything, im explaining the factors in what makes the AR and other rifles so much deadlier than handguns, but that the AR is among the lowest powered of those rifles. It just happens to be cheap and high capacity, that’s why its so dangerous. You can buy a cheap AR and 1000 rounds for under a grand, that’s it’s draw and what makes it so enticing to shooters. It’s certainly not more damaging than other rifles, that’s a weird thing that’s been pushed in the news. But it is far more effective than any pistol at range. 

[skillzdadirecta]

1 hour ago, BloodyHell said:

Oh, im not arguing against anything, im explaining the factors in what makes the AR and other rifles so much deadlier than handguns, but that the AR is among the lowest powered of those rifles. It just happens to be cheap and high capacity, that’s why its so dangerous. You can buy a cheap AR and 1000 rounds for under a grand, that’s it’s draw and what makes it so enticing to shooters. It’s certainly not more damaging than other rifles, that’s a weird thing that’s been pushed in the news. But it is far more effective than any pistol at range. 

I haven't seen anyone in the media say it was more dangerous than other rifles and that's certainly not what I was saying here. I was explaining why it was so deadly and why it was so concerning compared to handguns.  That's it. Bottom line is it doesn't belong in the hands of untrained civilians.

[CastlevaniaNut18]

So something legit weird just happened. I'm sitting here drinking my coffee before work and my husband left about 20 minutes ago for a walk with the dog. Front door was unlocked and I heard it open and someone step in. I was confused because I knew he shouldn't have been back at this point, so I opened the door and there's a Black woman going back to her vehicle. She apologized and asked if this was 2207 and I said it wasn't. Apparently she was looking for an AirBnB in my neighborhood and walked into the wrong house. I clearly saw the papers in her hand. We had a good laugh and she thanked me for being understanding.

 

Weird? Yep. But given all the recent news, it could have ended badly if she'd accidentally walked into the wrong house. What a world.

[Jason]

8 minutes ago, CastlevaniaNut18 said:

So something legit weird just happened. I'm sitting here drinking my coffee before work and my husband left about 20 minutes ago for a walk with the dog. Front door was unlocked and I heard it open and someone step in. I was confused because I knew he shouldn't have been back at this point, so I opened the door and there's a Black woman going back to her vehicle. She apologized and asked if this was 2207 and I said it wasn't. Apparently she was looking for an AirBnB in my neighborhood and walked into the wrong house. I clearly saw the papers in her hand. We had a good laugh and she thanked me for being understanding.

 

Weird? Yep. But given all the recent news, it could have ended badly if she'd accidentally walked into the wrong house. What a world.

 

You mean you didn't pull your best Frank Reynolds?

 

[CastlevaniaNut18]

25 minutes ago, Jason said:

 

You mean you didn't pull your best Frank Reynolds?

 

Lol, actually I was a mix of being confused and worried something had happened to the dog on their walk. 

[Ghost_MH]

Are we now at the point where people are bragging about how they'd love to shoot someone ringing on the wrong doorbell?

 

Texas weatherman going viral over post warning to keep kids from ringing doorbells: 'My 6 was loaded'

KATV.COM

 

[CastletonSnob]

Texas’s Solution to School Shootings: Training 8-Year-Olds in “Battlefield Trauma Care” | Vanity Fair

WWW.VANITYFAIR.COM

---

This is what it’s come to.

 

[Kal-El814]

2 hours ago, Ghost_MH said:

Are we now at the point where people are bragging about how they'd love to shoot someone ringing on the wrong doorbell?

 

Texas weatherman going viral over post warning to keep kids from ringing doorbells: 'My 6 was loaded'

KATV.COM

 

 

I said this before, Nextdoor is rife with people who openly talk about how they hope some kid plays ding-dong ditch at their door so they can shoot them.