Joe Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 11 minutes ago, Jwheel86 said: Wasn't it 29 years 2 months ago? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewhyteboar Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyser_Soze Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 Haven't we heard all of this before? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skillzdadirecta Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 3 minutes ago, Keyser_Soze said: Haven't we heard all of this before? We have, but most Americans haven't. They aren't watching the debates like we are, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 8 minutes ago, Massdriver said: Bernie is right that healthcare needs more radical reform than a band aid like Biden or Butti’s approach. I thoroughly agree! Hence, my position to declare healthcare as a "public good" and to nationalize the entire economic sector. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massdriver Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 18 minutes ago, SFLUFAN said: I thoroughly agree! Hence, my position to declare healthcare as a "public good" and to nationalize the entire economic sector. Sounds fine to me. There are other approaches that would work too if you look at other developed countries, but single payer works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jwheel86 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 8 minutes ago, Massdriver said: Sounds fine to me. There are other approaches that would work too if you look at other developed countries, but single payer works. Those countries don't have Republicans who will sabotage the public option to make it uncompetative with private insurance, drive costs up, and then declare it failed. Universal programs are the only programs that work in our political environment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewhyteboar Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 10 minutes ago, thewhyteboar said: This is INFINITELY WORSE than the First Gilded Age. At least back then, those guys had some sense of "social responsibility" and created foundations, funded museums, etc. to at least pretend they had some interest in the betterment of humanity. And they had colorful, interesting personalities. These motherfuckers are so goddamned bland and boring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 By the way, I HIGHLY recommend Anand Giridharadas's book Winners Take All: The Elite Charade of Changing the World Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massdriver Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 25 minutes ago, Jwheel86 said: Those countries don't have Republicans who will sabotage the public option to make it uncompetative with private insurance, drive costs up, and then declare it failed. Universal programs are the only programs that work in our political environment. Bernie's plan has a 4 year phase in period when Republicans will have plenty of time to make single payer fail. If you get past the 4 year mark, I agree it would be nearly impossible to dismantle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyser_Soze Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 1 hour ago, skillzdadirecta said: We have, but most Americans haven't. They aren't watching the debates like we are, Most Americans aren’t watching this debate either. Also that’s no excuse to not have an answer to the “arguments” the other candidates put up. You would think Bernie would plan ahead saying, “When I say ‘A’ this guy says ‘B’ so instead of what I usually say I should say ‘C’” Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skillzdadirecta Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 4 minutes ago, Keyser_Soze said: Most Americans aren’t watching this debate either. Also that’s no excuse to not have an answer to the “arguments” the other candidates put up. You would think Bernie would plan ahead saying, “When I say ‘A’ this guy says ‘B’ so instead of what I usually say I should say ‘C’” With the caucuses coming up, more people are tuning in. As far as Bernie goes... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 Warren refused to shake Bernie's hand and chewed him out. Damn! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 1 minute ago, Jose said: Warren refused to shake Bernie's hand and chewed him out. Damn! I was amused by Steyer during that scene. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 Y'all are delusional if you think anyone even tangentially attached to the word Socialist is winning the presidency in America. I don't give a shit what the polls and all the hypothetical match-ups say. The closet Trump voter phenomenon is real. I don't trust any of those polls. We're fucked. Trump is gonna win. His dementia is the only thing that will defeat him. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chakoo Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 1 hour ago, Jwheel86 said: Those countries don't have Republicans who will sabotage the public option to make it uncompetative with private insurance, drive costs up, and then declare it failed. Universal programs are the only programs that work in our political environment. No, they do. It's just it's much harder and takes more work to peal away any little bit they can. So any little change they make they get burned at the stake for it and usually get some minor change to survive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBladeRoden Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 I said yesterday on Reddit that Warren and Sanders need to come out practically holding hands or else the progressive movement is going to get kneecapped for another 4 years, let's see how that went. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skillzdadirecta Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 Just now, TheBladeRoden said: I said yesterday on Reddit that Warren and Sanders need to come out practically holding hands or else the progressive movement is going to get kneecapped for another 4 years, let's see how that went. Yeah he offered her his hand and who knows WTF she said to him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewhyteboar Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 Doesn't matter who Democrats nominate, the Republicans will call whoever it is a socialist. Satan could let Ronald Reagan out of hell and the Democrats could run him and Republicans would still call him a welfare queen-worshipping commie who's red down to his underwear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 2 minutes ago, thewhyteboar said: Doesn't matter who Democrats nominate, the Republicans will call whoever it is a socialist. Satan could let Ronald Reagan out of hell and the Democrats could run him and Republicans would still call him a welfare queen-worshipping commie who's red down to his underwear. You're not necessarily wrong, but that type of bullshit label doesn't stick as well to someone like Klobuchar or Biden. They'll massacre Bernie or Warren. "Our economy is riding higher than ever and we want to suddenly put a noose around our necks and jump off the ledge into Socialism!?!?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skillzdadirecta Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 4 minutes ago, thewhyteboar said: Doesn't matter who Democrats nominate, the Republicans will call whoever it is a socialist. Satan could let Ronald Reagan out of hell and the Democrats could run him and Republicans would still call him a welfare queen-worshipping commie who's red down to his underwear. And if The American People fall for that then we deserve what we get. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 5 minutes ago, Scott said: You're not necessarily wrong, but that type of bullshit label doesn't stick as well to someone like Klobuchar or Biden. They'll massacre Bernie or Warren. "Our economy is riding higher than ever and we want to suddenly put a noose around our necks and jump off the ledge into Socialism!?!?" They'll say verbatim about literally any Democrat. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 Everybody thinks Dems are losing anyways so might as well vote for Bernie since he is the best candidate. Stop being scared little bitches Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jwheel86 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 25 minutes ago, Scott said: You're not necessarily wrong, but that type of bullshit label doesn't stick as well to someone like Klobuchar or Biden. They'll massacre Bernie or Warren. "Our economy is riding higher than ever and we want to suddenly put a noose around our necks and jump off the ledge into Socialism!?!?" Michigan, Penn, and Wisconsin already rejected an establishment candidate in favor of Trump who himself ran on free healthcare. Moderates haven't won the White House since Bill Clinton. The rise of the right and the left is being fueled by the failure of moderates to deliver. Obama, Sanders, and Trump are all products of the same thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaysWho? Posted January 15, 2020 Author Share Posted January 15, 2020 I enjoy watching Steyer during this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_m_b_m_b_m Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaysWho? Posted January 15, 2020 Author Share Posted January 15, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 8 hours ago, Jason said: They'll say verbatim about literally any Democrat. Buttigieg made this point in one of the earlier debates, which really impressed me. He then continued to be his centrist bitch-ass self. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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