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~*Colin Trevorrow's Star Wars: Episode IX - Duel of the Fates OT*~


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22 minutes ago, TheGreatGamble said:

There was no Holdo manoeuvre done in this movie. I've seen it twice, that was not what was happening. 

The effect they used on the ship over Endor looks like only one thing we’ve ever seen: the Holdo. Could just be more crap filmmaking on JJ’s part, but it certainly looks like the Holdo.

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36 minutes ago, SaysWho? said:

I have a feeling that I'll find stuff to like about this long-term. The PTs aren't good movies but there are aspects or scenes I like, so I feel there will be things I like about this. And at the least, I'll enjoy watching McDiarmid scenes.

Same here... I was watching the Phantom Menace earlier and realized Palpatine's political machinations are actually pretty well done.

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20 minutes ago, TheGreatGamble said:

I thought it was a ship breaking up as it fell into a gravity well. I could be wrong though. 

I paused it the other day and compared it with the scene in TLJ, that shot over Endor looks the same to my eyes. I actually didn’t notice it until @Anzo mentioned it after their second viewing. 

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48 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

I paused it the other day and compared it with the scene in TLJ, that shot over Endor looks the same to my eyes. I actually didn’t notice it until @Anzo mentioned it after their second viewing. 

I never denied that this film has problems, so you guys could definitely be right. And you had the ability to pause, so you would see more. It's pretty much just a flash in motion. So you could be right as well. I just didn't see that during my viewings. 

 

I wonder if the visual dictionary will have more on it. 

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6 hours ago, TheGreatGamble said:

I never denied that this film has problems, so you guys could definitely be right. And you had the ability to pause, so you would see more. It's pretty much just a flash in motion. So you could be right as well. I just didn't see that during my viewings. 

 

I wonder if the visual dictionary will have more on it. 

Disney will probably have a comic where force ghost Anakin tears star destroyer in half to save a defenseless Endor. lol

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The Rise of Skywalker writer explains why Kelly Marie Tran had a reduced role

 

Quote

Terrio told Awards Daily that he and Abrams “adore” Tran and that the character’s role was originally more significant. Tran shot scenes where the character interacts with General Leia Organa, whose performance was created using Carrie Fisher’s deleted scenes from The Force Awaken. But the team ran into post-production difficulties making the Tico-Leia scenes believable.

 

“One of the reasons that Rose has a few less scenes than we would like her to have has to do with the difficulty of using Carrie Fisher’s footage in the way we wanted to,” Terrio told Awards Daily. “We wanted Rose to be the anchor at the rebel base who was with Leia. We thought we couldn’t leave Leia at the base without any of the principals who we love, so Leia and Rose were working together … As the process evolved, a few scenes we’d written with Rose and Leia turned out to not meet the standard of photorealism that we’d hoped for. Those scenes, unfortunately, fell out of the film.”

Terrio added: “The last thing we were doing was deliberately trying to sideline Rose. We adore the character, and we adore Kelly — so much so that we anchored her with our favorite person in this galaxy, General Leia.”

 

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1 minute ago, Kal-El814 said:

LOLOK

 

I can actually buy this explanation, particularly since we know some of Rose's scenes were cut (though it doesn't seem like anything crucial, sooo.... there are still big issues).

 

But even if that's 100% the explanation and there was no outside influence from the neckbeards on Twitter, it would really go into the writing and how ill-conceived using out-of-context Leia footage was. A bit of it is fine, but the way she reacts to what others say seems weird. You have to write the script around her out-of-context lines, which leads to Leia seeming out of place sometimes. Other times, it worked, but because of the difficulty of pulling it off, why not utilize a living actor more instead of giving a dead actor more to do than a living one?

 

One of the things I loved about TLJ is everyone had big and/or memorable moments. Finn saying, "Rebel scum," was a fantastically written piece of evolution for him. Rose saving Finn. Leia using the Force and having that great scene with Kylo as they both sensed each other. Kylo's got too many to list ("MORE!" his entire throne scene with Rey and Snoke), Rey's got a ton, Luke with his sass ("Feel that? That's the Force!" "See ya round, kid.") and his wipe the dirt off your shoulder move and his wink, Poe's epiphany on what the Resistance is and what Luke was doing, Holdo's maneuver, Snoke's taunting, Hux's comic relief and tension with Kylo (I stand by thinking Hux being the mole being a great evolution of his character considering his relationship with Kylo in the previous two movies)...

 

Fucking Rose's sister and broom boy were more memorable in TLJ than Rose was in RoS. >__>

 

Even more evidence of how well thought-out TLJ was and how well-utilized everyone was.

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1 hour ago, SaysWho? said:

 

I can actually buy this explanation, particularly since we know some of Rose's scenes were cut (though it doesn't seem like anything crucial, sooo.... there are still big issues).

 

But even if that's 100% the explanation and there was no outside influence from the neckbeards on Twitter, it would really go into the writing and how ill-conceived using out-of-context Leia footage was. A bit of it is fine, but the way she reacts to what others say seems weird. You have to write the script around her out-of-context lines, which leads to Leia seeming out of place sometimes. Other times, it worked, but because of the difficulty of pulling it off, why not utilize a living actor more instead of giving a dead actor more to do than a living one?

 

One of the things I loved about TLJ is everyone had big and/or memorable moments. Finn saying, "Rebel scum," was a fantastically written piece of evolution for him. Rose saving Finn. Leia using the Force and having that great scene with Kylo as they both sensed each other. Kylo's got too many to list ("MORE!" his entire throne scene with Rey and Snoke), Rey's got a ton, Luke with his sass ("Feel that? That's the Force!" "See ya round, kid.") and his wipe the dirt off your shoulder move and his wink, Poe's epiphany on what the Resistance is and what Luke was doing, Holdo's maneuver, Snoke's taunting, Hux's comic relief and tension with Kylo (I stand by thinking Hux being the mole being a great evolution of his character considering his relationship with Kylo in the previous two movies)...

 

Fucking Rose's sister and broom boy were more memorable in TLJ than Rose was in RoS. >__>

 

Even more evidence of how well thought-out TLJ was and how well-utilized everyone was.

It's bullshit... they could have easily given whatever lines Leia had to someone else. Leaving Rose on the Rebel HQ, how substantial would those scenes have really been anyway? There was literally nothing going on there. They deliberately minimized Rose to appease racist incels.

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Even if she was originally given more lines (which I can believe), the issue is that they sidelined her entirely and put her with the cast member that was dead and was going to stay in one place the whole movie, and therefore be inconsequential to both the plot and to character development. Even if she had double or triple the lines she ended up having, it was still a huge slap in the face to Rose. Imagine if, in 1983, Lando didn't show up in ROTJ and Han was like "where's Lando?" and Leia went "oh he helped us out for the past year, but then he stayed back at the secret base to study death star plans in case one pops up again," all because of racists.

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2 minutes ago, CitizenVectron said:

Even if she was originally given more lines (which I can believe), the issue is that they sidelined her entirely and put her with the cast member that was dead and was going to stay in one place the whole movie, and therefore be inconsequential to both the plot and to character development. Even if she had double or triple the lines she ended up having, it was still a huge slap in the face to Rose. Imagine if, in 1983, Lando didn't show up in ROTJ and Han was like "where's Lando?" and Leia went "oh he helped us out for the past year, but then he stayed back at the secret base to study death star plans in case one pops up again," all because of racists.

This is a great point... ironically Star Wars fans were a lot more tolerant 30 plus years ago than they are now apparently.  Maybe because Lando is a dude?

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I thought she was fine, but again, my answer to anyone who didn't like her is: Then have JJ write better material for her. Or did people not like the actress for actual performance reasons? 

 

I don't see why she couldn't have at least been on the strike team at the end, with the plan to have her use her tech abilities to take down the control tower or something. Didn't even need to have her be with Finn, just have her on the team.

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I thought Tran was cheesy and played off of Boyega poorly in almost every scene she was in. I really didn’t hear anybody have particularly positive things to say about her or the character until losers started harassing her online.

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Rose was instrumental in being the moral compass that propels Finn's character. 

 

And I really hate the idea of introducing a character to have a big role and then eliminating the character almost entirely in the subsequent film. Also, whoever the bearded guy (not Snap) was at the Resistance base, that part was dumb and worthless. Having more Rose and less him would have been preferred. 

 

 

I didn't like what the movie did. I accept what it did as an end. But it isn't a satisfying one. 

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FYI:

 

In the original leaks, Ben was yeeted into the pit by Palps and didn't come back. They killed him off. Then in reshoots they apparently changed it so that he climbed out, saved Rey (who died in the reshoots), and then Ben survived (and was on Tatooine at the end). Then they changed it again so that he did in her arms. This is why the shots are edited strangely (and they used reversed footage) in his death scene and on Tatooine.

 

Like, this movie really could have used another 6 months of script re-writes. Disney deserves all the criticism they get for this trilogy. I love TLJ and enjoy TFA, and even though I am not one of those people saying the entire thing needed to be planned out completely...I do think that they should have just delayed the entire project for a year (to give Brad Bird more time on TFA) and then spread them out by three years each instead of two).

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3 minutes ago, CayceG said:

Rose was instrumental in being the moral compass that propels Finn's character. 

 

And I really hate the idea of introducing a character to have a big role and then eliminating the character almost entirely in the subsequent film. Also, whoever the bearded guy (not Snap) was at the Resistance base, that part was dumb and worthless. Having more Rose and less him would have been preferred. 

 

 

I didn't like what the movie did. I accept what it did as an end. But it isn't a satisfying one. 

 

 

Allegedly that guy (from Lost) was in the background in TFA (but was cut), and so they wanted him around again because he would be in the background of the unused Leia scenes...to provide some sort of continuity. That's also the reason Rey went back to wearing her TFA white clothes instead of her new ones in TLJ.

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25 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

I don’t believe anybody actually wanted more Rose in the movie.

 

I kept waiting for her to do something the whole movie and waited for her to show up in the celebration at the end. While we were still in the theater, my friend and I said, "Why did they just drop Finn and Rose's relationship?"

 

2 minutes ago, CitizenVectron said:

FYI:

 

In the original leaks, Ben was yeeted into the pit by Palps and didn't come back. They killed him off. Then in reshoots they apparently changed it so that he climbed out, saved Rey (who died in the reshoots), and then Ben survived (and was on Tatooine at the end). Then they changed it again so that he did in her arms. This is why the shots are edited strangely (and they used reversed footage) in his death scene and on Tatooine.

 

Like, this movie really could have used another 6 months of script re-writes. Disney deserves all the criticism they get for this trilogy. I love TLJ and enjoy TFA, and even though I am not one of those people saying the entire thing needed to be planned out completely...I do think that they should have just delayed the entire project for a year (to give Brad Bird more time on TFA) and then spread them out by three years each instead of two).

 

TLJ had two and was excellent.

 

The issue isn't the two years. I'm pretty sure RJ could have done the whole trilogy from 2015 - 2019 and been fine.

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2 minutes ago, SaysWho? said:

 

I kept waiting for her to do something the whole movie and waited for her to show up in the celebration at the end. While we were still in the theater, my friend and I said, "Why did they just drop Finn and Rose's relationship?"

 

 

TLJ had two and was excellent.

 

The issue isn't the two years. I'm pretty sure RJ could have done the whole trilogy from 2015 - 2019 and been fine.

 

TLJ actually had between 3-5 years. Johnson was awarded the movie before TFA started filming, and was on the project the whole time. The script was finished before TFA finished filming. 

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1 minute ago, CitizenVectron said:

 

TLJ actually had between 3-5 years. Johnson was awarded the movie before TFA started filming, and was on the project the whole time. The script was finished before TFA finished filming. 

 

You said the movies should be spaced out three years instead of two. From your post it sounds like TFA should have had more time and then everything should have been spaced more:

 

"I do think that they should have just delayed the entire project for a year (to give Brad Bird more time on TFA) and then spread them out by three years each instead of two)."

 

I'm suggesting that's not the issue.

 

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Just now, SaysWho? said:

 

You said the movies should be spaced out three years instead of two. From your post it sounds like TFA should have had more time and then everything should have been spaced more:

 

"I do think that they should have just delayed the entire project for a year (to give Brad Bird more time on TFA) and then spread them out by three years each instead of two)."

 

I'm suggesting that's not the issue.

 

 

I think that TFA and ROS needed more time, since JJ basically had less than a year to do the scripts and other pre-production on them do to him taking over late in the process for both movies. Instead of doing that, Disney should have given him extra time, spacing them out more. JJ asked for more time on TFA and was refused beyond the initial 6-month delay. I assume he also asked for ROS.

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1 minute ago, CitizenVectron said:

 

I think that TFA and ROS needed more time, since JJ basically had less than a year to do the scripts and other pre-production on them do to him taking over late in the process for both movies. Instead of doing that, Disney should have given him extra time, spacing them out more. JJ asked for more time on TFA and was refused beyond the initial 6-month delay. I assume he also asked for ROS.

 

TFA feels significantly more polished than RoS, and considering its critical acclaim and my own love for it, I think he was fine and that delay was good enough.

 

RoS, I know I talked about earlier in the thread, needed more time to feel tighter and cleaner and work on the pacing and edits, but the story beats were JJ. I don't know if he'd have thought something better than, "Look at this test tube of Snokes."

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4 minutes ago, SaysWho? said:

 

TFA feels significantly more polished than RoS, and considering its critical acclaim and my own love for it, I think he was fine and that delay was good enough.

 

RoS, I know I talked about earlier in the thread, needed more time to feel tighter and cleaner and work on the pacing and edits, but the story beats were JJ. I don't know if he'd have thought something better than, "Look at this test tube of Snokes."

 

Oh yeah like it still would have been a weak film plot-wise, but hopefully more time would have at least allowed some refinement. But like you say, a lot would have still sucked.

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