Microsoft Forza Motorsport - Information Thread, update: Digital Foundry PC version technical review

[Keyser_Soze]

8 minutes ago, Spawn_of_Apathy said:

I got a survey asking if I liked the idea of using facial scans or pictures of government IDs as age verification for Xbox games and services. 
 

I said no. 

 

Isn't that what the ESRB wants to do?

[UpvoteShittyTakesOnly]

I havent played a forza motorsport since 2 but fired this up since i have gamepass

 

put a couple of hours into it and find it pretty fun and i like how easy it is to adjust difficulty to my liking to create competitive races that i dont know off the bat that i will win

 

graphics on series x with performance rt are pretty good though maybe a bit underwhelming

 

i like the auto upgrade feature because im not into cars enough to care about the parts differences just make my vroom vroom better

[Spawn_of_Apathy]

Careful with auto upgrade. I’ve been seeing where if you do it you get stuck in this loop of applying the upgrades. After that it wipes your progress for that cup you were in, making you do all those races again. 

[UpvoteShittyTakesOnly]

1 hour ago, Spawn_of_Apathy said:

Careful with auto upgrade. I’ve been seeing where if you do it you get stuck in this loop of applying the upgrades. After that it wipes your progress for that cup you were in, making you do all those races again. 

interesting will have to keep an eye out

[AbsolutSurgen]

2 hours ago, Spawn_of_Apathy said:

Careful with auto upgrade. I’ve been seeing where if you do it you get stuck in this loop of applying the upgrades. After that it wipes your progress for that cup you were in, making you do all those races again. 

I have heard a small (but very vocal) group of Xbox players are suffering from loss of progress bugs. The area I had heard those people should avoid is changing tire compounds and fuel loads. 

[Spawn_of_Apathy]

25 minutes ago, AbsolutSurgen said:

I have heard a small (but very vocal) group of Xbox players are suffering from loss of progress bugs. The area I had heard those people should avoid is changing tire compounds and fuel loads. 

I heard the same is thing. 

[Keyser_Soze]

I've heard that this is the worst game ever and you should go play Forza 4 instead.

[XxEvil AshxX]

10 hours ago, Keyser_Soze said:

I've heard that this is the worst game ever and you should go play Forza 4 instead.

 

Forza 4 did have the best track list lol.

 

Honestly the biggest gripe i have with FM right now is that they probably chose the most boring set of tracks to launch with. When you're flagship featured track is Maple Valley you know you done fucked up.

[AbsolutSurgen]

Real Life Tracks > Fake tracks

Spa > Maple Valley

[Keyser_Soze]

Watkins Glen the best because America!

[Spawn_of_Apathy]

There’s still a lack of good real world tracks too. And VIR is just straight garbage. But the overall track list feels so tiny. 
 

fantasy tracks don’t even need a whole to team to go laser scan them again. Just update the assets. Or don’t like some of the stuff in the game. 

[AbsolutSurgen]

Doesn't Forza Motorsport have 20 tracks, compared to 27 in Forza 4?

 

We already know there are 3 more coming in updates (Yas Marina in November, another in December and a third in the Spring).

 

They want this to be a live service platform, so they can't release ALL the content at once.

[Spawn_of_Apathy]

One of the tracks that FM3&4 had was Camino Viejo, which the extreme version of the track was massive and made up of 4 individual and unique tracks, and also reverse variants. It would be like if you connected the Nordschleife and GP circuit of the Nurburgring and called it one track, but also let you race on each individually. 
 

so while FM only lists 27, it felt like much more in terms of variety. 
 

…there were also drifting, drag racing, and rally style tracks or variants of tracks. 

[XxEvil AshxX]

18 hours ago, AbsolutSurgen said:

Doesn't Forza Motorsport have 20 tracks, compared to 27 in Forza 4?

 

We already know there are 3 more coming in updates (Yas Marina in November, another in December and a third in the Spring).

 

They want this to be a live service platform, so they can't release ALL the content at once.

 

it's not the number of tracks, it's the variety. The ones they chose to launch FM with this time around all feel so samey. If you were to show me a screenshot of one of those tracks, I honestly probably couldn't tell you which one it was.

 

They're fine when they're dispersed amongst other more unique tracks, but when you're just going from one to another to another, it gets real boring real fast.

 

They've had so many visually excellent tracks in the past they could've thrown in there. Camino Viejo, the Burnese Alps, Fujimi Kaido, Prague, NY, Dubai, Rally de Positano... some of these might not be the most technical or complicated track layouts, but they were all visually impressive and would've really showcased the new tech. But instead they chose a bunch of bland golf course race tracks. That's what has me scratching my head.

[AbsolutSurgen]

Race tracks aren't known for being "visually interesting".

I want to race at Spa, Suzuka, Yas Marinas, Silverstone, etc. -- because those are tracks that have been designed to be raced on by real race cars, and IMHO it shows.

I find the racing experience on the fake tracks less interesting -- and frequently "gimmicky".

[Spawn_of_Apathy]

Not all real tracks are good and not all fantasy tracks are bad. I’ve enjoyed fantasy tracks since GT on the PlayStation 1. I’ve often found them to be highlights at times when every racing game has the same real life tracks. In some cases it can happen because of licensing issues, like Cote d’azure in GT3&4. Some while not trying to be an exact copy of a real life track do use famous corners or famous sections. 
 

If you’ve ever seen the F1 community discuss tracks you’d know that just because it exists in the real world that doesn’t mean it’s a good track for racing. Many tracks have been designed by Hermann Tilke, a profiling track designer that many have accused of just copy and pasting the same kind of corners since 1999. Yas Marina had to have parts of it redesigned for drivers to like it. Which it’s not uncommon for real life tracks to need redesign in parts to improve racing. Especially tracks designed for cars from 1950s. 

It’s great to race in game on the same famous tracks you can see real racing on the Tv or in person at a live event. But I don’t see fantasy tracks being inherently worse because nobody has built that exact track layout in the real world yet. 

[AbsolutSurgen]

Not all real tracks are amazing.  However, there is a reason the same tracks appear again and again in racing games.

 

Is it possible to make better tracks?  Potentially.  I haven't found Turn 10's fictional/fantasy/fake tracks are as enjoyable to race as Spa/Laguna Seca/etc.

[Spawn_of_Apathy]

So how is the Mazda Formula car a A699 not an eligible car for the OPEN Class Tour: A Class Series? It’s an A class car.
 

I really dislike how restrictive this game gets with only allowing certain cars to be eligible for a race, when there are many more that can be.  

[AbsolutSurgen]

Reminder:  People only have until the 15th to claim the reward car in the monthly cup.

[Spawn_of_Apathy]

On 11/10/2023 at 1:06 PM, AbsolutSurgen said:

Reminder:  People only have until the 15th to claim the reward car in the monthly cup.

I heard it’s supposed to be replaced with an Open Italian tour with a Ferrari 488 as the prize car. 

[AbsolutSurgen]

Just a moment...

SUPPORT.FORZAMOTORSPORT.NET

[Keyser_Soze]

You could change your car tuning mid race? That sounds funny.

[Spawn_of_Apathy]

42 minutes ago, Keyser_Soze said:

You could change your car tuning mid race? That sounds funny.

I get why they don’t allow it, but I wish I could adjust brake bias mid race. 

[Keyser_Soze]

8 minutes ago, Spawn_of_Apathy said:

I get why they don’t allow it, but I wish I could adjust brake bias mid race. 

 

I think it would be fair if you could adjust the tuning in the pit.

[Spawn_of_Apathy]

16 minutes ago, Keyser_Soze said:

 

I think it would be fair if you could adjust the tuning in the pit.

I wish we could it during practice. I may decide I need more horsepower than aero, or maybe I need to adjust the dif, the sway bars, or brake bias. Instead I need to back out of the event completely. 
 

for MP I can’t think of anyone pitting to adjust tuning, unless the race is pretty long where you can make up any lost time. 

[AbsolutSurgen]

People are reporting that the aerowash "bug" has been fixed.

 

The community had done testing that demonstrated that when you had a car drafting behind you, it reduced your grip and your ability to turn at speed.  The result was often a leader would run ahead, and the trailing pack couldn't catch him (because they are losing several seconds a lap due to aerowash).

 

==================

The whole point of practice is to tune your car, and dial it in then.

[Spawn_of_Apathy]

1 hour ago, AbsolutSurgen said:

People are reporting that the aerowash "bug" has been fixed.

 

The community had done testing that demonstrated that when you had a car drafting behind you, it reduced your grip and your ability to turn at speed.  The result was often a leader would run ahead, and the trailing pack couldn't catch him (because they are losing several seconds a lap due to aerowash).

 

==================

The whole point of practice is to tune your car, and dial it in then.

I heard of that, but it was only one video showing it off so I wasn’t sure if it was real or just confirmation bias and making mistakes under pressure. Interesting. 

[AbsolutSurgen]

22 minutes ago, Spawn_of_Apathy said:

I heard of that, but it was only one video showing it off so I wasn’t sure if it was real or just confirmation bias and making mistakes under pressure. Interesting. 

There are a lot of videos showing it, and the Reddit consensus seems to be that aerowash was a problem. Patch notes do talk about a fix that could be the fix too. 

[Spawn_of_Apathy]

6 minutes ago, AbsolutSurgen said:

There are a lot of videos showing it, and the Reddit consensus seems to be that aerowash was a problem. Patch notes do talk about a fix that could be the fix too. 

I wonder if it was an accident or intentional. The one video I saw implied they thought it was intentional since it meant close racing stayed close as it could make back and forth battles much easier. 

[AbsolutSurgen]

29 minutes ago, Spawn_of_Apathy said:

I wonder if it was an accident or intentional. The one video I saw implied they thought it was intentional since it meant close racing stayed close as it could make back and forth battles much easier. 

Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by  neglect, ignorance or incompetence.

[Spawn_of_Apathy]

2 hours ago, AbsolutSurgen said:

Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by  neglect, ignorance or incompetence.

really I could just be giving them too much credit to be smart enough to do it on purpose. lol

[SoberChef]

Didn't realize that you could tune mid-race, seems like that goes against a "sim racer", but I digress. I did enjoy snagging a new ride, that opening track practice, I could dial in the tires or even gearing dependant on the car, and that was genuinely helpful (alas the penalty per lap if/when you did tune mid lap), but it legit never entered my head as a potential thing to do in an actual race, as it would seem that that shouldn't even be a thing (I guess possibly an option would be to pit but even then ...)

[Spawn_of_Apathy]

5 hours ago, SoberChef said:

Didn't realize that you could tune mid-race, seems like that goes against a "sim racer", but I digress

Depends on what is being tuned and on what car. Real life racing wheels have buttons, switches, and dials to tune a whole variety of things mid race while on track. GT3, Formula, LMP cars, maybe more all have the ability to tune things during the race. I know F1 cars can even adjust engine settings. 
 

the fact you can’t tune anything in FM in real time on the track in a race in certain cars is actually unrealistic and not very “sim”. 
 

I assume FM doesn’t allow it at all because they make the game for a controller audience first a foremost. It’s not a hardcore racing sim. 

[AbsolutSurgen]

6 minutes ago, Spawn_of_Apathy said:

Depends on what is being tuned and on what car. Real life racing wheels have buttons, switches, and dials to tune a whole variety of things mid race while on track. GT3, Formula, LMP cars, maybe more all have the ability to tune things during the race. I know F1 cars can even adjust engine settings. 
 

the fact you can’t tune anything in FM in real time on the track in a race in certain cars is actually unrealistic and not very “sim”. 
 

I assume FM doesn’t allow it at all because they make the game for a controller audience first a foremost. It’s not a hardcore racing sim. 

There is an ongoing debate about whether iRacing is a good sim.  And that is leaps and bounds closer to the real thing than Forza.

 

I think the "sim" community call Forza Motorsport Simcade -- not quite sim not quite arcade.

 

The really good hardcore Forza players spend a lot of time dialing in their setup for each track/car combo they are playing in multiplayer.  It's amazing how much time can be unlocked with settings (camber, tire psi, etc.).

[Spawn_of_Apathy]

2 hours ago, AbsolutSurgen said:

The really good hardcore Forza players spend a lot of time dialing in their setup for each track/car combo they are playing in multiplayer.  It's amazing how much time can be unlocked with settings (camber, tire psi, etc.).

Indeed. I don’t get into it as much as some, but yeah. With some cars or on some tracks I need to add brake bias to have more stability in the turns to prevent the rear from slipping. But with enough grip and downforce I can then remove brake bias and get even more speed. Just a 4% change could see a 3-4 second a lap difference.