~*Official #COVID-19 Thread of Doom*~ Revenge of Omicron Prime

[osxmatt]

 

[silentbob]

So I guess I ask for thoughts and prayers here. My cousin and husband who tested positive are still fighting it 2 weeks later, but over the worst of it. Sadly before they knew they were sick, they visited my cousin’s mom and she got it from them. She wasn’t feeling good and kept getting a little worse last week and checked herself into the hospital. They have been in contact since then nightly via cellphone chats/texts. So my cousin was a bit surprised that yesterday, they didn't have their usual interactions. Cousin called the hospital this morning and was informed that last night her mom was moved into the ICU and is now on a ventilator. How bad it is, I don’t know but cross your fingers

[Guest]

 

 

Your regularly scheduled reminder that Shaun King is as black as Rachel Dolezal, but also with a penchant for fraudulent fundraising.

[Jason]

 

[CitizenVectron]

My spouse's sister let her kids' father take them for the weekend last week, and he dropped by their grandparents' place unexpectedly (my spouse's mom and dad). They felt guilty and had them in for supper. Fast forward to today, and the one kid (who is 17) is being tested for COVID-19, along with her father and also her step-dad. So now we have to see if my spouse's parents get sick. I'm super pissed off because my spouse's sister wasn't taking it seriously, nor were her kids. I understand the kids not being able to act rationally, and that is why it is up to parents to do so. Even today, while her daughter is being tested, she is at work. smh

 

My spouse's parents are both smokers and in their 60s, so they are at a higher risk than normal. Fuck the people who don't take this seriously.

[Jason]

 

[CitizenVectron]

I am also done with everyone standing 6 feet apart and pretending like they are safe. I read a good article yesterday where epidemiologists were interviewed saying that outdoor, 10-20 feet is maybe safe, assuming the wind doesn't carry the droplets to you. Indoors, there is no safe distance if someone sneezes or coughs, as the droplets can remain airborne for an hour or two. They said they were frustrated with politicians not listening to expert recommendations, and their advice was basically don't even go to the grocery store unless you are literally about to run out of food.

[Jason]

3 minutes ago, CitizenVectron said:

My spouse's sister let her kids' father take them for the weekend last week, and he dropped by their grandparents' place unexpectedly (my spouse's mom and dad). They felt guilty and had them in for supper. Fast forward to today, and the one kid (who is 17) is being tested for COVID-19, along with her father and also her step-dad. So now we have to see if my spouse's parents get sick. I'm super pissed off because my spouse's sister wasn't taking it seriously, nor were her kids. I understand the kids not being able to act rationally, and that is why it is up to parents to do so. Even today, while her daughter is being tested, she is at work. smh

 

My spouse's parents are both smokers and in their 60s, so they are at a higher risk than normal. Fuck the people who don't take this seriously.

 

 

[osxmatt]

4 minutes ago, Jason said:

 

 

 

[Spawn_of_Apathy]

47 minutes ago, Jason said:

 

If it were so easy. 

[Joe]

 

The amount of tests going down in NY is staggering compared to the rest of the country. This article details how Cuomo arranged for that to happen.

 

Also, why the fuck is California still sitting on so many pending tests? Does anyone have an answer for this?

[Firewithin]

 

[SaysWho?]

19 minutes ago, Jose said:

 

The amount of tests going down in NY is staggering compared to the rest of the country. This article details how Cuomo arranged for that to happen.

 

Also, why the fuck is California still sitting on so many pending tests? Does anyone have an answer for this?

 

Thanks for that. Every time I see the number of cases by state, I think, "Geez, what did NY do?" but if the amount of testing correlates to the high amount of cases, then good on them for getting it done.

[johnny]

23 minutes ago, Jose said:

 

The amount of tests going down in NY is staggering compared to the rest of the country. This article details how Cuomo arranged for that to happen.

 

Also, why the fuck is California still sitting on so many pending tests? Does anyone have an answer for this?

My county took down the pending tests statistic on their website a couple weeks ago, which at the time was at a couple thousand. Gotta be much higher now. 

[Chris-]

1 hour ago, CitizenVectron said:

I am also done with everyone standing 6 feet apart and pretending like they are safe. I read a good article yesterday where epidemiologists were interviewed saying that outdoor, 10-20 feet is maybe safe, assuming the wind doesn't carry the droplets to you. Indoors, there is no safe distance if someone sneezes or coughs, as the droplets can remain airborne for an hour or two. They said they were frustrated with politicians not listening to expert recommendations, and their advice was basically don't even go to the grocery store unless you are literally about to run out of food.

 

Right, but at a certain point personal recommendations pass the threshold of feasibility and only serve to drive anxiety. Is it feasible that someone could have coughed in the dairy aisle two hours ago and I unwittingly walked into an infection? Sure it's feasible, but it's not likely, nor is it realistic to limit my exposure on such a granular level. Eventually I'm going to have to go to the dairy aisle, and even if I follow best practices - put space between myself and others, wear a mask, wash my hands, go as infrequently as possible, etc. - there is always going to be a feasible-but-uncontrollable risk, and people generally do not handle that type of information well. So any prescribed behavior has to strike that balance.

[CitizenVectron]

11 minutes ago, Chris- said:

 

Right, but at a certain point personal recommendations pass the threshold of feasibility and only serve to drive anxiety. Is it feasible that someone could have coughed in the dairy aisle two hours ago and I unwittingly walked into an infection? Sure it's feasible, but it's not likely, nor is it realistic to limit my exposure on such a granular level. Eventually I'm going to have to go to the dairy aisle, and even if I follow best practices - put space between myself and others, wear a mask, wash my hands, go as infrequently as possible, etc. - there is always going to be a feasible-but-uncontrollable risk, and people generally do not handle that type of information well. So any prescribed behavior has to strike that balance.

 

I don't mean that we have to enforce the 20 foot rule, only that people shouldn't assume that 6 feet makes them perfectly safe, as some seem to think. Go near people when you have to, but avoid it as much as possible. If you have to work in the same room as someone else and they have it, you are likely going to get it too, regardless if you are standing 6 feet away. We all still need to go to stores, etc (that don't deliver), but each trip should be quick and only for necessity's sake.

[Chris-]

Just now, CitizenVectron said:

 

I don't mean that we have to enforce the 20 foot rule, only that people shouldn't assume that 6 feet makes them perfectly safe, as some seem to think. Go near people when you have to, but avoid it as much as possible. If you have to work in the same room as someone else and they have it, you are likely going to get it too, regardless if you are standing 6 feet away. We all still need to go to stores, etc (that don't deliver), but each trip should be quick and only for necessity's sake.

 

I have not seen or witnessed any sort of assumption from people that 6 feet of distance creates a magical protective bubble, and if those people are out there then we've already squeezed as much caution out of them that we possibly can. 

[emalider]

1 hour ago, CitizenVectron said:

I am also done with everyone standing 6 feet apart and pretending like they are safe. I read a good article yesterday where epidemiologists were interviewed saying that outdoor, 10-20 feet is maybe safe, assuming the wind doesn't carry the droplets to you. Indoors, there is no safe distance if someone sneezes or coughs, as the droplets can remain airborne for an hour or two. They said they were frustrated with politicians not listening to expert recommendations, and their advice was basically don't even go to the grocery store unless you are literally about to run out of food.

 

Not saying I don't believe you, but can you provide the details for these recommendations? The most recent journal article that pointed to aerolization for three+ hours was from the New England Journal of Medicine, which its testing has its critiques (namely, it being performed in a highly controlled environment with extremely saturated viral load testings, which is highly unlikely comparable to a person's viral load). The current recommendation (at least while the PPE shortage is happening) is droplet precautions except during aerosol-generating procedures (e.g, intubation, extubation, bronchoscopy, etc), where an N95 respirator or PAPR is required.

 

Just found out yesterday: at a sister unit, our infection control team ran a small experiment (small sample size warning) where cultures were obtained from high contact areas (e.g, keyboard, door, floor, etc.) prior to a COVID+ patient being admitted. Upon admission, patient was swabbed, which came back positive, confirming a baseline for the test. Multiple nurses were asked to not change their behaviors to the best of their ability while maintaining personal safety as educated (i.e, don't wipe down keyboards more than you necessarily would). Along with the previous environment swabs, these nurses were swabbed in concerning areas, including hair, shoes, and scrubs. None of the swabs came back positive. We've been caring for COVID patients now for almost a month and we have had no staff exposures resulting in staff getting sick using the CDC guidelines.

 

This small test is definitely not the end-all be-all by any means, but I understand why we've taken the stance for droplet precautions except during (and after) certain circumstances. Personally, I think six feet, social distancing, and good hygiene are fine. The bigger concerns are people wearing masks and/or gloves thinking they're safe, and the people not doing anything because they're selfish assholes. The gloves don't matter when you touch something "dirty" followed by touching something else that ultimately goes near your face - same goes for masks. Practice social distancing, good hand hygiene, and (as difficult as it is) stop touching your face. (Not you specifically.)

[CitizenVectron]

3 minutes ago, Chris- said:

 

I have not seen or witnessed any sort of assumption from people that 6 feet of distance creates a magical protective bubble, and if those people are out there then we've already squeezed as much caution out of them that we possibly can. 

 

I know people who believe it keeps them safe, as if there is some radiation coming off the person that falls off. Hey, maybe it's related to 5G!

 

Better language might be "Keep 20 feet away from people when possible, and at least 6 feet apart when you need to interact with someone or be in a place with other people."

[CitizenVectron]

1 minute ago, emalider said:

 

Not saying I don't believe you, but can you provide the details for these recommendations? The most recent journal article that pointed to aerolization for three+ hours was from the New England Journal of Medicine, which its testing has its critiques (namely, it being performed in a highly controlled environment with extremely saturated viral load testings, which is highly unlikely comparable to a person's viral load). The current recommendation (at least while the PPE shortage is happening) is droplet precautions except during aerosol-generating procedures (e.g, intubation, extubation, bronchoscopy, etc), where an N95 respirator or PAPR is required.

 

Just found out yesterday: at a sister unit, our infection control team ran a small experiment (small sample size warning) where cultures were obtained from high contact areas (e.g, keyboard, door, floor, etc.) prior to a COVID+ patient being admitted. Upon admission, patient was swabbed, which came back positive, confirming a baseline for the test. Multiple nurses were asked to not change their behaviors to the best of their ability while maintaining personal safety as educated (i.e, don't wipe down keyboards more than you necessarily would). Along with the previous environment swabs, these nurses were swabbed in concerning areas, including hair, shoes, and scrubs. None of the swabs came back positive. We've been caring for COVID patients now for almost a month and we have had no staff exposures resulting in staff getting sick using the CDC guidelines.

 

This small test is definitely not the end-all be-all by any means, but I understand why we've taken the stance for droplet precautions except during (and after) certain circumstances. Personally, I think six feet, social distancing, and good hygiene are fine. The bigger concerns are people wearing masks and/or gloves thinking they're safe, and the people not doing anything because they're selfish assholes. The gloves don't matter when you touch something "dirty" followed by touching something else that ultimately goes near your face - same goes for masks. Practice social distancing, good hand hygiene, and (as difficult as it is) stop touching your face. (Not you specifically.)

 

I'll try to find it, it was on my twitter feed a day or two ago.

 

In response to the bolded part, that is good news, but there is also strong evidence (in the form of many sick and dead hospital staff) that it still spreads. I think around 10% of cases in my province are healthcare workers using PPE, and obviously in places where they do not have enough space to function (such as Italy) the numbers are even worse. Obviously in a situation where you have patients stacked side by side and all over the place in an entire hospital you are going to have a greater chance of getting it, of course.

[emalider]

From the information we've received, the healthcare worker infection rates typically happen when the hospital systems collapse (between the lack of PPE and untested McGuyver techniques like splitting the ventilator four ways [I don't even know how that would be feasible, and hope to god I don't ever have to provide care in that scenario]).

 

Thanks for looking up the info. I'm in an ongoing discussion with peers on what's best practice and this could definitely change things up.

[Chris-]

10 minutes ago, CitizenVectron said:

Better language might be "Keep 20 feet away from people when possible, and at least 6 feet apart when you need to interact with someone or be in a place with other people."

 

My man, you have a fundamental misunderstanding regarding how the average person thinks if you think that language would be productive. 

[Littleronin]

4 hours ago, osxmatt said:

 

Guys, we can learn from Melania. She has been social distancing from Donald for some time now. 

[emalider]

1 minute ago, Chris- said:

 

My man, you have a fundamental misunderstanding regarding how the average person thinks if you think that language would be productive. 

Prior to COVID for flu season:

 

At the public entry: "Please check in at the front desk. No visitors younger than 12 is permitted in patient care areas."

At the elevators: "Please check in at the front desk. No visitors younger than 12 is permitted in patient care areas."

In the elevators: "Please check in at the front desk. No visitors younger than 12 is permitted in patient care areas."

At every elevator lobby: "Please check in at the front desk. No visitors younger than 12 is permitted in patient care areas."

Prior to entering an inpatient unit: "Please check in at the front desk. No visitors younger than 12 is permitted in patient care areas."

 

Visitor: *Walks in with a stroller* "We're here to see _______. Is it ok if my eight month old comes?"

[CitizenVectron]

https://globalnews.ca/news/6799110/coronavirus-covid-19-vaccine-return-to-normality-trudeau/?utm_source=%40globalnews&utm_medium=Twitter

 

Trudeau: “Normality will not come back until we get a vaccine. Will be a very long way off, so remain vigilant for at least 1 year"

 

Quote

Trudeau’s comments came just after the release of modelling data that federal health officials have been using to inform Canada’s response to the pandemic.

 

The models suggested the first wave of the virus could end roughly sometime in the summer, but that further “wavelets” are possible in the following months.

 

Epidemic controls and surveillance will have to continue over that time so “the chains” of the virus don’t “reignite,” said Dr. Theresa Tam, Canada’s chief public health officer.

 

Canada is developing “tools and habits” now that will allow the country to be “much more resilient and resistant to further outbreaks and spreads,” Trudeau later told reporters.

 

Even then, “there will be things we just aren’t able to do” for a year to 18 months, he added in French.

 

First hint from a politician (here, at least) that there is no short-term end game to the restrictions (in some form or another).

[Littleronin]

7 minutes ago, emalider said:

Prior to COVID for flu season:

 

At the public entry: "Please check in at the front desk. No visitors younger than 12 is permitted in patient care areas."

At the elevators: "Please check in at the front desk. No visitors younger than 12 is permitted in patient care areas."

In the elevators: "Please check in at the front desk. No visitors younger than 12 is permitted in patient care areas."

At every elevator lobby: "Please check in at the front desk. No visitors younger than 12 is permitted in patient care areas."

Prior to entering an inpatient unit: "Please check in at the front desk. No visitors younger than 12 is permitted in patient care areas."

 

Visitor: *Walks in with a stroller* "We're here to see _______. Is it ok if my eight month old comes?"

Now the hospital in my town forces you to be pre-screened through the ER for scheduled appointments in the outpatient clinic. After being escorted into the ER by a deputy to make sure you are the only person (or guardian if the patient is a minor) going into the appointment. From there you are given a paper that informs you that you will be removed if you touch anything during the escort to the exam room. 

[Jason]

21 minutes ago, CitizenVectron said:

 

I'll try to find it, it was on my twitter feed a day or two ago.

 

In response to the bolded part, that is good news, but there is also strong evidence (in the form of many sick and dead hospital staff) that it still spreads. I think around 10% of cases in my province are healthcare workers using PPE, and obviously in places where they do not have enough space to function (such as Italy) the numbers are even worse. Obviously in a situation where you have patients stacked side by side and all over the place in an entire hospital you are going to have a greater chance of getting it, of course.

 

You can get infected via your eyes, right? So unless the PPE includes a face shield or something, that could be what the problem is. 

[emalider]

1 minute ago, Littleronin said:

Now the hospital in my town forces you to be pre-screened through the ER from scheduled appoints in the outpatient clinic. After being escorted into the ER by a deputy to make sure you are the only person (or guardian if the patient is a minor) going into the appointment. From there you are given a paper that informs you that you will be removed if you touch anything during the escort to the exam room. 

Yea, most hospitals around here are like that to some degree. We have fully embraced the open visitation and family care model - it has its pros for sure, but this lax nature can be difficult to manage. I've come to appreciate the open nature, but it's more frustrating to have the signs out for the public to not be enforced and people just blatantly disregarding it.

[cusideabelincoln]

On 4/4/2020 at 12:20 PM, marioandsonic said:

I have less than half a tank, and I haven't refilled in about a month.

 

Doesn't gas go bad after a month or so?  Should I just use it up somehow?

 

In an older, but still fuel-injected, vehicle I've gone about 2 years with the same gas in it.

 

 

18 hours ago, Chairslinger said:

Good read on what it's like to be a minimum wage "essential" worker.

 

I was going through much the same thing for weeks, but I finally told them on Monday I wasn't coming in for a month or two. Even though with my heart condition I am probably considered high risk myself, it's mostly due to worrying about infecting my sister or mother, who are both even higher risk than me. Not worth the risk.

 

 

 

Both of these are spot on.

 

Pretty much the first time in my life I've had the issue of the skin on my hands cracking and bleeding. I would get days off, they'd get better, and then wrecked when I worked again. Kind of funny thing I did to myself. Because I've never really had that happen to my hands before I did something to fuck up my hand before I even knew what I was doing. When I am watching TV or distracted I guess I have a habit of rubbing the stubble on my chin with the back of my hand. I was really distracted watching TV and realized after a looooong time, "Fuck, that hurts" look down and realize I have given myself what looks like about four dozen little paper cuts on my knuckles and back of my hand. 

 

 

 

I have kind of experienced this too. 

 

I know it sucks for the many, many people who have been laid off or fired, but it's kind of a fucked up opposite for some low wage, "essential" workers. Either work and take the risk, or quit and get nothing.

 

My skin was cracking and bleeding on the back of my hands the first week I upped my hand washing, too.  Since then it has gotten better, but I've also applied lotion to the problematic areas right after a handwash.

 

1 hour ago, CitizenVectron said:

 

I know people who believe it keeps them safe, as if there is some radiation coming off the person that falls off. Hey, maybe it's related to 5G!

 

Better language might be "Keep 20 feet away from people when possible, and at least 6 feet apart when you need to interact with someone or be in a place with other people."

 

If only people could pay attention to their own actions and restrain themselves, we could worry less and probably function normally without worrying about an outbreak that could overwhelm hospitals.  If you have a bad cough you shouldn't go out in public at all, regardless of what causes the cough.  And there are still people not covering their mouths when they do have to cough or sneeze.

[marioandsonic]

I had no choice but to go to the store today.  I was out of bread, milk, eggs, and butter.  I checked to order it online, but the next available time for pickup at my local store wasn't until next Saturday.  I fully covered myself, including gloves and a scarf for my mouth (I don't have a mask sadly), got my shit, and got out asap.  Came home, wiped down the groceries with disinfectant wipes, threw whatever clothing I was wearing in the wash, and took a shower.

 

Here's hoping I didn't catch it...

[johnny]

4 minutes ago, marioandsonic said:

I had no choice but to go to the store today.  I was out of bread, milk, eggs, and butter.  I checked to order it online, but the next available time for pickup at my local store wasn't until next Saturday.  I fully covered myself, including gloves and a scarf for my mouth (I don't have a mask sadly), got my shit, and got out asap.  Came home, wiped down the groceries with disinfectant wipes, threw whatever clothing I was wearing in the wash, and took a shower.

 

Here's hoping I didn't catch it...

You’re probably fine 

[CastlevaniaNut18]

6 hours ago, sblfilms said:

 

 

Your regularly scheduled reminder that Shaun King is as black as Rachel Dolezal, but also with a penchant for fraudulent fundraising.

I've never followed this guy much, he seems like a bit of a twat. Does he actually identify as black?

[CitizenVectron]

An interesting idea to get back to some kind of normal: increase testing by 200x and test everyone every 2 weeks.

 

It would cost huge amounts, but less than keeping things closed down, and then you can quarantine hotspots quickly.

[thewhyteboar]

 

[Chris-]

6 minutes ago, thewhyteboar said: