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WandaVision OT - For the Children!


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8 minutes ago, Kal-El814 said:

I think people saying Wanda is the villain of the show are giving it way too much credit. This just isn’t how the MCU operates.

 

 

Civil War isn’t about the line between heroes and villains. It’s about how an actual villain (Zemo) can exploit the relationships and different perspectives between heroes. At no point is either team in that movie portrayed as villainous, which is part of why I think it’s one of the weaker movies in the MCU to rewatch. As an excuse to have characters we like punch one another, it’s awesome. Beyond that... eh? Again, Iron Man fights his friends who don’t sign the accords at the same time he’s arming a teenager with a multimillion dollar battle suit and NOT having Pete sign the accords. It’s a mess.

 

But the MCU isn’t going to let “the villain” of WandaVision get put through an emotional meat grinder, tenderly depart from her children and boyfriend, punish Agatha, get a pat on the back from Rambeau on the way out, then fly away. The MCU doesn’t work like that.

 

Yeah, the "heroes" in the MCU don't exactly have clean hands. That's kind of the entire point of a lot of this. I mean, they did unleash Ultron on everybody.

 

Either way, why doesn't the MCU work like that when that seems to be exactly what happened in Wandavision? Wanda doesn't need mini-redemption at the end via a pat on the back if she wasn't being villainous the entire series. Before the reveal of Agatha we were all told Wanda was enslaving an entire city. Then we think maybe it's Agatha, but nope, it's all Wanda. There is literally a mother begging Wanda to at least have mercy on her children and that she be willing to sacrifice her own freedom if it meant freeing her kids from Wanda's enslavement.

 

This also isn't anything new for the MCU. Loki was victorious after Thor 2 and was still chilling and drinking and partying come Ragnarok. I mean, Wanda entered the MCU as a villain. The MCU isn't exactly filled with truly evil villains. I wouldn't consider Killmonger evil. I wouldn't consider Vulture evil. I wouldn't consider Ghost evil. Fuck, Winter Soldier is obviously not evil. I mean, even Thanos got his chance to beg for pity points on screen for a few minutes. He even got to shed a tear. There's an entire subreddit dedicated to Thanos being right.

 

I don't see what's so shocking about Wanda being the villain and the series not ending in a clear black and white note with her.

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9 minutes ago, Ghost_MH said:

I don't see what's so shocking about Wanda being the villain and the series not ending in a clear black and white note with her.


I think it comes from how they did it. We didn’t see SWORD and FBI agents actively avoid Wanda. Like being conflicted with “they know they should arrest her, but they don’t want to piss her off and get hurt”. 
 

If Monica had added to her sentiment of “they’ll never know what you gave up” with “but this wasn’t ok Wanda. You need to come with us” and Wanda was like “no. That’s not happening” and then flew off. We would have gotten a sense that she isn’t being let off the hook, but maybe they’re just not willing or able to have that battle if she won’t go willingly.

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I think this interview sums it up.

 

wandavision-westview-hostage-torture.png
TVLINE.COM

"WandaVision" head writer Jac Schaeffer and director Matt Shakman discuss the perceived lack of justice for the tortured people of Westview.

 

Quote

“I remember a note from [Marvel Studios chief] Kevin [Feige] being like, ‘More, more, let’s feel that for her, let’s understand that what she did was terrible,'” Schaeffer adds.

 

To those who wished a happier ending for Westview, “No, that’s not the story we’re telling, that now [Wanda] is has to make everything OK,” Schaeffer says. “It wasn’t about landing her in a way where it’s like, ‘Everything’s wrapped up and squeaky clean, and she’s a hero and has done no wrong!’ She’s done a lot of wrong. And there will probably be reckonings down the line. No, I like how that’s in the gray area of misdeeds that she’s been involved in.”

 

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I thought that the leaving Wanda has a flawed protagonist a great choice and I think the audience at this point knows that there will be a reckoning at some point down the line. She was never "let off the hook" and she had already demonstrated that she was FAR too powerful for any of the Law Enforcement agencies to even ATTEMPT to take her in. Wanda is definitely a fugitive at this point and is probably viewed as a villain in the Marvel Cinematic Universe right now.

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1 hour ago, Ghost_MH said:

Yeah, the "heroes" in the MCU don't exactly have clean hands. That's kind of the entire point of a lot of this. I mean, they did unleash Ultron on everybody.

 

I think the MCU gives a lot of lip service to this, but never anything more than that. Heroes having flaws is what makes them interesting, and that’s where Wanda ended up.

 

1 hour ago, Ghost_MH said:

This also isn't anything new for the MCU. Loki was victorious after Thor 2 and was still chilling and drinking and partying come Ragnarok. I mean, Wanda entered the MCU as a villain. The MCU isn't exactly filled with truly evil villains. I wouldn't consider Killmonger evil. I wouldn't consider Vulture evil. I wouldn't consider Ghost evil. Fuck, Winter Soldier is obviously not evil. I mean, even Thanos got his chance to beg for pity points on screen for a few minutes. He even got to shed a tear. There's an entire subreddit dedicated to Thanos being right.

 

First, a subreddit dedicated to people being wrong is not compelling evidence of anything :p

 

Kidding aside, I’m not saying the MCU doesn’t have sympathetic villains, they’re generally pretty good at that. But the delineation between who the MCU thinks is a hero and who is a villain tends to be clear and I don’t think WandaVision is different in this regard. Loki is a good example of the exception to this rule, but I think that’s largely related to him being around the longest / not dying.

 

1 hour ago, Ghost_MH said:

I don't see what's so shocking about Wanda being the villain and the series not ending in a clear black and white note with her.

 

I just don’t think the show portrays Wanda as the villain at all. Conflicted hero? Sure. But Agatha and SWORD are the villains of the show. They end up “recast” and arrested / replaced by the FBI. Wanda just pays the hero price that someone like Cap, Spider-Man, Thor, etc. do. They did the right thing even though it cost them something, even if some of them did something selfish to begin with.

 

I think the MCU might be more interesting if they leaned into a potentially villainous Wanda, but that’s just not what happened here. Again the show LITERALLY said it was Agatha All Along, I don’t think they were subtle about this. :p

 

58 minutes ago, Ghost_MH said:

I think this interview sums it up.

 

wandavision-westview-hostage-torture.png
TVLINE.COM

"WandaVision" head writer Jac Schaeffer and director Matt Shakman discuss the perceived lack of justice for the tortured people of Westview.

 

 

 

If this was the intent I think they did a pretty lousy job of showing it. The ending didn’t come off like a walk of shame to me, and even if it did, again, Rambeau’s line certainly tries to justify Wanda’s actions.

 

14 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

I thought that the leaving Wanda has a flawed protagonist a great choice and I think the audience at this point knows that there will be a reckoning at some point down the line. She was never "let off the hook" and she had already demonstrated that she was FAR too powerful for any of the Law Enforcement agencies to even ATTEMPT to take her in. Wanda is definitely a fugitive at this point and is probably viewed as a villain in the Marvel Cinematic Universe right now.

 

She’s certainly a fugitive, and I would agree that the global powers that be probably think she’s a villain. But the viewer is supposed to think of her as a flawed protagonist, for sure, I’d agree with that.

 

And yeah, the FBI is clearly out of their wight class if they tried to detain her. But them not trying to or even saying anything to her at all makes it pretty clear that the show’s not trying to portray her as the villain.

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3 minutes ago, Kal-El814 said:

And yeah, the FBI is clearly out of their wight class if they tried to detain her. But them not trying to or even saying anything to her at all makes it pretty clear that the show’s not trying to portray her as the villain.

What would they say to her? The last time she was confronted by a bunch of armed men she turned their guns back on them. Froma story logic standpoint, just letting her leave after she undid what she did actually makes sense.

 

As far as what the viewer is supposed to take away from this... she's NOT a villain in the strictest sense. She's a flawed, tragic protagonist who did terrible things in grief  and then came out of that grief even worse than she was when she went in because she's lost EVEN MORE now. If she was a true "villain" the show ends with her keeping keeping the town in thrall untill someone FORCES her to stop it. She stopped herself when she fully realized what she had done.

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7 minutes ago, Kal-El814 said:

 

I think the MCU gives a lot of lip service to this, but never anything more than that. Heroes having flaws is what makes them interesting, and that’s where Wanda ended up.

 

 

First, a subreddit dedicated to people being wrong is not compelling evidence of anything :p

 

Kidding aside, I’m not saying the MCU doesn’t have sympathetic villains, they’re generally pretty good at that. But the delineation between who the MCU thinks is a hero and who is a villain tends to be clear and I don’t think WandaVision is different in this regard. Loki is a good example of the exception to this rule, but I think that’s largely related to him being around the longest / not dying.

 

 

I just don’t think the show portrays Wanda as the villain at all. Conflicted hero? Sure. But Agatha and SWORD are the villains of the show. They end up “recast” and arrested / replaced by the FBI. Wanda just pays the hero price that someone like Cap, Spider-Man, Thor, etc. do. They did the right thing even though it cost them something, even if some of them did something selfish to begin with.

 

I think the MCU might be more interesting if they leaned into a potentially villainous Wanda, but that’s just not what happened here. Again the show LITERALLY said it was Agatha All Along, I don’t think they were subtle about this. :p

 

 

If this was the intent I think they did a pretty lousy job of showing it. The ending didn’t come off like a walk of shame to me, and even if it did, again, Rambeau’s line certainly tries to justify Wanda’s actions.

 

 

She’s certainly a fugitive, and I would agree that the global powers that be probably think she’s a villain. But the viewer is supposed to think of her as a flawed protagonist, for sure, I’d agree with that.

 

And yeah, the FBI is clearly out of their wight class if they tried to detain her. But them not trying to or even saying anything to her at all makes it pretty clear that the show’s not trying to portray her as the villain.

 

I don't know what to say. There are literally people crying and begging Wanda to free them or at least free their children that she had locked up. The entire town is coming at her, begging her to free them from her mental slavery, and she starts strangling them all as a result.

 

It's pretty clear this series has no real villain. Wanda is a villain to everyone of Westview and in the eyes of governments worldwide. Agatha is a villain only to Wanda. By Westview citizen standards, Agatha is the one that freed them long enough to convince Wanda to let them go. Hayward is a villain in that he broke the law and probably a few international treaties. At least he's human and can be arrested.

 

There are some clear good guys here, but I don't think there are any clear villains. Either way, in the end, the only person that did anything actually evil in this show was Wanda. Maybe Agatha to a lesser extent of you consider killing a fake dog evil.

 

 

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13 minutes ago, Ghost_MH said:

 

I don't know what to say. There are literally people crying and begging Wanda to free them or at least free their children that she had locked up. The entire town is coming at her, begging her to free them from her mental slavery, and she starts strangling them all as a result.

 

It's pretty clear this series has no real villain. Wanda is a villain to everyone of Westview and in the eyes of governments worldwide. Agatha is a villain only to Wanda. By Westview citizen standards, Agatha is the one that freed them long enough to convince Wanda to let them go. Hayward is a villain in that he broke the law and probably a few international treaties. At least he's human and can be arrested.

 

There are some clear good guys here, but I don't think there are any clear villains. Either way, in the end, the only person that did anything actually evil in this show was Wanda. Maybe Agatha to a lesser extent of you consider killing a fake dog evil.

 

 

If we're judging evil by Intent  then Agatha was definitely evil. She was motivated by power and self gain. Wanda is motivated by GRIEF... a powerful grief that broke her and caused her to do terrible things to the people of Westview. There's reason we get a whole episode devoted to showing us just how much Wanda has lost in her young life. She's lost pretty much everyone she's ever loved in very tragic ways and she eventually broke.  If anything the show illustrates that sometimes, there are no black and white "sides" to a situation.

 

Also, "Protagonist" and "Hero" are not interchangeable... two different terms with two different meanings.

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I mean if we’re debating wither or not it’s villainous to kill a “fake” dog then we should wonder about the legitimacy of Wanda’s attachment to “fake” Vision and “fake” children. They show Agnes killing her entire coven in flashback, the show’s main action sequence is a fight between Wanda and Agnes, Agnes is the main villain.

 

SWORD guy was a dick to Rambeau, let Wanda try to resurrect Vision as a living weapon, then when that didn’t work, tried to take advantage of the hex and detained the other protagonists of the show so he could do his thing. The show ends with him getting cuffed, he’s the B-villain here.

 

Woo, Rambeau, Darcy... these people are not conflicted in their support for Wanda and Vision. The show is not going to let its heroic supporting cast be unwavering in their support for the show’s villain, that’s just not how the MCU works. Wanda’s not a white knight of any kind, but she’s unquestionably the protagonist and hero of the show.

 

27 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

What would they say to her? The last time she was confronted by a bunch of armed men she turned their guns back on them. Froma story logic standpoint, just letting her leave after she undid what she did actually makes sense.

 

I stand by Woo or someone saying to her, “you just can’t fly away from this,” would have been much more logical than Wanda apologizing just to Rambeau before getting let off the hook by her, but that’s a fair point.

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14 minutes ago, Kal-El814 said:

I mean if we’re debating wither or not it’s villainous to kill a “fake” dog then we should wonder about the legitimacy of Wanda’s attachment to “fake” Vision and “fake” children. They show Agnes killing her entire coven in flashback, the show’s main action sequence is a fight between Wanda and Agnes, Agnes is the main villain.

 

SWORD guy was a dick to Rambeau, let Wanda try to resurrect Vision as a living weapon, then when that didn’t work, tried to take advantage of the hex and detained the other protagonists of the show so he could do his thing. The show ends with him getting cuffed, he’s the B-villain here.

 

Woo, Rambeau, Darcy... these people are not conflicted in their support for Wanda and Vision. The show is not going to let its heroic supporting cast be unwavering in their support for the show’s villain, that’s just not how the MCU works. Wanda’s not a white knight of any kind, but she’s unquestionably the protagonist and hero of the show.

 

 

I stand by Woo or someone saying to her, “you just can’t fly away from this,” would have been much more logical than Wanda apologizing just to Rambeau before getting let off the hook by her, but that’s a fair point.

 

To Wanda the dog, Vision, and the kids were all real. That was real attachment. To Agatha they were false beings conjured through magic. She thought Wanda's attachment to all these conjured beings was amusing and it's the main reason she was even up for playing along.

 

They showed Agatha killing her entire coven after they tried killing her for reading a book she wasn't allowed to read. I think this much was clear when Wanda brought Agatha back to her own execution only for Wanda to attacked by the coven for being the greater evil.

 

There are some heroes here, but clearly Wanda wasn't one of them. There was Vision trying to break through the hex and beg the FBI to save the people from Wanda. There was Monica breaking through the hex to try to save Wanda from herself.

 

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1 minute ago, Ghost_MH said:

 

To Wanda the dog, Vision, and the kids were all real. That was real attachment. To Agatha they were false beings conjured through magic. She thought Wanda's attachment to all these conjured beings was amusing and it's the main reason she was even up for playing along.

 

They showed Agatha killing her entire coven after they tried killing her for reading a book she wasn't allowed to read. I think this much was clear when Wanda brought Agatha back to her own execution only for Wanda to attacked by the coven for being the greater evil.

 

There are some heroes here, but clearly Wanda wasn't one of them. There was Vision trying to break through the hex and beg the FBI to save the people from Wanda. There was Monica breaking through the hex to try to save Wanda from herself.

 

Right... Vision is definitely another "hero" in this story. 

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Wanda may not be the hero but she's also not the villain. She kept things going once she was aware of what was happening but she was in complete denial about whether or not it was actually hurting the townspeople, she wasn't intentionally torturing them. And even strangling everyone when they tried to confront her in the finale didn't seem to be intentional, it seemed like it was the sort of out-of-control blind emotional response that created the Hex in the first place.

 

I'm sure there will be a conflict with her in the movies sometime soon but it will probably be more of a "hero gone rogue and needs to be pulled back in from the darkness" kind of situation than a straight-up villain conflict.

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1 hour ago, Spawn_of_Apathy said:


where Vision fell a little short to me was when he had the power to free them, but didn’t do it. 

He could only "free" them temporarily and he was also at her mercy. She altered HIM several times throughout the series. He correctly realized that the only way to truly free the town was to convince Wanda that what she was doing was wrong.

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23 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

He could only "free" them temporarily and he was also at her mercy. She altered HIM several times throughout the series. He correctly realized that the only way to truly free the town was to convince Wanda that what she was doing was wrong.


was it temporary though? Each time he did it he put them back. We never saw them revert back automatically when he was talking to them. Darcy never went back. 

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I think where I land is I think making Wanda not the hero and not the villain is a good idea, but they screwed up the landing giving her a bit too much of a pass. There ought to have been more of a reckoning, both from others and even herself. Just feels too easy as it was.

 

It's possible the less rushed finale would have done a better job at this, and future movies might fix some of it.

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13 minutes ago, legend said:

I think where I land is I think making Wanda not the hero and not the villain is a good idea, but they screwed up the landing giving her a bit too much of a pass. There ought to have been more of a reckoning, both from others and even herself. Just feels too easy as it was.

 

It's possible the less rushed finale would have done a better job at this, and future movies might fix some of it.

 

The article I posted on the previous page said everything for the finale was filmed and that the issue was purely about getting the VFX done on time, so I hope they eventually release a Director's Cut or Extended or whatever they want to call it edition of the show that has the complete finale.

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8 minutes ago, Jason said:

 

The article I posted on the previous page said everything for the finale was filmed and that the issue was purely about getting the VFX done on time, so I hope they eventually release a Director's Cut or Extended or whatever they want to call it edition of the show that has the complete finale.

 

Yeah I would definitely rewatch the episode if they did.

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26 minutes ago, legend said:

I think where I land is I think making Wanda not the hero and not the villain is a good idea, but they screwed up the landing giving her a bit too much of a pass. There ought to have been more of a reckoning, both from others and even herself. Just feels too easy as it was.

 

It's possible the less rushed finale would have done a better job at this, and future movies might fix some of it.

As far as the character goes, losing her husband a second time AND kids that she never would have been able to have doesn't seem "easy" to me but :shrug:

I think the character is worse of NOW than she was before because she's even MORE hated and feared by the world at large.

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3 hours ago, skillzdadirecta said:

As far as the character goes, losing her husband a second time AND kids that she never would have been able to have doesn't seem "easy" to me but :shrug:

I think the character is worse of NOW than she was before because she's even MORE hated and feared by the world at large.

 

It's absolutely easy from societal standpoint. Meaning, everyone has every reason to be worried about her because she just gets to go off on her own after proving she isn't responsible/capable enough to be trusted. I was expecting her to seek out Strange at the end for help at least, but not even that.

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1 hour ago, legend said:

 

It's absolutely easy from societal standpoint. Meaning, everyone has every reason to be worried about her because she just gets to go off on her own after proving she isn't responsible/capable enough to be trusted. I was expecting her to seek out Strange at the end for help at least, but not even that.

Again, who is going to force her to do anything? She's too powerful. And as far as Strange goes, does she even know who he is?  I don't remember them having any interaction during Endgame so from her perspective as a character, why would she seek him out? She didn't even know her powers had ANYTHING to do with magic. We're letting our knowledge of the characters as viewers get in the way of what makes sense in the story.

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7 hours ago, skillzdadirecta said:

Again, who is going to force her to do anything? She's too powerful. And as far as Strange goes, does she even know who he is?  I don't remember them having any interaction during Endgame so from her perspective as a character, why would she seek him out? She didn't even know her powers had ANYTHING to do with magic. We're letting our knowledge of the characters as viewers get in the way of what makes sense in the story.

 

These movies/shows/stories revolve around heroes, including non-super ones, so lots of people would still try. As pointed out earlier, Monica at a bare minimum could have done anything other than patting Wanda on the back before she leaves.

 

Positioning her as a threat is an interesting path to go -- I would enjoy that and will if they do actually go that way, but they don't do a good job finding that footing.

 

On the other hand, if they wanted to pose her more sympathetically, they should have shown far greater growth in her taking more responsibility and taking greater steps to be more careful. She doesn't do that either. Running off and reading the book of the dead or whatever all on her own doesn't really inspire confidence that she realizes she needs help and is being more responsible.

 

So instead it all comes across as rather unfinished. Rather than demonstrate Wanda as a future threat, or a person who has grown from this (as a person, not in terms of power), they portray it as if Wanda just did an oopsie.

 

That may in fact be because the show was incomplete! And maybe they'll release more to do a better job positioning where they want her to go. But at the moment, we have what we have.

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36 minutes ago, legend said:

 

These movies/shows/stories revolve around heroes, including non-super ones, so lots of people would still try. As pointed out earlier, Monica at a bare minimum could have done anything other than patting Wanda on the back before she leaves.

 

Positioning her as a threat is an interesting path to go -- I would enjoy that and will if they do actually go that way, but they don't do a good job finding that footing.

 

On the other hand, if they wanted to pose her more sympathetically, they should have shown far greater growth in her taking more responsibility and taking greater steps to be more careful. She doesn't do that either. Running off and reading the book of the dead or whatever all on her own doesn't really inspire confidence that she realizes she needs help and is being more responsible.

 

So instead it all comes across as rather unfinished. Rather than demonstrate Wanda as a future threat, or a person who has grown from this (as a person, not in terms of power), they portray it as if Wanda just did an oopsie.

 

That may in fact be because the show was incomplete! And maybe they'll release more to do a better job positioning where they want her to go. But at the moment, we have what we have.

I disagree with most of this... the power up that Wanda recieves, Agnes' ominous warnings about Wanda as the Scarlet Witch and the post credit stiinger with Wanda studying the Darkhold with her children's voices in the background ALL hint at her being a potential threat in an upcoming film or project. She's even MORE grief stricken now than she was before, is more powerful and seems to be studying the book looking for a way to bring her children back. She COULD very well be a threat the next time we see her or not, it's left open where she is at the end of this. I didn't get the impression that Wanda "did an ooopsie" and left with little to no consequence. She lost her husband for the second time and lost her children which is also why Monica DIDN'T try to stop her because she was going through her OWN grief having lost her mother and empathized with Wanda. I don't get why some of you are so stuck on the fact that nobody tried to stop Wanda when she was CLEARLY more powerful than anyone there, was leaving peacefully, and a futile battle would have endangered all of the civilians ther in a pointless excercise. Rambeau had her powers for all of five minutes... what was she realistically going to do against Wanda ESPECIALLY when it's clear that she felt for her.

 

Sure was there some stuff left on the cutting room floor that would have resolved some plotlines more satisfactorily potentially? Probably. But I think most of the beats they were trying to hit landed...  in my humble opinion :p

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There’s several ways they could have conveyed that Wanda wasn’t being given a pass. Like I mentioned before, Monica could have “invited” Wanda to be brought in. They could have shown FBI and SWORD agents start to approach with a just a threatening look from Wanda causing them all to halt and even step back. To show they know if she doesnt want to be taken, they can’t force her. In either event, then Wanda flies off. Could have had an exchange between an agent and somebody else asking if they’re really going to just Wanda go, and their superior saying something like that they’ll need bigger guns than they have if they hope to bring her in, nothing they can do, but there tracking her. 
 

but outside of the stink eye from the town’s people and Monica’s pat on the back, she was pretty much ignored, like she wasn’t any kind of priority. 
 

We had a better sense that authorities wanted to keep an eye on and hold Superman accountable at the end of Man of Steel than we got in WandaVision, and as a character Wanda is no Superman. Not nearly as righteous. 
 

I think we all get that Monica is an ally and somebody who will defend these “heroes”, which would be why she wouldn’t go to war with Wanda. But that shouldn’t mean she can’t see if Wanda’s willing to do the right thing voluntarily. 

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31 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

I disagree with most of this... the power up that Wanda recieves, Agnes' ominous warnings about Wanda as the Scarlet Witch and the post credit stiinger with Wanda studying the Darkhold with her children's voices in the background ALL hint at her being a potential threat in an upcoming film or project. She's even MORE grief stricken now than she was before, is more powerful and seems to be studying the book looking for a way to bring her children back. She COULD very well be a threat the next time we see her or not, it's left open where she is at the end of this. I didn't get the impression that Wanda "did an ooopsie" and left with little to no consequence. She lost her husband for the second time and lost her children which is also why Monica DIDN'T try to stop her because she was going through her OWN grief having lost her mother and empathized with Wanda.

 

Sure was there some stuff left on the cutting room floor that would have resolved some plotlines more satisfactorily potentially? Probably. But I think most of the beats they were trying to hit landed...  in my humble opinion :p

 

I feel like we're talking about two different things. The facts of what Wanda has done leads me to the conclusion that everyone *should* be worried about her. The narrative and presentation makes it come across like she did an oopsie. Yes, the town was angry with her, but "they'll never know what she sacrificed for them" immediately diminishes the portrayal.

 

Quote

I don't get why some of you are so stuck on the fact that nobody tried to stop Wanda when she was CLEARLY more powerful than anyone there, was leaving peacefully, and a futile battle would have endangered all of the civilians ther in a pointless excercise. Rambeau had her powers for all of five minutes... what was she realistically going to do against Wanda ESPECIALLY when it's clear that she felt for her.

 

I don't get why you think it would be weird for a story that introduces new heroes every Tuesday to show someone one trying harder to stop her despite the power discrepancy. Rambeau doesn't have to launch a nuclear assault on Wanda. Anything other than "They'll never know what you sacrificed" would have been better. How about even just arguing to Wanda "Wanda, your powers are dangerous and we need to get you help because you can't be trusted alone right now.  Come in and let us try to resolve this." But we don't even get that.

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Was Wanda born with her powers? The show is a little fuzzy about how magic works. Dr. Strange (the movie) seems to imply that everyone has some potential to use magic but that it could also be taken away or blocked. The Scarlet Witch as a concept / constant... the show didn’t seem to make it clear if someone gets born into the role or if someone’s sort of destined to become it?

 

It doesn’t matter, just curious. :p

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5 minutes ago, Spawn_of_Apathy said:

 

We had a better sense that authorities wanted to keep an eye on and hold Superman accountable at the end of Man of Steel than we got in WandaVision, and as a character Wanda is no Superman. Not nearly as righteous. 

Bad example... Did you see how many people DIED in Man of Steel? The Government in Man of Steel went from not knowing aliens and super powered beings existed to having an Alien Invasion and a major city damn near decimated not to mention an almost extinction level event. The kryptonians almost wiped out the PLANET and while Superman saved the day, he was still an unknown quantity to the goverment.

 

NOBODY died at Wanda's hands in Wandavision and she was leaving. The FBI and Sword agents, at THIS point in the series, ALREADY KNEW there was nothing they could do to stop her if she wanted to leave and since she was leaving on her own, why would they try to stop her and potentially further antagonize her and endanger the towns peoplle that they had no way of protecting in this circumstance?

 

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    I feel like we're talking about two different things. The facts of what Wanda has done leads me to the conclusion that everyone *should* be worried about her. The narrative and presentation makes it come across like she did an oopsie. Yes, the town was angry with her, but "they'll never know what she sacrificed for them" immediately diminishes the portrayal.

     

    Again, Rambeau was showing Wanda she empathized with her. That's ALL that line shows. Is it a clunky line given the circumstance? Maybe. But Wanda DID sacrifce something that was completely in her power to keep... her "family". Should she be commended for it? No. But it also blurs the line between her being a villain or not because a viallain would have kept the town in thrall without a second thought.

     

    6 minutes ago, legend said:

    I don't get why you think it would be weird for a story that introduces new heroes every Tuesday wouldn't show someone one trying harder to stop her despite the power discrepancy. Rambeau doesn't have to launch a nuclear assault on Wanda. Anything other than "They'll never know what you sacrificed" would have been better. How about even just arguing to Wanda "Wanda, your powers are dangerous and we need to get you help because you can't be trusted alone right now.  Come in and let us try to resolve this." But we don't even get that.

    No we don't because as I said above, the priority was removing the threat... which is Wanda herself. If she's leaving, let her ago. Why force a fight, verbal or otherwise, that you can't win especially when innocents could get caught in the crossfire?

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    Just now, Kal-El814 said:

    Was Wanda born with her powers? The show is a little fuzzy about how magic works. Dr. Strange (the movie) seems to imply that everyone has some potential to use magic but that it could also be taken away or blocked. The Scarlet Witch as a concept / constant didn’t seem to make it clear if someone gets born into the role or if someone’s sort of destined to become it?

     

    It doesn’t matter, just curious. :p


    it looked like, yes, Wanda was born a witch. The Mind Stone just supercharger her and made her far stronger without the training and knowledge one might normally need to develop. 

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    1 minute ago, Kal-El814 said:

    Was Wanda born with her powers? The show is a little fuzzy about how magic works. Dr. Strange (the movie) seems to imply that everyone has some potential to use magic but that it could also be taken away or blocked. The Scarlet Witch as a concept / constant... the show didn’t seem to make it clear if someone gets born into the role or if someone’s sort of destined to become it?

     

    It doesn’t matter, just curious. :p

    The series seems to imply that she always had her powers. She kept that Stark bomb that killed her parents from going off buy casting a "Probability hex" according to Agnes. Which is one of her early powers from the comics.

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    3 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

    Again, Rambeau was showing Wanda she empathized with her. That's ALL that line shows. Is it a clunky line given the circumstance? Maybe. But Wanda DID sacrifce something that was completely in her power to keep... her "family". Should she be commended for it? No. But it also blurs the line between her being a villain or not because a viallain would have kept the town in thrall without a second thought.

     

    It being clunky is kind of the point :p The narrative presentation feels at odds with the facts. There is a good chance a non-rushed version would have handled all this better.

     

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    No we don't because as I said above, the priority was removing the threat... which is Wanda herself. If she's leaving, let her ago. Why force a fight, verbal or otherwise, that you can't win especially when innocents could get caught in the crossfire?

     

    But what I'm suggesting to you isn't forcing a fight. There are so many other non-escalating things she could have tried. We don't even get the bare minimum, we get something that feels like it goes in the opposite direction.

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