Keyser_Soze Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 6 hours ago, Jason said: Good Samaritan law Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted October 10, 2021 Share Posted October 10, 2021 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyser_Soze Posted October 10, 2021 Share Posted October 10, 2021 49 minutes ago, Jason said: Very racist. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted October 11, 2021 Share Posted October 11, 2021 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSpreader Posted October 11, 2021 Author Share Posted October 11, 2021 Opinion | Why do we keep referring to Christopher Columbus as an Italian hero? WWW.NBCNEWS.COM We should stop trying to salvage a holiday that brings us no glory while reinforcing the pain of the descendants of the people Christopher Columbus exploited. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewhyteboar Posted October 11, 2021 Share Posted October 11, 2021 Patrick Wyman's takedown really is the ultimate piece on Columbus. Also, there is no problem with judging historical figures by our own standards. We decide who we want to honor and who we don't. There is no problem with applying our standards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSpreader Posted October 11, 2021 Author Share Posted October 11, 2021 @thewhyteboar- googled it, great piece, thank you for suggesting it. Quote Stories are abstractions and approximations, tools that help us make sense of a complex, messy, and wildly disordered historical reality. Their creators pick and choose some events for inclusion over others and place them in a structure that attributes them to characters, both heroes and villains. The events chosen, the roles picked for the characters, and the themes emphasized all combine to give these stories the function of justifying specific ways of understanding the past, courses of action taken long ago, and the importance of groups that claim descent from past heroes in the present. Columbus and the story of his voyages west into the Atlantic are perhaps the quintessential example of this. They serve the present, not the past; any history that puts him at the center of any story would just for that reason contribute nothing to an actual understanding of the forces that swept people from Western Europe to the furthest reaches of the globe beginning in the late 15th century. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost_MH Posted October 11, 2021 Share Posted October 11, 2021 36 minutes ago, thewhyteboar said: Patrick Wyman's takedown really is the ultimate piece on Columbus. Also, there is no problem with judging historical figures by our own standards. We decide who we want to honor and who we don't. There is no problem with applying our standards. I also love the implication that the only peoples whose opinions we should take into account are Europeans here, since nobody is arguing the enslaved enjoyed all the rape, pillaging, and murder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewhyteboar Posted October 11, 2021 Share Posted October 11, 2021 1 minute ago, Ghost_MH said: I also love the implication that the only peoples whose opinions we should take into account are Europeans here, since nobody is arguing the enslaved enjoyed all the rape, pillaging, and murder. I guess we could ask the Taino, but well... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSpreader Posted October 11, 2021 Author Share Posted October 11, 2021 2 minutes ago, thewhyteboar said: I guess we could ask the Taino, but well... Puerto Ricans are their descendants, I'm sure they have an opinion on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fizzzzle Posted October 11, 2021 Share Posted October 11, 2021 I don't find any problem in juding historical figures through a modern lense. 99.9% of them were pieces of shit. There's also an element of "separate the art from the artist," though. Do I think Columbus deserves his own holiday? No. He was fired for incompetence and corruption and seemed to be a general tool. Was he a genocidal maniac? Not particularly moreso than anyone else at the time. De Bobadilla and De Ovando were absolutely more brutal than Columbus was, but no one remembers their names, so who cares. Columbus gets painted as this wicked god-king of the new world, when the most genocidal policies towards natives weren't put into place until after he was removed from power. That's not to excuse Columbus in any way Shit, we put George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, and Andrew Jackson on our money, and all of them literally owned human beings for profit. Even Alexander Hamilton may have owned people, which puts us at a pretty shitty batting average regarding putting slavers on our currency. Point being, don't put historical figures on pedestals, but it's also okay to celebrate their accomplishments. John Locke probably had beliefs that would horrify us today, but he also basically invented modern federal democracy, so hey ho. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kal-El814 Posted October 11, 2021 Share Posted October 11, 2021 42 minutes ago, thewhyteboar said: Patrick Wyman's takedown really is the ultimate piece on Columbus. Also, there is no problem with judging historical figures by our own standards. We decide who we want to honor and who we don't. There is no problem with applying our standards. The notion that people suggest we hold people to the standards of their time are doing so in bad faith is spot on. This reminds me of people who complain when people call out movies like Revenge of the Nerds or Porky’s for glorifying sexual assault and rape with comments like, “it was the 80’s! Standards were different!” As if peeping / photographing people without their consent or fucking someone who thought you were a different person weren’t against the law when those movies were made or set.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewhyteboar Posted October 11, 2021 Share Posted October 11, 2021 People like Washington and Jefferson were also important to the founding and development of America. We can recognize their importance while also recognizing their flaws. The deification of the Founders by Republicans is just creepy. Wyman's take on Columbus is correct: Christopher Columbus And The Replacement-Level Historical Figure | Defector DEFECTOR.COM It’s easy to tell Columbus’s story as one of a determined innovator, triumphing over the backwardness and ignorance of medieval Europe to usher in a new era of global exploration, trade, colonization, and conquest through sheer grit and clarity of vision. That is all absolute nonsense, but it is a very easy story to tell. That he is just a replacement-level guy. He isn't really worth our time. He is the Trent Dilfer of history. Edit: I missed that @SuperSpreader posted the money-shot from this piece. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost_MH Posted October 11, 2021 Share Posted October 11, 2021 Just now, thewhyteboar said: I guess we could ask the Taino, but well... I've got some Taino blood in me. Family always taught us that Columbus was a monster. That, however, isn't really a lesson taught anymore since most of the family has moved onto the mainland and kids have gone to school up here. That said, at least at my son's school today is indigenous Peoples' Day. I'll take it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_m_b_m_b_m Posted October 11, 2021 Share Posted October 11, 2021 9 minutes ago, thewhyteboar said: We can recognize their importance while also recognizing their flaws Hell they recognized their own hypocrisy and justified it by saying "america isn't ready yet but someday it should happen!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar SFLUFAN Posted October 11, 2021 Share Posted October 11, 2021 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anathema- Posted October 11, 2021 Share Posted October 11, 2021 12 hours ago, Jason said: Really makes you wonder how much of the looting has ever been started by the people it's been blamed on. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost_MH Posted October 13, 2021 Share Posted October 13, 2021 Boston police arrested a Black man having a stroke. After $1.3 million payout, it's unclear if anything's changed WWW.WBUR.ORG The city of Boston agreed to pay a Boston driver $1.3 million after he pulled over to the side of the road after suffering a stroke and police arrested him instead of taking him immediately to the hospital. Guy has stroke in his car. When the police find him they claim to smell alcohol on him, so they lock him up for drunk driving. Only after a concussion and still throwing up all over the place five hours later does he get taken to the ER. Police ten the ER he's drunk, so they just leave him in the waiting room waiting for hours until family finds him demanding he not be tested as a drunk. No drugs. No alcohol. The delay in care is now leaving him with permanent damage. A year and $1.3m later, the cops that claim they smelled alcohol on a guy that's been dry for 30 years leading to the entire mess have yet to be disciplined. Cool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyser_Soze Posted October 15, 2021 Share Posted October 15, 2021 Rolling Stones drop ‘insensitive’ Brown Sugar song from US tour setlist | The Rolling Stones | The Guardian WWW.THEGUARDIAN.COM 1971 hit condemned by critics as ‘prime example of entitlement’ but Mick Jagger says it could return Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted October 15, 2021 Share Posted October 15, 2021 5 minutes ago, Keyser_Soze said: Rolling Stones drop ‘insensitive’ Brown Sugar song from US tour setlist | The Rolling Stones | The Guardian WWW.THEGUARDIAN.COM 1971 hit condemned by critics as ‘prime example of entitlement’ but Mick Jagger says it could return Quote Guitarist Keith Richards confirmed the decision not to perform the song to the LA Times but said he was confused by the backlash it had received over time. “I’m trying to figure out with the sisters quite where the beef is,” he said. “Didn’t they understand this was a song about the horrors of slavery? But they’re trying to bury it.” Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyser_Soze Posted October 15, 2021 Share Posted October 15, 2021 The song is #2 trending on Genius.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ort Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 This latest right wing scandal of being outraged at Merrick Garland over this memo is so fucking stupid, even by the so fucking stupid standards they usually play in. I mean, what the flying fuck is wrong with these people? And how unbelievably cosmically idiotic are the people who are choosing to be outraged by this? I mean really, this congressional hearing is a fucking farce. Shame on these people. It's just so fucking dumb. It's unbelievable. they are such fucking dishonest hucksters because they know they have an audience of millions who are so fucking brainwashed they'll just twitch around and act like fools over literally whatever hateful bullshit piece of bloody meat they throw at their ravenous feet. The world fucking sucks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_m_b_m_b_m Posted October 22, 2021 Share Posted October 22, 2021 26 minutes ago, ort said: This latest right wing scandal of being outraged at Merrick Garland over this memo What now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remarkableriots Posted October 22, 2021 Share Posted October 22, 2021 7 hours ago, ort said: This latest right wing scandal of being outraged at Merrick Garland over this memo is so fucking stupid, even by the so fucking stupid standards they usually play in. I mean, what the flying fuck is wrong with these people? And how unbelievably cosmically idiotic are the people who are choosing to be outraged by this? I mean really, this congressional hearing is a fucking farce. Shame on these people. It's just so fucking dumb. It's unbelievable. they are such fucking dishonest hucksters because they know they have an audience of millions who are so fucking brainwashed they'll just twitch around and act like fools over literally whatever hateful bullshit piece of bloody meat they throw at their ravenous feet. The world fucking sucks. What does that have to do with Systemic Racism? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ort Posted October 22, 2021 Share Posted October 22, 2021 The memo said that the FBI would be working with local governments to help them address growing concerns about threats of violence against school board members from parents angry about masks and critical race theory. In a congressional hearing, multiple people tried to get dunk on him and say he was corrupt by claiming he was profiting off of CRT because his son works for a company that sells school curriculums or something and some of their stuff touches on race. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted October 22, 2021 Share Posted October 22, 2021 A White Woman Told Me She Doesn't 'Think Of' Me As Black. Here's How I Reacted. WWW.HUFFPOST.COM "Irrespective of the neighborhood in which I live, regardless of how articulate I might seem, all I am and all I ever will be to some people is Black." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remarkableriots Posted October 22, 2021 Share Posted October 22, 2021 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fizzzzle Posted October 22, 2021 Share Posted October 22, 2021 5 hours ago, Jason said: A White Woman Told Me She Doesn't 'Think Of' Me As Black. Here's How I Reacted. WWW.HUFFPOST.COM "Irrespective of the neighborhood in which I live, regardless of how articulate I might seem, all I am and all I ever will be to some people is Black." I've said it before, the difference is that white is exclusionary, while all other races are inclusionary. As soon as you have a drop of anything not "white" in you, you're not white anymore. Barack Obama has a black father and a white mother. Shouldn't that mean he is both equally black and white? Society says "no," he is just black. Yet at the same time you have white people who have like a Cherokee great-great-grandmother or something who claim to be "white and native." Unfortunately, society does not work like that. Being white doesn't become inclusionary when you feel like it. You can't not be white when it's convenient for you, just like you can't be white if you're... anything else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimpleG Posted October 22, 2021 Share Posted October 22, 2021 15 minutes ago, Fizzzzle said: I've said it before, the difference is that white is exclusionary, while all other races are inclusionary. As soon as you have a drop of anything not "white" in you, you're not white anymore. Barack Obama has a black father and a white mother. Shouldn't that mean he is both equally black and white? Society says "no," he is just black. Yet at the same time you have white people who have like a Cherokee great-great-grandmother or something who claim to be "white and native." Unfortunately, society does not work like that. Being white doesn't become inclusionary when you feel like it. You can't not be white when it's convenient for you, just like you can't be white if you're... anything else. Mixed children (fuck I hate that term) can suffer from both sides. Koreans have told my daughter shes not really Korean because her mom is white. White folks will tell her shes not white cause her father is Korean. My wifes family struggled with dealing in "other then white" family members. My mother had issues with my wife early on but warmed up after some time passed. I will say in my limited experience that black folks seem the most open with acceptance and Latin folks not far behind. Asians are the fucking worse though. Sorry for my side rant. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fizzzzle Posted October 23, 2021 Share Posted October 23, 2021 It seems to me that Brazil gets the closest, but there is still a lot of "colorism" there. One of my best friends in high school was a Brazilian and a straight up ginger. Colorism is absolutely a thing in Brazil, but the lines between white/black/brown are so blurred that they become meaningless Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CastlevaniaNut18 Posted October 23, 2021 Share Posted October 23, 2021 I have a new coworker who is mixed, Black father, White mother, but she can “pass” for white. We were talking last night and she was telling me how the other day she kinda low key got upset because a Black tech from another floor came to visit us and it got brought up and she got kinda vocal about telling her she wasn’t Black enough because she didn’t “act or look Black.” So yeah, it goes both ways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fizzzzle Posted October 23, 2021 Share Posted October 23, 2021 42 minutes ago, SimpleG said: Mixed children (fuck I hate that term) can suffer from both sides. Koreans have told my daughter shes not really Korean because her mom is white. White folks will tell her shes not white cause her father is Korean. My wifes family struggled with dealing in "other then white" family members. My mother had issues with my wife early on but warmed up after some time passed. I will say in my limited experience that black folks seem the most open with acceptance and Latin folks not far behind. Asians are the fucking worse though. Sorry for my side rant. Biologically it doesn't make sense. Asian traits (like a flat nose) tend to be a dominant trait. Asian traits seem to spread to anyone who has them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 23, 2021 Share Posted October 23, 2021 15 hours ago, SimpleG said: Mixed children (fuck I hate that term) can suffer from both sides. Koreans have told my daughter shes not really Korean because her mom is white. White folks will tell her shes not white cause her father is Korean. My wifes family struggled with dealing in "other then white" family members. My mother had issues with my wife early on but warmed up after some time passed. I will say in my limited experience that black folks seem the most open with acceptance and Latin folks not far behind. Asians are the fucking worse though. Sorry for my side rant. Being biracial myself, and particularly being one of four brothers who run the gamut from very white-ish (me) to very Black-ish, it is interesting to see the way social circles include or reject each of us on the basis of racial identity over our lifetimes. It isn’t something I care about much, but it kinda makes the notions of race laughable to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyser_Soze Posted October 23, 2021 Share Posted October 23, 2021 Still amazed by the random guy on the bus who shouted at me, "Your daddy's black ain't he?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remarkableriots Posted October 31, 2021 Share Posted October 31, 2021 The white student braving racial politics in South Africa WWW.BBC.COM Jess Griesel faces a backlash for joining a party that backs the interests of poor black South Africans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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