Hospital Caught Dumping Patients On Street

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

I will make no apologies for expressing revulsion at the seeming mistreatment of a vulnerable member of society.

 

[CastlevaniaNut18]

I guess the frontline workers being abused by these “vulnerable” members of society can just get fucked. 

[TUFKAK]

3 minutes ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

I will make no apologies for expressing revulsion at the seeming mistreatment of a vulnerable member of society.

 

And I make no apologies for leaving public service due to this mindset.

 

they can find someone else to legit shit on, maybe you all in the lobby while you wait for providers who aren’t there. 

[TUFKAK]

1 minute ago, CastlevaniaNut18 said:

I guess the frontline workers being abused by these “vulnerable” members of society can just get fucked. 

We’ve never mattered dude.

[TUFKAK]

4 minutes ago, TUFKAK said:

And I make no apologies for leaving public service due to this mindset.

 

they can find someone else to legit shit on, maybe you all in the lobby while you wait for providers who aren’t there. 

Should be noted I’ve actually seen this happen from one of these “vulnerable” members.

 

next time I’m just gonna watch it happen. I’m not a cop, not my job to stop it after all.

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

This is far from being a purely binary situation (the well-being of healthcare workers vs the well-being of vulnerable populations) and represents the overall failure of society on every possible economic, moral, social, and political level.

 

But I will stand by my initial "gut" reaction.

[CastlevaniaNut18]

No one really knows what happened in this particular instance, since the hospital is bound by privacy laws and can’t divulge what led to this particular patient being kicked out. 
 

But you have two long time health care workers explaining the situations that typically lead to patients being given the boot, but we still get shit on. 
 

Mmmkay. 

[Guest]

The only things we know about this situation are: an elderly Black patient was discharged by a for-profit hospital and walked over to the sidewalk in front of the not-for-profit hospital and left laying on the ground until staff from the not for profit hospital came to their assistance, and the patient remained in the care of the not-for-profit hospital for several days after that. I don't know where all this additional narrative came from, but it wasn't any of the news stories on it.

[TUFKAK]

5 minutes ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

This is far from being a purely binary situation (the well-being of healthcare workers vs the well-being of vulnerable populations) and represents the overall failure of society on every possible economic, moral, social, and political level.

 

But I will stand by my initial "gut" reaction.

As will I.

 

And this thread is why another experienced ER nurse and public servant is leaving to greener pastures.

 

im prior military with 15 years of healthcare experience with a Hopkins degree (I hate it but that name carries in healthcare) I’ll have a new position by January.

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

Just now, TUFKAK said:

im prior military with 15 years of healthcare experience with a Hopkins degree (I hate it but that name Carrie’s in healthcare) I’ll have a new position by January.

 

Excellent!

 

You have more than earned that just reward!

[Guest]

1 minute ago, CastlevaniaNut18 said:

but we still get shit on.

 

Can you provide an example of anybody in this thread 'shitting' on you two? I read back through it multiple times and continue to be completely confused as to why you two think any of the handful of responses made were an attack on you. Even after the OP explicitly said it wasn't! 

[TUFKAK]

1 minute ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

 

Excellent!

 

You have more than earned that just reward!

The thing being missed, er providers love the er, we love helping and making a difference.

 

But I’m beyond done with this shit. I’ll go to my outpatient clinic and do nothing for the wage I make.

 

my gf will be pissed but she’ll adjust.

[TUFKAK]

4 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

 

Can you provide an example of anybody in this thread 'shitting' on you two? I read back through it multiple times and continue to be completely confused as to why you two think any of the handful of responses made were an attack on you. Even after the OP explicitly said it wasn't! 

Not us specifically but the profession. I’ve explained how it’s an attack on us and why were both insulted and pissed by this thread. You annoy me sometimes but I don’t doubt your intelligence or empathy; if I’m not clear in my thesis I’ll gladly reiterate it.

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

Just now, sblfilms said:

 

Can you provide an example of anybody in this thread 'shitting' on you two? I read back through it multiple times and continue to be completely confused as to why you two think any of the handful of responses made were an attack on you. Even after the OP explicitly said it wasn't! 

 

I honestly don't blame either of them for necessarily feeling a sense of exasperation or lack of sympathy for what they and their colleagues experience on a daily basis.  If anything, I would be surprised if they didn't feel that way and I'm OK with them taking that frustration out on the "safe space" of this board.

 

However, as I previously stated, I don't view it as binary situation at all and simply will not apologize or express any contrition for reacting the way that I did to the story.  

[TUFKAK]

3 minutes ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

 

I honestly don't blame either of them for necessarily feeling a sense of exasperation or lack of sympathy for what they and their colleagues experience on a daily basis.  If anything, I would be surprised if they didn't feel that way and I'm OK with them taking that frustration out on the "safe space" of this board.

 

However, as I previously stated, I don't view it as binary situation at all and simply will not apologize or express any contrition for reacting the way that I did to the story.  

Again, what is it you all are expecting of us? This keeps getting glossed over. 

[CastlevaniaNut18]

10 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

 

Can you provide an example of anybody in this thread 'shitting' on you two? I read back through it multiple times and continue to be completely confused as to why you two think any of the handful of responses made were an attack on you. Even after the OP explicitly said it wasn't! 

I’m typing in a hurry, but perhaps that wasn’t entirely the correct term. Just that the reactions in this thread reek of ignorance of the reality of healthcare and I get really bad vibes. My burnout is making it worse. 

[TUFKAK]

1 minute ago, CastlevaniaNut18 said:

I’m typing in a hurry, but perhaps that wasn’t entirely the correct term. Just that the reactions in this thread reek of ignorance of the reality of healthcare and I get really bad vibes. My burnout is making it worse. 

Shit dude this thread is why I applied to that ambulatory clinic and employee health job 😂

[b_m_b_m_b_m]

The general public in this country is so diseased (due to poverty, addiction, stress, political/environmental/social factors, other reasons and some combination thereof) that anyone who has to deal with it on the daily has my utmost sympathy. They shouldn’t have to bear the brunt of society’s failure to care for our own but that’s what collectively has been decided, and once these skilled people leave there’s a long and painful road to getting things back on track if it even can be. 

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

12 minutes ago, TUFKAK said:

Again, what is it you all are expecting of us? This keeps getting glossed over. 

 

I honestly have no answer to that question.

[TUFKAK]

1 minute ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

 

I honestly have no answer to that question.

Mother fucker!

 

i was working up a good mad and you just ruined it 😂

[Keyser_Soze]

I don't think this thread was made to come up with solutions just to show the status quo.

[Anathema-]

On 12/11/2022 at 12:22 PM, Derek said:

I can't even imagine, especially a patient going through withdrawals or something. I remember the last time I visited a family member in the hospital, all through the night, would be sporadic screaming and crying. It got to a point where I asked the nurse if she could move the problem patients to another floor or give them some sort of sedative. She said that, under the circumstances, it wouldn't be safe to do so. My heart was truly with all of those care workers that had to deal with that on a daily/nightly basis. I was so happy when we finally got to take my son home from the NICU. 

 

[Anathema-]

11 hours ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

This is far from being a purely binary situation (the well-being of healthcare workers vs the well-being of vulnerable populations) and represents the overall failure of society on every possible economic, moral, social, and political level.

 

But I will stand by my initial "gut" reaction.

 

Keep in mind that sticking with your initial gut reaction is how people wind up voting Republican.

[Mr.Vic20]

News =/= reality. Life is so much more complex then a "clear" story. People are always up to things that are unfortunately not accurately reflected in most stories served up. My mom was a nurse and would regularly come home with absolute horror stories.  Now mind you, I neither trust nor have a great love for my mother, but she was, according to the visiting cop one childhood night, assaulted with a broom stick by a patient. Life is hard and we all want easy answers to difficult questions, many of which have plagued our species for as long as you care to define it as such. You can win an argument on the internet simple by having the numbers, but it doesn't make that argument reality and reality is a shit sundae of ever unfolding possibilities. 

[CastlevaniaNut18]

1 hour ago, Mr.Vic20 said:

News =/= reality. Life is so much more complex then a "clear" story. People are always up to things that are unfortunately not accurately reflected in most stories served up. My mom was a nurse and would regularly come home with absolute horror stories.  Now mind you, I neither trust nor have a great love for my mother, but she was, according to the visiting cop one childhood night, assaulted with a broom stick by a patient. Life is hard and we all want easy answers to difficult questions, many of which have plagued our species for as long as you care to define it as such. You can win an argument on the internet simple by having the numbers, but it doesn't make that argument reality and reality is a shit sundae of ever unfolding possibilities. 

Your mom may be a piece of shit, but I have no doubt her horror stories are true. I could write a book. 
 

Don’t get me wrong, my career has certainly has had its rewarding moments over the years. I still feel like I’m doing some real good even now. But so often it feels like a losing battle. Like I’m drowning. And I’m not the outlier in this field. Even when I want to do my best and have great patients, it’s still so freaking hard because we are so understaffed and our cries to administration fall on deaf ears. 

[TUFKAK]

16 minutes ago, CastlevaniaNut18 said:

Your mom may be a piece of shit, but I have no doubt her horror stories are true. I could write a book. 
 

Don’t get me wrong, my career has certainly has had its rewarding moments over the years. I still feel like I’m doing some real good even now. But so often it feels like a losing battle. Like I’m drowning. And I’m not the outlier in this field. Even when I want to do my best and have great patients, it’s still so freaking hard because we are so understaffed and our cries to administration fall on deaf ears. 

The c-suite has to get their quarterly bonuses! Think of the important things.

[Guest]

In a completely not-shocking turn of events, the woman who was sent packing suffers from severe mental health issues. Unfortunately our country tried to fix the horrors of mental health care 50 years ago by removing many mechanisms for families and communities to help the afflicted in addition

to the truly terrible ones. You know have to pretty well prove an imminent danger of life to commit somebody.

 

Thats why you end up with @TUFKAK and @CastlevaniaNut18taking care of people who may not have physical medical emergencies anymore, but are dealing with severe psychiatric issues. We also force police officers, who have absolutely zero business dealing with people in mental distress, often being the front line when these folks get unruly.

 

This sort of stuff really hits hard for me given my sister and her struggles with schizophrenia. She had recently been on the streets again after losing her apartment, stayed with us for about 3 weeks until she just got it in her head that our 15 year old son was some sort of sexual predator. Crazy stuff, screaming for God to kill him. Obviously couldn’t keep her in the house when she’s like that. We tried our best to get her to take her medication, we even tried to show the video of her outburst at our son to the county mental health facility as proof she was a danger. But they talked to her and she was fairly lucid and pleasant at the time, so their hands are tied.

 

I always hate the conservative talking point about mental health as a response to gun violence, but it is indeed true that we need to do something serious about mental health care laws. We need tools to force care on those who lack the capacity to get it themselves.

[unogueen]

Maybe commodifying health care in a country with many obvious 'consumer first' problems and have mutated into political fraternity isn't such a good idea.

[Kal-El814]

4 hours ago, sblfilms said:

This sort of stuff really hits hard for me given my sister and her struggles with schizophrenia. She had recently been on the streets again after losing her apartment, stayed with us for about 3 weeks until she just got it in her head that our 15 year old son was some sort of sexual predator. Crazy stuff, screaming for God to kill him. Obviously couldn’t keep her in the house when she’s like that. We tried our best to get her to take her medication, we even tried to show the video of her outburst at our son to the county mental health facility as proof she was a danger. But they talked to her and she was fairly lucid and pleasant at the time, so their hands are tied.

 

I always hate the conservative talking point about mental health as a response to gun violence, but it is indeed true that we need to do something serious about mental health care laws. We need tools to force care on those who lack the capacity to get it themselves.

 

I've got someone I'm close to who went through something similar with one of their relatives. Alcoholism driven dementia, regular check ins on this person where they'd be covered in their own waste, the cat's litter box would be overflowing, beers and cigarettes everywhere despite insistence they just cleaned, stuff like that. And whenever they went through the system they were just stable enough to not warrant institutionalization. That went on for something like seven years before they finally crossed some threshold to got reviewed by the "right" person.  And now that happened, relatives have come out of the woodwork concerned about their care despite literally no contact nor offers to help until they were institutionalized. These situations are just awful; I genuinely don't know how people manage.

[Keyser_Soze]

I was on the other side of this when I was working security. A lot of the homeless had some sort of mental issue. Heck one guy straight up said, "Call the paramedics or I'll lay down on the train tracks" - I let him use my phone to call his wife who said he needed some help.

Turns out the guy was a big shot skater back in the day, had some terminal disease or something. He came back again crying to me that he wanted to see his daughter graduate, but he couldn't because he would die before that day would come.

He wasn't the only homeless guy to tell me he was going to die soon either.

 

And on the flip side you had homeless people faking like they had heart attacks because it was cold out because they wanted the paramedics to take them to the hospital so they could be somewhere warm.

[unogueen]

10 hours ago, Keyser_Soze said:

I was on the other side of this when I was working security. A lot of the homeless had some sort of mental issue. Heck one guy straight up said, "Call the paramedics or I'll lay down on the train tracks" - I let him use my phone to call his wife who said he needed some help.

Turns out the guy was a big shot skater back in the day, had some terminal disease or something. He came back again crying to me that he wanted to see his daughter graduate, but he couldn't because he would die before that day would come.

He wasn't the only homeless guy to tell me he was going to die soon either.

 

And on the flip side you had homeless people faking like they had heart attacks because it was cold out because they wanted the paramedics to take them to the hospital so they could be somewhere warm.

I wouldn't say the flip side. I've spent a few canadian winters in exposure, and life is HARD without a fridge and roof. All this just misses the point that there is very little preventative action to belay such conditions. And that vulnerability is as profitable as success.

[TUFKAK]

This new information is what I expected and doesn’t change my response. The majority of assaults are perpetrated by three demographics in my experience, (I don’t have the numbers off the top of my head so this is anecdotal but has been my experience from Baltimore to SF): mental health patients, unhoused, intoxicated on various substances. Granted there’s an obvious interplay between these three but these are almost universally those who attack us.

 

The system fails these people but it’s not my job to be brutalized by them either due to it. My new approach is to just walk away from any violent situation. Someone on an involuntary hold goes to leave I don’t stop them. They attack someone I call PD and stop other nurses from intervening (which is our new policy.) They refuse to leave I let them stay in the bed. They yell at me, I turn around and leave. Etc Even if the patient is conserved I am doing nothing but giving the medications.

 

Your front lines workers are done being the catch all for societies failures.

[Remarkableriots]

When I was in the hospital, I could see and hear what they had to deal with both in the waiting room and when I was in my room, and it was horrible. I treated everybody very nice and didn't have one bad experience from the nurses. I even had one that said she was happy to see me before I was discharged because of how nice I was to her. They definitely deserved to be paid better, in my opinion. We're seeing burnout with elderly home caregivers.

[TUFKAK]

33 minutes ago, Remarkableriots said:

When I was in the hospital, I could see and hear what they had to deal with both in the waiting room and when I was in my room, and it was horrible. I treated everybody very nice and didn't have one bad experience from the nurses. I even had one that said she was happy to see me before I was discharged because of how nice I was to her. They definitely deserved to be paid better, in my opinion. We're seeing burnout with elderly home caregivers.

The whole system is about to collapse.

 

even if we keep showing up to work, we’re not going above and beyond like we did before. I see the collapse happening in real time and nobody is ready for it. If it’s this bad in a place where nurses are basically making 200k, I can’t imagine what it’s like on the other side of the country.

[emalider]

On 12/13/2022 at 4:36 PM, TUFKAK said:

We’ve never mattered dude.

That hits too close to home.

 

Finally had to leave the clinical setting - loved the ICU and management was quite the experience (in a great way, outside of COVID), but the last three years of COVID took its toll. Sunday night panic attacks, daily 0500 calls for staffing, patient/visitor threats of violence, constant worrying about staff safety, all of it, just....oof. Recently had a false alarm on an active shooter, double oof.

 

Much respect to you and cnut. Be safe 🙏