Movies Star Wars will take a break after Episode IX

[Kal-El814]

Literally the whole point of the entire saga is emotional spectacle. It’s why the saber battles in the OT take a huge dump all over their equivalent in the PT even though the later are more visually impressive. 

 

I can’t believe we’re still having a “why didn’t a droid do it” conversation about Holdo’s sacrifice. It’s such a hollow possible contrivance to call out. 

[SaysWho?]

23 minutes ago, Kal-El814 said:

Literally the whole point of the entire saga is emotional spectacle. It’s why the saber battles in the OT take a huge dump all over their equivalent in the PT even though the later are more visually impressive. 

 

I can’t believe we’re still having a “why didn’t a droid do it” conversation about Holdo’s sacrifice. It’s such a hollow possible contrivance to call out. 

 

The one I'll always quibble with is anyone who thinks the one from A New Hope is good. How it resolved is great and memorable, but hell no was it a good piece of action on screen. Empire's, though, with Vader fighting one-handed and performing Force moves that Luke wasn't prepared to handle told a great story.

 

The Last Jedi's "battle" was also terrific in its story. The whole cinematography, the AT-AT shot, GAH, I love watching that.

[TwinIon]

16 minutes ago, Kal-El814 said:

I can’t believe we’re still having a “why didn’t a droid do it” conversation about Holdo’s sacrifice. It’s such a hollow possible contrivance to call out. 

Agreed. There are so many oddities in Star Wars when it comes to space battles and navigation that don't make a ton of sense. Droids are emotional, sentient beings, who possess the ability to calculate incredible probabilities using very limited data, are able to directly interface with spacecraft or (depending on the droid) use the controls built for humans, yet we very rarely see droids fly ships at all, even though it seems like they should be quite comfortable doing so. I could go on, but in general I think there are a lot of questions about what droids can do and what we see them doing in Star Wars.

 

Also, when it comes specifically to the Holdo maneuver, there are so many unanswered questions that it's pretty easy to assume that her sacrifice wasn't needless. We've never seen a hyperspace ship in Star Wars blow up another ship. Maybe droids have an Asimov-ian law of robotics keeping them from doing it, maybe there was something odd or difficult about this particular task, or maybe she just didn't trust a droid to save the remnants of the rebellion. There are a million possible in universe explanations that hold up just fine.

 

I've been personally critical about the Holdo maneuver and what it means in the geekiest possible terms. (The mass ratio of Holo's ship to the Supremacy is pretty close to mass ratio of an X-wing to an imperial class star destroyer, so...) Still, I don't have a problem with her personal sacrifice. 

[Kal-El814]

47 minutes ago, SaysWho? said:

 

The one I'll always quibble with is anyone who thinks the one from A New Hope is good. How it resolved is great and memorable, but hell no was it a good piece of action on screen. Empire's, though, with Vader fighting one-handed and performing Force moves that Luke wasn't prepared to handle told a great story.

 

The Last Jedi's "battle" was also terrific in its story. The whole cinematography, the AT-AT shot, GAH, I love watching that.

The one thing I’ll stan for about the duel in A New Hope is that it’s one of the only saber fights in the whole series where the participants actually behave as if they’re holding deadly weapons. The choreography is not great, but at least they behave like they really could slice one another apart instead of the flynning that dominates a lot of the OT and PT duels. 

[Brick]

Flynning? 

[Kal-El814]

13 hours ago, Brick said:

Flynning? 

Flynning. 

[Alpha1Cowboy]

21 hours ago, TwinIon said:

Agreed. There are so many oddities in Star Wars when it comes to space battles and navigation that don't make a ton of sense. Droids are emotional, sentient beings, who possess the ability to calculate incredible probabilities using very limited data, are able to directly interface with spacecraft or (depending on the droid) use the controls built for humans, yet we very rarely see droids fly ships at all, even though it seems like they should be quite comfortable doing so. I could go on, but in general I think there are a lot of questions about what droids can do and what we see them doing in Star Wars.

 

Also, when it comes specifically to the Holdo maneuver, there are so many unanswered questions that it's pretty easy to assume that her sacrifice wasn't needless. We've never seen a hyperspace ship in Star Wars blow up another ship. Maybe droids have an Asimov-ian law of robotics keeping them from doing it, maybe there was something odd or difficult about this particular task, or maybe she just didn't trust a droid to save the remnants of the rebellion. There are a million possible in universe explanations that hold up just fine.

 

I've been personally critical about the Holdo maneuver and what it means in the geekiest possible terms. (The mass ratio of Holo's ship to the Supremacy is pretty close to mass ratio of an X-wing to an imperial class star destroyer, so...) Still, I don't have a problem with her personal sacrifice. 

Rarely see droids flying ships.....What do you think R2 units are doing in those X-Wings..or the entire Droids in Episode 1 and 2.and 3..the entire  Trade Federation military was made up of droids.  ANd then there's L3-37in Han Solo A Star Wars Story and then there's this

 

 

 

I'd counter your phrase with the fact that the we have seen countless Droids piloting ships in Star Wars.

 

 

As for the Asimovian stuff....fine...even another living person could have done it.  

 

Game of Thrones Spoilers

 

Spoiler

Did you see GreyWorm at the front of the Unsullied sacraficing himself...no..because it's simple fact of warfare....military leadership leads from behind.  

 

 

Unlike Luke's...her sacrifice was indeed needless.  Just like in Chess...you don't sacrifice a queen when you don't need to or unless it's for the end game win.  There were other droids..and there were other humans/aliens that could have done it and should have done it. She wan't piloting the ship the entire movie so it's not like she's the only one capable of flying the ship. 

 

My response about this is not a criticism of the movie....it was a direct response to the assertion that JJ Abrams  uses fridge logic and Rian Johnson doesn't.  Both of them get away with it when needed for the sake of spectacle.

 

  

 

[Greatoneshere]

28 minutes ago, Alpha1Cowboy said:

Unlike Luke's...her sacrifice was indeed needless.  Just like in Chess...you don't sacrifice a queen when you don't need to or unless it's for the end game win.  There were other droids..and there were other humans/aliens that could have done it and should have done it. She wan't piloting the ship the entire movie so it's not like she's the only one capable of flying the ship. 

 

My response about this is not a criticism of the movie....it was a direct response to the assertion that JJ Abrams  uses fridge logic and Rian Johnson doesn't.  Both of them get away with it when needed for the sake of spectacle.

 

That's a false argument - I don't think anyone was saying TFA has fridge logic and TLJ doesn't, just that JJ Abrams' films are almost solely built entirely on fridge logic. There's a difference in proportion here. 

[Alpha1Cowboy]

4 minutes ago, Greatoneshere said:

 

That's a false argument - I don't think anyone was saying TFA has fridge logic and TLJ doesn't, just that JJ Abrams' films are almost solely built entirely on fridge logic. There's a difference in proportion here. 

 

I'll have to go back and reread the thread. I may be mistaken about that claim.

 

I don't dispute the fridge logoc claim in Abarms films.   I think the claim was equating TLJ to a masterpiece film like Memento when compared side by side and I'd say thats pretty hyperbolic as TLJ did indeed get away with some jarring fridge logic when you think about it.  That's not to say Rian Johnson uses it on other films as Abrams does....but in the Star Wars films both of them are just as guilty

[Greatoneshere]

28 minutes ago, Alpha1Cowboy said:

I'll have to go back and reread the thread. I may be mistaken about that claim.

 

I don't dispute the fridge logoc claim in Abarms films.   I think the claim was equating TLJ to a masterpiece film like Memento when compared side by side and I'd say thats pretty hyperbolic as TLJ did indeed get away with some jarring fridge logic when you think about it.  That's not to say Rian Johnson uses it on other films as Abrams does....but in the Star Wars films both of them are just as guilty

 

But they aren't equally as guilty - the fridge logic in TFA is worse than in TLJ, though both films certainly have fridge logic. Otherwise, I agree with you - TLJ isn't Schindler's List, but it probably has the best filmmaking and most depth of any Star Wars film, which makes it feel very different than other Star Wars films, which probably inspires that level of hyperbole.

[Brick]

2 hours ago, Kal-El814 said:

Flynning. 

 

I figured it had to do with Errol Flynn.