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Congratulations to Microsoft on "winning" Year 1 of the Ninth Console Generation


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6 hours ago, Bacon said:

car game

goty

:rofl:

 

GOTY is EW, btw 

 

6 hours ago, SaysWho? said:

Forza's off to a rough start in that consensus, then. And Game Pass was noticeably under their subscription target. I've wondered for a while if there's a ceiling for game subscription services and I've been thinking more that there is, but time will tell definitively on that.

 

Probably one of their better first party years since the 360 days, though. Fortunately, I'm able to play some of them on PS5. :p 

 

Bosman called it a month ago

 

 

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1 hour ago, SaysWho? said:

 

Fixed.

 

Chicory will be a dark horse in a couple sites. 

I think you’re right that some sites will go for the ones you added, but I suspect the ones I listed will be the most common winners? Then again I’m a moron. 

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7 hours ago, stepee said:

I think actually this gen finally when UE5 is the norm, there will be many 60fps games. There is so much room for easily scaling down with resolution difference either fixed or dynamic, and Xbox Series S spec is here to stay as two of the biggest reasons. I mean when UE5 is running, they will be using taau which can do wonders even if it’s no dlss. 


Epic’s talked about UE5’s Lumen targeting 30fps at 1080p on the PS5/XSX, prior to any upscaling.  That’s for indoor scenes, btw.  For outdoor gameplay, they suggest corners could be cut to reach 60fps.  In other words, there’s really not a lot of headroom.  It’s anyone’s guess how low the dynamic res would need to drop to get to 60fps in their ‘target’ scenarios.  So presumably we’ll see many UE5 games targeting 30fps on consoles.

 

Think about how much Series S would be left behind if that happens.  I’m not worried about it holding things back so much.  But it’s got a lot to prove still that it can hang.  Lower resolutions see diminishing returns with upscallers that don’t work like DLSS.

 

Side note:  I fully expect we’ll see mid-cycle consoles that address the raytracing/DLSS gap with PCs.  But that’s it’s own can of worms for later.  It's part of why FSR was so disappointing.

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11 hours ago, Commissar SFLUFAN said:

The evidence is pretty much here right before us:

 

- GamePass is an unqualified, industry-defining/disrupting success

- Forza Horizon 5 is probably gonna be the consensus GotY

- Age of Empires IV was a return to form for the venerable RTS series

- Halo Infinite multiplayer has been very warmly received (of course, we await the reception for the campaign)

- Psychonauts 2 is an absolutely genuine delight and also a legitimate consensus GotY candidate

- The updates to the overall console UI experience, especially in terms of accessibility features, have been very promising

- Backwards compatibility and FPS Boost that has given new life to games from previous generations.

 

I'm sure there are a few more things that I'm forgetting, but all-in-all, I really can't see how there is any dispute that Microsoft can readily be declared the victor of the First Year of the Ninth Console Generation.

 

- Flight Sim also shipped in a playable state, even on Series S. (I tried it on Series S and was pretty impressed by how good it looked for such a small box)

- MLB The Show, once a Playstation exclusive, was on Game Pass Day 1.  Playstation owners had to shell out $70 for it while Xbox owners with Game Pass didn't.

- Death Loop is also Microsoft 1st Party title now, and nominated Game of the Year.

- Xbox Game Studios games have 25 total nominations at The Game Awards, a few more than Playstation Studios games.

 

Sony has had a very impressive first year as well though, and have acquired quite a few solid studios to add to their portfolio.  They also some solid deals with some new 3rd parties like Jade Raymonds team, and that other multiplayer focused studio.  That will fill the hole they have with multiplayer focused exclusives.

 

I think both console makers should be pretty happy with their 1st years given the challenges of the pandemic.

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9 hours ago, Paperclyp said:

I think you’re right that some sites will go for the ones you added, but I suspect the ones I listed will be the most common winners? Then again I’m a moron. 


Admitting to the problem is the first step to recovery.

 

In other words, you’re way ahead of me. :nervous:

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6 hours ago, Mercury33 said:

This entire thread reads like 

 

MS did slightly more than the absolute nothing they’ve been doing for the last 3 years! Xbox fans rejoice in list of extremely pedestrian accomplishments and proclaim it TEH MEGATON YEAR!!!!!


There‘s a bit of that.  I think Psyconauts 2 and Halo Infinite (potentially) turning out great sill make it a very special year by Microsoft standards.  The final backwards comparability push is also a plus, and people will always consider games pass a winning deal.

 

Really though, the best first year we’ve seen for a console in some time was the Switch.  Nintendo was firing on all cylinders.

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1 hour ago, Mercury33 said:

This entire thread reads like 

 

MS did slightly more than the absolute nothing they’ve been doing for the last 3 years! Xbox fans rejoice in list of extremely pedestrian accomplishments and proclaim it TEH MEGATON YEAR!!!!!

 

 

YES, AND...?!?!?!?

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1 hour ago, crispy4000 said:


There‘s a bit of that.  I think Psyconauts 2 and Halo Infinite (pontentially) turning out great sill make it a very special year by Microsoft standards.  The final backwards comparability push is also plus, and people will always consider games pass a winning deal.

 

Really though, the best first year we’ve seen for a console in some time was the Switch.  Nintendo was firing on all cylinders.

 

This. 

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2 minutes ago, best3444 said:

 

I didn't even read your post entirely i don't think.


It’s a short post, but it’s a beautiful one.

 

I don’t own one, but if they continue to build their first party lineup, I just might. Hence it could be the first time where the big three all have a good showing, thus ms doesn’t win; I do.

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22 minutes ago, SaysWho? said:


It’s a short post, but it’s a beautiful one.

 

I don’t own one, but if they continue to build their first party lineup, I just might. Hence it could be the first time where the big three all have a good showing, thus ms doesn’t win; I do.

 

I got you and agree it’s a win for everyone when all 3 companies got things rolling! I've always owned every console each gen so I never got caught up with fanboys.

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I doubt sales will turn around dramatically enough to match or exceed Sony this generation, but it's pretty clear to me at this point that MS has the winning strategy for the immediate future, and that the Xbox ecosystem is easily the best among the competition. 

 

We're still a ways away from seeing the fruits of their acquisitions, but in the next couple of years, I'm guessing we'll start getting marquee first party games so frequently on Game Pass that it will become an even more absurdly fantastic value proposition than it already is.  The legwork that they've been doing for several years is going to pay off handsomely, and will be tough to match.

 

The much touted SSD stuff on both machines is minimally impactful at best, and since games are becoming more and more homogeneous, it's likely going to be about the quantity and quality of content rather than any specific "next-gen" feature.  Add to the fact that you don't have to be spending $70 and it'll be a no-brainer to a lot of non-enthusiasts about which box to choose.

 

The backwards compatibility stuff is also maybe my favorite thing that I've seen from Xbox.  I know it's finished now, but they really went all out on this last batch of games, and the effort to preserve and improve incredible experiences from the past three generations is admirable and much appreciated.  I was stunned to be able to put F.E.A.R. into my Xbox and play it at 4k/60fps with HDR.  Playing Sonic Generations with the same enhancements turns it into the best Sonic game and something that could come out today.  The list goes on.

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I mean I don't think we need a console war thread which is kinda what this is on its face lol, but haven't Sony and Nintendo massively outsold MS in pretty much every measurable category?

 

I love my SX but I also love my PS5. Switch honestly does feel very dated at this point so it's largely been collecting dust, but afaik they've outsold MS in hardware and software every month of the year and even Nintendo is probably making more money on nintendo online than MS is on gamepass because it isn't constantly $1 a month and a quick search tells you they have more subscribers...

 

Like I do appreciate what MS has been doing with gamepass but in terms of exclusives I don't think they're really above Sony or Nintendo, and they frankly don't have the same level of demand for hardware as Sony or Nintendo which is why they aren't making as many units...

 

They're definitely pursuing a loss leader strategy with gamepass, we'll see if it pays off for them in the next few years I suppose but I don't see them catching Sony.

 

Depending on what nintendo does with switch 2 I could see them sort of taking over the second place mondshare spot.

 

Switch does feel kinda similar to the wii in some ways. Dated tech with a gimmick that everyone loved for a few years but if Nintendo is too slow to move on a fairly powerful successor they'll be forgotten again.

 

Like I could see another Wii u type of flop if they go too underpowered and don't have a clear value proposition over the original switch. People would rather buy a ps5 or series. Just like Wii sales dropped off a cliff and even after wii u launch people would rather buy a PS3/360.

 

Difference here is I don't think they'll wait until 2024 for switch 2. Seems like they've learned their lesson. I think spring 2023 is the very latest they can go though without people thinking meh I'll wait to see what Sony and MS come up with next year.

 

We'll see.

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10 hours ago, Patatat said:

Like I do appreciate what MS has been doing with gamepass but in terms of exclusives I don't think they're really above Sony or Nintendo, and they frankly don't have the same level of demand for hardware as Sony or Nintendo which is why they aren't making as many units...


Both Sony and Microsoft are dealing with the chip shortage and supply chain issues.  Microsoft isn’t producing less at this point because they couldn’t sell out.  But it’s pretty safe to assume PS5 demand is higher in most markets.  After last gen, it’s up Microsoft to prove otherwise.

 

“Exclusives” is a loaded term with consoles these days.  With shifting attitudes towards PC, it can legitimately be said that Microsoft has no real exclusives, Sony has only timed exclusives, and Nintendo exclusives stick unless a limited publishing deal was negotiated.

 

That said, I think Sony’s doing slightly better job than Microsoft at creating hardware-exclusive experiences.  Mainly with the Dual Sense.  It’s not really a system seller in a traditional sense… but when the relevancy of software exclusives is so downplayed, maybe it is?  Auto-HDR on Series consoles isn’t really so exclusive anymore with Windows 11 (or 10 insider build) support.

 

If this is where the industry is headed long term, I think the console manufacturers will be pressured to do more to individualize their hardware instead of simply building something newer and faster.  Either that, or go in harder on the convenience angle by building consoles into TVs themselves.

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Why are people still talking about Xbox as if its a piece of hardware.  It's been like 5 years since they made it pretty clear, selling hardware isn't their priority.

 

10 million people played Forza Horizon 5 in a week.  That has been what they have been aiming for, player engagement.  They dont care if you play on Game Pass, Xbox, Steam, or Stream to you phone.

 

Stop thinking like its 2013.

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5 hours ago, JPDunks4 said:

Why are people still talking about Xbox as if its a piece of hardware.  It's been like 5 years since they made it pretty clear, selling hardware isn't their priority.

 

10 million people played Forza Horizon 5 in a week.  That has been what they have been aiming for, player engagement.  They dont care if you play on Game Pass, Xbox, Steam, or Stream to you phone.

 

Stop thinking like its 2013.

 

Hardware remains a huge portion of their gaming business.  They would absolutely prefer you to play predominantly on Xbox machines, since they’re practically guaranteed to collect more royalties and Live Gold fees there.  A strong closed ecosystem benefits their buisness model, even when they don’t rely on it exclusively.  Sure, they’ve been open minded about expanding their business elsewhere.  But you don’t pay for the R&D of two new console SKUs to imply selling hardware isn’t your priority anymore.

 

If they truly didn’t give a shit where you play, you’d see Gold fees dropped entirely and that same 12% cut on the Windows store applied to their console royalties.

 

If that ever happens, you’ll be 100% correct, and there would be so, so many reasons to celebrate it.

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If they Didn’t care, multiplats would be on PlayStation and Switch regularly, not on rare occasions.

 

Don’t fall for PR. It’s like that because they’re in third. Therefore, it’s “not important.” Minimizing what you don’t have is the 101 of corporate spin.

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It's not PR when every business decision made since 2016 has centered on the premise of moving away from depending entirely on hardware sales, and instead, focusing on player engagement.  When you can play majority of Microsoft's 1st party lineup without a PC or Console, and simply subscribe to a service and play on any phone or tablet, yeah, Hardware isn't the focus.

 

If they prioritized hardware, they never would put their exclusives day and date on PC.  They very easily could say, a year later our exclusives are coming to PC.  But they didn't, because they put player engagement over hardware sales.  No one has said hardware doesn't matter to them, but its very clearly not their priority, and to argue like they are in "3rd Place", or losing, because hardware sales are less, is literally 2013 thinking.  It'd be like arguing Blockbuster was winning back in early 2000's because they were bigger than Netflix, while entirely ignoring the shift in consumer behavior and business models that were going on at the time.

 

52 minutes ago, SaysWho? said:

If they Didn’t care, multiplats would be on PlayStation and Switch regularly, not on rare occasions.

 

Phil Spencer has been pretty open to the fact he would be open to having their games on Playstation or Nintendo, if they allowed Game Passs.  It even came out during the Apple Trial in emails he said he was still pursuing the possibility.

 

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On 11/26/2021 at 5:28 PM, JPDunks4 said:

If they prioritized hardware, they never would put their exclusives day and date on PC.  They very easily could say, a year later our exclusives are coming to PC.  But they didn't, because they put player engagement over hardware sales.  No one has said hardware doesn't matter to them, but its very clearly not their priority, and to argue like they are in "3rd Place", or losing, because hardware sales are less, is literally 2013 thinking.  It'd be like arguing Blockbuster was winning back in early 2000's because they were bigger than Netflix, while entirely ignoring the shift in consumer behavior and business models that were going on at the time.

 

They don’t prioritize hardware as much as their competition with that move, sure.  But selling Xbox hardware is absolutely a priority for the reason I already stated: console users are their biggest money maker.  Their consoles are still monetarily set up to leverage that ahead of other platforms.

They’ve proven over the last couple years they can have it both ways.  Exclusives day and date on PC and additional fees/royalties on Xbox.  Emphasizing player engagement in a (mostly) platform agnostic manner hasn’t really come at the expense of their console sales as far as we know.  They’re still seen as an alternative library and subscription focus to Sony, and people still really want their consoles.

 

This also bears repeating: if they truly valued player engagement above all else, the online paywall on their consoles would have been killed a long time ago.  Not just for F2P games - which they only allowed for to save face after attempting to double the price of Gold.

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7 hours ago, sblfilms said:

It is adorable to watch people who have never had to make business decisions think they understand how any of this works @JPDunks4


Ultimately, actions speak louder than words.  Not every choice they’ve made fits their PR rhetoric, but that doesn’t take anything away from the positive things they are doing to disrupt the status quo.

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