Basketball 2019 NBA Summer of Fun

[Amazatron]

Stay classy Raptor fans...

[AbsolutSurgen]

Warriors medical staff let KD back before he was healthy. Hopefully there is no long term damage. 

[Keyser_Soze]

Kawhi dominating.

[RedSoxFan9]

On 6/7/2019 at 11:37 PM, RedSoxFan9 said:

3-1 leads are dangerous 

 

[Keyser_Soze]

The Durant factor gave them was the difference in the game.

[Amazatron]

That was gutty as hell to pull that one out, but hard to see they have anything left in the tank.

[johnny]

4 hours ago, AbsolutSurgen said:

Warriors medical staff let KD back before he was healthy. Hopefully there is no long term damage. 

I think it’s ridiculous to put the blame on the staff *right away*. Players come back all the time before they’re healthy. We should wait to hear more about what happened in the days leading up to the game. And what about KD? He probably wanted to play more than anybody else in the org. Then again, the staff is supposed to protect the players. But it’s also possible they did everything correct. We need more information. I’m certainly not knowledgeable about this stuff to make an absolute decision on whose fault it is right after it happens. Ultimately both sides will take some amount of blame for a really unfortunate injury, and some of it will probably just be bad luck. 

[AbsolutSurgen]

14 hours ago, johnny said:

I think it’s ridiculous to put the blame on the staff *right away*. Players come back all the time before they’re healthy. We should wait to hear more about what happened in the days leading up to the game. And what about KD? He probably wanted to play more than anybody else in the org. Then again, the staff is supposed to protect the players. But it’s also possible they did everything correct. We need more information. I’m certainly not knowledgeable about this stuff to make an absolute decision on whose fault it is right after it happens. Ultimately both sides will take some amount of blame for a really unfortunate injury, and some of it will probably just be bad luck. 

He suffers a torn Achilles within a few minutes of being cleared to play.  KD is not a doctor -- and needs to be guided by the doctors on whether he can safely play.  I can't see how the decision to clear him is defensible.  

[johnny]

16 minutes ago, AbsolutSurgen said:

He suffers a torn Achilles within a few minutes of being cleared to play.  KD is not a doctor -- and needs to be guided by the doctors on whether he can safely play.  I can't see how the decision to clear him is defensible.  

What I’m saying is we’re not doctors and we don’t know what happened. Blaming people before knowing is amateur hour. I think we all know playing with an injury is more likely to result in re-injury or another injury. But like I said last night, people play injured all the time. Was this a situation where his calf was good enough to play and it was just unfortunate that this happened, or was he set up for failure? We don’t know. 

[AbsolutSurgen]

11 minutes ago, johnny said:

What I’m saying is we’re not doctors and we don’t know what happened. Blaming people before knowing is amateur hour. I think we all know playing with an injury is more likely to result in re-injury or another injury. But like I said last night, people play injured all the time. Was this a situation where his calf was good enough to play and it was just unfortunate that this happened, or was he set up for failure? We don’t know. 

I didn't realize I was dealing with a "professional" forum poster here.

[Amazatron]

Can’t speak to the medical details of it all, but it seems the Warriors completely bungled the situation from day 1.  Our first reaction to seeing the initial injury was that it was an achilles injury.  Then the Warriors announce that it is a mild calf strain and that he would be re-evaluated in a week to the relief of us all. Given that Durant has previously had a mild calf strain twice and returned in exactly one week, the expectations were set.  From here, they just kept delaying and delaying and failed to address that the initial injury was more serious than originally diagnosed, for whatever reason.  Clips of KD icing his injury showed the ice on his achilles, not the calf.  Then the media jumps in with their speculation that the Warriors are frustrated with Durant not coming back as soon as expected.

[Keyser_Soze]

[RedSoxFan9]

the nets have a better shot at kd. the Knicks are trash

[Commodore D]

19 hours ago, johnny said:

I think it’s ridiculous to put the blame on the staff *right away*. Players come back all the time before they’re healthy. We should wait to hear more about what happened in the days leading up to the game. And what about KD? He probably wanted to play more than anybody else in the org. Then again, the staff is supposed to protect the players. But it’s also possible they did everything correct. We need more information. I’m certainly not knowledgeable about this stuff to make an absolute decision on whose fault it is right after it happens. Ultimately both sides will take some amount of blame for a really unfortunate injury, and some of it will probably just be bad luck. 

If KD was on a contract that had him there for the next five years, I'm fairly confident he wouldn't have been cleared to play. They would have let the Raptors get this one, and go after the next three peat opportunity.

[johnny]

13 minutes ago, Commodore D said:

If KD was on a contract that had him there for the next five years, I'm fairly confident he wouldn't have been cleared to play. They would have let the Raptors get this one, and go after the next three peat opportunity.

You work in basketball ops for the warriors? Lmao. Thank you for your opinion. 

[Commodore D]

4 minutes ago, johnny said:

You work in basketball ops for the warriors? Lmao. Thank you for your opinion. 

No I don't; however I do have a buddy that is high up in basketball operations for the Pistons and he shares the sentiment. Assets are protected a lot harder when their your assets, basketball or not.

[johnny]

8 minutes ago, Commodore D said:

No I don't; however I do have a buddy that is high up in basketball operations for the Pistons and he shares the sentiment. Assets are protected a lot harder when their your assets, basketball or not.

Glad we established you don’t work for the warriors 

[Commodore D]

1 minute ago, johnny said:

Glad we established you don’t work for the warriors 

I do hope KD take the player option (I mean of course he will), and the Warriors make it back to the Finals and he get a real shot to play.

 

I also want to see Kawhi chip and dip on Toronto. They'll have to build him a statue for a one and done; kind of funny.

[johnny]

18 minutes ago, Commodore D said:

I do hope KD take the player option (I mean of course he will), and the Warriors make it back to the Finals and he get a real shot to play.

 

I also want to see Kawhi chip and dip on Toronto. They'll have to build him a statue for a one and done; kind of funny.

It’s absurd how nice Kawhi would be on the Clippers. 

 

Idk if taking the player option is a guarantee. At this point teams will still max him even with a torn Achilles. I forgot who but one reporter asked some GMs and they said they would absolutely offer KD the max right now. 

[Paperclyp]

I...kinda am somewhat of an expert in this. I’m a physical therapist, at least, and I regularly deal with rehabbing injuries and also deciding on when to return to sport. 

 

It’s an impossible task to suss out where to place “blame.” It’s certainly true that an athlete needs to be protected on some level from him or herself, because there is a culture of fighting through injury in sports that is hard to overcome, and that’s a complicated topic in and of itself. 

 

But there’s no perfect science in when to return to sport. It’s situational and there’s always risk involved regardless of the level of healing that has occurred. In Durant’s case, I keep seeing this idea that GS was hiding the true nature of his injury, like was it actually the Achilles the whole time or was it a calf strain, and that kind of amuses me because even if they were misleading people about the injury (which I don’t think they were), what is the average joe supposing he is going to do with that information. Like, does that person think that a strained Achilles is more serious than a strained calf (it’s not, necessarily)? The “calf” is essentially two muscles that come together and attach at the heel, the tendon doing so being the Achilles. It’s not all the same, but it’s all connected soft tissue.

 

In retrospect obviously he came back too soon. But it’s a fool’s errand to place blame on anyone for that without very detailed information. Was KD failing stress tests and strength tests prior to the game that would suggest he was a very serious risk of injuring himself? I’m certainly not privy to that information, and unless you are, you look a bit rash and frankly ignorant to accuse anyone of anything. 

 

It would be somewhat risky to put a fully healthy individual who hadn’t played in a month in the throes of an elimination NBA finals game. I’m sure everyone involved knew the risks, and unfortunately the worst happened. It happens. It sucks. It’s incredibly impactful for the next probably 5 years or so of the league, so it seems even more crazy. 

 

But this armchair doctoring is too much. 

 

If it comes out that he failed their return to sport protocols, go at ‘em. But until that information comes out, if it ever does, we simply do not know. 

 

I feel terrible for KD. 

[Guest]

It was obviously an Achilles injury by even dorks like us who just watch sports. Their calf strain claim was always more than suspect. If the Warriors let him play before truly being cleared, I hope the union takes them to court.

[Chris-]

8 hours ago, Paperclyp said:

I keep seeing this idea that GS was hiding the true nature of his injury, like was it actually the Achilles the whole time or was it a calf strain, and that kind of amuses me because even if they were misleading people about the injury (which I don’t think they were), what is the average joe supposing he is going to do with that information. Like, does that person think that a strained Achilles is more serious than a strained calf (it’s not, necessarily)?

 

8 hours ago, sblfilms said:

It was obviously an Achilles injury by even dorks like us who just watch sports. 

 

Love these boards.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Chris- said:

 

 

Love these boards.

That was my response to that post, I just didn’t quote it. It doesn’t take an expert to see where the injury was, several of us pointed it out in this thread when it happened.

 

Expertise doesn’t make a person right, being right makes them right. 

[RedSoxFan9]

I can't wait for grumpy Durant to talk about this situation 

[Chris-]

38 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

That was my response to that post, I just didn’t quote it. It doesn’t take an expert to see where the injury was, several of us pointed it out in this thread when it happened.

 

Expertise doesn’t make a person right, being right makes them right. 

 

[armchair PF nails the garbage can shot from the elbow]

 

‘You’re a baller by ballin’

[johnny]

The Achilles and calf are right next to each other. He can be grabbing in that area for more than one reason. 

[RedSoxFan9]

KD hurt himself on purpose so people would respect his toughness 

[Paperclyp]

2 hours ago, sblfilms said:

That was my response to that post, I just didn’t quote it. It doesn’t take an expert to see where the injury was, several of us pointed it out in this thread when it happened.

 

Expertise doesn’t make a person right, being right makes them right. 

Muscular pain (say, in the calf) can radiate down to its distal tendons. Experiencing pain there does not confirm that is where the damage is. 

 

So I’ll ask: why would they lie about the location of the sprain? 

 

Also just to make sure we’re on the same page, I’m talking about the initial injury. On Monday you could literally see his Achilles snap. 

[Guest]

Just now, Paperclyp said:

Muscular pain (say, in the calf) can radiate down to its distal tendons. Experiencing pain there does not confirm that is where the damage is. 

 

So I’ll ask: why would they lie about the location of the sprain? 

Pro sports teams lie about the severity of injuries regularly for both on court competitive and off court contractual reasons. 

[Paperclyp]

Just now, sblfilms said:

Pro sports teams lie about the severity of injuries regularly for both on court competitive and off court contractual reasons. 

We aren’t talking about severity. We’re talking about location. And as for severity, did they ever give an official grade?

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Paperclyp said:

We aren’t talking about severity. We’re talking about location. And as for severity, did they ever give an official grade?

A broken pinky is a less severe injury for a basketball player than a broken leg. Location certainly matters. I don’t recall whether they have a grade to the “calf strain” or not.

[Paperclyp]

8 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

A broken pinky is a less severe injury for a basketball player than a broken leg. Location certainly matters. I don’t recall whether they have a grade to the “calf strain” or not.

That’s a little willfully obtuse. We’re not talking about a pinky and a leg, we’re talking about an injury on the same muscular complex. 

 

I never saw them say anything so specific about the injury to even suspect they were lying. They were certainly vague, but there’s no reason to believe they lied about the location. 

 

And you never answered my question about why they’d lie about location in this case. 

[johnny]

I don’t believe they gave a grade for the sprain. 

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, Paperclyp said:

And you never answered my question about why they’d lie about location in this case. 

 

27 minutes ago, sblfilms said:

Pro sports teams lie about the severity of injuries regularly for both on court competitive and off court contractual reasons. 

 

[Paperclyp]

But again that doesn’t answer my question because the location is not relevant to the severity in this case. 

 

So i guess your answer assumes that it does, in which case you’re just not correct. I’m not trying to get you with that statement or anything - it’s just a statement of fact. Location without context of severity means nothing (on the same muscular complex). Certainly a pinky is less debilitating than a leg, but that’s irrelevant.