Shooting at Jacksonville leaves 4 dead, 11 injured

[Keyser_Soze]

So the guy has been hospitalized twice for mental illness, on antidepressants and bought the gun this month.

 

 

[Greatoneshere]

16 hours ago, mclumber1 said:

 

skill said:

 

If we're saying that even people who can't manage their expenses are mentally ill, what does that say about someone who murders scores of people? 

 

 

Just to address this - you are creating a false equivalency here. 

 

A person can be mentally ill - an indication of which is an inability to manage their finances.

 

Many people who murder scores of people can manage their finances. Thus, at least in that respect, they are showing no indication of mental illness. You seem to think, inherently for some weird reason, that killing people inherently means mental illness. It does not at all. But not being able to manage your finances is a clear sign of mental illness (or something), which is different and unrelated since many killers can manage their finances. Is their overlap? I'm sure some, but not noteworthy.

 

Many people who have killed a person (or more) can manage their finances well enough and have no (or minor) mental health issues. Why is that such an unbelievable proposition? If someone doesn't meet the medical or legal definitions of mental illness/insanity, then they aren't mentally ill and thus, are just bad people with little moral compass, etc. 

 

15 hours ago, mclumber1 said:

 

Most of Latin America (Western countries, AFAIK) have harsh drug laws, have rampant gang activity, and definitely have impoverished areas, have gun violence exceeding that of America.  And they all have very strict gun control.  

 

Latin America are not "westernized" or "industrialized" or "first world" countries, which is what @sblfilms meant. If you have to cite Latin American countries as an example of a "western" nation that has higher gun violence than the US, then you missed the point of sblfilms' post.

 

He's saying that in actual westernized countries like Japan, South Korea, Australia, and western Europe, that all of those countries have social media, video games, drugs, mental illness, and more, in the same proportion as America does, on average.

 

Yet, our gun violence is astronomically higher than similarly situated countries as our own (so Latin American countries don't count). Why is that? Can't be because of all the aforementioned things, because those countries have those things too (mental illness, video games, etc.). So what could it be? The only clear difference on this issue between those countries and our own is the availability and prevalence of guns and the gun/violence culture associated with it. That's the logically biggest and clearest difference to explain the difference in gun violence between those countries and our own, no? Of course it is other things too, but this major factor cannot be denied, no?

 

So it's guns. Guns first.

 

Does everything else play a role, like mental illness, etc.? Of course. It's all worth talking about and considering. But the biggest factor - the prevalence and easy availability of guns, seems to be the only factor that the right doesn't want to talk about, which is strange, because it's the biggest factor to consider. No one on the left is saying ignore mental health illness or the acceptance of violence as part of American culture, art, and media, but why ignore the most important factor? You can't, especially given the disparity between our gun violence and other similarly situated countries.

 

If we're like Latin American countries, we should not even attempt to proclaim we're westernized, industrialized, or "first world" then. And if that's the case, all the more reason to fix this issue because it's clearly quite bad if we're being equated to Latin American countries in this respect.

[MarSolo]

2 hours ago, Keyser_Soze said:

So the guy has been hospitalized twice for mental illness, on antidepressants and bought the gun this month.

 

 

 

Hmmm, and didn't someone reverse Obama's policy of restricting gun purchases to mentally ill people?

[Guest]

1 minute ago, MarSolo said:

 

Hmmm, and didn't someone reverse Obama's policy of restricting gun purchases to mentally ill people?

 

No. 

 

www.vox.com/platform/amp/the-big-idea/2017/2/6/14522132/gun-control-parkland-disabilities-republicans-nra-obama-liberty

[MarSolo]

4 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

 

No. 

 

www.vox.com/platform/amp/the-big-idea/2017/2/6/14522132/gun-control-parkland-disabilities-republicans-nra-obama-liberty

 

Ah, good to know.

[marioandsonic]

Reddit account user "RavenChamps", who was linked to the shooter and criticized "Trumptards", reveals he is not the shooter

[Pikachu]

 

[CitizenVectron]

 

[mclumber1]

5 minutes ago, CitizenVectron said:

 

 

I told you all he was mentally ill.

 

But seriously...Maryland makes it incredibly difficult to buy a gun.  The fact that he slipped through the cracks and was able to buy a gun in that state points to issues with the laws that already exist, not the lack of laws. 

[Greatoneshere]

2 hours ago, mclumber1 said:

I told you all he was mentally ill.

 

I don't know about others, but I was never arguing that this guy wasn't mentally unstable or mentally ill. My argument was about shooters more broadly. 

[CastlevaniaNut18]

2 hours ago, mclumber1 said:

 

I told you all he was mentally ill.

 

That's not what the discussion was about and you know it.