SaysWho? Posted March 3, 2020 Author Share Posted March 3, 2020 1 minute ago, Anathema- said: We totally gave ourselves enough excuses to ignore serious reports of issues with aggressive Sanders fans again, high fives all around gents! Phew, doubling down on fake news of a place that doesn't exist. Bold strategy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaysWho? Posted March 3, 2020 Author Share Posted March 3, 2020 Warren is going after Biden now. Quote "I respect his years of service," Warren said Monday night during a Los Angeles rally. "But no matter how many Washington insiders tell you to support him, nominating their fellow Washington insider will not meet this moment." "Nominating a man who says we do not need any fundamental change in this country will not meet this moment. Nominating someone who wants to restore the world before Donald Trump, when the status quo has been leaving more and more people behind for decades, is a big risk for our party and our country," Warren said in her strongest critique of the former vice president in this race so far. Looking back, I think her mistake was making a stronger case against Bloomberg, who wasn't on the ballot in Nevada and South Carolina, than Biden, who was. I can see her strategy making sense at the time, however, since Bloomberg seemed stronger and better funded than any candidate in history. And in a race this big, there's not a clear-cut strategy guaranteed to work. But I did read some of that criticism at the time by some either strategists or numbers people, and it wasn't something I thought about prior to the Nevada debate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_m_b_m_b_m Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 Nah, her dressing down of bloomy was cathartic. That was great to see, her best performance of the campaign by far. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marioandsonic Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 So I assume this means that if Warren drops out, she'll support Sanders? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyser_Soze Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spawn_of_Apathy Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 4 minutes ago, marioandsonic said: So I assume this means that if Warren drops out, she'll support Sanders? Or maybe nobody and just allow her delegates to be released and pick whoever they want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Signifyin(g)Monkey Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 Hate to be a debbie downer, but the Dems seem like they are just kinda screwed at this point. I'll be voting blue no matter who, (and you should too) but there's no way Biden wins against Trump, especially coming out of a contested convention; I could see Sanders eking out a win or losing massively if the party got behind him--nobody really knows, because no one has any idea how his left-populism will play out in a national presidential election--but if the party remains actively opposed to him, IMO the two outcomes switch to 'eke out a loss' vs 'lose massively'. And right now it seems like they'd rather oppose him and lose than support him and possibly (if perhaps improbably) win. Right now I'm just hoping that our worst fears of what Trump will be like in his second term will turn out to be overblown, RBG will make it four more years, and the Dems win it in 2024 so they can replace her. On election day, I encourage you to rub this post in my face if I'm wrong. Because I really, really want to be wrong. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_m_b_m_b_m Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 5 minutes ago, Spawn_of_Apathy said: Or maybe nobody and just allow her delegates to be released and pick whoever they want. So, Biden. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSpreader Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 I voted for Warren 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaysWho? Posted March 3, 2020 Author Share Posted March 3, 2020 19 minutes ago, b_m_b_m_b_m said: Nah, her dressing down of bloomy was cathartic. That was great to see, her best performance of the campaign by far. It was cathartic to us, but I don't think it helps her win the campaign when Biden was on the ballot in Nevada and South Carolina and Bloomberg wasn't. She basically ignored Biden that debate despite the fact that hurting Bloomberg wouldn't help her get some good news cycles off stronger showings in Nevada or South Carolina. I mean, who knows in the end how successful it would have been? But with Bloomberg not on the ballot, going after him potentially hurts him in the future but didn't do anything for her campaign again the candidates actually on the ballot in the early states. Going after Biden now as the return to the status quo is probably too little too late, imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 20 minutes ago, b_m_b_m_b_m said: Nah, her dressing down of bloomy was cathartic. That was great to see, her best performance of the campaign by far. She single-handedly demolished his momentum and it's nice to see recognition of it for once. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyser_Soze Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_m_b_m_b_m Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 7 minutes ago, SaysWho? said: It was cathartic to us, but I don't think it helps her win the campaign when Biden was on the ballot in Nevada and South Carolina and Bloomberg wasn't. She basically ignored Biden that debate despite the fact that hurting Bloomberg wouldn't help her get some good news cycles off stronger showings in Nevada or South Carolina. I mean, who knows in the end how successful it would have been? But with Bloomberg not on the ballot, going after him potentially hurts him in the future but didn't do anything for her campaign again the candidates actually on the ballot in the early states. Going after Biden now as the return to the status quo is probably too little too late, imo. That it doesn't help her win doesn't bother me in the least. Unequivocally taking down Bloomberg was more important than anything else in this race. A Biden nomination is bad, but a Bloomberg one would have all but guaranteed a second Trump term. 7 minutes ago, Jose said: She single-handedly demolished his momentum and it's nice to see recognition of it for once. I'll give credit where due. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaysWho? Posted March 3, 2020 Author Share Posted March 3, 2020 Just now, b_m_b_m_b_m said: That it doesn't help her win doesn't bother me in the least. Unequivocally taking down Bloomberg was more important than anything else in this race. A Biden nomination is bad, but a Bloomberg one would have all but guaranteed a second Trump term. I'm not talking about what bothers us and what we want; I'm talking specifically about her campaign and her strategy for her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_m_b_m_b_m Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 I won't disagree that it was strategically bad for her campaign specifically. Her campaign doesn't have a great strategy overall for what it's worth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaysWho? Posted March 3, 2020 Author Share Posted March 3, 2020 2 minutes ago, b_m_b_m_b_m said: I won't disagree that it was strategically bad for her campaign specifically. Her campaign doesn't have a great strategy overall for what it's worth. Yeah, that's all I'm saying. I LOVED her performance against Delaney and Bloomberg, but I wonder if continuing to focus on Bloomberg in the SC debate was really wise considering the number she did to him the week before (she mostly repeated attacks she already made). At that point, Biden was still polling well in South Carolina but was mostly ignored for the one not on the ballot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris- Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 Based on the polling today, what’s the projected delegate breakdown? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyser_Soze Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 On 2/29/2020 at 12:34 AM, Remarkableriots said: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.spin.com/2020/02/flavor-flav-rips-bernie-sanders-campaign-for-using-public-enemy-name-for-rally-does-not-approve-your-message%3famp=1 Pwned https://www.usatoday.com/story/entertainment/music/2020/03/01/flavor-flav-slams-bernie-sanders-campaign-promoting-public-enemy-show/4923987002/ Quote Public Enemy is 'moving forward without Flavor Flav' after Bernie Sanders rally dispute @Remarkableriots Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaysWho? Posted March 3, 2020 Author Share Posted March 3, 2020 omg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneticBlueprint Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 Just voted for Bernie. I prefer Warren but my vote is strategic at this point. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_m_b_m_b_m Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 15 minutes ago, Chris- said: Based on the polling today, what’s the projected delegate breakdown? Anywhere from a big Sanders win to a minor Biden win. A lot of polling in the past two days has been good to Biden Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 44 minutes ago, Signifyin(g)Monkey said: Hate to be a debbie downer, but the Dems seem like they are just kinda screwed at this point. I'll be voting blue no matter who, (and you should too) but there's no way Biden wins against Trump, especially coming out of a contested convention; I could see Sanders eking out a win or losing massively if the party got behind him--nobody really knows, because no one has any idea how his left-populism will play out in a national presidential election--but if the party remains actively opposed to him, IMO the two outcomes switch to 'eke out a loss' vs 'lose massively'. And right now it seems like they'd rather oppose him and lose than support him and possibly (if perhaps improbably) win. Right now I'm just hoping that our worst fears of what Trump will be like in his second term will turn out to be overblown, RBG will make it four more years, and the Dems win it in 2024 so they can replace her. On election day, I encourage you to rub this post in my face if I'm wrong. Because I really, really want to be wrong. His party preferring to lose than win under him is what let Corbyn lose to BoJo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elbobo Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 not feeling the super Tuesday hype this year, must all the shake up in the last few days has stolen the attention. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massdriver Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 Updated fivethirtyeight model now has Sanders at only an 8% chance of getting a majority. The Biden Surge could end up being real. We'll know more later this evening. My original prediction of a Biden nomination may end up being true after all even though I renounced it prematurely after Nevada! Edit: Biden is much more likely to end up with the plurality of the delegates going into a contested convention now as well, so all the debate about Sanders going in with more delegates may have been premature. Sanders might end up having to backtrack and change his position back to 2016 Sanders to try to pick off super delegates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 If Biden comes out with 100% support for M4A then I would at least be comfortable with him winning. I think he just doesn't get it, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massdriver Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 Just now, CitizenVectron said: If Biden comes out with 100% support for M4A then I would at least be comfortable with him winning. I think he just doesn't get it, though. Sanders and Warren seem to get attacked over M4A more than their other proposals, but I'm more comfortable with it than many of their other ideas. However, it won't pass the senate no matter how many people scream or make big signs about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 Just now, Massdriver said: However, it won't pass the senate no matter how many people scream or make big signs about it. And therefore we should just preemptively cede the point to the GOP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 1 minute ago, Massdriver said: Sanders and Warren seem to get attacked over M4A more than their other proposals, but I'm more comfortable with it than many of their other ideas. However, it won't pass the senate no matter how many people scream or make big signs about it. You go hard for M4A and then settle for the Public Option, then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massdriver Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 Just now, CitizenVectron said: You go hard for M4A and then settle for the Public Option, then. If you had a democratic majority, you would end up there regardless of where you started in my opinion. If Mitch has the senate, you will get neither. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 Just now, Massdriver said: If you had a democratic majority, you would end up there regardless of where you started in my opinion. If Mitch has the senate, you will get neither. Which sucks, but you keep pushing over and over and over and make a big stink about it to keep the base riled so that you keep winning more and more elections. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaysWho? Posted March 3, 2020 Author Share Posted March 3, 2020 5 minutes ago, Massdriver said: Sanders and Warren seem to get attacked over M4A more than their other proposals, but I'm more comfortable with it than many of their other ideas. However, it won't pass the senate no matter how many people scream or make big signs about it. They went for the public option in 2009 and compromised for Republican votes, got zero votes, and then kept it off the table anyway, calling it a "sliver" of the health care plan. Stop. Preemptively. Compromising. Maybe if they did that and stopped acting as if that's how things should be, the populism some here dislike wouldn't be in high demand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massdriver Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 3 minutes ago, Jason said: And therefore we should just preemptively cede the point to the GOP. No, I just think the prevailing wisdom that this is a magic formula for near term legislative success isn’t realistic with the senate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massdriver Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 2 minutes ago, SaysWho? said: They went for the public option in 2009 and compromised for Republican votes, got zero votes, and then kept it off the table anyway, calling it a "sliver" of the health care plan. Stop. Preemptively. Compromising. Maybe if they did that and stopped acting as if that's how things should be, the populism some here dislike wouldn't be in high demand. My point is that it won’t happen now. I didn’t say to not try. It won’t happen though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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