Microsoft Xbox Series X | S OT - Power Your Dreams, update: FTC case unredacted documents leaked, including XSX mid-generation refresh, new gyro/haptic-enabled controller, and next-generation plans for 2028

[Spawn_of_Apathy]

4 hours ago, Chairslinger said:

Remember how offended they acted when people started using XBone? Maybe they decided to lean into the meme making with this one....

Or there is a degenerate in charge of naming their new systems. 

[crispy4000]

1 hour ago, TwinIon said:

I would expect most first party titles be released across both gens for quite a while. If it can work on a PC, it should work just fine on a One X at the very least. I'd suspect that Indies cross release for a very long time, at least anything not terribly demanding. It's not like you even have to cross compile it to ARM or support a new input device or anything, it's all still very much the same. I don't know if it'll be the same digital SKU, though I would think they would be, but it sure seems like any digital only games should probably work on the older X One consoles.

 

The more I think about it, the more I wonder where that line will eventually be drawn. Eventually most of the audience will have migrated to a new gen console and it just won't be worth the time running all the QC tests and what not, but that's at least a couple years into the generational life cycle, and with the existence of the One X, maybe longer.

 

I think most retail games that do it will have to be designed to be cross gen (/lockhart) from the start.  Especially open world type games, which would benefit most from the SSD otherwise.

 

I can't see all first party games doing that in the long term.  To do it right, like say, Rise of the Tomb Raider on 360, will take some pairing down.  It becomes a geniune port job at some point.  Especially if base Xbox One is still supported.

[Guest]

I don’t know why there is such doubt in a system that has been common place on the PC for decades now. Just replace the series designations for the minimum and recommended specs on the back of the box.

[SimpleG]

23 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

I don’t know why there is such doubt in a system that has been common place on the PC for decades now. Just replace the series designations for the minimum and recommended specs on the back of the box.

Because Devs struggle to get games running on a 2 tier system now. Many games run like dog shit on OG PS4 and Xbox compared to the to the upper tier versions.

[Guest]

12 minutes ago, SimpleG said:

Because Devs struggle to get games running on a 2 tier system now. Many games run like dog shit on OG PS4 and Xbox compared to the to the upper tier versions.

The vast majority of Xbox One games run adequately on both the S and X.

[Mr.Vic20]

3 hours ago, Dodger said:

 

 

I'm no expert so correct me if I am wrong but it sounds like the Series X is going to be more powerful than all but the top of the line gaming PC's when it releases, and not already 4 years outdated like the PS4 and X1 were. 

 

If so next gen should be something special as the baseline hardware is actually pretty damn good this time around. 

With good coding and bigger budgets for its games, it could basically go toe to toe with any of the best of 2019's single GPU PC out there. Console gamers are in for a pleasing turn with this next generation of hardware. That said, I expect PC pull ahead of the XsX by June of 2020 with the launch of the 3080ti

[Brian]

Nvidia gonna delay

[Mr.Vic20]

6 minutes ago, ManUtdRedDevils said:

Nvidia gonna delay

YOU SHUT YOUR FILTHY WHORE MOUTH! I...I'm sorry, I meant, you might be right. 

[SimpleG]

18 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

The vast majority of Xbox One games run adequately on both the S and X.

 

If your idea of adequately is sub par frame rates , muddy textures and low resolution I suppose your right.

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, SimpleG said:

 

If your idea of adequately is sub par frame rates , muddy textures and low resolution I suppose your right.

I am right. There are only a handful of games that are fundamentally broken on the S.

[Brian]

42 minutes ago, Mr.Vic20 said:

YOU SHUT YOUR FILTHY WHORE MOUTH! I...I'm sorry, I meant, you might be right. 

Wow...no wonder you have so many ex-wives. 
 

[AbsolutSurgen]

1 hour ago, sblfilms said:

I am right. There are only a handful of games that are fundamentally broken on the S.

Aren't two of them, the two most significant games of the last few months? (Control and Jedi?)

[crispy4000]

2 hours ago, sblfilms said:

The vast majority of Xbox One games run adequately on both the S and X.

 

 

The S (let alone base console) hasn't really held on well this generation by and large.  Expectations for performance and resolution on the platform have lowered significantly since launch.  DF made this before Control and Jedi too.

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, crispy4000 said:

 

 

“These are very playable versions of the game”

 

Thanks for backing up my point.

[crispy4000]

7 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

“These are very playable versions of the game”

 

Thanks for backing up my point.

 

Depends on your personal threshold.  Do you mind dips to 30fps in '60fps' games like BFV?  Are you okay with resolutions locked at or approaching 720p today?  What's your feeling about temporal reconstruction to get to 1080p (or lower!)?

I'm okay to game a little behind the times on the TV.  Heck, I enjoyed the Wii library a lot.  But some times you do things like that for exclusives.  For a primary gaming platform as the XBO billed itself to be, it's harder to justify.

 

Lesson to me is, if you want to buy base hardware and for it to last a whole generation, wait to see which console will win with developers.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, crispy4000 said:

 

Depends on your personal threshold.  Do you mind dips to 30fps in '60fps' games like BFV?  Are you okay with resolutions locked at or approaching 720p today?

Am I? No. Which is why I have the better hardware in each case. Do my kids care about low resolution or frame rates? Not one bit. The games are still completely playable.
 

Control is the only one I’ve seen that gets decidedly into unplayable territory. The screen completely freezes on the reg.

[crispy4000]

Just now, sblfilms said:

Am I? No. Which is why I have the better hardware in each case. Do my kids care about low resolution or frame rates? Not one bit. The games are still completely playable.

 

Well, I still think N64 games are playable, if you want to go to extremes.  I think OoT averages at 20fps?

 

[Guest]

1 minute ago, crispy4000 said:

 

Well, I still think N64 games are playable, if you want to go to extremes.  I think OoT averages at 20fps?

Are you realizing your initial position is bad in real time

[TomCat]

MS doing what TomCat said they would.  2080 performance in the console

[crispy4000]

2 hours ago, sblfilms said:

Are you realizing your initial position is bad in real time

 

I wasn't going by "playability" which is a vague term to begin with.  No, I responded to what runs "adequately" for the hardware, in terms of the performance it was designed to support in the first place.  Solid 900p30fps performance should be Xbox One (S's) adequacy bar.

DF is right to say that if devs had more resources to put into Xbox One S ports, the current crop of games wouldn't feel quite as behind in that as they are.

[crispy4000]

23 minutes ago, TomCat said:

MS doing what TomCat said they would.  2080 performance in the console

Care to make a prediction about how it'll handle Control compared to a RTX 2080?

 

Because I don't see how you could say that if it doesn't match up.

[TomCat]

1 minute ago, crispy4000 said:

Care to make a prediction about how it'll handle Control compared to a RTX 2080?

havent paid attention to control  is it hard on the gpu?

 

[Dre801]

About three controllers tall.  Not that big.  Vertical orientation may not be as big an issue as some may think.

[crispy4000]

30 minutes ago, TomCat said:

havent paid attention to control  is it hard on the gpu?

 

 

So far, Control is the most taxing raytracing implementation in a game.  See the yellow bars below for all settings (including RT) on high, at 1080p:


(source)

A standard 2080 averages 50-51fps at 1080p, with no upscaling.  Do you expect the Xbox Series X to match that?

[TomCat]

waiting to see how amd actually handles Raytracing  before I make a statement on that

[crispy4000]

6 minutes ago, TomCat said:

waiting to see how amd actually handles Raytracing  before I make a statement on that

Yup, that's exactly the point I'm making.  Can't say it matches a 2080 without knowing how it compares to what a 2080 is designed to do.

[TomCat]

2 minutes ago, crispy4000 said:

Yup, that's exactly the point I'm making.  Can't say it matches a 2080 without knowing how it handles what a 2080 is designed to do.

sure I can It will give you 2080 performance in non raytraced games

[SimpleG]

1 minute ago, TomCat said:

sure I can It will give you 2080 performance in non raytraced games

so sorta, almost kind of , but not quite 2080 then

[skillzdadirecta]

17 minutes ago, Dre801 said:

About three controllers tall.  Not that big.  Vertical orientation may not be as big an issue as some may think.

Yeah I think it's smaller than people think it is.

[SimpleG]

Just now, skillzdadirecta said:

Yeah I think it's smaller than people think it is.

Its more or less a Silverstone FT03-mini

 

[crispy4000]

2 hours ago, TomCat said:

sure I can It will give you 2080 performance in non raytraced games

 

So in things that aren't the 2080's main selling point and whole reason for existing, it matches it.  Hooray?

If that's a sign of what in store for the Series X or PS5, I really won't want to invest in a base model console.  A real 2080 should drop to a plenty reasonable price in 2 years (or so).  I want my cake and to eat it too.

AMD can still change my mind.  We just have to see what they do.  Now, and later in the gen most likely.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, crispy4000 said:

 

I wasn't going by "playability" which is a vague term to begin with.  No, I responded to what runs "adequately" for the hardware, in terms of the performance it was designed to support in the first place.  Solid 900p30fps performance should be Xbox One (S's) adequacy bar.

DF is right to say that if devs had more resources to put into Xbox One S ports, the current crop of games wouldn't feel quite as behind in that as they are.

Why? If there are customers who are fine with 720p, why do you care? Get the model that meets the specs you want.

[Keyser_Soze]

11 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

Why? If there are customers who are fine with 720p, why do you care? Get the model that meets the specs you want.

 

They are fine because they don't know any better. Just like they are fine with crappy healthcare.

[crispy4000]

59 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

Why? If there are customers who are fine with 720p, why do you care? Get the model that meets the specs you want.

Let me clarify - I'd want the hardware I buy to live up to its promises for its full lifecycle.  Seeing a launch console sputter out prematurely (in optimization) because there's more SKUs to support is a real concern of mine.  I'm still very skeptical of the industry heading this direction for that reason.  It creates a climate of diminishing returns rather than mastery of the hardware.  That's true both for base machines and for mid-cycle consoles, which could be subjected to this low priority optimization pattern in even shorter time.

I also don't like being pressured to buy two of the same 'family' of boxes in a single generation.  I'd rather put that money into different ecosystems, for different exclusives, but still feel fine about the earlier current gen system I bought.  On a related note, Gamestop is the only convenient and cost-effective outlet for console trade-ins, and it's going to shit.  I don't trust them to stick around for long.

 

If I felt inclined to purchase a Series X or PS5 near launch, which I don't in the current climate, I'd probably want to wait at least until I know which side the market settles on.  Because if like this gen, the loser is the weaker one, it'll be sour grapes well before the generation is over.

 

Unless Lockhart is a thing, in which case, yay for holding back the industry?  That has its own pitfalls in the other direction.

[TheRealSmallville]

Remember back in '07 when Fox News called the 360 a "Sexbox" after Mass Effect came out? 

 

Pepperidge Farms remembers