Ricofoley Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 I guess you can somehow contort an argument that if you personally feel that having a mask on during a church service is inherently altering the service then your rights are being infringed. Like you think it's an affront to God if all of the call and responses sound muffled or something, I dunno. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 2 minutes ago, Ricofoley said: I guess you can somehow contort an argument that if you personally feel that having a mask on during a church service is inherently altering the service then your rights are being infringed. Like you think it's an affront to God if all of the call and responses sound muffled or something, I dunno. I think the argument is supposed to be that they can't suspend your constitutional rights if you're someone who refuses to wear a mask. Personally I think including polling places means it's yet another voter suppression angle, given the demographics on who will and won't wear masks and the politicization of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 52 minutes ago, sblfilms said: I was listening to the local NPR station and they had a doctor on that said he believes a major factor here is the much lower average age of infection in the positive tests. I’m sure there are many factors in the current data though. He briefly addresses that in the thread, and that it is likely a factor at this point, but not the main factor. Obviously those young people (if they were out and about catching it in the first place) will possibly spread it to older people as well, unfortunately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 Your rights can be suspended though. First amendment rights are the most protected of all, but they aren’t unlimited. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 Just now, sblfilms said: Your rights can be suspended though. First amendment rights are the most protected of all, but they aren’t unlimited. You know, it would be funny if the right-wing argued that requiring a mask to enter a polling place constituted a poll tax since it would cost money. Obviously we also require clothing...so you do not have a total constitutional right to go anywhere or say anything you want, like you've said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_m_b_m_b_m Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 We're also getting better at treating patients with covid, so that helps too. And that's a great thing. Lying prone for many patients keeps people off vents, and there's a steroid that cuts the death rate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skillzdadirecta Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 2 hours ago, CitizenVectron said: The Confederacy makes a return! COVID-19 hotspots. Source: https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/07/02/us/coronavirus-cases-increase.html The South shall rise again! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 14 minutes ago, CitizenVectron said: He briefly addresses that in the thread, and that it is likely a factor at this point, but not the main factor. Obviously those young people (if they were out and about catching it in the first place) will possibly spread it to older people as well, unfortunately. Shouldn’t the data show older people also getting infected at much higher nominal numbers? My understanding from that interview is that the growth rate in infections is very low in the 70+ age range in states like Texas and California, while it had exploded in the 20-35 range. Sounds like the kids don’t care about ha going out with themselves but aren’t going to visit grandma. Still not great, but it makes sense as to why we may not see deaths explode in a tight ratio to the cases compared with March/April. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osxmatt Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 43 minutes ago, Jason said: To be fair, I’ve only skimmed the Constitution but I must have missed the Mask Amendment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 6 minutes ago, sblfilms said: Shouldn’t the data show older people also getting infected at much higher nominal numbers? It takes time for the younger people to spread it back around to everyone else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 Just now, Jason said: It takes time for the younger people to spread it back around to everyone else. How long do we have to wait to see the olds catch it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaladinSolo Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 Just now, sblfilms said: How long do we have to wait to see the olds catch it? Till the numbers drop dramatically, and realistically till the pandemic is over with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chakoo Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 1 hour ago, sblfilms said: How long do we have to wait to see the olds catch it? As with everything covid has shown, expect a 2 week lagging indicator. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricofoley Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 Illinois is back up to 868 cases today after we'd gotten as far down as ~500-ish at the low point, but the positive rate has been holding at 2.6%, so testing is still increasing. It's been about a week since IL reopened everything indoors w\ limited capacity regulations that are maybe not being followed strictly. I got a bad feeling we're gonna regret that in another week or two, but I guess we'll see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osxmatt Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 22 minutes ago, chakoo said: As with everything covid has shown, expect a 2 week lagging indicator. Cases started ramping up a month ago in the younger age brackets, but not in the older ones. There seems to be a strong behavior shift that happened when states reopened which is that the youngins started socializing again and old folks continue to mostly stay in, especially those in the 70+ ages. Certainly the shift could occur, but “wait two weeks” doesn’t explain what is happening from June 1 to June 30. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricofoley Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 So we've gone all the way back around to "get mad at the Chinese until the virus goes away" as the plan? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaladinSolo Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 7 minutes ago, Ricofoley said: So we've gone all the way back around to "get mad at the Chinese until the virus goes away" as the plan? I'm guessing the report saying the Chinese trade deal was basically not going to happen was true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricofoley Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 17 minutes ago, sblfilms said: Cases started ramping up a month ago in the younger age brackets, but not in the older ones. There seems to be a strong behavior shift that happened when states reopened which is that the youngins started socializing again and old folks continue to mostly stay in, especially those in the 70+ ages. Certainly the shift could occur, but “wait two weeks” doesn’t explain what is happening from June 1 to June 30. I'm not gonna pretend like I have any real expertise to know for sure, but I think we can hope that there have been real changes in the protocols for long-term care facilities that have decreased the spread there since the beginning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 7 minutes ago, Ricofoley said: I'm not gonna pretend like I have any real expertise to know for sure, but I think we can hope that there have been real changes in the protocols for long-term care facilities that have decreased the spread there since the beginning. This is my hope. Anecdotally, this is what I’ve seen in regards to the facilities that family and friends here in the Houston area are in. I certainly won’t be surprised if a few weeks down the road we do see big increases in cases and, as a result, deaths amongst our oldest populations. The data just currently isn’t showing those increases in the states where cases went through the roof in June. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 I think we are certainly going to see death rates increase, as even younger people will begin to die if hospitalized in large numbers. Hopefully not to the same extent as before (% wise), but in absolute numbers I can't see the death count remaining stable with the massive increase in spread, regardless of the demographics of who has it now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 11 minutes ago, CitizenVectron said: regardless of the demographics of who has it now. Why? The rates of death are incredibly low from people under 30. The demographics are rather important to the expected nominal deaths, particularly if our medical facility capacity remains solid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chakoo Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 59 minutes ago, sblfilms said: Cases started ramping up a month ago in the younger age brackets, but not in the older ones. There seems to be a strong behavior shift that happened when states reopened which is that the youngins started socializing again and old folks continue to mostly stay in, especially those in the 70+ ages. Certainly the shift could occur, but “wait two weeks” doesn’t explain what is happening from June 1 to June 30. I haven't really looked over the data recently. It's just pointing out that with covid all knock on effects tend to lag by 2 weeks. It wasn't long ago that people were claiming that everything was fine when states reopened because the numbers weren't going up or that when they started to go up that ICU and hospital capacity was still low and now we're seeing that spike. There is a good chance things could be different or improve but based on past history we really don't know until after the fact. =/ I really do hope things are being taken more serious with those most at risk. I know in canada while the numbers improve it luckily hasn't caused a huge return in numbers for Long Term Care Homes who received the brunt of it at the start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_m_b_m_b_m Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 Numbers of deaths is still a product of the number of infections, and .1% of 145,000,000 (approx number of people 34 and younger) is still a big damn number, and an unacceptable loss, and it's not like we can keep these people from higher risk populations (45-65 or higher) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 13 minutes ago, sblfilms said: Why? The rates of death are incredibly low from people under 30. The demographics are rather important to the expected nominal deaths, particularly if our medical facility capacity remains solid. Sorry if I wasn't clear, I simply meant that if enough young people get sick, the smaller % that get severely sick will still be a large number. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaladinSolo Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 If we get to the point where the entire country's hospitals are overloaded and we can't shift medical staff around like we did back in March and April then people are going to start dying of all kinds of shit that wouldn't normally kill them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skillzdadirecta Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 46 minutes ago, johnny said: Sounds like she's one of those "Long Haulers" we did a story on earlier in the week. There's a decent amount of these folks... so much that they have their own Facebook groups. Even for the people that don't die, the long term effects of this disease are pretty damn serious and aren't getting enough attention. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 Yes, that famous American slogan. Remember when, at the foot of the fallen towers, George W. Bush said "We're gonna find the people who brought these towers down...and we're gonna live with it"? Or, after Pearl Harbor, FDR said "Today is a day which we will live with"? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricofoley Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 13 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said: Sounds like she's one of those "Long Haulers" we did a story on earlier in the week. There's a decent amount of these folks... so much that they have their own Facebook groups. Yeah, have there been any studies trying estimate how many people have long term effects like this? I haven't really seen anything like that reported on, and it seems like such an important question going forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricofoley Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 2016: "Only I can fix" 2020: "Learn to live with it" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skillzdadirecta Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 7 minutes ago, Ricofoley said: Yeah, have there been any studies trying estimate how many people have long term effects like this? I haven't really seen anything like that reported on, and it seems like such an important question going forward. https://www.today.com/health/covid-19-long-haulers-doctor-talks-having-symptoms-over-2-t185712 https://www.wsmv.com/news/doctors-concerned-about-covid-19-long-haulers/article_b65fbed8-bcc7-11ea-bb58-875424462675.html https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/jun/28/coronavirus-long-haulers-infectious-disease-testing https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2020/06/covid-19-coronavirus-longterm-symptoms-months/612679/ Quote For vonny leclerc, day one was March 16. Hours after British Prime Minister Boris Johnson instated stringent social-distancing measures to halt the SARS-CoV-2 coronavirus, LeClerc, a Glasgow-based journalist, arrived home feeling shivery and flushed. Over the next few days, she developed a cough, chest pain, aching joints, and a prickling sensation on her skin. After a week of bed rest, she started improving. But on day 12, every old symptom returned, amplified and with reinforcements: She spiked an intermittent fever, lost her sense of taste and smell, and struggled to breathe. When I spoke with LeClerc on day 66, she was still experiencing waves of symptoms. “Before this, I was a fit, healthy 32-year-old,” she said. “Now I’ve been reduced to not being able to stand up in the shower without feeling fatigued. I’ve tried going to the supermarket and I’m in bed for days afterwards. It’s like nothing I’ve ever experienced before.” Despite her best efforts, LeClerc has not been able to get a test, but “every doctor I’ve spoken to says there’s no shadow of a doubt that this has been COVID,” she said. Today is day 80. Those are just a few stories about this phenomenon. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marioandsonic Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 28 minutes ago, CitizenVectron said: Yes, that famous American slogan. Remember when, at the foot of the fallen towers, George W. Bush said "We're gonna find the people who brought these towers down...and we're gonna live with it"? Or, after Pearl Harbor, FDR said "Today is a day which we will live with"? We are beyond parody levels now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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