Television Superman and Lois Season 2 Premieres 1/11/22

[skillzdadirecta]

Looks surprisingly good.

 

 

[TwinIon]

I've seen a few seasons of most of the CW superhero shows and I think I'm done with them unless this one deviates heavily from that formula.

[cusideabelincoln]

If this show was on AMC the entire second season would take place inside the barn.

 

 

 

 

 

But really, looks to have a different vibe than the other Arrowverse shows - more thoughtful.

[Dre801]

I've never warmed up to "Great Value" Superman.  That being said, I will at least watch the pilot.  Hope it's good because Batwoman just ain't it; I at least watched two full seasons of Supergirl before I checked out.

[Jason]

1 hour ago, Dre801 said:

I've never warmed up to "Great Value" Superman.  That being said, I will at least watch the pilot.  Hope it's good because Batwoman just ain't it; I at least watched two full seasons of Supergirl before I checked out.

 

You should watch season 4 on Netflix, one of the best seasons of an Arrowverse show in general.

[skillzdadirecta]

Yeah Supergirl definitely got better as it went on.

[Jason]

25 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

Yeah Supergirl definitely got better as it went on.

 

Supergirl 3a was good, then 3b was good for the like the 3 or 4 weeks it came back before taking another break, and then the rest of 3b sort of fell apart because Kreisberg got fired. In 3b it seems like they wound up making a conscious decision to not bother trying to salvage the season and just provide the setup for a better 4th season, which really worked. Season 5 was eh. I hope season 6 goes out on a high note.

 

But it's not worth trying to rate an entire Arrowverse show instead of rating them by season, because other than maybe Legends the quality of the seasons tend to be really all over the place.

[Kal-El814]

On 1/22/2021 at 3:55 PM, TwinIon said:

I've seen a few seasons of most of the CW superhero shows and I think I'm done with them unless this one deviates heavily from that formula.

It will never not be weird to me that the main romance in The Flash is between people raised as siblings, the only living parental figure they both have is the same guy. 
 

I know that’s only superficially related to what you said but I can’t get over that everyone just ignores this. 

[skillzdadirecta]

8 minutes ago, Kal-El814 said:

It will never not be weird to me that the main romance in The Flash is between people raised as siblings, the only living parental figure they both have is the same guy. 
 

I know that’s only superficially related to what you said but I can’t get over that everyone just ignores this. 

I think it's not weird to most becuase they clearly weren't raised as siblings. Barry was always "the kid next door" that they took in and he ALWAYS had a crush on Iris even before he went to live with them. They were old enough at the point that Barry moved in to have a clear separation as "freinds" who lived under the same roof.

[Kal-El814]

13 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

I think it's not weird to most becuase they clearly weren't raised as siblings. Barry was always "the kid next door" that they took in and he ALWAYS had a crush on Iris even before he went to live with them. They were old enough at the point that Barry moved in to have a clear separation as "freinds" who lived under the same roof.

I get that the crush predates Barry moving in, but Joe is very clearly his father figure. There’s sweetness there too of course, it’s not ONLY weird. But it’s always going to be weird to me

[skillzdadirecta]

Just now, Kal-El814 said:

I get that the crush predates Barry moving in, but Joe is very clearly his father figure. There’s sweetness there too of course, it’s not ONLY weird. But it’s always going to be weird to me

Stop watching so much Taboo porn 

[Kal-El814]

Just now, skillzdadirecta said:

Stop watching so much Taboo porn 

That shit is weird too! I hate it. 

[skillzdadirecta]

Just now, Kal-El814 said:

That shit is weird too! I hate it. 

Yeah and it's pretty much taken over porn too... that shit single handedly drove me away from porn watching. Too weird 

[Jason]

The show's still going strong upon coming back for the rest of its season.

[Kal-El814]

41 minutes ago, Jason said:

The show's still going strong upon coming back for the rest of its season.

 

I’m really liking it.

 

The individual episodes have been generally very good, but the overall season feels so damn weird. It’s the stranger! Who is actually Luthor! Who’s actually Steel! And he’s bad! And he knows that Superman on his world was good, but went bad, so he wants to get Superman before he turns! But Superman didn’t kill him and ended up saving him, so he kind of trusts him, even though we established that HIS Superman used to be good! So I guess Steel is good! But his whole thing was about stopping the war, and now he knows that there are people with Kryptonian powers in Smallville, but he just leaves anyway! The boys are playing football! They’re not! Sam Lane is a dick! He’s not! This is a meteor freak of the week show! It’s not! Morgan Edge is bad! Actually he’s Superman’s brother!

 

There have been enough concepts in the first season to fill several seasons of a normal CW show. I suspect it’s partially COVID, partially the fact that Supergirl was supposed to be off the air when this was on, etc. It’s not BAD at all, but it makes for a weird experience when Superman just casually drops the thought that Kryptonian consciousnesses are being uploaded into humans.

 

I really like the relationship between the boys, I feel like they absolutely nailed that. Superman is obviously a caring protector, the “friend” that Christopher Reeve said his Superman was, so it makes sense that he gets visually pissed off when someone starts shooting at a kid with live rounds, and it makes sense that he talks to his son about how careful he has to be to not terrify people. They acknowledge the potentially problematic boundaries that Clark has had with Lois and is working on with the boys, etc. It’s clear that Clark and Lois are equals in their relationship, they have really good vibes. Lana’s family dynamic feels a little more cookie cutter and I honestly have no idea how the show wants me to feel about Sam Lane, but in general I think this show really nails the interpersonal relationships.

 

So yeah, it’s quite good so far. I’m curious to see how this season ends and where they go with the second one since they really threw SEVERAL kitchen sinks at this one.

 

Somewhat related, this season of The Flash is weird and extremely bad. How many times can Barry have a terrible plan and then realize the answer is love? Was I supposed to buy that Barry and Iris actually had parental feelings for the Forces? Was I supposed to be sad that Kamilla left, did she have any defining moments on the show? Killer Frost went to jail for life and then was let our on probation 2 weeks later? How on earth do they have content left for season 8? Gustin looked like he was having more fun breakdancing and doing karaoke in the last episode than he’s had on the show in YEARS. This show is so predictable now, which would be fine if it was fun, but man, it’s a drag and has been for a while.

 

Also this season of Legends has been weird and great, I genuinely don’t care that almost none of it even comes close to making sense anymore.

[Jason]

@Kal-El814 more to say later but it really feels like Flash has gone way more extreme than the other shows on COVID restrictions. They've all had obvious COVID-caused stuff, like how in scene with dedicating the bench to Martha Kent you have the small spaced out crowd, but none of them seem like they've been trying to absolutely minimize touching as much as humanly possible—I mean hell Barry and Iris have barely even touched hands this season. So when you're insisting on minimizing not just the scale of fight scenes but even having fight scenes at all then you get goofy shit like Barry constantly using the power of love to talk down the baddies. 

[Kal-El814]

10 minutes ago, Jason said:

@Kal-El814 more to say later but it really feels like Flash has gone way more extreme than the other shows on COVID restrictions. They've all had obvious COVID-caused stuff, like how in scene with dedicating the bench to Martha Kent you have the small spaced out crowd, but none of them seem like they've been trying to absolutely minimize touching as much as humanly possible—I mean hell Barry and Iris have barely even touched hands this season. So when you're insisting on minimizing not just the scale of fight scenes but even having fight scenes at all then you get goofy shit like Barry constantly using the power of love to talk down the baddies. 

As you know I am 100% on board with Barry and Iris never touching every again

[Jason]

16 minutes ago, Kal-El814 said:

As you know I am 100% on board with Barry and Iris never touching every again

 

Okay so take out that bit and reply to the comment sans that bit.

[Spawn_of_Apathy]

Is anybody streaming this?

[Remarkableriots]

On 1/24/2021 at 4:24 PM, Kal-El814 said:

It will never not be weird to me that the main romance in The Flash is between people raised as siblings, the only living parental figure they both have is the same guy. 
 

I know that’s only superficially related to what you said but I can’t get over that everyone just ignores this. 

Barry's dad wasn't dead.

[Kal-El814]

33 minutes ago, Jason said:

 

Okay so take out that bit and reply to the comment sans that bit.

 

 

Fiiiiiine.

 

1 hour ago, Jason said:

@Kal-El814 more to say later but it really feels like Flash has gone way more extreme than the other shows on COVID restrictions. They've all had obvious COVID-caused stuff, like how in scene with dedicating the bench to Martha Kent you have the small spaced out crowd, but none of them seem like they've been trying to absolutely minimize touching as much as humanly possible—I mean hell Barry and Iris have barely even touched hands this season. So when you're insisting on minimizing not just the scale of fight scenes but even having fight scenes at all then you get goofy shit like Barry constantly using the power of love to talk down the baddies. 

 

It's hard for me to say how much the show has been impacted by COVID other than "obviously to some extent." The support group / press conference thing Iris went to was obviously COVID seated, and some other scenes I can't remember well offhand were also. But I dunno how much it's that and how much it is them just running on fumes. It's just a weird season. Wells going, Cisco going...

 

That said, the perp walk they did for Ralph's goodbye is one of the most savage things I've ever seen on television so it's not a total loss!

[Kal-El814]

38 minutes ago, Spawn_of_Apathy said:

Is anybody streaming this?

 

The CW does on their app / website.

[Kal-El814]

Okay, so this show continues to pass story arcs like it took too many laxatives. The Kryptonian invasion is over just like that? I get that it’s a comic reference, but why on earth would something that hosts Kryptonian consciousnesses be called the Eradicator? Why would Lara have preserved the consciousnesses of Kryptonians bent on world domination? Why would Edge bait Superman with resurrecting his mom when it’s obvious she’d side against him? This show never gives anything a moment to breathe.

 

It’s also weird that this show acknowledges the existence of the multiverse but not the existence of Supergirl… at all. Everyone is talking about Kryptonian family and she doesn’t come up? Is this just a side effect of this show initially not taking place until Supergirl was off the air, or does this show not take place in the same reality as the other CW shows?

 

I don’t care about some of the other dumb stuff; Lana not recognizing Clark is hilarious but that’s the brand, them establishing that Superman COULD listen in to someone regardless of where they are on earth but not bothering to listen for Morgan Edge, or vice versa now that we know Edge is Kryptonian, etc.

 

In 10 episodes this show has resolved more major plot points than would take other CW shows several seasons to get through.

[Fizzzzle]

All this does is remind me of all those times when I was a kid i was browsing the guide and see "Lois and Clark" sand think it was a show about the legendary adventurers LOUIS and Clark. That would be a much more interesting show.

 

[Jason]

Biggest breaking suspension of disbelief moment: the idea of the US military using Macs.

[Jason]

On 6/18/2021 at 7:58 AM, Kal-El814 said:

Okay, so this show continues to pass story arcs like it took too many laxatives. The Kryptonian invasion is over just like that? I get that it’s a comic reference, but why on earth would something that hosts Kryptonian consciousnesses be called the Eradicator? Why would Lara have preserved the consciousnesses of Kryptonians bent on world domination? Why would Edge bait Superman with resurrecting his mom when it’s obvious she’d side against him? This show never gives anything a moment to breathe.

 

It’s also weird that this show acknowledges the existence of the multiverse but not the existence of Supergirl… at all. Everyone is talking about Kryptonian family and she doesn’t come up? Is this just a side effect of this show initially not taking place until Supergirl was off the air, or does this show not take place in the same reality as the other CW shows?

 

I don’t care about some of the other dumb stuff; Lana not recognizing Clark is hilarious but that’s the brand, them establishing that Superman COULD listen in to someone regardless of where they are on earth but not bothering to listen for Morgan Edge, or vice versa now that we know Edge is Kryptonian, etc.

 

In 10 episodes this show has resolved more major plot points than would take other CW shows several seasons to get through.

 

Apparently a Batwoman crossover was cut due to COVID, and something involving Kara was cut for time (it's just Lois grabbing a picture that has Kara when leaving the Daily Planet so it wasn't just not filmed due to COVID).

 

https://www.cheatsheet.com/entertainment/superman-lois-cut-a-scene-with-supergirl-kara-danvers-and-clark-together.html/

 

What I'm confused about is, why no mention of Argo City? I'd be fine with this show soft-rebooting into its own parallel continuity that picks and chooses what it wants to acknowledge from the Arrowverse, but between that cancelled Batwoman crossover and the fact that we know Diggle is showing up this season I'm honestly just confused about what specifically they're shooting for in terms of overall Arrowverse continuity vs Crisis changes. Whichever one they're going for is fine since it's a good show so far even with basically not having any explicit acknowledgments of the wider Arrowverse so far (even though we know that was not intentional and mostly due to COVID), I'd just like to be clear on which it is.

 

Likewise IIRC pre-Crisis they had just gone off to Argo to have one baby because carrying the baby to term on Earth would have killed Lois, and now they have two teenagers. Another point of confusion about whether it's a Crisis change or a soft continuity reboot. Acknowledging Crisis or not you'd think nothing has changed about whether or not carrying Clark's kid(s) to term on Earth would be safe for Lois.

[Kal-El814]

2 minutes ago, Jason said:

 

Apparently a Batwoman crossover was cut due to COVID, and something involving Kara was cut for time (it's just Lois grabbing a picture that has Kara when leaving the Daily Planet so it wasn't just not filmed due to COVID).

 

https://www.cheatsheet.com/entertainment/superman-lois-cut-a-scene-with-supergirl-kara-danvers-and-clark-together.html/

 

What I'm confused about is, why no mention of Argo City? I'd be fine with this show soft-rebooting into its own continuity but between that cancelled Batwoman crossover and the fact that we know Diggle is showing up this season I'm honestly just confused about what specifically they're shooting for in terms of overall Arrowverse continuity.

 

Also IIRC pre-Crisis they had just gone off to Argo to have one baby because carrying the baby to term on Earth would have killed Lois, and now they have two teenagers. Another point of confusion about whether it's a Crisis change or a soft continuity reboot. Acknowledging Crisis or not you'd think nothing has changed about whether or not carrying Clark's kid(s) to term on Earth would be safe for Lois.

Yeah, it’s confusing. Team Flash seems (or seemed, I cannot recall their current POV) to believe that the multiverse collapsed and that there’s only one earth. Superman clearly knows that it hasn’t after his encounter with John, AND he knows team Flash could (again, at some point) move between earths. I can’t think of a good reason for Superman to not send John to Team Flash to see if they can send him home?

 

I feel like the shows used to wink at one another a bit to hand wave away the whole “isn’t at least one person on every show close friends with a crew member on a time machine” thing… S&L hasn’t done this at all which would be fine except like you said… it apparently IS in the same universe as the other shows. It’s weird. 

[Jason]

1 minute ago, Kal-El814 said:

Yeah, it’s confusing. Team Flash seems (or seemed, I cannot recall their current POV) to believe that the multiverse collapsed and that there’s only one earth. Superman clearly knows that it hasn’t after his encounter with John, AND he knows team Flash could (again, at some point) move between earths. I can’t think of a good reason for Superman to not send John to Team Flash to see if they can send him home?

 

I feel like the shows used to wink at one another a bit to hand wave away the whole “isn’t at least one person on every show close friends with a crew member on a time machine” thing… S&L hasn’t done this at all which would be fine except like you said… it apparently IS in the same universe as the other shows. It’s weird. 

 

Team Flash currently is not aware that there is in fact a new multiverse, they still think it's all just Earth Prime now. So no reason to believe Superman would think there's a new multiverse out there either. 

 

I don't know if you've been watching Batwoman but after Crisis last season they had an alt-universe Beth show up and IIRC she was a refugee from one of the other Earths. Supergirl also addressed this with the other Brainiacs who'd managed to bail out of their universes which got destroyed in Crisis to one of the universes which survived and then got merged into Earth Prime. So for all we know John Henry Irons also hopped over to a parallel universe that survived and then got merged into Earth Prime and isn't from the new multiverse, they haven't explicitly said anything either way yet on that point, so the default assumption is Clark thinks JHI is also pre-Crisis leftover. 

 

I'm really hoping that the weirdness and confusion so far is just the result of not having time to work in other winks and nods after the Batwoman crossover had to be scrapped and that the Diggle episode gives us some clarity on what exactly they're going with in terms of continuity. 

[Kal-El814]

8 minutes ago, Jason said:

 

Team Flash currently is not aware that there is in fact a new multiverse, they still think it's all just Earth Prime now. So no reason to believe Superman would think there's a new multiverse out there either. 

 

I don't know if you've been watching Batwoman but after Crisis last season they had an alt-universe Beth show up and IIRC she was a refugee from one of the other Earths. Supergirl also addressed this with the other Brainiacs who'd managed to bail out of their universes which got destroyed in Crisis to one of the universes which survived and then got merged into Earth Prime. So for all we know John Henry Irons also hopped over to a parallel universe that survived and then got merged into Earth Prime and isn't from the new multiverse, they haven't explicitly said anything either way yet on that point, so the default assumption is Clark thinks JHI is also pre-Crisis leftover. 

 

I'm really hoping that the weirdness and confusion so far is just the result of not having time to work in other winks and nods after the Batwoman crossover had to be scrapped and that the Diggle episode gives us some clarity on what exactly they're going with in terms of continuity. 

 

Huh. I assumed Superman knew the multiverse was still a thing once John revealed he was from a different earth, but I guess you’re right and  they’re just assuming he’s a leftover from Crisis.  I haven’t been watching Batwoman, just S&L, Flash, and Legends. 

 

 

 

[Kal-El814]

This was a really good episode! I dunno how I feel about an evil ray, but whatever. Given the show’s pace I suspect this will wrap itself up during the next episode anyway.

 

The flashback to Clark and Lois’s relationship was actually kind of lovely. This show really understands Superman as a character, and I think they’re doing a good job of “modernizing” him as well.

[Jason]

Apparently the Nazi guy is such an old character he's from the radio show, which I just learned existed on account of a comment about the Nazi guy. 

 

Also are the Diggle episodes still going to air in the intended order given this show's latest COVID delay? Because their Diggle episode is the show's next episode. 

[Remarkableriots]

On 6/25/2021 at 9:56 AM, Kal-El814 said:

This was a really good episode! I dunno how I feel about an evil ray, but whatever. Given the show’s pace I suspect this will wrap itself up during the next episode anyway.

 

The flashback to Clark and Lois’s relationship was actually kind of lovely. This show really understands Superman as a character, and I think they’re doing a good job of “modernizing” him as well.

I was thinking Ray was back but now evil! 

[Kal-El814]

This was another really good episode, and another episode that could have been the season finale.

[Jason]

So the entire Diggle cameo boiled down to name dropping Oliver, Lyla, and Argus so yes, actual confirmation this really is still the Arrowverse. 

 

If they're making Diggle Green Lantern that leaves Supergirl. Which I guess makes sense, Brainiac is an obvious choice for being able to recognize what's happening to Dig. 

 

Otherwise yeah, another good episode. This is the "power of love" shit Flash has been trying for all season, but actually good. 

[Kal-El814]

I thought this episode was really good too.

 

It's really refreshing to see a show that has relationships where they function like mature adults. Clark and Lois talk to one another, respect and love one another, and it's clear they're on relatively even footing in their relationship which would be easy to do badly given who the characters are. Lois fucked up at the paper and apologized. Even the Cushings are approaching their situation in a relatively mature way.

 

That's not to say there aren't contrivances (I have no idea what Jordan and Sara were arrested for? Clark really needed to lampshade Lois's journalistic ethics given that she's married to Superman, etc.), but as long as they're in service to the characters behaving earnestly I'm all in. There's plenty of potential for ongoing drama with the boys having to keep the family secrets, Lois walking the line between doing her job and protecting the family, etc.

 

My biggest gripe is that I don't think that they really know which way they want to lean with Sam Lane. But I'm a Dylan Walsh mark from the nip/tuck days so whatever.

 

Really the biggest thing for me is that I LOVE this take on Superman. He's accountable, he's honest, he's a hero, and he appreciates his global reach. So much of what we've seen from DC characters on film is "dark" and deeply cynical, so much of the MCU tries to be everything to everyone and shit like The Boys acts like it's about "what if superheroes were REAL" but is really just everyone acting like a cock at every possible moment. The biggest MCU hero gave a teenager a WMD after recruiting him as a chid soldier in a war he waged to regulate superheroes. This version of Superman has enough self awareness to keep 7734 active because he knows humanity needs a trump card. He's admitted his mistakes in spying on the boys, the angriest we've seen him is when the military fired live rounds at a kid... who knows if the show at large will end up being great, but so far this is a GREAT version of Superman.

 

EDIT - again it feels a bit weird that Tal-Rho's dad didn't mention Supergirl?