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Alan Wake II (PS5/Xbox Series/EGS) - update: upcoming patch (03/06) drastically improves GTX 10-series performance


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1 hour ago, ShreddieMercury said:

I'm really taking my time and savoring this game.  I really like the episodic structure because it lets you break up the experience very cleanly between sections.  It seems to be a pretty lengthy game, which in most cases I don't really like.  But the story and atmosphere is so gripping that I don't mind at all. 

 

It is quite large for this kind of game, but 15-20 hours is actually the perfect game size for me. Though, it’ll surely take me longer as I’m going slow and trying to find secrets and stuff.

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24 minutes ago, best3444 said:

 

I put it on story difficulty after really getting fucked up by the first boss. But now the combat is way too easy. I think I'll keep it here because I'm in this for the atmosphere and story. 

 

It gets harder on story later on too. It’s a pretty decent difficulty for me, just difficult enough to keep it scary.

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Finished Alan Wake Remastered. It's an interesting storytelling exercise layered on top of a very mediocre game. I think the game was a bit too generous with supplies, and didn't have any interesting gameplay elements for the pure narrative parts. The driving was terrible, the puzzles basically non-existent, but at least the core light+shooting mechanic worked well enough. I felt like the balance was off for the random haunted objects, like they took too much time to kill and it was difficult to effectively dodge them. I had a few odd physics encounters, but nothing game breaking. Overall I'm glad I put in the $10 and 10 hours, but it's not going to be a lasting favorite of mine.

 

Staring the second game is a revelation, mostly just because of how gorgeous it looks.  My 4080 is able to push path tracing at an acceptable frame rate with most everything else turned up to high, and it's easily up there with the best graphics you can get anywhere. I feel like I haven't seen the best of it, only being mid way through Chapter 2, but I'm extremely impressed so far.

 

Still, at that early stage of the game, it's clear how much has changed in the last 13 years in their ability to tell story and induce gameplay while not shooting at something. That's a very welcome change, even if I think the mind place conceit is a bit much. I find it odd that there is only one "correct" way to place any piece of evidence, but you have to "figure it out." It seems like an odd middle ground where either extreme would have made more sense to me. Either just have that stuff auto-complete and show me an evolving board as my character figures it out, or give me a free form board (a-la Shadows of Doubt), and let me feel like I'm actually figuring things out. I also don't love that you can't move the story along without placing the evidence on the board. I got stuck for a while in Chapter 1, running up and down the map from the lake to the car looking for clues I must have missed, only to figure out that I couldn't do anything until I placed some evidence I'd already collected. Forcing you to constantly go back in there is already a frustrating slowdown in pace. I do think laying it all out is a good idea, and does a good job of showing the narrative progression of the investigation. It's good to feel like you're solving a mystery, but I'm not entirely sold on it yet and I hope it grows on me as I move through the game.

 

I have also found the difficulty surprising. In the first game I was constantly finishing chapters with a ton of ammo, but in the early stages of this one I'm feeling very desperate for supplies. I finished the first boss completely empty on ammo and batteries. It made for a harrowing encounter, and I largely expected to quickly re-supply, but that has not happened yet. I think it's good to lean more into the survival horror aspect, but thus far it's caught me slightly off guard.

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9 hours ago, TwinIon said:

Finished Alan Wake Remastered. It's an interesting storytelling exercise layered on top of a very mediocre game. I think the game was a bit too generous with supplies, and didn't have any interesting gameplay elements for the pure narrative parts. The driving was terrible, the puzzles basically non-existent, but at least the core light+shooting mechanic worked well enough. I felt like the balance was off for the random haunted objects, like they took too much time to kill and it was difficult to effectively dodge them. I had a few odd physics encounters, but nothing game breaking. Overall I'm glad I put in the $10 and 10 hours, but it's not going to be a lasting favorite of mine.

 

Staring the second game is a revelation, mostly just because of how gorgeous it looks.  My 4080 is able to push path tracing at an acceptable frame rate with most everything else turned up to high, and it's easily up there with the best graphics you can get anywhere. I feel like I haven't seen the best of it, only being mid way through Chapter 2, but I'm extremely impressed so far.

 

Still, at that early stage of the game, it's clear how much has changed in the last 13 years in their ability to tell story and induce gameplay while not shooting at something. That's a very welcome change, even if I think the mind place conceit is a bit much. I find it odd that there is only one "correct" way to place any piece of evidence, but you have to "figure it out." It seems like an odd middle ground where either extreme would have made more sense to me. Either just have that stuff auto-complete and show me an evolving board as my character figures it out, or give me a free form board (a-la Shadows of Doubt), and let me feel like I'm actually figuring things out. I also don't love that you can't move the story along without placing the evidence on the board. I got stuck for a while in Chapter 1, running up and down the map from the lake to the car looking for clues I must have missed, only to figure out that I couldn't do anything until I placed some evidence I'd already collected. Forcing you to constantly go back in there is already a frustrating slowdown in pace. I do think laying it all out is a good idea, and does a good job of showing the narrative progression of the investigation. It's good to feel like you're solving a mystery, but I'm not entirely sold on it yet and I hope it grows on me as I move through the game.

 

I have also found the difficulty surprising. In the first game I was constantly finishing chapters with a ton of ammo, but in the early stages of this one I'm feeling very desperate for supplies. I finished the first boss completely empty on ammo and batteries. It made for a harrowing encounter, and I largely expected to quickly re-supply, but that has not happened yet. I think it's good to lean more into the survival horror aspect, but thus far it's caught me slightly off guard.

 

Skipping Control is somewhat of a faux pas here (it's decently integral to Alan Wake's story), unless you already played it?

 

Edit: Also Alan Wake Remastered unfortunately forces you to play easy or normal as hard is not available until you beat the game once. Hard is a decent bit harder, with less ammo and harder enemies, so that might be why you felt the remaster was relatively easy, while Alan Wake II let's you pick hard from the start. Which difficulty did you go with for both games?

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1 hour ago, Greatoneshere said:

 

Skipping Control is somewhat of a faux pas here (it's decently integral to Alan Wake's story), unless you already played it?

I played Control. 

 

However, since I played it well prior to finishing Alan Wake, I can’t say that I caught any of the connections during my playthrough. I did love Control, which is largely why I was willing to buy both Alan Wake games. 

 

I played on the middle setting, whatever they call it, on all three games. I don’t recall Control having any difficulty issues one way or another. The first Alan Wake seemed very easy, but I didn’t turn it up in order to rush through it. The second one seems much harder (I want my recharging flashlight back! I wish I could stun enemies without focusing on them!) but again, I’m very early in the game, so I can’t say how that initial impression holds up.

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1 hour ago, TwinIon said:

I played Control. 

 

However, since I played it well prior to finishing Alan Wake, I can’t say that I caught any of the connections during my playthrough. I did love Control, which is largely why I was willing to buy both Alan Wake games. 

 

I played on the middle setting, whatever they call it, on all three games. I don’t recall Control having any difficulty issues one way or another. The first Alan Wake seemed very easy, but I didn’t turn it up in order to rush through it. The second one seems much harder (I want my recharging flashlight back! I wish I could stun enemies without focusing on them!) but again, I’m very early in the game, so I can’t say how that initial impression holds up.

 

Well, you won't retroactively see any connections between Alan Wake and Control because Alan Wake came first. But Control has plenty of connections to Alan Wake, and Alan Wake II explicitly references the FBC, etc. If you don't know things like points of power or whatever from Control, you're going in to Alan Wake II much more blind. I can't imagine someone playing Alan Wake II without Control and it making sense as much as someone who has played Control. You don't see the connections?

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  • Commissar SFLUFAN changed the title to Alan Wake II (PS5/Xbox Series/EGS) - update: "PC Path Tracing: The Next Level In Visual Fidelity?" (Digital Foundry)
6 hours ago, Mercury33 said:

They include specific objects of power from Control? Jesus I don’t remember most of those and I finished it in the last year lol

 

I'm still relatively early in Alan Wake II but there's an FBC station right at the beginning of Alan Wake II and an FBC engineer is working on it, fixing it. In Control, Bright Falls and Cauldron Lake are referenced as a place of power due to the Dark Place. Control explicitly folds everything from Alan Wake into Control's world building, so if you play Alan Wake II without having played Control you're going in to the story a lot more blind and armed with a lot less knowledge of everything that's going on in Bright Falls. Control's second DLC even specifically wraps up one character's plot thread from Alan Wake (evil psychiatrist Dr. Hartman) and the end of that DLC hints at a lot of what I presume either Alan Wake II or Control II will address, but it involves the character Alan Wake so I'd assume Alan Wake II, even though I don't see Jesse from Control suddenly showing up in Alan Wake II (but maybe?). Control is key I think.

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On 11/4/2023 at 12:28 PM, Greatoneshere said:

 

I'm still relatively early in Alan Wake II but there's an FBC station right at the beginning of Alan Wake II and an FBC engineer is working on it, fixing it. In Control, Bright Falls and Cauldron Lake are referenced as a place of power due to the Dark Place. Control explicitly folds everything from Alan Wake into Control's world building, so if you play Alan Wake II without having played Control you're going in to the story a lot more blind and armed with a lot less knowledge of everything that's going on in Bright Falls. Control's second DLC even specifically wraps up one character's plot thread from Alan Wake (evil psychiatrist Dr. Hartman) and the end of that DLC hints at a lot of what I presume either Alan Wake II or Control II will address, but it involves the character Alan Wake so I'd assume Alan Wake II, even though I don't see Jesse from Control suddenly showing up in Alan Wake II (but maybe?). Control is key I think.

Oh yeah, the Control connections are pretty obvious, but it has been a few years since I played it so I'm sure I'm missing some things. AW2 has me thinking I should replay Control, but there are just too many games top play, so I'll probably just watch a video.

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Article that accompanies the video posted a couple of days ago.

 

WWW.EUROGAMER.NET

A deep dive into Alan Wake 2's graphics at their path-traced best, along with optimised settings for mid-range GPUs.

 

Quote

 

Alan Wake 2 is sublime - a masterclass in the visual arts - and while it still manages to look fine on consoles from Xbox Series S upwards, it's with high-end PC that you get to see Remedy's masterpiece at its absolute best thanks to hardware-accelerated ray tracing, path tracing and DLSS 3.5 ray reconstruction. The question is: do you need best-of-the-best hardware like RTX 4080 or RTX 4090 to benefit from the experience? Well, it's a demanding experience to be sure, but we were happy with the results we gleaned from RTX 3080 and its nearest 40-series equivalent, RTX 4070, both running at 1440p output resolution. And of course, those settings can and will provide similar scalability on other RT-capable GPUs, though your mileage may vary.

 

There's scalability then, but let's kick off by taking a look at the individual RT features and what they actually do. Ray-traced direct lighting essentially adds RT shadows to all light sources. Alan Wake 2's standard shadow maps can be temporally unstable, and also switch from different quality shadows depending on distance, resulting in some obvious 'popping' as you move through the cascade.

 

Rasterised shadows also have a uniform sharpness to them, whereas in real life, shadows are sharper the closer to the casting light source they are, tapering off into the distance. This is linked to another problem: not every object casts shadows. RT shadows in Alan Wake 2 solve each and every one of these issues, while common problems in other games with this effect are also side-stepped. RT shadows often do not animate, for example. This particularly jarring on elements like vegetation, but it's not an issue in this game.

 

 

Quote

 

Next up, let's discuss path-traced indirect lighting, which accounts for the dramatic increase in reflection quality via RT in Alan Wake 2. At the surface level, this has all the advantages of other RT reflection implementations in other games.

 

Without RT, reflections are calculated using information within screen-space. This looks fine, except that when information is not in screen-space, there's nothing to add into a reflection which remains visible, creating jarring visual discontinuities. This means that panning up/down with, say, a lake in view sees reflection detail vanish as the content being reflected moves out of screen-space.

 

However, in Alan Wake 2, you can see that light sources behind a player (like sunlight streaming through a window, for example) can also cause reflections within the viewport to present in a completely different way to the SSR alternative. The light shows up in the reflective sheen of a varnished doorway, for example, while the window itself may be reflected in the glass of a framed photograph. The presentation of the reflection can also be influenced by variations in the glass itself.

 

 

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Remedy has a small article showcasing some of the tech in their Northlight engine. Have to say that it's nice to see a smaller studio succeeding with an in house engine that really looks as good as anything out there. They're doing some pretty cool stuff.

 

From that article, they linked this video from early this year that goes through their engine, as well as another article talking about their implementation of USD, which is pretty cool.

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6 minutes ago, TwinIon said:

Remedy has a small article showcasing some of the tech in their Northlight engine. Have to say that it's nice to see a smaller studio succeeding with an in house engine that really looks as good as anything out there. They're doing some pretty cool stuff.

 

From that article, they linked this video from early this year that goes through their engine, as well as another article talking about their implementation of USD, which is pretty cool.

 

Thats very cool that they open sourced their pipeline migration plugin thingy!

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I finished this a few days ago and have had some time to let it all sink in.  Overall, I thought this was an astonishing and unique experience.  I'm so thankful that this was finally made, and that Remedy was able to fully follow their whims on a project that they were undoubtedly extremely passionate about.  You can feel their passion in every frame.

 

I do think experience is how I would sum this up best.  I'm not convinced that it's a great game.  Alan Wake II is more of an experimental multimedia presentation that includes some gameplay.  I think that what's there is very solid, but it's clear that the story and presentation took priority.  That's a completely understandable approach, but it also surprises me that the reception was not more divisive for this reason. 

 

This gets into a bigger issue that I have with modern AAA games that are relentlessly chasing photo-realism and cinematic storytelling.  The desire to tell grounded stories in a cinematic way is often at odds with developing fun and engaging gameplay.  The heavier that developers lean into the former, the more that the latter suffers, and vice versa.  Very few games (if any) are able to balance these two elements, and I tend to enjoy games that either have very little story or eschew it altogether in favor of pure gameplay.  This type of graphical realism also prioritizes animation, and I feel games have gotten more and more sluggish to play as a result.

 

As much as I really enjoyed the strange directions that Alan Wake II took its story, I think Remedy has twisted themselves into unnecessary knots with their "connected universe".  The more that multiverses or layers of reality become exposed, the less stakes or weight any story has.  There is no impact because nothing is real, or it can be altered on a whim to connect with whatever gives lore seekers that extra hit of connection-chasing.

 

All in all, this is still perhaps my favorite experience of the year, and it's got some incredible high points.  But I still prefer the relative simplicity of the first game.

 

 

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1 hour ago, ShreddieMercury said:

I finished this a few days ago and have had some time to let it all sink in.  Overall, I thought this was an astonishing and unique experience.  I'm so thankful that this was finally made, and that Remedy was able to fully follow their whims on a project that they were undoubtedly extremely passionate about.  You can feel their passion in every frame.

 

I do think experience is how I would sum this up best.  I'm not convinced that it's a great game.  Alan Wake II is more of an experimental multimedia presentation that includes some gameplay.  I think that what's there is very solid, but it's clear that the story and presentation took priority.  That's a completely understandable approach, but it also surprises me that the reception was not more divisive for this reason. 

 

This gets into a bigger issue that I have with modern AAA games that are relentlessly chasing photo-realism and cinematic storytelling.  The desire to tell grounded stories in a cinematic way is often at odds with developing fun and engaging gameplay.  The heavier that developers lean into the former, the more that the latter suffers, and vice versa.  Very few games (if any) are able to balance these two elements, and I tend to enjoy games that either have very little story or eschew it altogether in favor of pure gameplay.  This type of graphical realism also prioritizes animation, and I feel games have gotten more and more sluggish to play as a result.

 

As much as I really enjoyed the strange directions that Alan Wake II took its story, I think Remedy has twisted themselves into unnecessary knots with their "connected universe".  The more that multiverses or layers of reality become exposed, the less stakes or weight any story has.  There is no impact because nothing is real, or it can be altered on a whim to connect with whatever gives lore seekers that extra hit of connection-chasing.

 

All in all, this is still perhaps my favorite experience of the year, and it's got some incredible high points.  But I still prefer the relative simplicity of the first game.

 

 

 

Im also surprised the game hasn’t been more divisive as it does lean heavily into being an adventure game with Resident Evil 2 sections in between, especially at first. 
 

I still have the last 1/3rd to get back to when I get home next week before I have complete thoughts, but I do want to say that as far as balancing story telling/gameplay - the actual combat itself didn’t suffer to any realism/cinematic choices they made, I think the actual combat feels better and is definitely a step up over the original. It’s just that there isn’t as much of it, which could be for better or worse depending on the person, and when considering how repetitive AW could get. 

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I think I'm nearing the end and I'm still really enjoying my time with Alan Wake 2, but I'm also beginning to take umbridge at some of the gameplay and design choices. 

 

I really think the inventory management was a straight up bad idea. It only serves as a source of frustration. The first game had limits to how much ammo you could carry, but there was no need to organize boxes or worry about what you could carry. Charms should absolutely be in the "items" category that doesn't take up space, and items should stack more. The existence of a physical inventory to manage is a step back in every way.

 

The movement is generally acceptable, but not great. There have been a few times where I couldn't get down from to a main path because I was six inches higher up, but couldn't vault down. I also really wish there was an actual sprint. Give it a crazy short burst and long refill time or whatever, but there are a number of times when you're running for your life and your characters have no sense of urgency at all. I think the slow walking and "running" speed are fine most of the time, it's good for the pace of the game, but not having any real speed ever is annoying.

 

I overall like the design decision to have a lot less combat and make that combat more difficult and more resource intensive. I think the combat is generally more exciting and fun in this game and the weapons overall feel pretty good. The boss fights are pretty intense and far more interesting than any of the combat in the first game. However, the occasional increased difficulty highlights the lack of saving locations and exacerbates the inventory issues. I went through a whole long section without one of my weapons because I couldn't get to a shoebox, and I don't see why. If you're going to make me manage inventory and only save at specific spots, they should be much more common.

 

I do really like the narrative and what they're doing with it here. I feel like the concepts were very half baked in the first game. Here the ideas behind the storytelling manifest in much more fun and interesting ways, and they're telling a better story while they're at it.

 

I also appreciate that this is a beautiful game that really forces you to look around. There's no ping to point you towards the thing you're told to find or to illuminate all the clues for you. I don't think anything is terribly difficult to find, but you do actually have to look around. There are a number of times where you need to follow a trail of some kind or other, and again, no hud elements point you, you just need to look.

 

Even in this year of great games, this is a stand out experience.

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5 hours ago, ShreddieMercury said:

I do think experience is how I would sum this up best.  I'm not convinced that it's a great game.  Alan Wake II is more of an experimental multimedia presentation that includes some gameplay.  I think that what's there is very solid, but it's clear that the story and presentation took priority.  That's a completely understandable approach, but it also surprises me that the reception was not more divisive for this reason. 

 

This is a fair criticism but this is entirely baked into a game like Alan Wake. My younger brother is going through Alan Wake Remastered since he's never played it before but always been curious because of me and watching him play, your description would fit that game perfectly. It's more of a storytelling interactive experience than a traditional game, even though it has combat, etc. It's the same reason it was silly for people to bag on Shenmue III for being . . . Shenmue. Alan Wake II is still an Alan Wake game first and foremost, I'd be disappointed if it was more of a game. As is, I'm impressed (so far) with how tactile the combat feels at least and the enemies on hard difficulty aren't always easy.

 

5 hours ago, ShreddieMercury said:

This gets into a bigger issue that I have with modern AAA games that are relentlessly chasing photo-realism and cinematic storytelling.  The desire to tell grounded stories in a cinematic way is often at odds with developing fun and engaging gameplay.  The heavier that developers lean into the former, the more that the latter suffers, and vice versa.  Very few games (if any) are able to balance these two elements, and I tend to enjoy games that either have very little story or eschew it altogether in favor of pure gameplay.  This type of graphical realism also prioritizes animation, and I feel games have gotten more and more sluggish to play as a result.

 

Yeah, in general I have noticed the same and it's becoming a rampant problem these days. Again, Alan Wake II doesn't really suffer from this compared to other games since it's "story and presentation" first mentality was always there from the start. And Control has awesome gameplay and a lot of it, so I don't think we have to worry here, Control II will be like Control, not like Alan Wake.

 

5 hours ago, ShreddieMercury said:

As much as I really enjoyed the strange directions that Alan Wake II took its story, I think Remedy has twisted themselves into unnecessary knots with their "connected universe".  The more that multiverses or layers of reality become exposed, the less stakes or weight any story has.  There is no impact because nothing is real, or it can be altered on a whim to connect with whatever gives lore seekers that extra hit of connection-chasing.

 

Multiverse and timey-wimey stuff frequently suck because of this very reason. Alan Wake/Control have done well with this conceit so far, I guess we'll see, I'm only on Chapter 3.

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Finished the game and I'm still very positive about it overall. It's a unique experience in gaming, and it's just exciting to play through something with real AAA production quality that is also so different from everything else. I think as both a storytelling exercise and as a game this one is an absolutely massive step up from the first. It really seems like the crazy ideas that they were chasing in the first game actually matter here so much more, and the way that the Alan chapters make you weave the story is both dramatic and a cool gameplay element.

 

Unfortunately the same is not true of Saga's mind place, which never grew on me and I came to mildly resent. Unlike Alan's storyboard, there's no gameplay element involved, it's just hand holding you through the story. There are times where you can collect all the clues and finish your task without having to pin every little thing to the board, but most of the time that's not the case. I think the game would have been better if that storyboard was like the computer in the Outer Wilds, just a place you could go look at things in case you forgot something or needed more clarity. Just have it auto-complete with all the evidence you find and make it a useful reference should you need it, but something to ignore otherwise. Also, just make the profiling happen in the moment like a cut scene. I feel like every time I was forced to go into the mind place was an unnecessary break in pacing in an already very slow game.

 

For the most part I think the combat was well done. It's intermittent, but more dangerous. It would have been better without the inventory management, which I've mostly already complained about in another post. Still, it's annoying that you can't pause to manage inventory at all. If you get into a fight and don't have something assigned to a quick slot, it's basically impossible to use fast enough. Still, most of the time it was well balanced and exciting.

 

This is primarily a game about storytelling, and it does that well. It rewards attention and has plenty of both sharp turns and slow reveals. It's a bit overbearing at times, but it fits the genre well enough that it's hard to complain.

 

As for the ending:

Spoiler

I didn't expect the game to tie up everything in a bow, so I'm not really disappointed on a story level. I think it leaves things in a much more interesting place than the first game and it makes me excited to learn more while being almost satisfying. I was annoyed by how the end played. Way too much time spent in the mind place, walking around collecting and pinning clues, which was not a very satisfying mechanism for Saga's realizations. Switching Alan and Saga felt like a really interesting gameplay opportunity that wasn't fully realized. I knew I was at the end of the game, but it would have been so interesting to see Saga manipulate the dark place, maybe in a different way. Alan escapes, but immediately returns and has so little to actually do that it felt like a anti-climax. For a game that did so well at weaving storytelling into gameplay, it ended with a bit of a thud in that regard.

 

While there are some rough patches, I really enjoyed Alan Wake 2. It takes big swings that make it a completely different experience from most AAA games, and most of the time those pay off.

 

I really do think that playing Alan Wake (Remastered) and Control greatly enhance the experience of Alan Wake 2. Control is simply a great game, so that should be an easy sell. Alan Wake 1 is a 10 hour oddity that I don't think is great, but it is an interesting experiment and still worthwhile for anyone looking to get the most out of Alan Wake 2.

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I find myself seduced by the world building and style of Remedy’s games but find them a bit of a slog to actually play. I gave control two long attempts but I just burnt out each time. Maybe I’m better off putting that game on easy and just taking in all the cool story stuff it has. I wanna get AW2 sometime but am afraid I would have similar feelings toward it. 

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  • Commissar SFLUFAN changed the title to Alan Wake II (PS5/Xbox Series/EGS) - update: Old Gods of Asgard videos posted
  • 2 weeks later...

Im nearing the end and this literal all things media wrapped up into one package is incredible. I think it’s a great game too, personally. 
 

But I just want to say “This shit won’t write itself” - William Shakespeare 

 

Since this game has no chance at regular game sales, being a digital only AAA current gen only Epic store exclusive with steep system requirements, I hope Epic gets whatever they want out of it. No way this game could have been made without someone specifically wanting to pay for a critically acclaimed game, so I hope they are happy with what it’s done so far and that it continues to sell well for a long time. I know we at least get two pieces of dlc and Control 2 is a given and will give them a chance to be more commercially successful. But we need more AAA that fucking swings wildly for the fences like this.

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