2/3 of GOP voters in South say region should secede from USA

[Nokra]

I feel like we might have faced the issue of succession before. I just wish we had more statues to teach us our history.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Joe]

47 minutes ago, Nokra said:

I feel like we might have faced the issue of succession before. I just wish we had more statues to teach us our history.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

We didn’t listen!

[Xbob42]

21 hours ago, CayceG said:

Were the south to secede, it would become the world's third largest nuclear power. 

 

Kings Bay, Georgia is host to 6 of our ballistic missile submarines, each with 24 missiles. Total, this base hosts around 1,300 warheads and another 150 nuclear cruise missiles. 

Barksdale Air Force base, Louisiana is host to four squadrons of B-52s. Barksdale has approximately 940 warheads. 

Both of those locations have active nuclear weapons stockpiles.

Oak Ridge, TN can produce uranium. 

The Pantex plant in Amarillo, TX can assemble warheads. More than half of our arsenal that is waiting to be dismantled is located here. That's somewhere north of 1,000. 

The Savannah River Site in South Carolina can produce plutonium. 

 

 

This is not something we want. 

 

 

 

Warhead source numbers from here. The numbers are from 2011 and so through New START, I would imagine that these numbers now are about half of what they were when these numbers were published. 

Going Nuclear: Locations of Nuclear Weapons in the United States and Worldwide – BatchGeo Blog

BLOG.BATCHGEO.COM

 

 

EDIT: Up to date numbers as of this year. Not broken down by base, but seeing as we have only one other B-52 base, one other submarine base, and , Pantex hasn't moved, I'd say the Southern US would still be the world's third largest nuclear power. Greater than China. 

Now I ain't no fancy federal government lawyer, but I'm pretty sure nuclear weapons being located in a place doesn't make them the property of that place. Assuming they belong to the federal government/military, I think they'd be moving those weapons long before any secession actually happened. Unless the state of Georgia owns those nuclear subs.

[CayceG]

6 minutes ago, Xbob42 said:

Now I ain't no fancy federal government lawyer, but I'm pretty sure nuclear weapons being located in a place doesn't make them the property of that place. Assuming they belong to the federal government/military, I think they'd be moving those weapons long before any secession actually happened. Unless the state of Georgia owns those nuclear subs.

 

It all depends on how the base commanders and crews feel about it. 

 

In the event of a split, it could be that the nuclear arsenal would wind up on both sides of the dividing line. That's precisely what happened to the USSR and why Ukraine, Belarus, and Kazakhstan became nuclear powers in 1991. 

[Guest]

I feel like if we actually got to the point of a major split, a not insignificant part of the military chooses the south. Seems like securing weapons would be a very high priority for the traitor regime.

[Kal-El814]

Since we're engaging in this wild hypothetical...

 

Are any of our nuclear weapons "usable" without launch codes? It's obviously bad if Confederacy 2: Traitor Boogaloo gets control of a sub armed with nuclear warheads, I just don't know if they could use them.

[GeneticBlueprint]

16 minutes ago, Kal-El814 said:

Since we're engaging in this wild hypothetical...

 

Are any of our nuclear weapons "usable" without launch codes? It's obviously bad if Confederacy 2: Traitor Boogaloo gets control of a sub armed with nuclear warheads, I just don't know if they could use them.

 

At a minimum, it seems like they could build new missiles with the fissionable (not sure if that's a word) material inside of them.

[CayceG]

19 minutes ago, Kal-El814 said:

Since we're engaging in this wild hypothetical...

 

Are any of our nuclear weapons "usable" without launch codes? It's obviously bad if Confederacy 2: Traitor Boogaloo gets control of a sub armed with nuclear warheads, I just don't know if they could use them.

 

I think so. Things like unguided gravity bomb nukes can be loaded and dropped. But the Permissive Action Link authorization is something I'm not certain of. 

 

 

Though, if there's a president that is sympathetic to the movement, he could issue an order. 

 

So there's the kickoff concept for your new near-future 2nd American Revolution novel!

[Spawn_of_Apathy]

1 hour ago, Xbob42 said:

Now I ain't no fancy federal government lawyer, but I'm pretty sure nuclear weapons being located in a place doesn't make them the property of that place. Assuming they belong to the federal government/military, I think they'd be moving those weapons long before any secession actually happened. Unless the state of Georgia owns those nuclear subs.

lol I actually read this in a southern accent. 

[marioandsonic]

 

1 hour ago, Spawn_of_Apathy said:

lol I actually read this in a southern accent. 

 

 

[PaladinSolo]

Its no where near the level you would need for this to actually happen, and the chaos from the fact that the cities in the south would be openly hostile to the new "nation" or whatever would be pretty catastrophic.

[Fizzzzle]

Trying to seize federal arms reserves was exactly the first thing that happened during the secession crisis in 1860/61. Those weren't the only instances, and both of them happened before the states had even seceded.

 

And by the way, if you ever see anyone say the Civil War was the "war of Northern Aggression," remind them that all that shit happened, as well as the secession of 7 of the 11 confederate states, before Lincoln even took office.

[SilentWorld]

Before Quebec had their independence referendum, the Canadian government removed certain military assets out of the province. I don't remember the specifics exactly, but I know that fighter jets were all flown out of the province prior to the vote. Of course, in the example of Canada, we don't have much of a military and don't really have anything comparable to nukes to deal with. 

[osxmatt]

I'll be honest—a bit surprised Democratic support in the Pacific isn't higher.

[Jason]

7 hours ago, Kal-El814 said:

Since we're engaging in this wild hypothetical...

 

Are any of our nuclear weapons "usable" without launch codes? It's obviously bad if Confederacy 2: Traitor Boogaloo gets control of a sub armed with nuclear warheads, I just don't know if they could use them.

 

For 20 Years the Nuclear Launch Code at US Minuteman Silos Was 00000000

GIZMODO.COM

---

Today I found out that during the height of the Cold War, the US military put such an emphasis on a rapid response to an attack on American soil, that to minimize any foreseeable delay in launching a...

 

[Fizzzzle]

2 hours ago, osxmatt said:

I'll be honest—a bit surprised Democratic support in the Pacific isn't higher.

I think it's just signaling, I don't think most people want to secede from the US if it came down to it, but a lot of people absolutely are okay with eastern Oregon/Washington/northern California/Idaho/Utah becoming their own white supremacist/Mormon shithole superstate. They keep trying, so let them. Nothing of value was lost.

[SaysWho?]

11 hours ago, Fizzzzle said:

Trying to seize federal arms reserves was exactly the first thing that happened during the secession crisis in 1860/61. Those weren't the only instances, and both of them happened before the states had even seceded.

 

And by the way, if you ever see anyone say the Civil War was the "war of Northern Aggression," remind them that all that shit happened, as well as the secession of 7 of the 11 confederate states, before Lincoln even took office.

And remind them that Lincoln wasn’t even a radical, but conservatives scared people into thinking he was.

[osxmatt]

8 hours ago, Fizzzzle said:

I think it's just signaling, I don't think most people want to secede from the US if it came down to it, but a lot of people absolutely are okay with eastern Oregon/Washington/northern California/Idaho/Utah becoming their own white supremacist/Mormon shithole superstate. They keep trying, so let them. Nothing of value was lost.

 

Greater Idaho or Jefferson or whatever they hell they call it.

[BloodyHell]

6 hours ago, SaysWho? said:

And remind them that Lincoln wasn’t even a radical, but conservatives scared people into thinking he was.

They pretty much pushed lincoln into the emancipation proclamation lol.

And to be fair, it was the liberals then. Party switch or not, it was what it was. No matter which way put it, lincoln was a republican.

[CitizenVectron]

10 minutes ago, BloodyHell said:

They pretty much pushed lincoln into the emancipation proclamation lol.

And to be fair, it was the liberals then. Party switch or not, it was what it was. No matter which way put it, lincoln was a republican.

 

The slave-owning Confederates were the liberals? No.

[BloodyHell]

5 minutes ago, CitizenVectron said:

 

The slave-owning Confederates were the liberals? No.

Ok, lincoln wasn't a republican, and racist dixicrats didnt rule the democrats for many decades after....

[Joe]

Are you really starting THAT bullshit argument on a Friday afternoon?

[SaysWho?]

32 minutes ago, BloodyHell said:

They pretty much pushed lincoln into the emancipation proclamation lol.

And to be fair, it was the liberals then. Party switch or not, it was what it was. No matter which way put it, lincoln was a republican.

 

This ain't it, chief lol.

 

We're not talking about parties. Conservatives -- who were Democrats -- scared the shit out of their constituents to the point where states were seceding before Lincoln stepped foot into office. That's all.

[Joe]

If you think Thaddeus Stevens was a conservative, you’re a fucking moron and I have no time for you.

[Jason]

8 hours ago, SaysWho? said:

And remind them that Lincoln wasn’t even a radical, but conservatives scared people into thinking he was.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Soil_Party

[stepee]

lol. BloodyHell, for when sblfilms is like “sorry but that viewpoint is too contrarian for me.”

[Air_Delivery]

14 hours ago, BloodyHell said:

Ok, lincoln wasn't a republican, and racist dixicrats didnt rule the democrats for many decades after....

You do understand Dixiecrats became a thing because they didn't like the direction the party was going right? Motherfuckin Strom Thurmond became a Republican in 1964.

Do you idiots actually believe your own bullshit? Or is it just more disingenuousness to obfuscate your own racism?

[thewhyteboar]

On 5/26/2020 at 12:56 PM, thewhyteboar said:

If anyone is actually really interested in the party switch, here is some reading:

 

Hubert Humphrey's 1948 DNC Convention Speech

https://www.americanrhetoric.com/speeches/huberthumphey1948dnc.html

"My friends, to those who say that we are rushing this issue of civil rights, I say to them we are 172 years late. To those who say that this civil-rights program is an infringement on states’ rights, I say this: The time has arrived in America for the Democratic Party to get out of the shadow of states' rights and to walk forthrightly into the bright sunshine of human rights. People -- human beings -- this is the issue of the 20th century. People of all kinds -- all sorts of people -- and these people are looking to America for leadership, and they’re looking to America for precept and example."

 

This speech caused Strom Thurmond to storm out of the convention and run as a Dixiecrat on a platform of segregation. Thurmond of course, would later become a Republican (remember when Trent Lott had to step down as Majority Leader when he said the country would be better off if Thurmond won??? Different times man).

 

Next, Jackie Robinson (yes, that Jackie Robinson!) and Barry Goldwater

https://www.chicagotribune.com/opinion/commentary/ct-perspec-jackie-robinson-100-politics-mlk-nixon-0131-20190130-story.html

 

"But Republican leaders weren’t looking for a black messiah, and in the following year, Robinson implored Nixon to counter Barry Goldwater’s white-centered politics. “We’re not going to get the Negro vote as a bloc in 1964 and 1968, so we ought to go hunting where the ducks are,” Goldwater had said. That divisive statement, Robinson wrote Nixon, “will be Republican policy until someone other than Goldwater vigorously denies that the Republican Party is not interested in the Negro vote.”

Nixon did not come through, and Robinson’s disappointment only deepened when the Republicans nominated Goldwater for president in 1964. “His candidacy reeks with prejudice and bigotry,” Robinson wrote.

Warning that Republicans were forming a “white man’s party,” Robinson then supported the Democratic Lyndon Johnson-Hubert Humphrey ticket in 1964. But he drifted back to the Republican fold once again in the mid-1960s, this time focusing his lobbying efforts on his all-time favorite politician, Republican governor Nelson Rockefeller of New York. “The sooner there is a strong two-party system in New York as well as nationwide, the sooner we get our rights,” he penned to Rockefeller in 1965."

 

Robinson would later support some other Republicans, but he recognized how terrible Goldwater was for the party.

 

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/03/goldwater-jackie-robinson/474498/

This article has a lot of good quotes from black newspapers during the time.

 

“During my life, I have had a few nightmares which happened to me while I was wide awake,” Robinson wrote in 1967. “One of them was the National Republican Convention in San Francisco, which produced the greatest disaster the Republican Party has ever known—Nominee Barry Goldwater.” Robinson, a loyal Republican who campaigned for Richard Nixon in 1960, was shocked and saddened by the racism and lack of civility he witnessed at the 1964 convention. As the historian Leah Wright Rigueur describes in The Loneliness of the Black Republican, black delegates were verbally assaulted and threatened with violence by Goldwater supporters. William Young, a Pennsylvania delegate, had his suit set on fire and was told to “keep in your own place” by his assailant. “They call you ‘nigger,’ push you and step on your feet,” New Jersey delegate George Fleming told the Associated Press. “I had to leave to keep my self-respect.”  

 

As the Draft Goldwater campaign expanded in early 1963, the editors at the Chicago Defender warned that Goldwater’s “brand of demagoguery has a special appeal to ultra conservative Republicans” and that he “cannot be laughed off as a serious possibility as is being done in some quarters unfriendly to him.” After the 1964 Republican National Convention, the Defender suggested, “Goldwater in the White House would be a nightmare from which the nation and the world would not soon recover.” Another editorial two days later struck a stronger tone: “The conviction is universal that Goldwater represents the most diabolical force that has ever captured the leadership of the Republican Party. After 108 years of exhortation to freedom, liberty, and justice, the GOP now becomes the label under which Fascism is oozed into the mainstream of American politics.” (pretty fucking prescient, eh?)

 

And last, for anyone who still thinks the Civil War wasn't about slavery, let me present the Cornerstone Speech, by the Confederate Vice President, Alexander Stephens

https://www.battlefields.org/learn/primary-sources/cornerstone-speech

 

"Our new government is founded upon exactly the opposite idea; its foundations are laid, its corner- stone rests, upon the great truth that the negro is not equal to the white man; that slavery subordination to the superior race is his natural and normal condition. This, our new government, is the first, in the history of the world, based upon this great physical, philosophical, and moral truth."

 

"It is, indeed, in conformity with the ordinance of the Creator. It is not for us to inquire into the wisdom of His ordinances, or to question them. For His own purposes, He has made one race to differ from another, as He has made "one star to differ from another star in glory." The great objects of humanity are best attained when there is conformity to His laws and decrees, in the formation of governments as well as in all things else. Our confederacy is founded upon principles in strict conformity with these laws. This stone which was rejected by the first builders "is become the chief of the corner" the real "corner-stone" in our new edifice."

I guess I gotta quote myself from last year...

[Anathema-]

21 hours ago, BloodyHell said:

They pretty much pushed lincoln into the emancipation proclamation lol.

And to be fair, it was the liberals then. Party switch or not, it was what it was. No matter which way put it, lincoln was a republican.

 

By modern standards, Lincoln's republican party represented the liberal position.

[Joe]

7 hours ago, Air_Delivery said:

You do understand Dixiecrats became a thing because they didn't like the direction the party was going right? Motherfuckin Strom Thurmond became a Republican in 1964.

Do you idiots actually believe your own bullshit? Or is it just more disingenuousness to obfuscate your own racism?

This was probably the reaction he was hoping for.

[DPCyric]

On 7/14/2021 at 11:34 PM, CayceG said:

 

Not exactly, but kinda. I just know where to look detailed stuff up. 

 

I think you are plotting something...

 

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I'm in