Brian Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brucoe Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 I'm starting to think that too many people have a video game mentality when it comes to actual war, and I don't just mean here. I mean the media as well. I'm watching and reading all sorts of "the Russians are failing because the war isn't going as well as they planned" TWO DAYS INTO THE BATTLE. Battles take time, and there are ebbs and flows that are quite often so unpredictable, but the reality of the situation is the results you achieve at the end of the battle. There are so many factors that have not yet come into play that will make a serious difference in how this plays out, yet we're not even touching on the Plans B, C, and D that have been drawn up long before the first bullet was fired. I'd love to see the Ukrainians wipe out the Russians during this conflict, but the Russians went in with the knowledge that their military suffers in serious areas that their generals have obviously thought long and hard about. Things like command and control, supply chains, morale, and even deterioration of their advanced weaponry has all been realized as struggles they would have to correct once in the field. If you look at history, even the US had some serious complications when we first fielded units into battle (both World War II where we jumped into battle with low tech and built up our tech as the war escalated AND the Gulf War where we jumped into battle with equipment that had no armor, practically building it onto our Humvee's during battle, using stuff we found in the field until actual supply lines could bolster our equipment with what it really needed). 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted February 26, 2022 Author Share Posted February 26, 2022 1 minute ago, silentbob said: In some ways, do you think Putin’s failure is an excuse for him to play with his bigger guns on actually people? Like, how close do you guys think he is too going with nukes? Russia's policy has been that they will use first-strike nuclear weapons if they are losing a war, defensively (so if NATO forces were entering Russian soil, Russia would use nukes to stop them). I can't imagine in any rational world that Russia would use nuclear weapons in Ukraine, no matter how bad their losses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 US would have collapsed by now 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jwheel86 Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted February 26, 2022 Author Share Posted February 26, 2022 A friend of mine has friends in the civil defense force in Ukraine. He said they've run out of assault rifles to give out in Kyiv, but expect more tomorrow. He said yesterday they gave out an additional 25,000. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted February 26, 2022 Author Share Posted February 26, 2022 Translated: 14 aircraft (13 attackers (SU-25 and other CAS) and 1 IL-76) 8 helicopters 102 tanks 536 armored cars and APCs 15 artillery pieces 1 Buk air defense system 3500 soldiers (dead, captured, wounded) EDIT - It's possible that these numbers were published by TASS from Anonymous hacking their systems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricofoley Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 4 minutes ago, ManUtdRedDevils said: US would have collapsed by now I mean, in large swathes of the country there's no public transport to actually shut down in the first place. There would be one Uber guy in each mid-sized city still taking rides, and Uber's social media intern would make a post about it like, "Never stop the grind 💪💪💪💪💪" 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 2 minutes ago, CitizenVectron said: Translated: 14 aircraft (13 attackers (SU-25 and other CAS) and 1 IL-76) 8 helicopters 102 tanks 536 armored cars and APCs 15 artillery pieces 1 Buk air defense system 3500 soldiers (dead, captured, wounded) All TASS did was copy that from the Ukrainian MoD last night - it's the same numbers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted February 26, 2022 Author Share Posted February 26, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted February 26, 2022 Author Share Posted February 26, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaladinSolo Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 17 minutes ago, brucoe said: I'm starting to think that too many people have a video game mentality when it comes to actual war, and I don't just mean here. I mean the media as well. I'm watching and reading all sorts of "the Russians are failing because the war isn't going as well as they planned" TWO DAYS INTO THE BATTLE. Battles take time, and there are ebbs and flows that are quite often so unpredictable, but the reality of the situation is the results you achieve at the end of the battle. There are so many factors that have not yet come into play that will make a serious difference in how this plays out, yet we're not even touching on the Plans B, C, and D that have been drawn up long before the first bullet was fired. I'd love to see the Ukrainians wipe out the Russians during this conflict, but the Russians went in with the knowledge that their military suffers in serious areas that their generals have obviously thought long and hard about. Things like command and control, supply chains, morale, and even deterioration of their advanced weaponry has all been realized as struggles they would have to correct once in the field. If you look at history, even the US had some serious complications when we first fielded units into battle (both World War II where we jumped into battle with low tech and built up our tech as the war escalated AND the Gulf War where we jumped into battle with equipment that had no armor, practically building it onto our Humvee's during battle, using stuff we found in the field until actual supply lines could bolster our equipment with what it really needed). Nah, Russia is fucking this up pretty badly, they're supply lines are getting destroyed, entire columns are just running out of fuel, and soldiers are getting hungry. That and they seem to just be driving around the countryside to get blown to hell. Theres no reason any of this should be happening to a "competent" military. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted February 26, 2022 Author Share Posted February 26, 2022 1 minute ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said: I've read analysis that most military forces during a push will require resupply at around 72 hours...and it's very, very hard to do that if you don't control the territory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted February 26, 2022 Author Share Posted February 26, 2022 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricofoley Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 It was less than a year ago, I think, that I realized that Kalningrad was a thing that existed, and it was just from randomly scrolling around on Google Maps. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted February 26, 2022 Author Share Posted February 26, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted February 26, 2022 Author Share Posted February 26, 2022 Real? Fake? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted February 26, 2022 Author Share Posted February 26, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 2 minutes ago, Ricofoley said: It was less than a year ago, I think, that I realized that Kalningrad was a thing that existed, and it was just from randomly scrolling around on Google Maps. You're the second person in as many days that I've seen come to that realization Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 2 minutes ago, CitizenVectron said: Real? Fake? The full context is that he wants to fight "Ukrainian neo-Nazis" not the "Ukrainian people" - so easentially parroting the Tsarist Pretender. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massdriver Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 How many tanks, aircraft, soldiers, etc. has Ukraine lost? I always see the Russian figures posted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 1 minute ago, Massdriver said: How many tanks, aircraft, soldiers, etc. has Ukraine lost? I always see the Russian figures posted. Oh, they're definitely not gonna tell the world that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris- Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 1 minute ago, Massdriver said: How many tanks, aircraft, soldiers, etc. has Ukraine lost? I always see the Russian figures posted. I would think UA doesn't want that information out there in any way, shape, or form. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted February 26, 2022 Author Share Posted February 26, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brucoe Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 3 minutes ago, Massdriver said: How many tanks, aircraft, soldiers, etc. has Ukraine lost? I always see the Russian figures posted. They have four tanks and two planes. They just get around A LOT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 4 minutes ago, Massdriver said: How many tanks, aircraft, soldiers, etc. has Ukraine lost? I always see the Russian figures posted. 2 minutes ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said: Oh, they're definitely not gonna tell the world that! 2 minutes ago, Chris- said: I would think UA doesn't want that information out there in any way, shape, or form. Just in... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted February 26, 2022 Author Share Posted February 26, 2022 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted February 26, 2022 Author Share Posted February 26, 2022 Though I don't think this will end with Ukraine in NATO, I do think it will end with Ukraine in the EU, assuming Ukraine survives. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted February 26, 2022 Author Share Posted February 26, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marioandsonic Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 How much of this early success should be credited to Ukraine? Or is this much more on Russia failing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 1 minute ago, CitizenVectron said: Well, yes... Syria Cuba Venezuela Nicaragua Central African Republic Myanmar etc. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenVectron Posted February 26, 2022 Author Share Posted February 26, 2022 Just now, marioandsonic said: How much of this early success should be credited to Ukraine? Or is this much more on Russia failing? Combination of both. Ukrainians have been incredibly resistant to invasion (both militarily and culturally), and Russia apparently did not understand that or plan for it. Additionally, Ukraine managed to keep their air force and air defenses partially intact (credit to Ukraine), and Russia has continued to send paratroopers and helicopters deep into Ukrainian territory despite this (bad decision by Russia). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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