General Gaming WOMAN FIRED FROM JOB! Don't miss this hot Guild Wars 2 drama.

[Chris-]

1 minute ago, SFLUFAN said:

None -- OK, very few -- of us on D1P do that.

 

Maybe people have come around, but on the old board there was plenty of, 'Men get it just as bad' and 'It's just talk on the internet, get over it' arguments being thrown around.

[Engel]

I wonder if they fired him to cut off any "double standard" complaints.

[Bacon]

34 minutes ago, SFLUFAN said:

Uh-huh.

"Uh-huh" what? To all of that or do you just not think things will return to normal. It seems to me Anet is already trying say it is over and back to business soon.

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

1 minute ago, Bacon said:

"Uh-huh" what? To all of that or do you just not think things will return to normal.

 

Yes.

[Bacon]

3 minutes ago, SFLUFAN said:

 

Yes.

why

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

11 minutes ago, Engel said:

I wonder if they fired him to cut off any "double standard" complaints.

That thought crossed my mind as well.

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

2 minutes ago, Bacon said:

why

Because it's 2018 and we've had multiple examples of how these things occur in recent years.

[HGLatinBoy]

8 minutes ago, Bacon said:

"Uh-huh" what? To all of that or do you just not think things will return to normal. It seems to me Anet is already trying say it is over and back to business soon.

Arena Net isn't saying shit except for the initial statement. The reddit community wants to put the issue to rest because it is DONE. 

[Bacon]

2 minutes ago, SFLUFAN said:

Because it's 2018 and we've had multiple examples of how these things occur in recent years.

I don't know what examples you are talking about. I don't recall the "gamer" portion to have actually been happy with any of the outcomes, except for this one.

5 minutes ago, HGLatinBoy said:

Arena Net isn't saying shit except for the initial statement.

Yeah, I guess it isn't Anet as whole. I was mainly referring to this:

 

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

ArenaNet knew that Price was outspoken on issues involving anti-woman toxicity in the gaming industry (both video games and tabletop games) when she was hired and the man-children of Reddit had their oh-so-predictable and tiresome "SJW fit" so it's not like ANet management was unaware of the "risk" they were taking when they hired her and I'm assuming that they evaluated it as one worth taking for her writing talents.

 

So what exactly changed between her hiring and those tweets from July 4 which are not necessarily too out-of-line from her previous public comments for ANet management to make seemingly radical decision?  I really do think that the Bain tweet might have been a "bridge too far" for ANet management and that she was asked to be more circumspect in her public use of Twitter.  There is a difference between taking on Reddit man-children and appearing to dance on someone's grave publicly (even if that person acted like a Reddit man-child himself on more than one occasion).  

 

In any event, the more I think about it, the more ANet looks like they bungled this, especially if firing the guy was simply a means to head off a "double standard" claim which REALLY does appear to be the case.

[HGLatinBoy]

I dont know if you play GW2 or visit the subreddit but the there are  lot of devs the communicate and are well liked on the subreddit and what they're saying is that what happened to price wont stop the other devs from still engaging with the community.

[Scape Zero]

4 hours ago, LazyPiranha said:

Can someone point out to me the firing worthy offense here?  Being a salty asshole on twitter now is grounds for losing your job as opposed to any other disciplinary action?  Yes, it was absolutely a stupid thing to do and engage in, and she handled it poorly, but an outright termination is just absurd.  

 

Also, let’s not pretend there isn’t a shitty angry mob of dipshits that eagerly jump into whatever torch wielding mob is aimed at yet another woman in game dev.  Did this start off as a targeted campaing against someone?  Doesn’t seem to be that way, but it sure got its signal boosted way past where it normally would have been because of the same ridiculous chodes that are whining about authenticity in Battlefield because of the wimenz in it.

 

She set thousands of her followers after a person for "*sightly* disagreeing" with her in a respectful way, calling them sexist.

 

I'm sure if all she said was her first remark, she would have been fine. However throwing that post up in front of her 10k followers, calling the person sexist, is a bad fucking look for a company. ANet doesn't want to be known as the company that supports their developers targeting harassment at their customers for respectfully disagreeing with them. It's a bad look.

[Engel]

He wasn't just a customer. He is an anet partner, someone who promotes their game on youtube.

[LazyPiranha]

16 minutes ago, Scape Zero said:

 

She set thousands of her followers after a person for "*sightly* disagreeing" with her in a respectful way, calling them sexist.

 

I'm sure if all she said was her first remark, she would have been fine. However throwing that post up in front of her 10k followers, calling the person sexist, is a bad fucking look for a company. ANet doesn't want to be known as the company that supports their developers targeting harassment at their customers for respectfully disagreeing with them. It's a bad look.

 

She didn’t not “set thousands of followers” on the guy.  She did not state or even imply that this person should be hounded or bothered.  There is no targeted harassment on her part at all, unless you call every single negative response on twitter to be targeted harassment.  You can’t just go around claiming that any time a person with a decent following throws some shade in someone’s direction that suddenly it means they are intentionally calling for an online crusade against them.  

 

Now, that mass emailing of ANet and the concern trolling, that shit was targeted harassment .  The dipshits gloating that they can stomp their feet and get anyone they dislike fired, that’s targeted harassment .  Being mildly shitty to one person online is not.

[Mr.Vic20]

2 hours ago, SFLUFAN said:

I wouldn't go as far to say that it was handled "well" as much as it "might have been handled less poorly than the alternatives".

 

And that would entirely be dependent on whether or not she had been subjected to previous internal disciplinary action for similar behavior (the Bain tweet).  If she had been previously been warned, then this was the more than likely the proper course of action.  If she had NOT been previously warned, then this was handled terribly by management.  Of more interest to me is the "veteran" writer who was sacked as that one does seem to have no real precedent in his public behavior.

Eh, I'll cut the middle and say there is always room for improvement, but I side with their general approach to the matter. Truth be told, I think that we never really know all the details we would need to settle this in the "People's Court" that is the interwebnets! 

[Moa]

I, for one, am surprised that someone in the gaming industry could keep their job after expressing relief that Totalbiscuit is dead. Talk about a lack of empathy.

[Scape Zero]

54 minutes ago, LazyPiranha said:

 

She didn’t not “set thousands of followers” on the guy.  She did not state or even imply that this person should be hounded or bothered.  There is no targeted harassment on her part at all, unless you call every single negative response on twitter to be targeted harassment.  You can’t just go around claiming that any time a person with a decent following throws some shade in someone’s direction that suddenly it means they are intentionally calling for an online crusade against them.  

 

Now, that mass emailing of ANet and the concern trolling, that shit was targeted harassment .  The dipshits gloating that they can stomp their feet and get anyone they dislike fired, that’s targeted harassment .  Being mildly shitty to one person online is not.

 

Well if you love her so much, lucky you, she's in the market. You can hire her to write for your company.

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

9 minutes ago, Scape Zero said:

 

Well if you love her so much, lucky you, she's in the market. You can hire her to write for your company.

 

Hell, I'd hire her to write for D1P if I could.

[LazyPiranha]

11 minutes ago, Scape Zero said:

 

Well if you love her so much, lucky you, she's in the market. You can hire her to write for your company.

 

A good counter argument, and quite well made.

[Scape Zero]

9 minutes ago, LazyPiranha said:

 

A good counter argument, and quite well made.

 

What else is there to say? She tossed someone who didn't do anything into the feed off her followers. Call you what you want it, but obviously she's trying to fuck with that person's reputation.

 

That's a bad look. If you can't understand that, then there's nothing left to say. You have already made up your mind on this being perfectly okay, which obviously ANet disagrees with. At the end of the day, they are the ones spending the money on her and that other dude being part of the company, so it's ultimately their choice. 

[Paperclyp]

3 hours ago, LazyPiranha said:

 

She didn’t not “set thousands of followers” on the guy.  She did not state or even imply that this person should be hounded or bothered.  There is no targeted harassment on her part at all, unless you call every single negative response on twitter to be targeted harassment.  You can’t just go around claiming that any time a person with a decent following throws some shade in someone’s direction that suddenly it means they are intentionally calling for an online crusade against them.  

But this is sort of the logic people are using for why you can't fire her - that it fuels the fan base to then harass others in the industry in hopes to get anyone they disagree with fired. I don't really agree with either. 

 

For the record, I don't really think she harassed the guy directly, nor did she set the mobs on him. But she certainly flipped out over an extremely leveled and non-aggressive response to her tweet, and when he responded in another non-threatening way, she acted even more inappropriately and obtuse. 

 

Austin Walker made a few points that I considered and at least understand where he's coming from. But on its face he still feels the firing is completely out of line, and I just don't agree with that. I would consider changing my opinion if I did learn that this was like the first time she has ever been approached by the company to change the way she interacts with the public. But I do find that hard to believe after she was spitting on a dead guy on the same forum. 

[Pent]

Maybe I missed a line or something, but nothing she said is anything that I consider to be "bad".  I am thinking I missed a line though after reading this thread.

 

People (both sides) need to just let things go sometimes, and not try to make a mountain out of a mole hill.  I guess a lot of people nowadays think they deserve to make a news story out of something that is really nothing.

 

 

[Scape Zero]

22 hours ago, Pent said:

Maybe I missed a line or something, but nothing she said is anything that I consider to be "bad".  I am thinking I missed a line though after reading this thread.

 

People (both sides) need to just let things go sometimes, and not try to make a mountain out of a mole hill.  I guess a lot of people nowadays think they deserve to make a news story out of something that is really nothing.

 

 

 

I don't see the problem with firing Price, but I do agree. This is most definitely not a news story.

 

Tons of people get fired every day for being dicks to customers. We don't need an article for it.

[Xbob42]

"I can't write an interesting MMO character!"

 

"I respectfully disagree, and here's a few reasons why."

 

"REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE"

 

The entirety of this Twitter exchange.

It's really bizarre, too, since I think Guild Wars 2 already has fairly interesting MMO characters, definitely far-and-away above the rest of the industry. My little mouse man is a sassy fuck with his own opinions and engages in plenty of conversations. (All Guild Wars 2 main characters are fully voiced and are not silent protagonists at all. And it's awesome.) I've never really considered him a blank slate at all. You also make plenty of choices in Guild Wars 2 that influence multiple things, including which NPCs follow you in your adventures later on. Choices I made in 2012 are still felt today in terms of that, at least. I dunno how deep it goes, but I disagree with this woman's presumptions entirely based on even the launch game.

 

I think what happened here is this lady probably has a bit of a victim complex, maybe justified, maybe not, I have no idea, as I'm sure she gets plenty of shit, but she took it out the completely wrong way on the completely wrong person for the completely wrong reason. And then she kept fucking going. His "criticism" was a very mild-mannered, totally inoffensive disagreement after thanking her for her insight. Then she pulls the "I'm the ARTISTE, you goddamn plebe!" card because she's "been in the industry for 10 years" and it comes off as a child throwing an utterly ridiculous tantrum.

 

I dunno what set her off, but I imagine it wasn't actually that guy's tweet. If it was, then she might have bigger issues to deal with. You can't redirect your anger of toxicity and whatnot on completely innocent people. That just makes you the toxic asshole.

[SimpleG]

22 hours ago, Pent said:

Maybe I missed a line or something, but nothing she said is anything that I consider to be "bad"

Calling one your companies biggest streamers/promoter a rando asshat is what I consider to be "bad" 

I dont think this was in OP links so you may have not seen it.

[Dre801]

She pushed that shit in a direction it didn't need to go.  Jesus, woman.  Put your claws back in.

 

Anyway, she's another who celebrated TotalBiscuit's death, so fuck her for that alone.

[SuperSpreader]

[HGLatinBoy]

She did not just single out anyone. She attacked 2 content creators and basically said she'd block anyone who even tried to talk to her about branching dialogue trees she took it as a personal affront to her professional career if anyone tried talking to her and said "this is my private twitter account where I don't have to pretend to like you" meaning she puts on a public face and acts like she likes the guild wars 2 community during official events. She's not wrong but at the same time she is engaging the community thinking shes free to say what she wants because shes off company clock and using her personal twitter account to do so. But shes doing it publicly while wearing the company badge on her Twitter account. 

 

Also good ol Randy Pitchford of Gearbox has reached out to offer them jobs.

oh no wait he's just jumping on the bandwagon. 

[BuckFly]

On July 6, 2018 at 6:29 PM, Paperclyp said:

But this is sort of the logic people are using for why you can't fire her - that it fuels the fan base to then harass others in the industry in hopes to get anyone they disagree with fired. I don't really agree with either. 

 

For the record, I don't really think she harassed the guy directly, nor did she set the mobs on him. But she certainly flipped out over an extremely leveled and non-aggressive response to her tweet, and when he responded in another non-threatening way, she acted even more inappropriately and obtuse. 

 

Austin Walker made a few points that I considered and at least understand where he's coming from. But on its face he still feels the firing is completely out of line, and I just don't agree with that. I would consider changing my opinion if I did learn that this was like the first time she has ever been approached by the company to change the way she interacts with the public. But I do find that hard to believe after she was spitting on a dead guy on the same forum. 

 

 

Great response, and your second paragraph just nails it.

 

Now, some may not like it, but that just really is the nuts and bolts of what this is.

[LazyPiranha]

People once again have some weird definitions of things.  That remarkably bland tweet about TB is pretty dame far removed from "dancing on his grave."  I also hope I'm not the only one here to see the irony in the exact same people demanding a woman be fired for being a dick probably had zero problems with the things TB said to make people upset with him and probably told those people to get over it.

 

My problem with the take people are going with here is that "if this was the first incident I'd feel differently but... I'm just going to assume it isn't" is an extra step you don't need to take.  Why assume this isn't the first time?  Why are you inventing a narrative that takes the company off of the hook based on pure conjecture?

[Xbob42]

Talk about creating a narrative.

 

Quote

I also hope I'm not the only one here to see the irony in the exact same people demanding a woman be fired for being a dick probably had zero problems with the things TB said to make people upset with him and probably told those people to get over it.

"There's probably a couple dudes who cross over on these two subjects like I'm assuming, so I'll base my entire argument on it"

 

And I don't think anyone's taking any extra steps on anything. She publicly lauded the death of a man while accusing him of abusing people, while later abusing totally innocent people because she's the fucking goddamn narrative writer and she knows story better than any of you rando fucking dipshit plebes. I'm sure celebrating the death of a man who had just died of cancer got her nothing but thumbs up from her company. I see a clear pattern of her using current social norms to talk shit and be a cunt. And now it bit her in the ass. Oh well. 

 

And if you don't think using your platform to directly quote someone who was CLEARLY giving their opinion while calling them a "rando asshat" and then making it about you being a woman that's getting pushed around is a method of basically directing a mob to harass someone, you're either a fucking dipshit or an ignoramus. She publicly derided this guy for absolutely no reason, clearly intending to get those that follow and respect her to blast this guy for... what, again? Absolutely nothing? Why is anyone defending this? WHAT IS THERE TO DEFEND? Did some of you not actually read the entire Twitter exchange? This woman went off the deep end and just didn't stop. It was absurd and embarrassing to read.

[BuckFly]

On 7/8/2018 at 11:12 PM, Xbob42 said:

Talk about creating a narrative.

 

"There's probably a couple dudes who cross over on these two subjects like I'm assuming, so I'll base my entire argument on it"

 

And I don't think anyone's taking any extra steps on anything. She publicly lauded the death of a man while accusing him of abusing people, while later abusing totally innocent people because she's the fucking goddamn narrative writer and she knows story better than any of you rando fucking dipshit plebes. I'm sure celebrating the death of a man who had just died of cancer got her nothing but thumbs up from her company. I see a clear pattern of her using current social norms to talk shit and be a cunt. And now it bit her in the ass. Oh well. 

 

And if you don't think using your platform to directly quote someone who was CLEARLY giving their opinion while calling them a "rando asshat" and then making it about you being a woman that's getting pushed around is a method of basically directing a mob to harass someone, you're either a fucking dipshit or an ignoramus. She publicly derided this guy for absolutely no reason, clearly intending to get those that follow and respect her to blast this guy for... what, again? Absolutely nothing? Why is anyone defending this? WHAT IS THERE TO DEFEND? Did some of you not actually read the entire Twitter exchange? This woman went off the deep end and just didn't stop. It was absurd and embarrassing to read.

Here, Bob.

 

You'll enjoy this from Polygon:

 

https://www.polygon.com/2018/7/9/17549492/arenanet-jessica-price-guild-wars-2-writer-fired

 

 

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

27 minutes ago, BuckFly said:

Here, Bob.

 

You'll enjoy this from Polygon:

 

https://www.polygon.com/2018/7/9/17549492/arenanet-jessica-price-guild-wars-2-writer-fired

If that is true and she was terminated without warning/counseling from HR for her social media activities in regard to fan interaction, then that changes my perception of events entirely, especially since ArenaNet was well aware of her social media use to address the industry's anti-woman toxicity issues.

[BuckFly]

22 minutes ago, SFLUFAN said:

If that is true and she was terminated without warning/counseling from HR for her social media activities in regard to fan interaction, then that changes my perception of events entirely, especially since ArenaNet was well aware of her social media use to address the industry's anti-woman toxicity issues.

 

 

If true, Wade I don't necessarily disagree with you.  It would also depend upon if she was hired at will and possibly what their employee handbook says on such matters.

 

For me, my "if true" is because I have first hand experience in letting employees go who were "blindsided by this and it came without warning" when there were warnings, on the record, and recent events indicated they should have known enough was enough.

 

 

[Commissar SFLUFAN]

12 minutes ago, BuckFly said:

If true, Wade I don't necessarily disagree with you.  It would also depend upon if she was hired at will and possibly what their employee handbook says on such matters.

 

For me, my "if true" is because I have first hand experience in letting employees go who were "blindsided by this and it came without warning" when there were warnings, on the record, and recent events indicated they should have known enough was enough.

Right - we have only her side from the Polygon interview regarding the events of July 5. 

 

The ArenaNet employee handbook SHOULD have a section covering social media interaction with fans if the firm does encourage that interaction as a routine part of an employee's expected functions.  This is even more important if the firm encourages an atmosphere of being "outspoken and fearless" and if "there were meetings in which executives promised us that they wanted us to speak up about the ugly things, the harmful things, and that we wouldn’t be punished for doing so..."

 

If a firm values those things, then it must make every effort to ensure that its employees understand what the "boundaries" around those things are in a culture of engagement with the community at large.  The ArenaNet CEO's statement to Polygon says "The expectation was to behave professionally and respectfully, or at least walk away."  Was that expectation communicated to employees?  Were there policies and procedures in place that documented what would happen if such an expectation was violated?