Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
SFLUFAN

Puerto Rico governor: "We need more resources from the DoD"

Recommended Posts

On 10/01/2017 at 7:13 PM, CheeTo said:

No, I'm saying I can empathize with someone's point of view, even when it's wrong, particularly when someone is backed into a corner. Treating every supporter of Trump as if they are also extremists doesn't accomplish much. Everyone gets to their political side for a reason, and following that trail to form productive conversation is better than blindly calling people nazis (not implying you are, but that is a frequent reaction I see).

 

I would be more sympathetic to that side if one, THEY extended the courtesy you're talking about to people who didn't see things the way they do and were open to the fact that more than one thing can be true. Also if the didn't automatically discount anyone from New York or LA as a "coastal elite" despite showing so much support for one. Two if they displayed some type of ideological consistency in their support of Trump. I have a friend who is a Cop and is VERY conservative... he and I despite being very friendly and respecting each other agree on very little politically (We have a whole BUNCH of other shit in common outside of that) despite this, and voting Republican in nearly every election in his adult life, he couldn't bring himself to vote for Trump. Mind you he HATED Hillary and wasn't going to vote her her either, but he couldn't bring himself to vote for Trump because of the stuff that Trump has done/said/presented/defended. I respect that... he stood on his principles. I have no problem empathizing with someone's point of view that differs from my own. But there's a limit to that. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. NO ONE is entitled to their own facts. Trump and his supporters coined the phrase "Alternative facts" so... you can see where someone like me might have a problem with that.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Supporting someone don't mean you align with everything he/she says. I voted for Obama both terms, but I didn't always agree with him and I don't want or expect someone to associate my vote with undying loyalty. Nor do I support Trump or many of the appalling things he says on Twitter. My point was never made that people should support Trump, but is that it's anti-productive to assimilate that every person that might agree with one thing he has said or done agrees with all of those things. Again, it's about the divide of shouting at each other rather than taking the time to understand the why.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, SFLUFAN said:

One of the great myths of American history is that there never was a time when we weren't shouting at each other.  

Yeah, I guess the loudest voice and deepest pockets gets to be prom queen.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
24 minutes ago, SFLUFAN said:

One of the great myths of American history is that there never was a time when we weren't shouting at each other.  

 

If anything I think our body politic is poorer for it now being considered unduly rude for Senators to use canes to beat the living shit out of each other.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
30 minutes ago, SFLUFAN said:

One of the great myths of American history is that there never was a time when we weren't shouting at each other.  

But you do have to admit it has got much louder in the internet era.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, CheeTo said:

Supporting someone don't mean you align with everything he/she says. I voted for Obama both terms, but I didn't always agree with him and I don't want or expect someone to associate my vote with undying loyalty. Nor do I support Trump or many of the appalling things he says on Twitter. My point was never made that people should support Trump, but is that it's anti-productive to assimilate that every person that might agree with one thing he has said or done agrees with all of those things. Again, it's about the divide of shouting at each other rather than taking the time to understand the why.

 

So... when Trump supporters LITERALLY say that there is nothing he can do or say that will affect their support of him (which many actually have) We're not supposed to take that as undying loyalty? I think you and I are talking about two different classes of Trump voter... there are PLENTY of people who voted for Trump who are dissatisfied with him now and regret their vote or have since changed their opinion of him. While I don't understand WHO they thought they were voting for, THOSE people are not the ones I'm talking about. I'm talking about the people who are ride or die Trump supporters... the ones who he himself said would stick with him even if he "shot someone in the middle of fifth avenue". THOSE are the ones who GLADLY support and own everything he says and does and there is nothing counter productive about calling them out and holding them accountable. There's no consensus or middle ground to be had with those folks anyway.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
30 minutes ago, Littleronin said:

But you do have to admit it has got much louder in the internet era.

Perhaps, but I wonder if that's the effect of its immediacy as opposed to its actual volume.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
37 minutes ago, Jason said:

 

If anything I think our body politic is poorer for it now being considered unduly rude for Senators to use canes to beat the living shit out of each other.

HAH!  That was going through my mind when I was formulating my previous post!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:
 What Asian country is that where politicians routinely beat the shit out of each other on the parliamentary floor? 

Republic of China (Taiwan)

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
35 minutes ago, SFLUFAN said:

Perhaps, but I wonder if that's the effect of its immediacy as opposed to its actual volume.

I have wondered about that myself. I mean we have seen what it has done for the realm of conspiracy theorists. I genuinely there are more or less percentage wise of the population that shares the beliefs as much as it is just easier to find and organize ideals with each other. Just making it seem like more have come to those thoughts.

Every idiot gets a soapbox with the internet. Just how much of an idiot you make of yourself is up to you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 minutes ago, Littleronin said:

I have wondered about that myself. I mean we have seen what it has done for the realm of conspiracy theorists. I genuinely there are more or less percentage wise of the population that shares the beliefs as much as it is just easier to find and organize ideals with each other. Just making it seem like more have come to those thoughts.

Every idiot gets a soapbox with the internet. Just how much of an idiot you make of yourself is up to you.

 

People like Joe typically have to have gone completely over the deep end to be willing to spout their bullshit in meatspace; the anonymity of the internet definitely lets people like him be a LOT noisier (and thus grab an outsized chunk of attention) than they'd ever be able to do offline. Partially because people would just ignore them and partially because it's a lot more intimidating to be vocal about that nonsense when you have to show your face while doing so.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, GuyWhoPostsThings said:

 

One of the most heartbreaking things I read is how after the storm hit, everyone in a hospital's ICU was dead. Without power, they just all died. That is probably the case all over the island. Do we have any casualty figures? Unfortunately with the shooting in Las Vegas, I feel like Puerto Rico is going to be completely forgotten, now (even more so).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 hours ago, skillzdadirecta said:

 

I would be more sympathetic to that side if one, THEY extended the courtesy you're talking about to people who didn't see things the way they do and were open to the fact that more than one thing can be true. Also if the didn't automatically discount anyone from New York or LA as a "coastal elite" despite showing so much support for one. Two if they displayed some type of ideological consistency in their support of Trump. I have a friend who is a Cop and is VERY conservative... he and eye despite being very friendly and respecting each other agree on very little politically (We have a whole BUNCH of other shit in common outside of that) despite this, and voting Republican in nearly every election in his adult life, he couldn't bring himself to vote for Trump. Mind you he HATED Hillary and wasn't going to vote her her either, but he couldn't bring himself to vote for Trump because of the stuff that Trump has done/said/presented/defended. I respect that... he stood on his principles. I have no problem empathizing with someone's point of view that differs from my own. But there's a limit to that. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. NO ONE is entitled to their own facts. Trump and his supporters coined the phrase "Alternative facts" so... you can see where someone like me might have a problem with that.

 

 

Sympathy with conditions is barely (if it is at all) sympathy.

 

You basically said, if they voted for Trump, but now think like me, I'm cool with the way they think.

 

Plus everything you mentioned that the supporters are doing wrong, you can say about his detractors, yet your premise seems to be that it only applies to his supporters. You are just as disingenuous as the people you are against (the main problem with the country).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, Fuhrer D said:

Sympathy with conditions is barely (if it is at all) sympathy.

 

You basically said, if they voted for Trump, but now think like me, I'm cool with the way they think.

 

Plus everything you mentioned that the supporters are doing wrong, you can say about his detractors, yet your premise seems to be that it only applies to his supporters. You are just as disingenuous as the people you are against (the main problem with the country).

Oh what horseshit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, skillzdadirecta said:

Seriously... Im not even going to dignify that overly simplistic take on what i said with a response.

Lol. Thanks for the extra chuckle today.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, Fuhrer D said:

Better than the donkey crap to which I replied.

 

Given the forum we're posting on, Wade's opinion objectively matters more than yours doe.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, skillzdadirecta said:

Does horseshit even have a smell... besides straw?

It most certainly does. My grandparents had a farm when I was young, and I was one of their slaves (I shouldn't complain, they left the whole of their estate to me), they most certainly smell. But nothing like beef or pork. I think pigs are the absolute worst when it comes to smell. They taste good though. That's why I wouldn't have picked horse shit to describe his comment. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

Sign in to follow this  

×