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Nintendo Switch button prompts are going to kill me

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On 2/18/2018 at 6:59 PM, RedSoxFan9 said:

I try to play a few Nintendo games in a row so I don’t have to readjust to the flipped buttons. 

Yea this is what I have to do too.

     The buttons are the only real issue I have with the Switch and the 3DS XL, as it has grown on me quite a bit. If you grab the right games for it {in my opinion} it's amazing. I'm playing Rocket league, New Mario and Bayonetta 1 - 2, but the buttons really do hinder me, especially is intense, precice moments as I tend to revert to the other 99% of systems button configurations when the shit hits the fan. It is what it is, wish you could remap all games like you can in Rocket League, but sadly that's a nope! 

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12 minutes ago, HardAct said:

Yea this is what I have to do too.

     The buttons are the only real issue I have with the Switch and the 3DS XL, as it has grown on me quite a bit. If you grab the right games for it {in my opinion} it's amazing. I'm playing Rocket league, New Mario and Bayonetta 1 - 2, but the buttons really do hinder me, especially is intense, precice moments as I tend to revert to the other 99% of systems button configurations when the shit hits the fan. It is what it is, wish you could remap all games like you can in Rocket League, but sadly that's a nope! 

 

Very much the bolded! Remapping would be good, or for the love of god don't flash the button name at me. Saying "kick" or "jump" would work way better for my head. You show me a "B" and now I'm trying to think which button is the B button.

 

I'm looking at you Bayonetta!

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Eh, 'A' for accept and 'B' to cancel has always made sense. And except for N64, Nintendo has always had "B' on the bottom of the controller, and 'A' towards the right. Not sure how this got confusing for anyone, but....here we are. :P 

 

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42 minutes ago, GameDadGrant said:

Eh, 'A' for accept and 'B' to cancel has always made sense. And except for N64, Nintendo has always had "B' on the bottom of the controller, and 'A' towards the right. Not sure how this got confusing for anyone, but....here we are. :P 

 

well we read right to left in america, japan reads right to left { and back to front if I'm not mistaken } so there is that, that could and would confuse almost anyone, except you I mean :D

 

I personally think that button mapping in anything and everything gaming makes sense. it may take awhile, wasn't that long ago that Audio wasn't even adjustable, so it takes awhile, but it will happen. You want your customers comfortable I would think. I usually mess up the buttons navigating menus the most as backing out comes with at least one {oops} moment, but I just don't play the Nintendo systems as much as the others, that's not gonna change, so just something I will battle with, more so the longer between games, but it's always there messing with my head! 

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Very much the bolded! Remapping would be good, or for the love of god don't flash the button name at me. Saying "kick" or "jump" would work way better for my head. You show me a "B" and now I'm trying to think which button is the B button.
 
I'm looking at you Bayonetta!
Something else you can blame Sega for. They're the ones that popularized the quick time event.

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk

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1 hour ago, GameDadGrant said:

Eh, 'A' for accept and 'B' to cancel has always made sense. And except for N64, Nintendo has always had "B' on the bottom of the controller, and 'A' towards the right. Not sure how this got confusing for anyone, but....here we are. :P 

 

Its not what the A and B buttons do as they do the same thing on all controllers. Its the placement of them. This is similar to the asymmetrical joystick debate with the PS and Xbox controller. 

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2 hours ago, AndrewDean84 said:

Just stop playing games using the xbox controller and embrace Nintendo.  

 

The Switch is the only console I own this generation. But I also game a ton of PC and even though I primarily use the steam controller (when I use a controller) rather than an xbox controller, it (and PC controllers in general) also follow the Xbox scheme.

 

I never really had a problem with Xbox to PS though because PS has completely different symbols which makes for no overloading. Even its 'X' button is quite different looking than the letter x so it never really conflicted for me.

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1 hour ago, The def star said:

Its not what the A and B buttons do as they do the same thing on all controllers. Its the placement of them. This is similar to the asymmetrical joystick debate with the PS and Xbox controller. 

 

But it's been this way since the NES. 'A' on the right, 'B' on the left. Y'all been Xbox/Playstation-brainwashed, lulz. :P 

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You guys are all weird. Every last one of you.

 

Who gives a shit about the symbol? It's all about color recognition.

 

And the Switch fucks that up AS ALL THE FUCKING BUTTONS ARE THE SAME COLOR FORCING YOU TO READ THE SYMBOL.

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14 minutes ago, Jason said:

Haven't they had that layout since the SNES?

Not the point, but yes. The thing is, there is no standardization, and no good reason to have gone BA, instead of AB,. 

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30 minutes ago, Xbob42 said:

You guys are all weird. Every last one of you.

 

Who gives a shit about the symbol? It's all about color recognition.

 

And the Switch fucks that up AS ALL THE FUCKING BUTTONS ARE THE SAME COLOR FORCING YOU TO READ THE SYMBOL.

 

I've played games that use instructions and button prompts only specifying the symbol, not the color.

 

If some games specify the symbol and not the color, then internalizing the symbol mapping is a reasonable cognitive response.

 

And as you pointed out, since the Switch only specifies the symbols because there are no differentiating colors, it's going to conflict with any pre-existing internalized mapping.

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17 minutes ago, apoc81 said:

Not the point, but yes. The thing is, there is no standardization, and no good reason to have gone BA, instead of AB,. 

But if Nintendo has been consistent, then they have their own standard, with the  NES, SNES, Wii controllers, Wii U, Gameboy, GBC, GBA, DS, 3DS, Switch, and even the gamecube had BA and YX.  That's 11 platforms with BA design.

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On 2/19/2018 at 10:21 AM, legend said:

 

Accept vs cancel could be solved with remapping, but my problem is also with placement because of in game button prompts. In particular, I'm playing Bayonetta right now which has quick time events and I'm significantly slower because it shouts at you "B" and I have to do a translation in my head.

You should request a ram upgrade.

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3 minutes ago, therockdltj said:

You should request a ram upgrade.

 

RAM's actually not the issue. Both concepts exist simultaneously just fine. It's the additional compute overhead for managing the switch. I will gladly accept compute upgrades.

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4 hours ago, HardAct said:

well we read right to left in america, japan reads right to left { and back to front if I'm not mistaken } so there is that, that could and would confuse almost anyone, except you I mean :D

 

I personally think that button mapping in anything and everything gaming makes sense. it may take awhile, wasn't that long ago that Audio wasn't even adjustable, so it takes awhile, but it will happen. You want your customers comfortable I would think. I usually mess up the buttons navigating menus the most as backing out comes with at least one {oops} moment, but I just don't play the Nintendo systems as much as the others, that's not gonna change, so just something I will battle with, more so the longer between games, but it's always there messing with my head! 

We read left to right in America not right to left....

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45 minutes ago, legend said:

 

I've played games that use instructions and button prompts only specifying the symbol, not the color.

 

If some games specify the symbol and not the color, then internalizing the symbol mapping is a reasonable cognitive response.

 

And as you pointed out, since the Switch only specifies the symbols because there are no differentiating colors, it's going to conflict with any pre-existing internalized mapping.

I've seen instruction without the color, which is fine, but I don't think I've ever noticed active prompts in-game that are just the symbols. At least not in a manner that would require me to react quickly. But I imagine we play some fairly different titles.

 

Further, all platform holders and devs should strive to go for color first and foremost, as it's much easier to memorize and vastly easier to see in your peripheral vision.

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The God of War Games handled the button prompts well, with putting the button on the same side of the screen, for QTE at least.  So you would see the Triangle near the top of the screen, or the square on the left side of the screen.  

 

dmecfyzjxkbxpglykwdt.jpg

 

chains4.png

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43 minutes ago, Xbob42 said:

I've seen instruction without the color, which is fine, but I don't think I've ever noticed active prompts in-game that are just the symbols. At least not in a manner that would require me to react quickly. But I imagine we play some fairly different titles.

 

Further, all platform holders and devs should strive to go for color first and foremost, as it's much easier to memorize and vastly easier to see in your peripheral vision.

 

 

 

The times I can remember seeing active prompts without the color were in games that were trying to keep with a more stylistic look where the color wouldn't work well. I have some vague images in my head, but I probably can't pinpoint any from the top of my head. I more so remember acknowledging that they eschewed the color for that purpose.

 

Either way though, that the symbol is sometimes required and often at least indicated in conjunction makes it all but impossible for my mind to have not built that mapping over the many years.

 

A controller going color only would be interesting. Although they would have to use different colors because the colors typically chosen are not good for the color blind :P It would be just our luck that if someone does it though that they'll end up conflicting with other controllers' color choices. We'll never escape this hell :P 

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1 hour ago, therockdltj said:

Doesn't Japanese sometimes write top to bottom right to left?

 

Yeah, historically that is how it was. But they do it less commonly now. At least that's my understanding.

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34 minutes ago, AndrewDean84 said:

The God of War Games handled the button prompts well, with putting the button on the same side of the screen, for QTE at least.  So you would see the Triangle near the top of the screen, or the square on the left side of the screen.  

 

dmecfyzjxkbxpglykwdt.jpg

 

chains4.png

 

Yeah this approach would probably help a lot because it would be easier to ignore the symbol and any conflicts with other symbol placement.

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6 hours ago, HardAct said:

well we read right to left in america, japan reads right to left { and back to front if I'm not mistaken } so there is that, that could and would confuse almost anyone, except you I mean :D

 

I personally think that button mapping in anything and everything gaming makes sense. it may take awhile, wasn't that long ago that Audio wasn't even adjustable, so it takes awhile, but it will happen. You want your customers comfortable I would think. I usually mess up the buttons navigating menus the most as backing out comes with at least one {oops} moment, but I just don't play the Nintendo systems as much as the others, that's not gonna change, so just something I will battle with, more so the longer between games, but it's always there messing with my head! 

 

You for is Phonics on Hooked.

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5 hours ago, GameDadGrant said:

 

But it's been this way since the NES. 'A' on the right, 'B' on the left. Y'all been Xbox/Playstation-brainwashed, lulz. :P 

Just because it was done this way from the NES doesnt mean its the best way to do things :nottalking:

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15 hours ago, legend said:

 

Yeah, historically that is how it was. But they do it less commonly now. At least that's my understanding.

 

When writing vertically like they traditionally did (following Chinese), it's right to left but when writing horizontally it's left to right (following Western influence).

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13 hours ago, The def star said:

Just because it was done this way from the NES doesnt mean its the best way to do things :nottalking:

But their main target audience isn't complaining.  Just you western dogs.

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19 minutes ago, dualhunter said:

 

When writing vertically like they traditionally did (following Chinese), it's right to left but when writing horizontally it's left to right (following Western influence).

 

The googling I did previously indicated that they used to do right to left for horizontal as well, but more recently (post WWII) shifted to left to right for horizontal.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horizontal_and_vertical_writing_in_East_Asian_scripts#Right-to-left_horizontal_writing

Quote

Historically, vertical writing was the standard system, and horizontal writing was only used where a sign had to fit in a constrained space, such as over the gate of a temple or the signboard of a shop. This horizontal writing is in fact a special case of vertical writing in which each column contains just one character.
Therefore, before the end of World War II in Japan, those signs were read right to left.
Today, the left-to-right direction is dominant in all three languages for horizontal writing

 

But I'm no expert on this matter.

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5 minutes ago, AndrewDean84 said:

But their main target audience isn't complaining.

 

How do you know they aren't?

 

5 minutes ago, AndrewDean84 said:

  Just you western dogs.

 

Even if so, are you saying it would be intractable for Nintendo to localize differently?

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