Anime Trigun Stampede - New 3D Anime from Studio Orange | Out Now!

[Ghost_MH]

1 hour ago, LazyPiranha said:

I’m up to episode five and I enjoy it so far, the art style has grown on me and I do think that they manage to make some really compelling imagery.  
 

I don’t really know how well the show works on its own as opposed to a companion piece to the original.  So much of what’s going on doesn’t feel like it stands as well on its own.  Most of the show doesn’t really make a ton of sense unless you already know these people, and the rushed pace comes off as trying to get to the new direction as quickly as possible because most people are already going to know the basic deal.  I get that, it wouldn’t make a ton of sense to spend five whole episodes before he even pulls his gun again, he’s no longer a mystery, but the show ejects that intrigue and replaces it with… nothing?  It’s fine for me as someone who understands the presumed past for Vash, but if you only ever watched this I don’t know if any of it lands.  

 

I'll poke my nephews. They're younger, hadn't seen the original series or read the manga. I know a few episodes in and they weren't really confused by anything going on.

 

This seems like a recurring criticism of the series, but I can't help but feel like this is based on our own expectations on where we believe things are going or when they take place versus items that have been revealed in full and what's still being kept a secret. This far into the 98 series and Vash not being a regular human had yet to be established, nor has Wolfwood's double agent role.

 

I can't help but point out that the 98 anime AND manga took place after the events at July. Vash's bounty was already at $$60b in the first episode of the 98 anime. In Trigun Stampede, his bounty is only $$6m. This series so far has taken place entirely prior to July. There is a very good chance this series/season will end on the July Incidence which Vash will be blamed for and will skyrocket his bounty by 10,000x.

[LazyPiranha]

3 hours ago, Ghost_MH said:

 

I'll poke my nephews. They're younger, hadn't seen the original series or read the manga. I know a few episodes in and they weren't really confused by anything going on.

 

This seems like a recurring criticism of the series, but I can't help but feel like this is based on our own expectations on where we believe things are going or when they take place versus items that have been revealed in full and what's still being kept a secret. This far into the 98 series and Vash not being a regular human had yet to be established, nor has Wolfwood's double agent role.

 

I can't help but point out that the 98 anime AND manga took place after the events at July. Vash's bounty was already at $$60b in the first episode of the 98 anime. In Trigun Stampede, his bounty is only $$6m. This series so far has taken place entirely prior to July. There is a very good chance this series/season will end on the July Incidence which Vash will be blamed for and will skyrocket his bounty by 10,000x.

 

I’m not saying the show is confusing because of the lack of context, I’m saying it feels shallow.  It took five episodes for us to find out Vash is a legit gunslinger and not a lucky clown, it took seventeen episodes to know that Vash was truly a plant and where his whole ethos comes from.  In stampede we know most of that from the first episode.  Meryl sticks around stubbornly because her job demands it and Vash can’t really stop her, Wolfwood worms his way into the group slowly and actually earns their trust and respect only then he is revealed to be in league with the villains and it’s tragic, etc.  Stampede fast forwards through all of that because it probably assumes most people already know it.  It’s borrowing pathos from its predecessor instead of earning it.  
 

Which is why I say that Stampede loses that richness and doesn’t replace it.  I don’t feel like the new series is giving me something to justify it other than it’s kind of fun to hang out with characters I liked.  Compare it to something like the Eva rebuilds which, love or hate them, meaningfully added to what came before and became crucial to the whole.  

[Ghost_MH]

6 minutes ago, LazyPiranha said:

I’m not saying the show is confusing because of the lack of context, I’m saying it feels shallow.  It took five episodes for us to find out Vash is a legit gunslinger and not a lucky clown, it took seventeen episodes to know that Vash was truly a plant and where his whole ethos comes from.  In stampede we know most of that from the first episode.  Meryl sticks around stubbornly because her job demands it and Vash can’t really stop her, Wolfwood worms his way into the group slowly and actually earns their trust and respect only then he is revealed to be in league with the villains and it’s tragic, etc.  Stampede fast forwards through all of that because it probably assumes most people already know it.  It’s borrowing pathos from its predecessor instead of earning it.  

 

Which is why I say that Stampede loses that richness and doesn’t replace it.  I don’t feel like the new series is giving me something to justify it other than it’s kind of fun to hang out with characters I liked.  Compare it to something like the Eva rebuilds which, love or hate them, meaningfully added to what came before and became crucial to the whole.  

 

That's just complaining about the source material then, because this series is hewing closer to the manga character arcs than the 98 anime did.

 

I think the reason you feel it's shallow is because you're used to the 98 anime beats and where it created depth.

 

Here's a simple example. We know Vash is different in Stampede, but we still don't know how he's different. You feel the reveal of his heritage has already been spoiled, but that's really only because you already knew his heritage. Going in blind, the third episode has Knives tell us Vash is special but now l not why. Then in the fifth episode we're given the first hint that Vash might be different from a normal human due to his unchanging picture. However, that reveal gets muddied when Wolfwood's background gets further explored in episode six. Six episodes in and we know there's something different about Vash, but there's hasn't been anything concrete and certainly nothing to suggest he isn't human. Especially in a series this focused on human experimentation.

 

This series is a retelling of the Trigun manga with a couple of fun nods to the 98 anime since the 98 anime was a LOT of filler. Like, I've seen some people complain about Wolfwood not being Christian when that was an anime construct. Stampede, like the manga, has him as an unwilling part of that Eye of Michael cult we explored in more detail with episode five. Follow that with the deepdive into Wolfwood's past in episode six  and that's already WAY more than we ever got to learn about Wolfwood in the 98 anime...since none of this background had yet to be brought in by the time than anime was out.

 

I think maybe your expectations are being colored here.

[Kal-El814]

I remember the manga having a similar pace to Stampede; the characters generally get less attention than the action and the sheer amount of art compared to the '98 anime.

 

For me the issue is less that than it is that we've spent most of the time showing what Vash being himself costs the people that he fails and not enough time showing what he gets out of being the way he is and what it costs him personally. This is also more similar to the manga, but the '98 anime was just straight up better in this regard and hopefully Stampede gets around to some of that as well. 

 

That said it's still better so far than I'd expected it would be so I can't complain too much.

[Greatoneshere]

So I finally sat down and watched the 4 episodes out that are dubbed. It's good so far! I'm enjoying it. I just watched Beastars and Studio Orange absolutely nailed that show so I went in with high expectations. It's pretty clear that animating animals in 3D is a lot easier than humans, but they still did a pretty good job here. Vash, et. al. look good and stylized and though it doesn't have the heart or detail of the 1998 anime it's still really good. Binging 4 episodes at once I think helped because I don't really see the complaints others are making. This isn't going to be a 26 episode season, I'm assuming. They don't have 15 episodes to fill out character arcs and kill time. Using filler-ish episodes to make Gung-Ho Guns the background villains is a smart move when you know things gotta move faster with this adaptation.

 

I'm gonna agree with @Ghost_MH with regard to I think we're bringing a lot of memories from the 1998 anime to this adaptation. I agree this show kills some mysteries that the 98 anime took time with (plants, etc.) but it's introduced new ones (higher dimensions, gates, etc.) so a new viewer probably is going along just fine - they don't have the manga or 98 anime to bias them like it has us. I will say it's clear the show wants these characters to be younger and less experienced. Vash is less bipolar and less hardened here than he was in the 98 anime, where he's clearly older. Meryl is hardly recognizable, being a rookie when she was the leader in the 98 anime and Wolfwood is more energetic and less world weary here than he was in the 98 anime. Knives actually lives up to his name and introducing him early is nice since we barely got him in the 98 anime. The one aspect where this show fails is the music. It's good, but Tsuneo Imahori's soundtrack to the original is just too iconic. It's the reason we reflect so memorably on the 98 anime and this soundtrack just isn't nearly as weird or as interesting.

 

The dub is fantastic. Hearing Johnny Yong Bosch again as Vash is worth it all alone. They got similar voices to the old dub actors for the other roles so that worked out too. I look forward to watching more. I'm still bummed that this is some "repurposing" of Trigun rather than a straight adaptation but oh well, a lavish, well directed Studio Orange adaptation is something I will settle for. It's pretty clear, if nothing else, that Studio Orange's animators grew up with Trigun because you can tell they treat the fact they get to animate Trigun with reverence. Also complaints this anime is too dark don't ring true either - the first 4 episodes have plenty of goofiness and jokes and light hearted moments, I mean, they get eaten by a worm in episode 4 and basically treat it like it's nothing. So yeah, I'm gonna say the show strikes the right tonal balance. I'm excited to see them dig properly into Vash's difficult ideology of absolute pacifism.

[Ghost_MH]

Somehow they managed to pace a lore/flashback episode so well, the episode was over before I realized it.

[Greatoneshere]

The dub just dropped episodes 5 and 6 (the sub looks like it just recently released episode 8) and I'm impressed that they've already shown/introduced all 13 Gung-Ho Guns except 5 of them. I don't think they've used the term "Gung-Ho Gun" in the dub yet though. Episode 5 (Monev the Gale) and episode 6 (Nicholas the Punisher and Livio the Double Fang as well as showing the Bad Lads Gang) were both really good. Like the manga, this repurposed adaptation is moving faster than the original anime did. Still enjoying things so far, though not sure how I feel about drugs speeding up aging since that significantly changes the mental maturity of these characters for this adaptation but it's an interesting angle at least. Really liked the different animation style for the flashback.

[Kal-El814]

I’ve come to enjoy this more as it approaches the end, but I can’t help but think it would go from enjoyable to memorable if Vash was marginally interesting or even had agency. 

[Ghost_MH]

2 hours ago, Kal-El814 said:

I’ve come to enjoy this more as it approaches the end, but I can’t help but think it would go from enjoyable to memorable if Vash was marginally interesting or even had agency. 

 

This Vash doesn't have as much going on as 98 anime Vash, but he's also younger than he was in that series. He's also younger than he was in the manga. After yesterday's episode, it seems pretty clear that this series will end on the July Incident. If we get a second season, then we'll end up with a Vash that is in the same place as he was in the manga and 98 anime. A Vash that is a LOT more bipolar and a lot more hardened and weary. It's being set up pretty well too. If Knives is right and Vash is the way he is because he still blames himself for the crash from 150 years ago; how much is he going to blame himself for willingly walking into a trap that winds up killing everyone in July along with all the plants Knives has been gathering? In the 98 anime, I think it was said that most people survived. I don't remember that being the case in the manga. With the way this series is going, I have a feeling Vash is going to accidently kill a whole lot of people.

 

Also...

Spoiler

I knew Roberto was bound to die and give his derringer to Meryl. It just made all the sense in the world. I just wasn't expecting that to happen here and now. I really liked him too. I thought it would maybe be a last episode thing. Maybe even an escape from Vash going nuclear in July thing.

 

Either way, unlike in the 98 anime, I don't think Milly starts with Meryl right away and rather teams up with her later in the manga. If the news agency is looking to give Meryl a new partner, she could wind up with Milly in a second season. She could also get fired for getting her senior killed and find a new job as an insurance adjuster. Who knows. This being a sort of semi-prequel really leaves it fe4eling like there's a lot being set up for future seasons. I do hope we get them, because I've really enjoyed this series thus far.

 

[Greatoneshere]

The dub of episode 8 just dropped, the flashback episode, and I'm also enjoying the show more as it goes on. Two episodes behind you guys watching the sub though. It is true that this Vash is considerably younger, like @Ghost_MH said manga/1998 Vash is far more bipolar and hardened and weary which makes sense as he gets older and faces more shit on top of still reeling from the shit he's already dealt with.

[Ghost_MH]

This deep dive into Knives' motivations was great. If more people would give this series a chance, we'd see a KnivesDidNothingWrong subreddit or something.

[Kal-El814]

Yeah this was a pretty good one. There's what, one episode left? Two?

[Ghost_MH]

1 hour ago, Kal-El814 said:

Yeah this was a pretty good one. There's what, one episode left? Two?

 

Should be one episode left, so we'll get a full view of the July Incident and then maybe some clean up afterward. If we get a season 2, it should pretty much pick up, timeframe-wise, where the 98 anime and manga begin.

 

This is one anime that could really use a second cour that starts immediately after the first, because I don't know how you end the series on the July Incident and not have that just be depressing as fuck.

[Ghost_MH]

@Kal-El814 Last episode, but another season on the way. Let's see how many episodes they try to tell the story of Maximum in.

 

Damn that was a great season finale. It's exactly as I thought...

 

Spoiler

Vash got his spiky hair, his angel arm, July was destroyed, and now he's got a $$60b bounty on his head. Meryl is getting a new partner in Milly and, story-wise, we'll be heading into more Maximum territory. Also, hey, Vash has no recollection of July and is going by the name Eriks.

 

I'm guessing next season will be a lot of vengeful and deranged Legato along with contact from Earth.

 

[Greatoneshere]

I'm watching the dub, which just dropped episode 10. Without spoilers, is a season 2 (or cour 2) officially confirmed then? This show is definitely one that needs more episodes, at least 26 like the original 1998 anime, liking everything so far though.

[Ghost_MH]

45 minutes ago, Greatoneshere said:

I'm watching the dub, which just dropped episode 10. Without spoilers, is a season 2 (or cour 2) officially confirmed then? This show is definitely one that needs more episodes, at least 26 like the original 1998 anime, liking everything so far though.

 

Without spoilers...

 

 

Yes. All other announcements including a teaser trailer are all spoilerific.

[Greatoneshere]

1 hour ago, Ghost_MH said:

Without spoilers...

 

Yes. All other announcements including a teaser trailer are all spoilerific.

 

Nice, happy to hear that - has the show been doing well? I see a lot of stuff online, I imagine Vash is still pretty popular so I think it's been doing well.

[Ghost_MH]

2 hours ago, Greatoneshere said:

Nice, happy to hear that - has the show been doing well? I see a lot of stuff online, I imagine Vash is still pretty popular so I think it's been doing well.

 

It's hard to tell. The series has been very divisive. I think the finale absolutely nailed the landing, so we'll see how things go as word of mouth spreads.

 

As far as new series this season go, I do believe it's fallen behind stuff like Tomo-chan is a Girl, The Girl Next Door Spoils Me Rotten, and a few isekai with titles longer than I can remember, but that might just be a shift in demographics. I do think it's the best series of the season, and I was really close to handing that nod over to the ever so long titled The Magical Revolution of the Reincarnated Princess and the Genius Young Lady. Trigun just capped it off perfectly where as MagiRevo slipped trying to cram like half a novel into five minutes of animation thanks to not knowing if a couple of lesbians in bed might get them not renewed.

[Greatoneshere]

17 minutes ago, Ghost_MH said:

 

It's hard to tell. The series has been very divisive. I think the finale absolutely nailed the landing, so we'll see how things go as word of mouth spreads.

 

As far as new series this season go, I do believe it's fallen behind stuff like Tomo-chan is a Girl, The Girl Next Door Spoils Me Rotten, and a few isekai with titles longer than I can remember, but that might just be a shift in demographics. I do think it's the best series of the season, and I was really close to handing that nod over to the ever so long titled The Magical Revolution of the Reincarnated Princess and the Genius Young Lady. Trigun just capped it off perfectly where as MagiRevo slipped trying to cram like half a novel into five minutes of animation thanks to not knowing if a couple of lesbians in bed might get them not renewed.

 

It's really been building - the last two episodes go the way I think they could go, a second season is mandatory. Also isekai titles have really taken over haven't they?

[Ghost_MH]

1 hour ago, Greatoneshere said:

It's really been building - the last two episodes go the way I think they could go, a second season is mandatory. Also isekai titles have really taken over haven't they?

 

Thank the lowered barrier for self publishing.

 

Investing in a new anime is risky. Sure we just got Lycoris Recoil, but more anime than ever is being adapted from a previous hit. Now we've got more anime and even manga that are adaptations of web comics and light novels that are hosted and sold on sites like Amazon. One Punch Man is a based on the manga which is an adaptation of a web comic. We're getting more Horimiya. It's one of my all time favorite romcom manga and anime. The anime is based on the manga which is also based on a web comic, though the new season of anime will be based on the web comic.

 

Either way, with more of there, now if you want to stick out in the crowd you need a premise that sounds so crazy someone is willing to throw a couple of dollars at you just to check them out. That's how you get these crazy long titles.

 

This summer season we'll have the beautifully titled Reborn as a Vending Machine, I Now Wander the Dungeon. I have a good friend who swears the light novel is amazing and that I should give the anime a chance. He also tells me this season's Campfire Cooking in Another World with my Absurd Skill is great. His absurd skill? For some reason, he can still get online orders delivered to him even though he now lives in a magical world with no Internet or grocery stores.

 

What a world.

[Kal-El814]

15 hours ago, Ghost_MH said:

@Kal-El814 Last episode, but another season on the way. Let's see how many episodes they try to tell the story of Maximum in.

 

Damn that was a great season finale. It's exactly as I thought...

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Vash got his spiky hair, his angel arm, July was destroyed, and now he's got a $$60b bounty on his head. Meryl is getting a new partner in Milly and, story-wise, we'll be heading into more Maximum territory. Also, hey, Vash has no recollection of July and is going by the name Eriks.

 

I'm guessing next season will be a lot of vengeful and deranged Legato along with contact from Earth.

 

Been at PAX East all weekend, gonna watch this tonight or tomorrow. Looking forward to it.