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~*Colin Trevorrow's Star Wars: Episode IX - Duel of the Fates OT*~

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ByWatterson

ByWatterson

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Posted
5 minutes ago, SaysWho? said:

 

Considering your opinions of the PT, I'm honestly surprised!

 

PT is antiseptic, cold, and distant. ROS's main "flaw" is that it arguably leans too much into heart, warmth, and optimism. 

 

Which has always been the main reason Star Wars works, when it works - even in ESB. And it works here. I mean, I think Return of the Jedi is almost indisputably a bad movie. And yet, when it stops trying it sell me toys, the heart of the characters makes it a pleasant experience. ROS is not a bad movie at all, but succeeds for the same reason ROTJ is remembered fondly. It's just NICE to be around these characters' energy and pluckiness. It's like the Cheers of movies. 

 

ROS has already started to trend ahead of TLJ in box office. I'll bet it ends up ahead on strong word of mouth. 

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SaysWho?

SaysWho?

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Just now, ByWatterson said:

 

PT is antiseptic, cold, and distant. ROS's main "flaw" is that it arguably leans too much into heart, warmth, and optimism. 

 

Which has always been the main reason Star Wars works, when it works - even in ESB. And it works here. 

 

It has already started to trend ahead of TLJ in box office. I'll bet it ends up ahead on strong word of mouth. 

 

Word of mouth isn't actually as good, but it's certainly benefiting from a holiday week that TLJ did not.

 

Still feels weird as a trilogy finale that there's even a chance it doesn't surpass the second film domestically. 

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ByWatterson

ByWatterson

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5 minutes ago, SaysWho? said:

 

Word of mouth isn't actually as good, but it's certainly benefiting from a holiday week that TLJ did not.

 

 

 Look at user scores vs. critics on RT. TLJ was heralded by critics and, by this metric (which isn't perfect, but I think tells us more than CinemaScore - I mean, what is the actual difference between and A- and a B+...) ROS is far more popular among moviegoers. 

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ByWatterson

ByWatterson

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2 minutes ago, johnny said:

“This is a good movie because it makes me feel good” 

 

ok 

 

Sure. 

 

Actual emotional reaction is kind of hard to pull off. I already said all of its flaws are real. 

 

But they don't matter because they're crushed under the sheer weight of fun and heart. I guess we could celebrate the 173rd Scorcese movie about a sociopath but...nah. I like this better at this point in my life. 

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SaysWho?

SaysWho?

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1 minute ago, ByWatterson said:

 

 Look at user scores vs. critics on RT. TLJ was heralded by critics and, by this metric (which isn't perfect, but I think tells us more than CinemaScore - I mean, what is the actual difference between and A- and a B+...) ROS is far more popular among moviegoers. 

 

TLJ was review-bombed. There are groups "reverse review-bombing" RoS.

 

CinemaScores are far more reliable than groups who review bomb movies like TLJ, and it got a great A while RoS was a B+. It didn't get better word of mouth than any of the Star Wars films since the prequels.

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Joe

Joe

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1 hour ago, ByWatterson said:

 

Sure. 

 

Actual emotional reaction is kind of hard to pull off. I already said all of its flaws are real. 

 

But they don't matter because they're crushed under the sheer weight of fun and heart. I guess we could celebrate the 173rd Scorcese movie about a sociopath but...nah. I like this better at this point in my life. 

 

Wait, we are still talking about Star Wars: Rise of Motherfuckin' Skywalker, right?

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Guest

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Posted
1 hour ago, ByWatterson said:

 

 Look at user scores vs. critics on RT. TLJ was heralded by critics and, by this metric (which isn't perfect, but I think tells us more than CinemaScore - I mean, what is the actual difference between and A- and a B+...) ROS is far more popular among moviegoers. 

TLJ was review bombed on Rottentomatoes by Russian bot farms. This isn’t even in dispute :p 

 

Our actual industry research tools show across the board, reaction to ROS is slightly worse than TLJ. Not hugely, just slightly.

 

And as I’ve mentioned here and elsewhere, comparing the BO takes of these films will be wonky. For example, ROS opened much lower than it would have if Christmas wasn’t it’s 5th day of release due to all the last minute weekend shopping and travel. Conversely, having the Holiday in the middle of its first week as opposed to in its second week like TLJ is a big boost. It will be interesting to compare second weeks with TLJs being the Christmas holiday and ROS’ New Years.

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johnny

johnny

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Cinemascore tells you a lot and is much more trustworthy than some internet website with random user submitted reviews. 
 

a b+ for a franchise like Star Wars is not good. It takes scores from opening night, so arguably some of the most excited and passionate fans. 
 

If any movie gets below a B, something has gone wrong which could be the movie sucking or the marketing being shit/misleading. 

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Guest

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It should be noted, the most heavily weighted aspect of stuff like Cinemascore is the “recommend/not recommend” piece, which is really what WOM means.

 

This stuff is pretty WOM proof though.

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TheGreatGamble

TheGreatGamble

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Posted

The movie is no masterpiece. It has problems with flow, it desperately needed to be slowed down for the first hour, and it's obvious there was no plan going into this. But it was still fun. I liked the redemption of Ben. I even liked seeing the emperor again, even though he was shoehorned in there. It was cool to see Rey bury Luke and Leia's sabers together on tattooine. It was nice to see Chewy get his medal. I liked Finn and Poe. I liked the Rey/Kylo stuff. 

 

 

The people claiming this is better then TLJ are absolutely ridiculous, that was probably the second best movie in the saga. But as I said the first time, it's fun if you can just sit back and enjoy it for what it is, a Star Wars movie. 

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Spawn_of_Apathy

Spawn_of_Apathy

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The stuff I did like in the movie

 

I liked seeing Rey train. I got the feeling she has been serous in her training since we last saw her. 
 

I liked the energy and relationship between Finn and Poe. That is something I could watch more adventures of. 
 

I found C3P0 to be the just about most tolerable he’s ever been in the franchise. At least since the OT.  He was funny, and didn’t grate on me. His sub plot wasn’t great, since it had no real consequences. But I felt he added to the scenes more than he detracted. 
 

I really liked the dynamic between Rey and Kylo. Kylo still trying t get Rey to join him, and I feel like it is because he doesn’t want to be alone. And she can understand him better than anyone
 

 I liked when Rey grabbed that ship and the ensuing tug of war with Kylo. You can see it wasn’t easy for Rey. Even without Kylo she was straining. I felt like the ship should have ripped apart instead of the Force Lighting, but whatever. 
 

I like that you can still see the skill gap between them. Kylo is really just making sure he doesn’t get hurt. He’s not trying to hurt, or kill Rey. And you can see in the saber clashes he’s ahead of her. I just like this because he’s been training and practicing for years at this point. Much longer than Rey. It kind of reminded me of Luke vs Vader in ESB.L, where Vader was clearly going easy in Luke. 
 

I liked Ben getting to have his do-over with his father. Making the right decision this time. I then liked the swagger he had as Ben. You can see the Solo in him. lol

 

I liked Luke still being Rey’s guide, like Kenobi and Yoda were for him. The lightsaber line was corny, but everything after that I really liked. 

 

I really Rey fighting Palpatine’s guards. She was throwing blaster bolts, deflecting them, cutting them down. She looked like a proper badass. Much more proficient than fighting Snoke’s guards in TLJ. 
 

I liked creepy Palpatine. Especially when he was trying to manipulate Rey into taking power from him, to join the Sith. 
 

I really loved the Jedi of old speaking to Rey. I loved hearing Ashoka, and Yoda’s “never have you been alone.” Choked me up a bit. 
 

I liked Rey burying Luke’s and Leia’s lightsabers. Kind of putting them to rest in the planet where the Skywalker line started. And I don’t care, I liked Ray taking the Skywalker name. Luke was the closest thing she had as a father and Leia the closest she had to a mother. She may not be blood, but wherever the universe takes Rey, the legacy of Skywalker will live on. 
 

I REALLY like that Re built her own lightsaber. I like that it looks to be part of her staff, giving it a very personal touch. More so than all the Jedi sabers that look professionally manufactured. I was not happy when Disney started calling the Anakin saber Rey’s. Not because it is Anakin’s, but because Rey deserves her own saber. And she got it now. 
 

compared to my list on the previous page, I liked far more moments than I am just accepting because I have no choice. Overall I am pleased with the movie. I will see it again. 

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TheLeon

TheLeon

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1 hour ago, Mercury33 said:

There was emotion in RoS? Where? I didn’t take any bathroom breaks(I should have) so I dont think I missed it. I felt more emotion in a 15 minute episode of Bluey my kid watched this morning than the entirety of the 2 1/2 hour, 9 movie culminating train wreck that was RoS. 

By far the most emotional moment for me was when Rey accidentally destroyed the transport ship and killed Chewie. That was thrilling. I was stunned, and audibly said “holy shit”. Then 5 minutes later that was completely undone and it was REALLY hard for me to care about anything else that happened in the rest of the movie. 

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Mercury33

Mercury33

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2 minutes ago, TheLeon said:

By far the most emotional moment for me was when Rey accidentally destroyed the transport ship and killed Chewie. That was thrilling. I was stunned, and audibly said “holy shit”. Then 5 minutes later that was completely undone and it was REALLY hard for me to care about anything else that happened in the rest of the movie. 


Agreed. But to me it wasn’t even that emotional, it could have been. They could have take another minute or two to really build the tension. But instead it resulted in something that was surprising for sure but lacked the real emotional punch that potentially killing a main character should have. Which kinda sums up the whole movie for me 

 

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69los

69los

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47 minutes ago, Mercury33 said:


Agreed. But to me it wasn’t even that emotional, it could have been. They could have take another minute or two to really build the tension. But instead it resulted in something that was surprising for sure but lacked the real emotional punch that potentially killing a main character should have. Which kinda sums up the whole movie for me 

 

 

It certainly didn't help that there was a scene in the trailer of Chewie and Lando in the Falcon which didn't happen yet.

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Alpha1Cowboy

Alpha1Cowboy

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Plot holes or Fortunate Coicidences galore...but a fun movie.  Say what you want about the kiss (still on the fence myself) but they sold their sexual tension almost but not quite as good as Han and Leia.....and like 100X better than Portman and Christianson.  

 

Really like that they added the young  Luke and Leia training sequence.   So many people went into the new trilogy confused about that and probably would have been better if JJ had done that in TFA.

 

I do wish Chewie had died.....it was like the whole Marion Ravenwood psyche out in Raiders unfortunately but would have played into their vision of Rey having to deal with her relation to the force and I wish C3PO had lost his memories for good.  

 

But I get it....just like the OT they weren't into killing off characters because it's a family film.

 

 

 

 

 

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johnny

johnny

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3 hours ago, Mercury33 said:


Agreed. But to me it wasn’t even that emotional, it could have been. They could have take another minute or two to really build the tension. But instead it resulted in something that was surprising for sure but lacked the real emotional punch that potentially killing a main character should have. Which kinda sums up the whole movie for me 

 

I think her shooting lightning for the first time also takes away from the death cuz you’re like holy shit she can shoot lightning. 

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elbobo

elbobo

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Posted

this was a dumb movie, star wars has always been kind of stupid and silly but this cranked it up a notch or two

 

"yeah lets use the holdo maneuver to take out the imperial ships, it is super effective"

 

"we can't do that, it is an impossible 1 in a million shot that can never be replicated because plot"

 

2 hours later there is a shot of the aftermath of it being done.

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Kal-El814

Kal-El814

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Posted
2 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

So I just started The Clones Wars cartoon... I'm on the second episode and apparently Jedi CAN survive in space for a short amount of time. Jedi Master Plo does it in the second episode

 

 

So why were Star Wars nerds so pissed off when Leia did it in The Last Jedi for a much shorter period of time :confused:

Plo has goggles and doesn't have a vagina?

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Spawn_of_Apathy

Spawn_of_Apathy

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22 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

So I just started The Clones Wars cartoon... I'm on the second episode and apparently Jedi CAN survive in space for a short amount of time. Jedi Master Plo does it in the second episode

 

 

So why were Star Wars nerds so pissed off when Leia did it in The Last Jedi for a much shorter period of time :confused:

It may be more to do with his race than being a Jedi. Maybe it is both. The clones did not fare so well. 
 

 

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TheGreatGamble

TheGreatGamble

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, elbobo said:

this was a dumb movie, star wars has always been kind of stupid and silly but this cranked it up a notch or two

 

"yeah lets use the holdo maneuver to take out the imperial ships, it is super effective"

 

"we can't do that, it is an impossible 1 in a million shot that can never be replicated because plot"

 

2 hours later there is a shot of the aftermath of it being done.

There was no Holdo manoeuvre done in this movie. I've seen it twice, that was not what was happening. 

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skillzdadirecta

skillzdadirecta

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Posted
1 minute ago, CayceG said:

 

What WAS happening to that FO Star Destroyer over Endor then?

 

I was gonna ask the same thing. Another misconception is that when Holdo did it in TLJ, she destroyed the whole first order fleet... she didn't. She crippled the Main ship and may have destroyed whatever ships were in her flight path. That's it.

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SuperSpreader

SuperSpreader

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, skillzdadirecta said:

So I just started The Clones Wars cartoon... I'm on the second episode and apparently Jedi CAN survive in space for a short amount of time. Jedi Master Plo does it in the second episode

 

 

So why were Star Wars nerds so pissed off when Leia did it in The Last Jedi for a much shorter period of time :confused:

No one knew Leia was a trained Jedi and most ppl haven't watched the cartoon, I know I've only seen the movies. (except solo)

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