Football College Football 2021 - SEC vs The World

[b_m_b_m_b_m]

1 hour ago, Chris- said:

Hopefully MSU gets the Peach Bowl so Pitt can hang 45 on one of these allegedly great Big 10 teams. 

msu not great

[Chris-]

3 minutes ago, b_m_b_m_b_m said:

msu not great

 

A No True Scotsman fallacy, Big 10 intellect at work.

[b_m_b_m_b_m]

6 minutes ago, Chris- said:

 

A No True Scotsman fallacy, Big 10 intellect at work.

no great team is near last in pass defense of all fbs schools full stop 

[Keyser_Soze]

 

[b_m_b_m_b_m]

bama-uga 2 for the 'ship

[Biggie]

1 minute ago, b_m_b_m_b_m said:

bama-uga 2 for the 'ship

Bama living in their heads.

[b_m_b_m_b_m]

allah favors the wolverines

[b_m_b_m_b_m]

4 hours ago, Chris- said:

Hopefully MSU gets the Peach Bowl so Pitt can hang 45 on one of these allegedly great Big 10 teams. 

yall gonna hang 50 on them

[Chris-]

Narduzzi's defense is also predicated on stopping the run at all costs and just letting his DBs rack up PI calls, so there may not be a whole lot of points the other direction either.

[Brian]

A Big East Basketball team won the ACC? Wow 

[Brian]

Oklahoma finalizes deal with Brent Venables to be Sooners' head football coach, sources say

WWW.ESPN.COM

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Oklahoma has finalized a deal with Clemson defensive coordinator Brent Venables to be the Sooners' next head football coach, sources said.

 

[Guest]

What the major name schools can provide to students with the NIL rules is only going to make the divide between the rich and poor conferences worse. At some point they really need to move the group of 5 schools to their own division with their own playoff.

[Chris-]

Nothing about the divide between the rich and poor conferences is going to change; what is going to change is the divide within the conferences. Even in the P5, most schools don't have the financial backing to hang with the elite; Alabama, Clemson, LSU, Ohio State, et. al will always have the cash to remain in the conversation. Wake Forest? Vanderbilt? Northwestern? Even smaller state schools like Washington State and Kansas State? Not so much. That's all the more reason to expand the playoff and open up viable competition paths.

[Guest]

52 minutes ago, Chris- said:

Nothing about the divide between the rich and poor conferences is going to change; what is going to change is the divide within the conferences. Even in the P5, most schools don't have the financial backing to hang with the elite; Alabama, Clemson, LSU, Ohio State, et. al will always have the cash to remain in the conversation. Wake Forest? Vanderbilt? Northwestern? Even smaller state schools like Washington State and Kansas State? Not so much. That's all the more reason to expand the playoff and open up viable competition paths.

 

I think you misunderstand how NIL works if you're including Alabama, Clemson, and LSU in there  Wealthy alumni bases + strong corporate sponsors + desire to win at football is the recipe. And you don't really find that combination in the group of 5. You do find it in the power 5, but there are plenty of power 5 schools that do not care about fielding winning football teams or don't have to corps and alumni to make it work. Do you think Vandy cares at all? Naw, they just keep cashing those revenue sharing checks from the SEC TV deals and mosey along.

 

So there certainly is room for there to be more divide in the power 5 conference haves and have nots, but it completely destroys the ability of group of 5 teams to produce reasonably competitive teams.

[Chris-]

9 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

 

I think you misunderstand how NIL works if you're including Alabama, Clemson, and LSU in there  Wealthy alumni bases + desire to win at football is the recipe. And you don't really find that combination in the group of 5. You do find it in the power 5, but there are plenty of power 5 schools that do not care about fielding winning football teams. Do you think Vandy cares at all? Naw, they just keep cashing those revenue sharing checks from the SEC TV deals and mosey along.

 

What? Those schools absolutely have deep pocketed alumni/boosters, and a complete disregard for anything that isn't winning. They are the epitome of schools that will win NIL battles.

 

That said, I think the impact of NIL will be short-lived. It's fresh and exciting now, but eventually the results won't pan out...It doesn't matter how much UT earns its linemen in NIL money; UT is still going to find a way to be UT, only soon it will attempt to avoid that fate in the SEC (which is going to be incredible to watch). Once that happens the boosters behind the deals will get a little more selective with their checkbooks, and the 'market' will slow down a bit (remember: the players are still pretty exploited!)

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Chris- said:

 

What? Those schools absolutely have deep pocketed alumni/boosters, and a complete disregard for anything that isn't winning. They are the epitome of schools that will win NIL battles.

 

That said, I think the impact of NIL will be short-lived. It's fresh and exciting now, but eventually the results won't pan out...It doesn't matter how much UT earns its linemen in NIL money; UT is still going to find a way to be UT, only soon it will attempt to avoid that fate in the SEC (which is going to be incredible to watch). Once that happens the boosters behind the deals will get a little more selective with their checkbooks, and the 'market' will slow down a bit (remember: the players are still pretty exploited!)

Look at the 20 wealthiest schools in the US. Where you think they get that $$$? Both Texas and Texas A&M have endowments that are 10X+ that of Alabama and Clemson, and 20x of LSU.

 

While they can’t compete with the financial resources of the alumni and corporate sponsors of UT/TAMU, they provide something that G5 and wealthy but terrible football programs don’t: a better chance of being drafted into the NFL. And that is something worth skipping over the crazy NIL money that the wealthy schools can help their students get. The top of the top will get lots of NIL cash even at the poorer P5 schools, the real difference is that even bench warmers in burnt orange and maroon will begin to get substantial NIL revenue shares over the next few years. Kids that would be starters for G5 teams.

[Chris-]

8 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

Look at the 20 wealthiest schools in the US. Where you think they get that $$$? Both Texas and Texas A&M have endowments that are 10X+ that of Alabama and Clemson, and 20x of LSU.

 

While they can’t compete with the financial resources of the alumni and corporate sponsors of UT/TAMU, they provide something that G5 and wealthy but terrible football programs don’t: a better chance of being drafted into the NFL. And that is something worth skipping over the crazy NIL money that the wealthy schools can help their students get. The top of the top will get lots of NIL cash even at the poorer P5 schools, the real difference is that even bench warmers in burnt orange and maroon will begin to get substantial NIL revenue shares over the next few years. Kids that would be starters for G5 teams.

 

University endowments don't really have much to do with it (since most of that money is encumbered); it has to do with how much in donations each athletic department can generate. Last year, UT fans donated $33 million. Clemson? $76 million. Alabama? $106 million. LSU's athletic foundation brought in $65 million in 2019. UT is in a unique position because of the Longhorn Network and how much cash that brings in, but in an environment where everyone is getting the same conference payout, its fundraising that makes the difference. And if you think Alabama and LSU have that money on the books, think how much those boosters had off the books before NIL starting bringing it into daylight.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Chris- said:

 

University endowments don't really have much to do with it (since most of that money is encumbered); it has to do with how much in donations each athletic department can generate. Last year, UT fans donated $33 million. Clemson? $76 million. Alabama? $106 million. LSU's athletic foundation brought in $65 million in 2019. UT is in a unique position because of the Longhorn Network and how much cash that brings in, but in an environment where everyone is getting the same conference payout, its fundraising that makes the difference. And if you think Alabama and LSU have that money on the books, think how much those boosters had off the books before NIL starting bringing it into daylight.

 

Where do you think endowments come from? It is a good proxy for the wealth of those networks for each school.

 

And of course you don’t have as much direct cash to the athletics program. You know wealthy donors don’t just write checks without input from the administration on where to direct it. The Authenticator program doesn’t need it.

 

Also kinda wonky to pick years where some schools had outsized giving for specific one time athletic program needs!

[Chris-]

11 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

Where do you think endowments come from? It is a good proxy for the wealth of those networks for each school.

 

And of course you don’t have as much direct cash to the athletics program. You know wealthy donors don’t just write checks without input from the administration on where to direct it. The Authenticator program doesn’t need it.

 

Also kinda wonky to pick years where some schools had outsized giving for specific one time athletic program needs!

 

If that were the case then athletic budgets would have a positive correlation with endowments, but that is not the case (if it were then Northwestern and Duke would be powerhouses). In practice the donor pools for academics and athletics are quite different, especially at programs that capture substantial regional attention. And in this day and age there is almost always a 'one time' need, because the facility arms race necessitates it. 

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, Chris- said:

 

If that were the case then athletic budgets would have a positive correlation with endowments, but that is not the case (if it were then Northwestern and Duke would be powerhouses). In practice the donor pools for academics and athletics are quite different, especially at programs that capture substantial regional attention. And in this day and age there is almost always a 'one time' need, because the facility arms race necessitates it. 

If what were the case? That endowments are a good proxy for a school’s alumni and corporate wealth?

 

Or that wealthy donors take input from the administration on where to direct funds?

 

I genuinely don’t know what you are disagreeing with there 😂

 

Regarding facilities, they are typically on an average of 6-7 year cycles for major donation drives. You can see how they bounce up and down at any given school’s athletic department. Like Oklahoma State ends up with the largest single year donations to their athletic department once a decade or so when billionaire energy guy T Boone Pickens picks up the whole tab for a football stadium or something. But their average year is much smaller.

 

I guess in general I don’t know what you’re arguing, that some schools aren’t significantly more resourced in their alumni networks or that such things have no impact on the NIL money available to students?

[Chris-]

1 minute ago, sblfilms said:

If what were the case? That endowments are a good proxy for a school’s alumni and corporate wealth?

 

Or that wealthy donors take input from the administration on where to direct funds?

 

I genuinely don’t know what you are disagreeing with there 😂

 

Regarding facilities, they are typically on an average of 6-7 year cycles for major donation drives. You can see how they bounce up and down at any given school’s athletic department. Like Oklahoma State ends up with the largest single year donations to their athletic department once a decade or so when billionaire energy guy T Boone Pickens picks up the whole tab for a football stadium or something. But their average year is much smaller.

 

I guess in general I don’t know what you’re arguing, that some schools aren’t significantly more resourced in their alumni networks or that such things have no impact on the NIL money available to students?

 

I took your post to mean that Alabama, LSU, Clemson, etc. don't have have the 'recipe' behind them to compete in the NIL era; that is what I am disagreeing with. Those schools have more money to play with than most, and the size of their endowments is irrelevant because the donor pools aren't interchangeable (the type of person writing a $10k check to Alabama athletics is pretty different from the type of person donating $10k to the university endowment). Endowments are a good proxy for a school's wealth, but the school's wealth and the athletic department's wealth aren't always the same thing. 

[Chris-]

Like, it's not the engineering grad making a $20,000 gift to the scholarship fund who is going to cut an NIL deal with the back up ILB; it's the car dealership owner who didn't even go to the school dropping $10,000 on box seats every year.

[Guest]

13 minutes ago, Chris- said:

 

I took your post to mean that Alabama, LSU, Clemson, etc. don't have have the 'recipe' behind them to compete in the NIL era; that is what I am disagreeing with. Those schools have more money to play with than most, and the size of their endowments is irrelevant because the donor pools aren't interchangeable (the type of person writing a $10k check to Alabama athletics is pretty different from the type of person donating $10k to the university endowment). Endowments are a good proxy for a school's wealth, but the school's wealth and the athletic department's wealth aren't always the same thing. 

Sorry, to clarify: Schools in the P5 have three main things going for them that G5 schools.

One is they are wealthy of their own accord and without respect for their current athletic achievements (the Texas and TAMUs)

 

Two is they are a part of a conference that pays even if they don’t actually try to field a competitive product (Vandy, Kansas)

 

The third is success at winning at the highest level and putting players into the NFL draft (Bama, Clemson).

 

The financial resources of the alumni and corporate networks of the first category mean they can get players, even the bench warmers, ungodly sums of NIL dollars. That makes them a landing spot for player who previously may have went to a G5 school due to financial issues with moving across the country to play at a P5 school.

 

There really aren’t any schools in the P5 that want to be good but can’t due to lack of resources, the schools in the P5 that are almost always bad are that way because football doesn’t matter to them. There are G5 schools who actually try to field good teams every year who will have a harder time recruiting 4 star+ talent when those kids can get money that will help fix their parent’s financial situation.

[Chris-]

13 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

Sorry, to clarify: Schools in the P5 have three main things going for them that G5 schools.

One is they are wealthy of their own accord and without respect for their current athletic achievements (the Texas and TAMUs)

 

Two is they are a part of a conference that pays even if they don’t actually try to field a competitive product (Vandy, Kansas)

 

The third is success at winning at the highest level and putting players into the NFL draft (Bama, Clemson).

 

The financial resources of the alumni and corporate networks of the first category mean they can get players, even the bench warmers, ungodly sums of NIL dollars. That makes them a landing spot for player who previously may have went to a G5 school due to financial issues with moving across the country to play at a P5 school.

 

There really aren’t any schools in the P5 that want to be good but can’t due to lack of resources, the schools in the P5 that are almost always bad are that way because football doesn’t matter to them. There are G5 schools who actually try to field good teams every year who will have a harder time recruiting 4 star+ talent when those kids can get money that will help fix their parent’s financial situation.

That really just goes back to my original point that relatively speaking the gap between P5 and G5 isn’t going to change, and that the imbalance is really going to be seen in the P5 between the schools that are ‘all in’ and those that are just happy to be there. Alabama isn’t going to have well paid benchwarmers over Troy, it’s going to have well paid benchwarmers over Mississippi State. 

[Guest]

I don’t know why you are pitting those issues against each other as though they can’t both be true

[Chris-]

1 hour ago, sblfilms said:

I don’t know why you are pitting those issues against each other as though they can’t both be true

To a degree they are; Texas and Alabama can only have so many players. The Cal’s and NC State’s of the world might lose some of their best players to the blue chips, but those programs aren’t necessarily raiding G5 rosters at a high clip to replenish (because the money behind them isn’t so great to be that enticing). Pressure upward will be disproportionate in the P5. 

[b_m_b_m_b_m]

11 hours ago, Chris- said:

To a degree they are; Texas and Alabama can only have so many players. The Cal’s and NC State’s of the world might lose some of their best players to the blue chips, but those programs aren’t necessarily raiding G5 rosters at a high clip to replenish (because the money behind them isn’t so great to be that enticing). Pressure upward will be disproportionate in the P5. 

and even bama can only play so many players per game. if your want is to play yeah you can get 5 minutes in garbage time or maybe get rotated in earlier at bama/osu/clemson or you can start at miss st/indiana/uva and even 150k in NIL might not be sufficient 

[Keyser_Soze]

 

[Brian]

Imagine paying Rattler all that NIL money only to see him get benched and transfer out. 

[Keyser_Soze]

Jimmy Kimmel has his own bowl game now

 

 

SoFi Stadium

WWW.SOFISTADIUM.COM

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Jimmy Kimmel LA Bowl, coming December 18, 2021, will celebrate the tradition of great college football in Los Angeles through an extraordinary game-day experience that focuses on premium hospitality and highlights the diverse community of Los Angeles.

 

[Brian]

Pittsburgh did what we all expected them to do against a quality team

 

[Keyser_Soze]

On 12/5/2021 at 7:44 AM, Chris- said:

Hopefully MSU gets the Peach Bowl so Pitt can hang 45 on one of these allegedly great Big 10 teams. 

 

Looks like MSU got closer to 45 than Pitt 🤔

[Chris-]

They were on their third-string QB and still had a shot going into the last 30 seconds, the Big 10 is trash.

[b_m_b_m_b_m]

Imagine losing to msu

[b_m_b_m_b_m]

One thing we can all agree one: what the fuck is this shit???