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johnny

Topic: spanking your child

On Spanking  

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  1. 1. Would you/Do you spank your child?

  2. 2. Are you opposed to other people spanking their children?



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My friends and I talked about this and to my surprise I’m the only one that would not spank a child and I’m the only one who apparently thinks a child can be raised without smacking them. One also said it’s the best way to raise decent humans. To be clear, none of us are parents and we were all spanked as kids (only my mom spanked me, my dad gave me lectures which were torture at the time but more useful now). They agreed that once a kid gets old enough, timeout is just not a good punishment anymore and spanking must be used to teach them right from wrong. 

 

Where does D1P stand on these two questions?

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Don't know if I would, but not really against people doing so. I have known new parents that said "they would never" but that changed as the kids got older. Some kids just won't listen. I also know of parents who do things I consider worse than spanking. Like locking their kid in a dark room or bathroom for timeout. From an adult perspective I find that worse. 

 

Edit: Of course there is a difference between beating and spanking. And no tools should be used. An open handed smack on the butt. I also don't think spanking should be used often. 

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2 minutes ago, Bacon said:

Don't know if I would, but not really against people doing so. I have known new parents that said "they would never" but that changed as the kids got older. Some kids just won't listen. I also know of parents who do things I consider worse than spanking. Like locking their kid in a dark room or bathroom for timeout. From an adult perspective I find that worse. 

I don’t really care if other people spank their kids but what chapped my ass was them saying that its something that should be done if you want to raise a kid correctly. It was one of those BS “what’s wrong with America today is people don’t spank their children” kinda things. I stopped replying because I knew if I kept going I was going to offend my snowflake friends eventually. 

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1 hour ago, johnny said:

I don’t really care if other people spank their kids but what chapped my ass was them saying that its something that should be done if you want to raise a kid correctly. It was one of those BS “what’s wrong with America today is people don’t spank their children” kinda things. I stopped replying because I knew if I kept going I was going to offend my snowflake friends eventually. 

That’s a bullshit attitude from people who don’t have the patience and discipline to teach their kids how to act without threat of violence.

 

They are wrong. And to suggest America’s problems stem in any way from the fact that a child might not have been spanked just shows how out of touch with reality they are. 

 

Unfortunately, they might represent the general consensus.

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24 minutes ago, Paperclyp said:

That’s a bullshit attitude from people who don’t have the patience and discipline to teach their kids how to act without threat of violence.

 

They are wrong. And to suggest America’s problems stem in any way from the fact that a child might not have been spanked just shows how out of touch with reality they are. 

 

Unfortunately, they might represent the general consensus.

That’s kind of what I wanted to say to them but they’d get all pissed off like I’m attacking their parents or something lol. One of them thinks it’s the best to teach respect and “you can tell which people weren’t spanked as children”. Then I brought up that it’s not respect it’s fear and at best respect through fear but they didn’t agree because that’s not what happened to them.

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I think the evidence is plentiful that spanking doesn't do much good in disciplining your children and it can have harmful effects later on. There's really just no good reason to do it. I still struggle with the effects of what my mom did to me for years. 

 

I'm not going to report someone to the police for giving their kid a spat on the butt with an open hand, but it's definitely something I want to happen less as we move toward the future now that we know what we know. 

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1 hour ago, johnny said:

They agreed that once a kid gets old enough, timeout is just not a good punishment anymore and spanking must be used to teach them right from wrong. 

How old is a kid that is too old for time out? 

 

I feel like a kid would outgrow spanking first. At a certain size the amount of force you’d have to use for a spanking to do anything would cross the line into just beating up a kid. 

 

By then punishments go more into the removal of privileges and added chores. Such as turning data off on their phone, collecting power cords for video game consoles or gaming PCs, grounded, and doing a bunch of labor intensive menial chores around the house.  

 

I don’t see spanking as a must. It’s a disciplinary tool. Some kids it is the only thing that gets through to them until they’re old enough that other punishments are more effective. But there are kids so susceptible to punishment, even in lecture form you’ll never run out of non-violent ways of discipline. 

 

I believe discipline needs to be tailored to the personality of the child. Time out works like a fucking charm for a kid with ADHD that loves to run around. Not so much for a kid that spends all their free time sitting in front of a tv.  

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54 minutes ago, johnny said:

That’s kind of what I wanted to say to them but they’d get all pissed off like I’m attacking their parents or something lol. One of them thinks it’s the best to teach respect and “you can tell which people weren’t spanked as children”. Then I brought up that it’s not respect it’s fear and at best respect through fear but they didn’t agree because that’s not what happened to them.

As you said before we can have the debate about spanking as a practice - it certainly gives the parent the immediate desired result that they want. 

 

But your friends went too far in saying it’s the “best” or that children who aren’t spanked are not up to some standard they’ve set. In that regard they’re just wrong. There are many other parenting strategies that achieve the desired result without violence. And I think that being the case it’s silly to advocate for spanking. 

 

As I said before, the other strategies are more work, so many (most?) people will not do them. And so they adopt the opinion that spanking is not only the right way to do it but if you DON’T, well man, you’re what’s wrong with this country today. 

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Where is the "I am opposed to anyone having a child in the first place" option?

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It’s not effective or a real deterrent. Non physical discipline is proven to be more effective so why not go with what works?

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21 minutes ago, Rachel said:

It’s not effective or a real deterrent. Non physical discipline is proven to be more effective so why not go with what works?

I agree Rachel 

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As someone who has both been spanked and physically abused - mostly by my cunt of a mother, my father was usually fair and lenient - I decided to adopt a non-corporal punishment approach to disciplining my daughter using a tiered system similar to the one employed in her school, but with a few modifications.

 

Privileges are granted based overall behavior, scholastic performance and cooperation throughout the day:

  • Purple - The highest ranking. Netflix (Kids) or Hulu for 2 Hours or Video Games for 1 Hour, Ice Cream for Dessert, Can retrieve one item from her donation bin, additional privileges such as field trips and doesn't have to do any extra home work assignments.
     
  • Green - An average ranking. Netflix (Kids) or Hulu for 1 Hour, No Dessert, has to do one extra homework assignment.
     
  • White - A below average ranking. Educational Television for 1 Hour, No Dessert, has to do two extra homework assignments.
     
  • Red - The worst ranking. For every instruction or command disobeyed, or for any bad action - hitting, throwing, etc - she must donate one toy to a child in need. Loss of all positive privileges until she gets 3 consecutive purple days, she has five days to earn her donated toys back.

 

I've found this system to work out pretty well for my daughter as the incentives to do well are strong enough that she consistently tries to perform her best. This shows in both her school performance as well as her relationships with other children and adults. She has earned honor roll (whatever that means for a kindergartener going to 1st grade) with every report card and has received a student of the month award on multiple occasions. While my daughter does have her bad days, they're so few and far between that I'd consider my method of discipline a success for the most part. My entire goal with her has been to instill an attitude that focuses on moderation, working hard and learning to compromise - if you want privileges, you have to earn them - while giving her an opportunity to be a child who forges quality bonds, with her friends, her teachers as well as my wife and I. 

 

 

@johnny it's entirely possible to raise well-adjusted children without resorting to violence. Simply replace violence with some other uncomfortable form of punishment - e.g. loss of privileges - and actually enforce that punishment. The one thing I've noticed with other parents is their reticence to enforce non-violent forms of punishment because it's difficult. It's extra work that has to be done and if you're a wage slave working 9-5 with little in the way of respite, actually trying to treat your child like a human being worthy of the dignity and respect that comes along with the title is quite a difficult thing to do. This is especially true for younger parents who grew up in households were such violence was the norm.

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24 minutes ago, Man of Culture said:

As someone who has both been spanked and physically abused - mostly by my cunt of a mother, my father was usually fair and lenient - I decided to adopt a non-corporal punishment approach to disciplining my daughter using a tiered system similar to the one employed in her school, but with a few modifications.

 

Privileges are granted based overall behavior, scholastic performance and cooperation throughout the day:

  • Purple - The highest ranking. Netflix (Kids) or Hulu for 2 Hours or Video Games for 1 Hour, Ice Cream for Dessert, Can retrieve one item from her donation bin, additional privileges such as field trips and doesn't have to do any extra home work assignments.
     
  • Green - An average ranking. Netflix (Kids) or Hulu for 1 Hour, No Dessert, has to do one extra homework assignment.
     
  • White - A below average ranking. Educational Television for 1 Hour, No Dessert, has to do two extra homework assignments.
     
  • Red - The worst ranking. For every instruction or command disobeyed, or for any bad action - hitting, throwing, etc - she must donate one toy to a child in need. Loss of all positive privileges until she gets 3 consecutive purple days, she has five days to earn her donated toys back.

 

I've found this system to work out pretty well for my daughter as the incentives to do well are strong enough that she consistently tries to perform her best. This shows in both her school performance as well as her relationships with other children and adults. She has earned honor roll (whatever that means for a kindergartener going to 1st grade) with every report card and has received a student of the month award on multiple occasions. While my daughter does have her bad days, they're so few and far between that I'd consider my method of discipline a success for the most part. My entire goal with her has been to instill an attitude that focuses on moderation, working hard and learning to compromise - if you want privileges, you have to earn them - while giving her an opportunity to be a child who forges quality bonds, with her friends, her teachers as well as my wife and I. 

 

 

@johnny it's entirely possible to raise well-adjusted children without resorting to violence. Simply replace violence with some other uncomfortable form of punishment - e.g. loss of privileges - and actually enforce that punishment. The one thing I've noticed with other parents is their reticence to enforce non-violent forms of punishment because it's difficult. It's extra work that has to be done and if you're a wage slave working 9-5 with little in the way of respite, actually trying to treat your child like a human being worthy of the dignity and respect that comes along with the title is quite a difficult thing to do. This is especially true for younger parents who grew up in households were such violence was the norm.

This is a good post and you should feel good 

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We don’t spank but I don’t care if other people do. Discipline is much more complex that just sparking or not and most parents are lazy regardless of the methods they use :p

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This is what a terrible parent looks like:

 

 

 

 

 

 

Young dad doesn't know how to coax a child into eating something that appears unappealing without the use of violence, so he pretends to feed a Mickey doll and when the doll doesn't accept the food, he beats its face in, prompting the toddler to accept food, less he face similar consequences.

 

This is such an easy thing that so many parents get wrong:

 

1. Give your child a consistent eating schedule. That includes planning meals in advance when you are going to be out and about.

 

2. Make eating look like fun.

 

3. Do not avoid foods in front of your toddler, definitely avoid looking disgusted at foods. This is probably the biggest reason for kids being super picky eaters.

 

4. Sometimes toddlers want a little control. Let them feed themselves at their own pace.

 

5. Be firm, but patient. Don't give in to cries for chicken tenders and french fries. Talk to them and have them understand that fried foods, candies,  sweet cereals, chips and such are treats, not every day foods. Offer healthier (but fun) alternatives instead, veggie chips, prunes, pickles, toast w/ jam, etc.

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I don't spank my kid but I haven't really disciplined either, other than picking her up when shes in a dangerous situation or putting her down and letting her cry it out.

 

Most days shes good but it does drive your patience somedays. Especially when you're tired and stressed from other things.

 

Edit: as for being opposed or not when other parents do it, as long as its not abuse, i don't care. every child is different, every parent has different circumstances they need to overcome. theres no one-size fits all parenting method.

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No to spanking or any kind of physical punishment. Yes to clear boundaries, rules and expectations and just as clear consequences (timeouts, reduction in privilege etc)

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4 hours ago, Man of Culture said:

This is what a terrible parent looks like:

 There are a bunch of these videos going around and they infuriate me every time. It’s one thing when you see some kind of in effective parenting method that the parent is trying their best with, and another to outright terrorize a child. And to do it for the purpose of likes and RTs on social media is next level ugly.

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24 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

 There are a bunch of these videos going around and they infuriate me every time. It’s one thing when you see some kind of in effective parenting method that the parent is trying their best with, and another to outright terrorize a child. And to do it for the purpose of likes and RTs on social media is next level ugly.

 

Seriously. This is the kind of guy who seems like he'd exploit his children via pranks and tricks - at their expense - for YouTube dollars.

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23 minutes ago, Man of Culture said:

 

Seriously. This is the kind of guy who seems like he'd exploit his children via pranks and tricks - at their expense - for YouTube dollars.

No doubt about it. Their is something intensely sinister about this crap. I also really hate when parents post things to humiliate their children. I know a lady that was bragging the other day about going to her daughter’s high school and went to great lengths to be as embarrassing to the kid as possible because she got caught playing on her cell phone in class a couple of times.

 

Kids routinely fall into cycles of self-harm due to the treatment of their peers. Why would you give the other children ammunition against your child like that? 

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16 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

No doubt about it. Their is something intensely sinister about this crap. I also really hate when parents post things to humiliate their children. I know a lady that was bragging the other day about going to her daughter’s high school and went to great lengths to be as embarrassing to the kid as possible because she got caught playing on her cell phone in class a couple of times.

 

Kids routinely fall into cycles of self-harm due to the treatment of their peers. Why would you give the other children ammunition against your child like that? 

 

Exactly. Public humiliation is probably the worst thing you can do to your kid. The last thing any reasonable parent should want is for their kids not to just fear them, but actually loathe them. I had disowned my mother for that very reason. She would publically humiliate us (my siblings and I), verbally abuse us and physically accost us with dog chains, glassware, hangers, basically whatever she could get her hands on and lift. She even stabbed my father in the neck on one occasion because he refused to abuse us in a manner she found to be befitting. Just an all around terrible person. Even as a child, I had vowed to never let my future child endure that kind of shit.

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5 minutes ago, Man of Culture said:

 

Exactly. Public humiliation is probably the worst thing you can do to your kid. The last thing any reasonable parent should want is for their kids not to just fear them, but actually loathe them. I had disowned my mother for that very reason. She would publically humiliate us (my siblings and I), verbally abuse us and physically accost us with dog chains, glassware, hangers, basically whatever she could get her hands on and lift. She even stabbed my father in the neck on one occasion because he refused to abuse us in a manner she found to be befitting. Just an all around terrible person. Even as a child, I had vowed to never let my future child endure that kind of shit.

I’m sorry to hear that. I’m proud of you for breaking that cycle. Very easy for that sort of thing to be perpetuated generation after generation.

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6 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

I’m sorry to hear that. I’m proud of you for breaking that cycle. Very easy for that sort of thing to be perpetuated generation after generation.

Eh, don't be sorry for me. She taught me a valuable lesson about humanity and parenting. If I ever had the desire for my daughter to want to have literally nothing to do with me, I have my mother as an example to follow. Literally not following her example makes me a better parent by about 1000% :cool:

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There are a ton of reasons I don't want kids that have nothing to do with my mom, but there's always this fear in the back of my mind that I could be like her if I had a kid. It's always bothered me.

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This reminds of those daddy of five people that played pranks on their kids or whatever but it was really just abuse

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2 hours ago, CastlevaniaNut18 said:

There are a ton of reasons I don't want kids that have nothing to do with my mom, but there's always this fear in the back of my mind that I could be like her if I had a kid. It's always bothered me.

Patience, Endurance and Understanding are probably the biggest key components for any new parent. If you're 30 or older and have these features, you'll probably be an A-OK mom. My wife felt similarly to you, after some coaxing and actually going through with the whole ordeal, she turned out to be an absolutely fantastic mother. The only problem we had was her being almost entirely uneducated on vaccines, so that was a fun.. I actually took my daughter to get vaccinated and dealt with the blowback. Once she realized that vaccines don't outright murder babies or cause autism, she calmed down and we compromised with "Just don't get them so close together."

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I think spanking should be reserved for something that the kid was doing that was extremely dangerous that could've potentially resulted in serious injury or death, where you don't have time to wait to teach them normally. I think the only time I got a real spanking when I was a kid is when I was like 4 and managed to sneak out when no one was looking and wander down the block with my cousin who was maybe 3. It wasn't a beating or anything, just a spanking, which I was not used to and very much did not like, but it got the point across quickly and I never did it again.

 

We all like to imagine we should all have lead our kids down the absolute perfect path otherwise we've failed (and I think if you're spanking your kid on the regular then you did fuck up somewhere and you're not fixing the problem, just accentuating it) but sometimes, like what happened with me, things can slip through the cracks, and a quick lesson is needed. I had of course been told not to touch the door, the locks, and most certainly to not go down the street on my own, but for some reason I did. A parent can't eyeball a child 24/7.

 

But even in these cases, the more you do it, the less effective it's gonna be. In my case it startled the lesson into me, that I done fucked up. But if it happened regularly, it'd fade into every other spanking and would only effectively make me resentful, as I saw happen with a good majority of my friends when I was younger. I've done no studies, but I imagine that's a large part of the rebellious phases kids go through, especially when they get real out of hand. They're treated like abuse-able idiots instead of people, so they sneak out to go get a taste of what they assume is freedom, where they're treated like peers rather than nuisances. Obviously every kid and every parent is different, and the chemistry between them will be different as well, so it's not as simple as never do this or never do that, but I think if the parents I've seen are any indication, actually just listening to your kid instead of being annoyed when they have something to say or just going "uh huh" dismissively as you're not interested will be a great first step towards building a proper foundation for a relationship where your authority is more properly respected, rather than resented. You don't have to be their friend, per se, but you're not their jailer, either.

 

My daughter's 5 now and I haven't had to spank her at all, she listens when I explain why she shouldn't do something, asks for more details, etc. And it's not that she's just a quiet kid, he's super hyper and loud and energetic, but that doesn't mean you can't sit her down and talk to her. Maybe she will need a spanking someday, but even if so, I don't foresee it becoming a regular thing at all, and I think if your opinion is that a kid "needs a spanking to be raised properly" then you have absolutely no fucking idea what you're doing, and are patently stupid, and should never be a parent.

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3 hours ago, Man of Culture said:

Patience, Endurance and Understanding are probably the biggest key components for any new parent. If you're 30 or older and have these features, you'll probably be an A-OK mom. My wife felt similarly to you, after some coaxing and actually going through with the whole ordeal, she turned out to be an absolutely fantastic mother. The only problem we had was her being almost entirely uneducated on vaccines, so that was a fun.. I actually took my daughter to get vaccinated and dealt with the blowback. Once she realized that vaccines don't outright murder babies or cause autism, she calmed down and we compromised with "Just don't get them so close together."

Well, I'm glad you were able to educate her on the vaccines. 

 

But like I said, there are a whole buncha reason I don't want kids that don't have anything to do with my own abuse as a kid. 

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I grew up with a physically very abusive mother and all it taught me was to be a violent and aggressive teenager and young adult who thought attacking back was the only way through basically any problem. I just remember being terrified of her and loathing her as an entity and learning basically nothing else. 

 

I don't have children, and am extremely reluctant to even think about having any with my family's history of mental illness, so maybe I'm talking out of my ass, but it doesn't seem particularly productive to me. Secondly I feel like it can be a sort of "gateway drug" to increasing levels of violence. I'm not saying it is most of the time or anything but...it seems easy to me to go from spanking to eventually grabbing arms a little too hard and so forth. 

 

All I know is that I was a very sensitive type of kid and got that beaten out of me and I'm still paying for it mentally. Doesn't seem worth it. 

 

PS: I know parenting is fucking hard and complex so I'm sure there are situations where it is appropriate in worst case scenarios as well. 

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These stories break my heart. I hope you all continue to recover and grow. The wounds of abuse at the hands of a parent are some of the toughest to heal.

2 hours ago, Bloodporne said:

PS: I know parenting is fucking hard and complex so I'm sure there are situations where it is appropriate in worst case scenarios as well. 

 

I know the conventional wisdom is that parenting is a really difficult task, but that hasn’t been my experience. The early years (especially the 3s and 4s) have been the most difficult with all three of my kids (they are 12, 10, and 8) as many situations feel like negotiating with a terrorist.

 

Patience and persistence wins out though. Most often what I see as difficulty for parents is self-inflicted wounds that compound over time. Laying a solid foundation for your children and sticking to it takes some effort in the early years but pays off in a major way as they get older.

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