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Update: Gov backs down from outlawing strike, but fails to negotiate...so new strike incoming || Ontario Conservative government overrides constitution, eliminates right to strike for education workers

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Captain Pickle

Captain Pickle

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1 hour ago, CitizenVectron said:

 

I guess it will come down to whether or not their testimony is believable (in that they actually were prepared to clean it up). Because the evidence from the ground indicates that police at all levels were unwilling to issue even parking tickets to the convoyists. 

 

"We could have cleaned it up."

"Okay, but why didn't you?"

"We didn't want to."

So what you’re saying is all they had to do was fire all the cops, hire all new cops, provide them with six months training and then have them clear out the protest?

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chakoo

chakoo

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2 hours ago, AbsolutSurgen said:

Trudeau has mostly been silent on Legault's use of the NWC, which is far more egregious.

 

I agree with you that Trudeau's silence on Legault use of the NWC is horrendous but no it is not more egregious than either provinces actual use of them in the first place. 

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AbsolutSurgen

AbsolutSurgen

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I recognize that the Supreme Court has ruled that back-to-work legislation violates freedom of expression and the right to assembly.  I am not a legal scholar, so I won't pretend to understand the legal arguments behind it.

 

When I read the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, as a lay person, I can clearly see how Legault violated the "freedom of conscience and religion".  Since, I can't read the text of the CR&A, as a layperson, and see how this Bill violates those rights, I have a hard time getting upset about it.  If someone can do that, I could see myself changing my opinion.

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CitizenVectron

CitizenVectron

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20 minutes ago, AbsolutSurgen said:

I recognize that the Supreme Court has ruled that back-to-work legislation violates freedom of expression and the right to assembly.  I am not a legal scholar, so I won't pretend to understand the legal arguments behind it.

 

When I read the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, as a lay person, I can clearly see how Legault violated the "freedom of conscience and religion".  Since, I can't read the text of the CR&A, as a layperson, and see how this Bill violates those rights, I have a hard time getting upset about it.  If someone can do that, I could see myself changing my opinion.

 

You also can't clearly see (in the text) how right to gay marriage exists, but it does—does that mean you wouldn't be upset if that right was somehow revoked, even if you yourself can't understand the legal text? Seems like a copout. 

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CitizenVectron

CitizenVectron

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Sounds like Ford is setting fines at $4,000 per day for any workers who refuse to work. That's 10% of their annual salary per day. $500,000 fine for the union.

 

In return, the union says that if the government wants to make striking illegal, then they are prepared to take labour action of the sort from before labour rights existed.

 

:sickos:

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  • CitizenVectron changed the title to Ontario Conservative government to override Canadian constitution, removing the right to strike. Education union vows to wildcat strike
CitizenVectron

CitizenVectron

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1 hour ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

 

It's a strike that's carried out without the authorization of the union's leadership

 

This one seems to have tacit approval, so not really a wildcat I guess.

 

1 hour ago, chakoo said:

Chicken shit ford couldn't be arsed to show up for the vote today that his government pushed through.

 

High chance this blows up in their face as it's now put into question other contract negotiations come up and in the works atm with larger unions.

 

Absolutely. If this union caves, then Ford knows he can pull this move on teachers and nurses. 

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CitizenVectron

CitizenVectron

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Andrew Coyne suggests the federal invoke the nuclear option and invoke Disallowance:

 

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Opinion: What Ottawa should say to the provinces: See your notwithstanding clause, raise you disallowance

WWW.THEGLOBEANDMAIL.COM
If the taboo on using the notwithstanding clause no longer applies, then neither should the taboo on disallowance

 

 

This is a power not used since 1943. In short, the 1867 constitutional (still in effect, merely enhanced by the 1984 constitution) gave the power of federal cabinet to disallow ANY provincial law within one year of its passing. Trudeau could simply invoke this power and overrule Ford.

 

Will he? Unlikely. But I hope he does.

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chakoo

chakoo

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It’s interesting to see Andrew Coyne suggest how the federal government could go nuclear on Ontario. Yet I don’t see that happening. I think in the end what will happen is ford will cave to pressure and try to song and dance that this was all not a big deal it was made out to be.

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AbsolutSurgen

AbsolutSurgen

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19 hours ago, CitizenVectron said:

 

You also can't clearly see (in the text) how right to gay marriage exists, but it does—does that mean you wouldn't be upset if that right was somehow revoked, even if you yourself can't understand the legal text? Seems like a copout. 

IMHO, it is pretty explicit:

"Every individual is equal before and under the law and has the right to the equal protection and equal benefit of the law without discrimination and, in particular, without discrimination based on race, national or ethnic origin, colour, religion, sex, age or mental or physical disability."

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CitizenVectron

CitizenVectron

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RKIVQLABVZIZDCPSWNV7TF3DAQ.JPG

Ontario files labour board application to stop job action as education workers begin strike

WWW.THEGLOBEANDMAIL.COM
Despite the province’s use of the notwithstanding clause, many schools are closed today as the union defies the government after contract talks collapse

 

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The Ontario government filed an application with the labour board to stop job action from a union of 55,000 education support workers who walked off the job on Friday to defy the passing of a bill that stripped them of their right to strike.

 

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Education workers represented by the Canadian Union of Public Employees are picketing at politicians' offices today, including hundreds who are outside the Education Minister's constituency office in Vaughan, Ont., along with a large protest planned for the legislature, where hundreds of people are already gathering on the lawn.

 

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On Thursday, Ontario used the Constitution's notwithstanding clause to strip an education workers union of its right to strike in an attempt to avoid disrupting classrooms. However, many schools were closed Friday, and more than a million students were at home, as the union defied the government and walked out.

 

Revive Dick Grayson GIF by HBO Max

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  • CitizenVectron changed the title to Ontario Conservative government overrides constitution, eliminates right to strike. 55,000 education workers walk off jobs in protest, risking fines and arrest
AbsolutSurgen

AbsolutSurgen

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When the government announced their intention to block CUPE's right to strike, their official position was raises of the following (all % based on present salaries)

2022: 11.7%

2023: 11.7%

2024: 11.7%

The Ontario government's proposal is unreasonable, but fuck any public sector union that is demanding a greater than 30% increase over 3 years.

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CitizenVectron

CitizenVectron

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29 minutes ago, AbsolutSurgen said:

When the government announced their intention to block CUPE's right to strike, their official position was raises of the following (all % based on present salaries)

2022: 11.7%

2023: 11.7%

2024: 11.7%

The Ontario government's proposal is unreasonable, but fuck any public sector union that is demanding a greater than 30% increase over 3 years.

 

FgkGoYkXEAYAKWY?format=jpg&name=large

 

Not that unreasonable.

 

However, you're wrong about CUPE's position. When the government rejected the 11.7-11.7-11.7 offer and threatened the NWC, CUPE countered this week with an amount less than half of that (specifics weren't disclosed by either party). So at most it would be 5.8-5.8-5.8, which is quite reasonable especially given current inflation and the historic under-funding of their contracts.

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CitizenVectron

CitizenVectron

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3 minutes ago, AbsolutSurgen said:

Average wage increases are 2.5%-3.0% this year, and that has been consistent through time.  The private sector has been below 2.0%.  2.5%-3.0% is reasonable.  5.8% is not.

 

FWIW, CUPE's counterproposal was not shared publicly.  Their official position at the announcement of their strike was 11.7% per year.

 

If you're getting less than 6% this year then you work for a bad company or organization. I am in the public sector and got 5.7% (though we are also getting salary reviews, so should bump another few %), and my wife (private sector) got 6.7%.

 

Obviously the 11.7% was for initial posturing and to bargain down. If you believe that was their line in the sand then you're not worth talking to.

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TUFKAK

TUFKAK

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5 hours ago, CitizenVectron said:

 

If you're getting less than 6% this year then you work for a bad company or organization. I am in the public sector and got 5.7% (though we are also getting salary reviews, so should bump another few %), and my wife (private sector) got 6.7%.

 

Obviously the 11.7% was for initial posturing and to bargain down. If you believe that was their line in the sand then you're not worth talking to.

We got an 8% raise and 5 the next two years. 
 

They should’ve asked for more.

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  • CitizenVectron changed the title to Update: Multi-sector strike planned for Nov 14 || Ontario Conservative government overrides constitution, eliminates right to strike for education workers, sets fines at $4k/day for workers

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