General Gaming C2 over Samsung S95B OLED for gaming in a living room with sunlight right?

[stepee]

Ok so I’m tired of waiting and want an oled, the absolute latest Id get one is prob with my tax return in March at this point, but might just pick one up next month. Anyway, so I’m looking now.

 

I was surprised to see the top Rtings choice is the new Samsung quantum dot oled. As both top tv and top gaming tv. I get that the tech makes for great colors. But isn’t no Dolby Vision a big downside for starters (for tv/movies I mean I know gaming support is low)?

 

Anyway then I’m reading that there are raised blacks if there is any ambient light. I like the sun and don’t sit in complete darkness during the day and this will be my living room tv where my pc and ps5 are. I work from home and get off at 4, so even if I play after work out here it’s still bright here.

 

That seems like a huge issue to me, so I wonder if I’m missing something or if it sounds like a bigger deal than it is.
 

It seems to me C2 is the good safe choice. I just want proper blacks, the instant response for temporal resolution, and proper working 120hz gsync with no flickering. C2 should get me that. But then also they said to consider the Samsung qd-oled if you are in a bright room since it’s brighter so shows better. But so then what lol.

 

Are they just against not sitting in the dark or what?

 

 

[stepee]

I should note I think I might get a second 77” tv the following year (24) that will become my living room tv and then this will become my bedroom tv. BUT I still want this right for right now as my main priority.

 

Also considering the above, while I’m open to other suggestions, I’m going to hard limit this at $1800.

[DarkStar189]

I had a plasma in a decently bright room for years and never had a complaint. Unless it's like a sunroom or the room has skylights I think either oled would be manageable in a bright room.

[SimpleG]

4 hours ago, stepee said:

But isn’t no Dolby Vision a big downside for starters (for tv/movies I mean I know gaming support is low)?

I moved from a DV TV to Samsung oled. The difference was minimal especially if your viewing streamed content versus a 4KUHD disk. 4k disk vs 4k disk you could see some difference but 99.9 percent of people wouldnt even notice. Mostly films were slightly brighter overall  when using DV but again unless you are doing a side by side you wouldnt notice. 

By biggest complaint about the TV is Samsungs absolute shit interface and its remote. 

[Spork3245]

I believe the QD is brighter actually, if you go for a G2 it’s close to a wash, however. BUT the IQ/accuracy of the Samsung QD-OLED is lacking compared to the C2 and especially the G2 last I checked. If you’re planning on going QD-OLED I’d go with Sony’s (has better accuracy and way better image processing compared to Samsung afaik)… or say f-it and get Sony’s new flagship mini-LED which beats the shit out of any OLED brightness and has nearly identical blacks and bloom/haloing in dark scenes, also there’s basically 0 concern of burn-in with mini-LED as QD wasn’t the savior people hoped it would be. It is apparently practically as prone as non-QD OLED to burn-in, which, admittedly has gotten much better in the past 3-4 years starting with the CX or C9 as they’ve improved the heatsink and general heat dissipation drastically. I babied the F out of my B7 and still wound up with some burn-in, I currently have a CX I got a great deal on, but my next TV is likely going to be a top-end mini-LED or, god willing, micro LED will finally be available. 

 

TL;DR - get a Sony QD-OLED (way out of budget for 65”), an LG G2 (just under $2k but will likely go on sale by the time you buy in March-ish), or go for the Sony X95K mini-LED (same as the G2) for a bright room.

[Spork3245]

@stepee

77" LG OLED77C2PUA C2 4K OLED TV + 4-Yr Accidental Warranty w/ Burn-in Coverage $2199 + free s/h

SLICKDEALS.NET

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[stepee]

3 hours ago, Spork3245 said:

I believe the QD is brighter actually, if you go for a G2 it’s close to a wash, however. BUT the IQ/accuracy of the Samsung QD-OLED is lacking compared to the C2 and especially the G2 last I checked. If you’re planning on going QD-OLED I’d go with Sony’s (has better accuracy and way better image processing compared to Samsung afaik)… or say f-it and get Sony’s new flagship mini-LED which beats the shit out of any OLED brightness and has nearly identical blacks and bloom/haloing in dark scenes, also there’s basically 0 concern of burn-in with mini-LED as QD wasn’t the savior people hoped it would be. It is apparently practically as prone as non-QD OLED to burn-in, which, admittedly has gotten much better in the past 3-4 years starting with the CX or C9 as they’ve improved the heatsink and general heat dissipation drastically. I babied the F out of my B7 and still wound up with some burn-in, I currently have a CX I got a great deal on, but my next TV is likely going to be a top-end mini-LED or, god willing, micro LED will finally be available. 

 

TL;DR - get a Sony QD-OLED (way out of budget for 65”), an LG G2 (just under $2k but will likely go on sale by the time you buy in March-ish), or go for the Sony X95K mini-LED (same as the G2) for a bright room.

 

So, for keeping to budget, sounds like for keeping it the 1800 budget thing, sounds like C2 or if it gets cheap enough, G2. 

 

Honestly I was pretty set on C2 and I’m confident it will fit what I’m looking for, for right now (I’ll prob go Sony on the tv I plan to get in 24) and eventually be an amazing bedroom tv, but the rtings #1 ranking on that Samsung threw me.
 

 

[stepee]

13 hours ago, DarkStar189 said:

I had a plasma in a decently bright room for years and never had a complaint. Unless it's like a sunroom or the room has skylights I think either oled would be manageable in a bright room.

 

I should take a picture next time it’s sunny and see what people think maybe, it’s just the patio door I keep the blinds up and so the light from that is in the room the tv will be in but it’s not shining like right on the tv. 

 

I have a feeling it would be totally fine and that the concern is exaggerated too.

[Spork3245]

45 minutes ago, stepee said:

 

So, for keeping to budget, sounds like for keeping it the 1800 budget thing, sounds like C2 or if it gets cheap enough, G2. 

 

Honestly I was pretty set on C2 and I’m confident it will fit what I’m looking for, for right now (I’ll prob go Sony on the tv I plan to get in 24) and eventually be an amazing bedroom tv, but the rtings #1 ranking on that Samsung threw me.
 

 

 

I've seen the 65" G2 sub-$1800 (sub $1700 iirc) a couple times in the past few months. With SDR content the G2 is comically brighter than the C2 due to the superior heatsink allowing higher brightness. In a bright room with direct sunlight, you definitely want the brightest possible display.

[stepee]

1 minute ago, Spork3245 said:

 

I've seen the 65" G2 sub-$1800 (sub $1700 iirc) a couple times in the past few months. With SDR content the G2 is comically brighter than the C2 due to the superior heatsink allowing higher brightness.

 

Nice, I’ll have to start looking out!

[Joe]

I was recently helping my brother shop for a TV and was intrigued by the Samsung OLED. But no Dolby Vision to me is a HUGE dealbreaker. I honestly can’t believe they are doubling down on that shit.

[Brian]

I have a 3 year old so I will be getting a mini-led or whatever is the best non-OLED tv. I am still rocking my Sony W900A 55” 1080p tv at the moment but it’s starting to act up.  

[Spork3245]

19 minutes ago, Joe said:

I was recently helping my brother shop for a TV and was intrigued by the Samsung OLED. But no Dolby Vision to me is a HUGE dealbreaker. I honestly can’t believe they are doubling down on that shit.

Sony’s QD OLED uses the same panel but offers dolby vision and better IQ + better image processing.

[stepee]

@Spork3245 slickdeals had the G2 for 1800 today. I should get it in about a week. whoops

[stepee]

If this thing flashes when using vrr like my current tv I’m going to jump off a cliff tho

[Spork3245]

16 minutes ago, stepee said:

@Spork3245 slickdeals had the G2 for 1800 today. I should get it in about a week. whoops

[stepee]

1 minute ago, Spork3245 said:

 

Thanks for the tip on the G2 though, it wasn’t even on my radar and wouldn’t have known to even look for it! It sounds like exactly what I’m looking for from reading reviews!

[Spork3245]

8 hours ago, stepee said:

 

Thanks for the tip on the G2 though, it wasn’t even on my radar and wouldn’t have known to even look for it! It sounds like exactly what I’m looking for from reading reviews!

If I was looking for a new OLED right now it would definitely be the G2. Sony’s QD-OLED might be a hair better/brighter if you have them side-by-side, but the large price difference isn’t worth the difference.
What TV are you upgrading from?

[best3444]

5 hours ago, Spork3245 said:

If I was looking for a new OLED right now it would definitely be the G2. Sony’s QD-OLED might be a hair better/brighter if you have them side-by-side, but the large price difference isn’t worth the difference.
What TV are you upgrading from?

 

A Sanyo 13" CRT television. He's in for a real eye opener with this new TV.

[stepee]

10 hours ago, Spork3245 said:

If I was looking for a new OLED right now it would definitely be the G2. Sony’s QD-OLED might be a hair better/brighter if you have them side-by-side, but the large price difference isn’t worth the difference.
What TV are you upgrading from?

 

Also reading comparisons the G2 has better input response for gaming as well as the Sony they said had issues with raised blacks (same with the Samsung so I guess a thing with the tech) when there is ambient light. It sounds like that tech overall is nice and a good option but it’s not that next leap we’ve been wanting, which I guess is still waiting for micro led to be mass produced. 

 

My current tv is a Visio PQ9-H1

 

Vizio P Series Quantum 2020 Review (P65Q9-H1, P75Q9-H1) - RTINGS.com

WWW.RTINGS.COM

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The Vizio P Series Quantum 2020 is an overall great 4k TV. Like its predecessor, the Vizio P Series Quantum 2019, it sports a VA panel that can display deep blac...

 

It’s okay. Ive been a bit disappointed though and I think they rated it too high. And that they probably rate the newer models too high too from what I’ve seen on forums/reddit of them having the same issues.

 

The panel can be pretty nice for an LED and super super bright which I do like. I think I’ll enjoy it in my room for tv and my XSX. It’ll be a nice improvement especially for colors and black levels over my current 2016 Sony 4k hdr that’s there.

 

But as my main gaming tv connect to my pc where I put in a lot of money to make things look top notch, it’s been disappointing. It’s very buggy for starters and switching between pc modes can make the screen get stuck to where I need to change inputs to unfreeze it. Switching between two hdmi2.1 sources doesn’t work great. The vrr works..kinda. I don’t quite understand it, sometimes it seems almost like it’s fine then other times it flickers like crazy at the bottom, and is useless pretty much at fps lower than 70 or so because it’s too much flicker. It also does this brightness ghosting thing that I don’t understand with vrr where in low light situations the screen with brighten when you move the camera it’s incredibly distracting in some situations. It also has a dirty screen effect sometimes that leads me to over calibrating to try to get the pq right.

 

But my bedroom tv doesn’t have vrr anyway and I won’t use that much on XSX but at least now I’ll have the option (I haven’t tried it with xsx either, maybe that works better?) and for tv and movies it’s mostly pretty darn good and I’ll have much much better hdr and now dolby vision in my room now. So all that aside I’m excited also just to get that in here!

 

But yeah so excited for the G2, turn on gsync, and have everything just work!

 

[Spork3245]

38 minutes ago, stepee said:

 

Also reading comparisons the G2 has better input response for gaming as well as the Sony they said had issues with raised blacks (same with the Samsung so I guess a thing with the tech) when there is ambient light. It sounds like that tech overall is nice and a good option but it’s not that next leap we’ve been wanting, which I guess is still waiting for micro led to be mass produced. 

 

My current tv is a Visio PQ9-H1

 

Vizio P Series Quantum 2020 Review (P65Q9-H1, P75Q9-H1) - RTINGS.com

WWW.RTINGS.COM

---

The Vizio P Series Quantum 2020 is an overall great 4k TV. Like its predecessor, the Vizio P Series Quantum 2019, it sports a VA panel that can display deep blac...

 

It’s okay. Ive been a bit disappointed though and I think they rated it too high. And that they probably rate the newer models too high too from what I’ve seen on forums/reddit of them having the same issues.

 

The panel can be pretty nice for an LED and super super bright which I do like. I think I’ll enjoy it in my room for tv and my XSX. It’ll be a nice improvement especially for colors and black levels over my current 2016 Sony 4k hdr that’s there.

 

But as my main gaming tv connect to my pc where I put in a lot of money to make things look top notch, it’s been disappointing. It’s very buggy for starters and switching between pc modes can make the screen get stuck to where I need to change inputs to unfreeze it. Switching between two hdmi2.1 sources doesn’t work great. The vrr works..kinda. I don’t quite understand it, sometimes it seems almost like it’s fine then other times it flickers like crazy at the bottom, and is useless pretty much at fps lower than 70 or so because it’s too much flicker. It also does this brightness ghosting thing that I don’t understand with vrr where in low light situations the screen with brighten when you move the camera it’s incredibly distracting in some situations. It also has a dirty screen effect sometimes that leads me to over calibrating to try to get the pq right.

 

But my bedroom tv doesn’t have vrr anyway and I won’t use that much on XSX but at least now I’ll have the option (I haven’t tried it with xsx either, maybe that works better?) and for tv and movies it’s mostly pretty darn good and I’ll have much much better hdr and now dolby vision in my room now. So all that aside I’m excited also just to get that in here!

 

But yeah so excited for the G2, turn on gsync, and have everything just work!

 

Let me know how the brightness compares to your current LED panel please

[stepee]

8 minutes ago, Spork3245 said:

Let me know how the brightness compares to your current LED panel please

 

Will do! I’m guessing that will still be a bit of a bit of a notch down, but I notice sometimes oled can appear brighter due to more vivid colors so will be interesting!

[stepee]

I actually haven’t seen this tv, but didn’t mind buying sight unseen since I don’t really need to see “C2 but brighter” to know it’s what I want. I wish it wasn’t raining, and well, nye, so I could talk someone to go with me to Best Buy to look at it! I have no idea what we are actually talking about in terms of how much brighter they made it.

 

Oh and also super pumped that I got a taker for my old Sony (which is a rare 65” 4k hdr AND 3D tv!) so I don’t have to worry about getting that out of here since they will take it. I’m obviously not helping to move a 65” tv down the stairs anymore at any point in my life now.

[Spawn_of_Apathy]

If you’re not dead set that it has to be an OLED, I’m going to throw up a recommendation. The LG QNED Mini-LED. It is absolutely gorgeous looks good in a sunlit room and is even less prone to burn in because it’s LED, and has a good game mode with very low latency. 
 

I have the 65QNED90. I came up from an LG OLED A8 and it felt like an upgrade in every way. 
 

also, it is cheaper per inch than an OLED. 

[Guest]

Every recommendation for something that is finally better than an OLED always has something that nags at me as inferior once I see it myself. 

[stepee]

20 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

Every recommendation for something that is finally better than an OLED always has something that nags at me as inferior once I see it myself. 

 

I kinda feel this and this time yeah just really wanted to get the actual thing I always want.

[Spawn_of_Apathy]

55 minutes ago, stepee said:

 

I kinda feel this and this time yeah just really wanted to get the actual thing I always want.

Im sure you’ll be in love once you get it all set up. Congrats. 

[stepee]

So it’s showing arriving early, Thursday, now.

 

The bad news is LG literally just announced the G3 which is apparently even brighter by 70%! But whatever, then I’d be waiting a year for that to get to the price I would buy it at and the cycle would continue!
 

Ill just take that as promising news for super bright oled on the next tv.

 

Supppper pumped for this.

[best3444]

8 minutes ago, stepee said:

So it’s showing arriving early, Thursday, now.

 

The bad news is LG literally just announced the G3 which is apparently even brighter by 70%! But whatever, then I’d be waiting a year for that to get to the price I would buy it at and the cycle would continue!
 

Ill just take that as promising news for super bright oled on the next tv.

 

Supppper pumped for this.

 

You are completely and utterly set for anything next-gen throws at you. You have top of the line everything you son of a bitch! 

[stepee]

25 minutes ago, best3444 said:

 

You are completely and utterly set for anything next-gen throws at you. You have top of the line everything you son of a bitch! 

 

Mmm, my cpu might need an upgrade when the 7800x3D comes out, I don’t care what spork says!

 

 

[Spork3245]

2 minutes ago, stepee said:

 

Mmm, my cpu might need an upgrade when the 7800x3D comes out, I don’t care what spork says!

 

 

7900x3D or bust

[stepee]

37 minutes ago, Spork3245 said:

7900x3D or bust

 

When I upgrade it’ll be whatever is best at the time, I thought there was something to the 7800x3d that makes it actually better for gaming though, maybe @cusideabelincoln has an idea, something with the die or bandwidth?

[cusideabelincoln]

53 minutes ago, stepee said:

 

When I upgrade it’ll be whatever is best at the time, I thought there was something to the 7800x3d that makes it actually better for gaming though, maybe @cusideabelincoln has an idea, something with the die or bandwidth?

 

It can be situational, and vary game to game, but a 7800x3D could potentially avoid the CCD-to-CCD latency penalty because it only has one CCD while the 79xx chips have two CCDs. So if thread is bouncing around the CPU cores, and happens to go from a core on one CCD to a core on another CCD, then that takes longer to do than if the thread bounced to a different core on the same CCD. This happens because the information for that thread has to travel over the infinity fabric of the CPU, which is how the chiplets communicate to each other.  The Infinity fabric bandwidth is simply slower than the cache within a chiplet, and since gaming is one of the more bandwidth- and latency-intensive uses for the CPU there can be a performance drop.

 

Good software programming, or BIOS updates, could help this issue though. And I haven't done much research into this since the launch of the 7000 series CPUs, however I noticed a handful of reviews showing the 7800X matching or slightly besting the 7900 in some, but not all, of their respective gaming tests. I also noticed this CCD->CCD issue with older chips in these same reviews, where a Ryzen 3700x was matching or slightly beating a 3950x even though there's a pretty big clockspeed difference and the 3950x should never lose to the 3700x, and strangely enough when these CPUs launched it never did. So possible changes over the last few years could be game engines, or Windows scheduling differences, or AMD microcode tweaks.

 

Since it's very unlikely that games are going to be heavily using more than 8 cores for the foreseeable future, the extra cores from the 79xx chips don't add any benefit to make up the latency penalty.

 

Now with all of that said, the differences I saw were about 5% or less, and these differences can also be determined by the quality of silicon you get or can be overcome by properly cooling and tweaking the 79xx CPUs. It's also possible AMD improves the Infinity fabric for the X3D chips, or it's just a non-issue because the inclusion of the large X3D cache means there's less data traveling over the Infinity Fabric to begin with.  We just have to wait for reviews  

 

edit: You have Intel now, right? It would definitely be interesting to see how the Intel 13900k paired with ultra fast DDR5 memory stacks up to the X3D chips.  AMD's memory wall is DDR5-6200, max overclock. Intel can go way beyond that.

[stepee]

37 minutes ago, cusideabelincoln said:

 

It can be situational, and vary game to game, but a 7800x3D could potentially avoid the CCD-to-CCD latency penalty because it only has one CCD while the 79xx chips have two CCDs. So if thread is bouncing around the CPU cores, and happens to go from a core on one CCD to a core on another CCD, then that takes longer to do than if the thread bounced to a different core on the same CCD. This happens because the information for that thread has to travel over the infinity fabric of the CPU, which is how the chiplets communicate to each other.  The Infinity fabric bandwidth is simply slower than the cache within a chiplet, and since gaming is one of the more bandwidth- and latency-intensive uses for the CPU there can be a performance drop.

 

Good software programming, or BIOS updates, could help this issue though. And I haven't done much research into this since the launch of the 7000 series CPUs, however I noticed a handful of reviews showing the 7800X matching or slightly besting the 7900 in some, but not all, of their respective gaming tests. I also noticed this CCD->CCD issue with older chips in these same reviews, where a Ryzen 3700x was matching or slightly beating a 3950x even though there's a pretty big clockspeed difference and the 3950x should never lose to the 3700x, and strangely enough when these CPUs launched it never did. So possible changes over the last few years could be game engines, or Windows scheduling differences, or AMD microcode tweaks.

 

Since it's very unlikely that games are going to be heavily using more than 8 cores for the foreseeable future, the extra cores from the 79xx chips don't add any benefit to make up the latency penalty.

 

Now with all of that said, the differences I saw were about 5% or less, and these differences can also be determined by the quality of silicon you get or can be overcome by properly cooling and tweaking the 79xx CPUs. It's also possible AMD improves the Infinity fabric for the X3D chips, or it's just a non-issue because the inclusion of the large X3D cache means there's less data traveling over the Infinity Fabric to begin with.  We just have to wait for reviews  

 

edit: You have Intel now, right? It would definitely be interesting to see how the Intel 13900k paired with ultra fast DDR5 memory stacks up to the X3D chips.  AMD's memory wall is DDR5-6200, max overclock. Intel can go way beyond that.

 

I have an i9 10850 but I don’t think I can use this motherboard for a new cpu anyway. I’ll definitely have to check out benchmarks when the time comes. I’m hoping it’s going to be a bit better than a 13900k, if it’s not, then maybe I wait for 14900k.

[Guest]

3 hours ago, stepee said:

The bad news is LG literally just announced the G3 which is apparently even brighter by 70%!

To make you feel better, the 70% increase is over standard OLED panels like the C2, not the G2. I think the upgrade is closer to 20% G3 over G2.